city limits and Tulsa Gov't vehicles

[MH2010]

The city started the take-home car policy inside the city limits for several reasons.  The first is a public safety measure.  Police officers going to work, coming home from work, going to court, going to in-service, going to the range, going to a specialty assignment ect. are visible and can respond to high priority calls if they are close.  It simply puts more officers on the street.  Secondly, people in neighborhoods like to see the police cars. I know my neighbors love it.  It gives a visible presence in neighborhoods.  Third, businesses like having police cars outside their buildings when police work extra jobs.  There is a reason why no banks have been robbed in Tulsa when a uniformed car is out front. Businesses argue that they spend enough in taxes to warrant the police car if they want it. Fourth, it cuts down on overtime for the city.  I usually get called in to work about 10-12 times a month.  It saves the city about 30 to 45 minutes for me to leave from home and get to where I am supposed to be instead of stopping off at a uniformed division to get my police car. Lastly, officers get to work 15 minutes before their shift for squad meeting.  They are not paid for this time. Unpaid squad meetings were also a trade off for the take-home cars.


As far as the out of the city take-home cars, Mayor LaFortune administration gave that to the officers one year instead of a raise.  They stated that officers deserved a raise to get them up to market value but did not have the money. As a result, they gave us the 25-mile radius as compensation.

Additionaly, the take-home cars eliminate the argument of "donning and doffing" the uniform. The union has said that they will not pursue the "donning and doffing" argument.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

The city started the take-home car policy inside the city limits for several reasons.  The first is a public safety measure.  Police officers going to work, coming home from work, going to court, going to in-service, going to the range, going to a specialty assignment ect. are visible and can respond to high priority calls if they are close.  It simply puts more officers on the street.  Secondly, people in neighborhoods like to see the police cars. I know my neighbors love it.  It gives a visible presence in neighborhoods.  Third, businesses like having police cars outside their buildings when police work extra jobs.  There is a reason why no banks have been robbed in Tulsa when a uniformed car is out front. Businesses argue that they spend enough in taxes to warrant the police car if they want it. Fourth, it cuts down on overtime for the city.  I usually get called in to work about 10-12 times a month.  It saves the city about 30 to 45 minutes for me to leave from home and get to where I am supposed to be instead of stopping off at a uniformed division to get my police car. Lastly, officers get to work 15 minutes before their shift for squad meeting.  They are not paid for this time. Unpaid squad meetings were also a trade off for the take-home cars.


As far as the out of the city take-home cars, Mayor LaFortune administration gave that to the officers one year instead of a raise.  They stated that officers deserved a raise to get them up to market value but did not have the money. As a result, they gave us the 25-mile radius as compensation.

Additionaly, the take-home cars eliminate the argument of "donning and doffing" the uniform. The union has said that they will not pursue the "donning and doffing" argument.

9-11 should have eliminated this foolish, ultra-expensive city policy.

Reason:

A Tulsa Police car parked in front of a house in a suburban neighborhood would make an excellent terrorist vehicle.

Once the policeman's donkey got owned by the terrorist assault team, then they would have leisurely, unimpeded access to both a police uniform PLUS an official Tulsa Police vehicle.

Allah Akbar, anyone?

[xx(]

[Townsend]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

The city started the take-home car policy inside the city limits for several reasons.  The first is a public safety measure.  Police officers going to work, coming home from work, going to court, going to in-service, going to the range, going to a specialty assignment ect. are visible and can respond to high priority calls if they are close.  It simply puts more officers on the street.  Secondly, people in neighborhoods like to see the police cars. I know my neighbors love it.  It gives a visible presence in neighborhoods.  Third, businesses like having police cars outside their buildings when police work extra jobs.  There is a reason why no banks have been robbed in Tulsa when a uniformed car is out front. Businesses argue that they spend enough in taxes to warrant the police car if they want it. Fourth, it cuts down on overtime for the city.  I usually get called in to work about 10-12 times a month.  It saves the city about 30 to 45 minutes for me to leave from home and get to where I am supposed to be instead of stopping off at a uniformed division to get my police car. Lastly, officers get to work 15 minutes before their shift for squad meeting.  They are not paid for this time. Unpaid squad meetings were also a trade off for the take-home cars.


As far as the out of the city take-home cars, Mayor LaFortune administration gave that to the officers one year instead of a raise.  They stated that officers deserved a raise to get them up to market value but did not have the money. As a result, they gave us the 25-mile radius as compensation.

Additionaly, the take-home cars eliminate the argument of "donning and doffing" the uniform. The union has said that they will not pursue the "donning and doffing" argument.

9-11 should have eliminated this foolish, ultra-expensive city policy.

Reason:

A Tulsa Police car parked in front of a house in a suburban neighborhood would make an excellent terrorist vehicle.

Once the policeman's donkey got owned by the terrorist assault team, then they would have leisurely, unimpeded access to both a police uniform PLUS an official Tulsa Police vehicle.

Allah Akbar, anyone?

[xx(]

TADAAAAAAA

[YoungTulsan]

Limit the vehicles to the City of Tulsa.  When it comes to critical assets of the community such as the Police, they should be encouraged to live in the City.  In addition to having the vehicle benefit, they should also make it more financially viable to hold a residence in the City of Tulsa.  Pay a bonus to cops who reside in the City to make it worth their while.  Good for the economy to keep 800 good-paying jobs in Tulsa.  Good for Tulsa to have police ready to mobilize when urgent attention is needed to a situation.  Whether you take your car home or not, you are much less able to spring to action if you live in the sticks as a cop.  If you live in Beggs or Oolagah you are straight up less valuable due to your hugely increased mobilization time.  Sure, police are free to live where they please, but when you are counted on for public safety, your proximity to urgent matters should be a directly tied in to your VALUE to the city.  You could be the most skilled and experienced cop in all the land, but you aren't catching a North Tulsa shooter on the run when you are in Leonard.

[RecycleMichael]

Why do more than half of the Tulsa Police officers live outside the city limits?

Doesn't that seem odd?

Do they not want to support the city that employs them?

[Townsend]

I'm also concerned with the trips home made during shift.

At least if they go home for lunch et al, they'd still be in town if they lived in town.

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by Townsend

I'm also concerned with the trips home made during shift.

At least if they go home for lunch et al, they'd still be in town if they lived in town.

It's really all about appearances.

By APPEARING to have a lot of police ON DUTY driving around, the local population have a feel good reaction.

Actually, this is a total ruse.  

The police driving around Tulsa are picking up their dry cleaning, going out to breakfast/lunch/supper, going by to pick up their moonlighting check from the after-hours employers, driving to/from home for work, driving to/from home to their second job, etc., etc. etc.

And, I wouldn't be surprised in the least that while it is police procedure that their police radio be ON while in operation, when they don't want to be bothered, like when they are headed off duty, that they simply turn it OFF.

I see a fair number of police driving our police cars while talking on a cell phone. How can they be listening to the police radio with one ear when the other ear is glued to a cell phone??

It is a total waste of the city's limited and strained operating budget, as well as an unnecessary diversion of Third Penny Sales Tax to finance a vast fleet of 800 police cars.

Proper RESPONSE:  Do NOT vote for approval of any more city tax increases or renewals until the City Government provides better financial management of our hard-earned tax dollars.

[MH2010]

Friendlybear, The Department of Homeland security suggests that police department DO NOT park large numbers of police vehicles in areas.  They suggest take-home cars are one of the safest ways to insure that in an emergency (terrorist attack, natural disaster ect) officers will be able to effectively get to and operate their vehicles.

Youngtulsan has a great point.  Officers have been for that for years but the city won't do anything about it.

Recyclemichael, we've talked about this at length in previous threads.  Officers would love to support Tulsa but officers want to support their families more.  Officers can get more house for less money in the surrounding areas.  Also officers feel like they are less likely to run into someone they arrested when they are with their family when they are outside the city. If the city were to reward officers for living in the city then I'm sure more would move back in.  

[RecycleMichael]

What kind of reward would be necessary to entice officers to live in Tulsa?

Maybe allowing them a take-home vehicle?

[YoungTulsan]

quote:Originally posted by recyclemichael

What kind of reward would be necessary to entice officers to live in Tulsa?

Maybe allowing them a take-home vehicle?

We're so auto oriented here that even a police officer with full reign over his take home vehicle likely owns his own vehicle as well.  So it is a perk, but not some sort of prohibitive reason not to live in Broken Arrow.

Frankly they should just be PAID more (in ADDITION to getting a take home vehicle that out of towners should be denied) for living in the city limits.  There are plenty of nice places to live in the City of Tulsa, and those sworn to protect the citizens should have enough pride in this city to deem it liveable for themselves.  We don't need officers just coming here to collect a paycheck, then fleeing town declaring it a place unfit to live in.  It also encourages them to fight crime when it is their own neighborhoods they are policing.

[MH2010]

Extra money would be nice but it could also just be a discount on city services (trash, water ect.).

[Friendly Bear]

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

Friendlybear, The Department of Homeland security suggests that police department DO NOT park large numbers of police vehicles in areas.  They suggest take-home cars are one of the safest ways to insure that in an emergency (terrorist attack, natural disaster ect) officers will be able to effectively get to and operate their vehicles.

Youngtulsan has a great point.  Officers have been for that for years but the city won't do anything about it.

Recyclemichael, we've talked about this at length in previous threads.  Officers would love to support Tulsa but officers want to support their families more.  Officers can get more house for less money in the surrounding areas.  Also officers feel like they are less likely to run into someone they arrested when they are with their family when they are outside the city. If the city were to reward officers for living in the city then I'm sure more would move back in.  

The Heimat Sicherheitdienst (Homeland Security Department) may or may not have given that advice.  

The REAL answer is:  IT DEPENDS.

If the cars are concentrated in one location, then they can be guarded.  Cars scattered all over Tulsa are subject to vandalism or theft.

Tulsa is unlikely to suffer a Pearl Harbor type attack.  

The Police Car Take-Home Policy has been justified by a ever changing pretext:

It's about Public Safety within the city limits of Tulsa.

Then, moving the boundary 25 miles from 41st and Yale:  

It's now about TERRORISM.

True Answer:  It's about FREE-LOADERS.

Tulsa should have no more than about 200 police cars.  That would save 4-fold our Capital Expenditures for new police cars, and reduce significantly our fuel expenditures incurred by the City operating budget by eliminating commuting expense.

[}:)]

[MH2010]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

Friendlybear, The Department of Homeland security suggests that police department DO NOT park large numbers of police vehicles in areas.  They suggest take-home cars are one of the safest ways to insure that in an emergency (terrorist attack, natural disaster ect) officers will be able to effectively get to and operate their vehicles.

Youngtulsan has a great point.  Officers have been for that for years but the city won't do anything about it.

Recyclemichael, we've talked about this at length in previous threads.  Officers would love to support Tulsa but officers want to support their families more.  Officers can get more house for less money in the surrounding areas.  Also officers feel like they are less likely to run into someone they arrested when they are with their family when they are outside the city. If the city were to reward officers for living in the city then I'm sure more would move back in.  

The Heimat Sicherheitdienst (Homeland Security Department) may or may not have given that advice.  

The REAL answer is:  IT DEPENDS.

If the cars are concentrated in one location, then they can be guarded.  Cars scattered all over Tulsa are subject to vandalism or theft.

Tulsa is unlikely to suffer a Pearl Harbor type attack.  

The Police Car Take-Home Policy has been justified by a ever changing pretext:

It's about Public Safety within the city limits of Tulsa.

Then, moving the boundary 25 miles from 41st and Yale:  

It's now about TERRORISM.

True Answer:  It's about FREE-LOADERS.

Tulsa should have no more than about 200 police cars.  That would save 4-fold our Capital Expenditures for new police cars, and reduce significantly our fuel expenditures incurred by the City operating budget by eliminating commuting expense.

[}:)]

Thank you for showing that you are completely uninformed. []

[shadows]

It seems that when this "out of city residence" was first established the conditions was that the employee would not be at a residence  greater in distance from his station than 25 minutes in case he was needed and called back.   There is a difference "as the crow flies" and the time by road.

[Wilbur]

quote:Originally posted by Friendly Bear

quote:Originally posted by MH2010

Friendlybear, The Department of Homeland security suggests that police department DO NOT park large numbers of police vehicles in areas.  They suggest take-home cars are one of the safest ways to insure that in an emergency (terrorist attack, natural disaster ect) officers will be able to effectively get to and operate their vehicles.

Youngtulsan has a great point.  Officers have been for that for years but the city won't do anything about it.

Recyclemichael, we've talked about this at length in previous threads.  Officers would love to support Tulsa but officers want to support their families more.  Officers can get more house for less money in the surrounding areas.  Also officers feel like they are less likely to run into someone they arrested when they are with their family when they are outside the city. If the city were to reward officers for living in the city then I'm sure more would move back in.  

The Heimat Sicherheitdienst (Homeland Security Department) may or may not have given that advice.  

The REAL answer is:  IT DEPENDS.

If the cars are concentrated in one location, then they can be guarded.  Cars scattered all over Tulsa are subject to vandalism or theft.

Tulsa is unlikely to suffer a Pearl Harbor type attack.  

The Police Car Take-Home Policy has been justified by a ever changing pretext:

It's about Public Safety within the city limits of Tulsa.

Then, moving the boundary 25 miles from 41st and Yale:  

It's now about TERRORISM.

True Answer:  It's about FREE-LOADERS.

Tulsa should have no more than about 200 police cars.  That would save 4-fold our Capital Expenditures for new police cars, and reduce significantly our fuel expenditures incurred by the City operating budget by eliminating commuting expense.

[}:)]

I'm not aware of any concern over the Japanese attaching Tulsa in the near future, but those little pesky tornadoes are a problem, and Tulsa's history of flooding is also a problem.

During the floods of '84 and '86, the City lost who-knows how many cars because one of the repair facilities (and the surrounding neighborhood) flooded.  Ask New Orleans who many police cars they lost due to flooding (nearly 500).

And if you cut the police car fleet by more then half, you simply end up buying more then twice as many cars because the cars end up being driven 24 hours a day instead of 10, thus they don't last as long.