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November 17, 2017, 06:54:40 pm
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Author Topic: Making the Case for Medical Marijuana  (Read 78725 times)
Conan71
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« Reply #45 on: September 15, 2011, 01:37:23 pm »

I very much agree with your last statement.

There is lots of controversy in Colorado and California as regards the medical usage. Many small communities are up in arms. Both states have movements to restrict or eliminate them. That is a preview of what would happen nationally.

Nationally, you could never get enough consensus, so I suspect it will be a state-by-state issue.  Are California and Colorado the only ones so far?  I would have thought Oregon and Vermont would have passed it by now.
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"It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first” -Ronald Reagan
Teatownclown
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« Reply #46 on: September 15, 2011, 03:01:11 pm »

It would not be an incentive to me as I like having full lung capacity and don't want them pasted up with tar toxins in the Tulsa air we breath.  I did enough damage over the years with smoking.  There's all sorts of long term health issues with drugs we choose to keep legal like tobacco and alcohol too.  Many of the same maladies as you outlined with the dope can be found with heavy alcohol use and genetic disorders.

We simply have to get a handle on how many people we incarcerate and this is one thing which would help, as well as trying to rehabilitate end users of other drugs rather than incarceration.

Love fixing up your posts.  Wink

Let's use the Portugal system. Well, that might be at conflict with our Afghanistan strategy of protecting the poppy distribution network.

Keep it illegal. Tattoo and massage parlors along with bars and restaurants leave enough retail for money laundering. Government regulation doesn't work if you'll recall. I've learned so much here at TNF. Too bad about Gweed. I had to start listening to hate radio to get educated...
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Teatownclown
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« Reply #47 on: September 15, 2011, 09:20:32 pm »

This is good.
Violent Attack At Marijuana Rally Ignored By Police
http://www.tokeofthetown.com/2011/09/violent_attack_at_marijuana_rally_ignored_by_polic.php

Culture war...it's part of the GOP playbook.
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« Reply #48 on: September 15, 2011, 10:04:45 pm »


Here is some info from Arizona:

Quote
Three-quarters of approved patients are men and about 60 percent are older than 41. But the department said two minors have also had applications approved. The vast majority of applicants cited chronic pain as the reason they needed medical marijuana.

Close to 80 percent of applicants have asked for approval to grow their own marijuana, which is allowed under Arizona law for anyone who does not live within 25 miles of a dispensary. Individuals approved to grow their own can legally maintain up to 12 plants in their homes and caregivers can grow for up to five patients at a time.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/election/azelections/articles/2011/07/14/20110714arizona-medical-marijuana-cards-0714.html

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Conan71
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« Reply #49 on: September 15, 2011, 10:29:28 pm »

This is good.
Violent Attack At Marijuana Rally Ignored By Police
http://www.tokeofthetown.com/2011/09/violent_attack_at_marijuana_rally_ignored_by_polic.php

Culture war...it's part of the GOP playbook.

Probably a drunk Tea Bagger, no doubt.  That or stoned on a legal Lortab prescription...

I question whether or not these were real potheads or plants.  Most heads I know wouldn't have the attention span for a one hour protest:

"J. would not go with the ambulance; he said he was not going to put his life in their hands after the way the cops 'kept peace' in Lansing!"

According to Zig Zag Man, J. is still in a lot of pain; his muscles were wrenched when his head was turned too far by being hit with a sign. He'll be seeing a doctor on Tuesday.

"What great people us 'potheads,' are," Zig Zag man wrote. "Thank you to all that cooperated for the one hour before the smile hit the fan. Boy, a couple of these women were right in his face. What was sort of funny was for every bit of Scripture he tried to spout, five or 10 people were yelling back at him the opposing Scripture. He could not believe potheads actually knew about the Bible!

"I could not have been prouder of all the people at the rally... Thank you all!"

Pothead FAIL!

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"It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first” -Ronald Reagan
dbacks fan
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« Reply #50 on: September 15, 2011, 11:19:49 pm »

Probably a drunk Tea Bagger, no doubt.  That or stoned on a legal Lortab prescription...
I question whether or not these were real potheads or plants.  Most heads I know wouldn't have the attention span for a one hour protest:
"J. would not go with the ambulance; he said he was not going to put his life in their hands after the way the cops 'kept peace' in Lansing!"
According to Zig Zag Man, J. is still in a lot of pain; his muscles were wrenched when his head was turned too far by being hit with a sign. He'll be seeing a doctor on Tuesday.
"What great people us 'potheads,' are," Zig Zag man wrote. "Thank you to all that cooperated for the one hour before the smile hit the fan. Boy, a couple of these women were right in his face. What was sort of funny was for every bit of Scripture he tried to spout, five or 10 people were yelling back at him the opposing Scripture. He could not believe potheads actually knew about the Bible!
"I could not have been prouder of all the people at the rally... Thank you all!"Pothead FAIL!

I saw more violence at a Walmart in Sun City watching little old ladies fight over the new items on the $1.00 or less table when they bring out new items.
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Teatownclown
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« Reply #51 on: September 16, 2011, 12:31:00 pm »


I question whether or not these were real potheads or plants.  Most heads I know wouldn't have the attention span for a one hour protest:

"J. would not go with the ambulance; he said he was not going to put his life in their hands after the way the cops 'kept peace' in Lansing!"

According to Zig Zag Man, J. is still in a lot of pain; his muscles were wrenched when his head was turned too far by being hit with a sign. He'll be seeing a doctor on Tuesday.

"What great people us 'potheads,' are," Zig Zag man wrote. "Thank you to all that cooperated for the one hour before the smile hit the fan. Boy, a couple of these women were right in his face. What was sort of funny was for every bit of Scripture he tried to spout, five or 10 people were yelling back at him the opposing Scripture. He could not believe potheads actually knew about the Bible!

"I could not have been prouder of all the people at the rally... Thank you all!"

Pothead FAIL!



They are shills for money launderers....Mexican drug lords ??

Actually, Fast food and doob seem to be the perfect combo for keeping a revolution at bay.

I just realized I can't post a pic....

Conan, I know you still would do a big fattie. Cheesy
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Conan71
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« Reply #52 on: September 16, 2011, 03:30:55 pm »

They are shills for money launderers....Mexican drug lords ??

Actually, Fast food and doob seem to be the perfect combo for keeping a revolution at bay.

I just realized I can't post a pic....

Conan, I know you still would do a big fattie. Cheesy

No, I quit doing fatties at about the same time I quit smoking doobies Wink
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jacobi
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« Reply #53 on: September 16, 2011, 08:03:27 pm »

pot should be legal in its own grounds.  Pragmatic arguments are distractions.
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AquaMan
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« Reply #54 on: September 17, 2011, 10:50:23 am »

Really.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #55 on: September 17, 2011, 07:34:32 pm »

Answer this question truthfully. Do you think the de-criminalization of marijuana, based on the argument that other drugs and alcohol are legal, will increase or decrease usage of the drug? And corollary questions...Will de-criminalization result in the corporatizing of the drugs production and marketing? Will you feel any safer knowing that you're being served by someone who is or recently was legally hammered?

I think it will increase usage and result in the passage of tons of regulations and lawsuits over who can and can't produce and sell it based on the history of moonshining. The long term usage negative health results, which beside cancer, may include permanent changes in brain function, genetic damage and early onset diabetes more than offset its relaxation abilities even if it is not a "gateway" drug. And I think it is incorrect to believe that where you buy your drugs has no impact on what other drugs you may buy. When I go to the liquor store for a bottle of wine and see cherry flavored Vodka, the weekend just got a little fuzzier. Wink


In a reality based world, we have experience on a nationwide scale - as I have posted here before.  And not the Netherlands.

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html


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AquaMan
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Just Cruz'n


« Reply #56 on: September 18, 2011, 12:04:58 pm »

In a reality based world, we have experience on a nationwide scale - as I have posted here before.  And not the Netherlands.

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html




Make note that the study was by the Libertarian Cato Institute. Might as well have the Catholic church do a study on the efficacy of birth control methods.

Want to talk reality? Take this paragraph-
At the recommendation of a national commission charged with addressing Portugal's drug problem, jail time was replaced with the offer of therapy. The argument was that the fear of prison drives addicts underground and that incarceration is more expensive than treatment — so why not give drug addicts health services instead? Under Portugal's new regime, people found guilty of possessing small amounts of drugs are sent to a panel consisting of a psychologist, social worker and legal adviser for appropriate treatment (which may be refused without criminal punishment), instead of jail.


We don't live in Europe. We aren't much like people in Portugal or Spain or France. You simply cannot confuse Americans with facts and expect them to respond with a reasonable approach to punishment, drug therapy and best use of resources.  That is fantasy.

First, find a president that has the fortitude to even propose such a commission. He won't be black or liberal I assure you. If we elected Ron Paul and I would say this process would work here as it would signal a quantum change in political outlook. Until then the Portugal experience will be pooh poohed by conservatives, hard liners from all sides and fundamental fanaticists who still think drug users are simply basically evil or under the spell of Satan.

Let me re-emphasize that I believe in de-criminalization of a lot of drug classifications. I just don't believe that we are ready to intelligently evolve to panels of psychologists, social workers and legal reps that refer drug users to treatment. Wish we were.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2011, 12:34:54 pm by AquaMan » Logged

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Teatownclown
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« Reply #57 on: September 19, 2011, 11:44:54 am »

Clearing the Smoke: The Science of Cannabis

http://video.pbs.org/video/1825223761?starttime=1200000


Take an hour and you will probably learn something useful; might just save your life someday. You'll want to move to Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Vermont, or California. Healthier states for aging boomers....
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Conan71
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« Reply #58 on: September 19, 2011, 11:56:13 am »

Clearing the Smoke: The Science of Cannabis

http://video.pbs.org/video/1825223761?starttime=1200000


Take an hour and you will probably learn something useful; might just save your life someday. You'll want to move to Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Vermont, or California. Healthier states for aging boomers.... Dead heads

FIFY  Wink
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #59 on: September 19, 2011, 12:25:10 pm »

Biggest problem is how we have shut down even the research on the chemicals that have the benefits.  I would just as soon take a pill with the proper stuff in it.  Don't have to smoke a joint to benefit from the stuff.


Plus what we miss out on for energy self sufficiency.  But we really aren't interested in that, are we?

C   Corn        200 bu/acre @ 56 lb/bushel   1200 lbs    .6 ton
S   Switchgrass   4-6 ton per acre             8,000 lbs   4 ton
H   Hemp            12-14 ton per acre          24,000 lbs  12 ton

During World War I - Biomass yield
WWI      German   50 gal/ton
      US      25 gal/ton - faster throughput

German   C   50 x .6      30 gal
      S   50 x 4      200 gal
      H   50 x 10   500 gal

US      C   25 x .6      15 gal
      S   25 x 4      100 gal
      H   25 x 10   250 gal


US oil useage   19,500,000 barrels/day (we are down from this)
Gallons          819,000,000 gallons/day
            
At 50 gal per ton, need 819,000,000/50 = 16,380,000 tons biomass per day.
At 14 ton per acre, need 16,380,000/14 = 1,170,000 acres per day equivalent of growing biomass.
At 365 days per year, need 27860 x 365 = 427,050,000 acres.
At 640 acres per square mile, need 10,167,858/640 = 667,266 square miles of growing biomass.

Area of state in square miles - just 8 states!

Nebraska    77,421 sq. miles
Kansas      82,264
South Dakota   77,353
Oklahoma   69,899
Texas      268,580
Wyoming   97,813
Montana   147,042
Sub total         820,372

Missouri   69,704
Virginia   42,774
Next Sub total         932,850

Even if we just used part of our farmland, and maybe some marginal land, we could easily cover today's needs.  And it would be very easy to just use MJ for part of our energy needs.  Suppose we only grow half... then we are at energy self-sufficiency.  No more foreign imports.

Yeah, off topic.  But it really IS a part of the total topic - stupid drug laws!



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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without.

What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
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