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November 23, 2017, 09:29:57 pm
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Author Topic: Pedestrian Bridge  (Read 6379 times)
TheArtist
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« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2017, 09:06:15 pm »

Here is an original idea from a friend of mine on another site. Maybe it's the extra caffeine I've swilled today, but I'm contemplating submitting something for this -- or, at least, posting something about it now so that others will take my idea and run with it. I was envisioning a new pedestrian bridge like the Ponte Vecchio in Florence, except Tulsa's could be the Art Dec-chio over Arkansas -- or something much less stupid-sounding -- with local-centric retail shops and food stalls, art displays, you name it. Oh! Or The Boxyard Over the Arkansas! Anyway, I'm excited to see what some of our area's awesome visionaries come up with.

Believe it or not back in the early oil boom years of the 20s & 30s they envisioned a Ponte Vecchio type bridge over the Arkansas River.  I wish I had saved the drawing I saw of it.  
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Conan71
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« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2017, 09:10:08 pm »

Putting some (real) trolley rails across the river there might be a good route for a trolley to get downtown folks to both the Gathering Place and Turkey Mountain.  There would be some difficulties using the old Midland Valley R.O.W. but it is a possibility. Think trolley parks of the late 1800s.


I like the sound of that...a lot!
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2017, 08:44:51 am »

We just added a rail crossing at Southwest Blvd/244.  To go along with the 2 interstate bridges, the abandoned bridge, the SW Blvd bridge and the pedestrian bridge.  I do not believe that rail line is in use or even leased out to anyone yet.  My guess is adding the requirements to carry trains would exponentially increase the expense.'

There are a ton of awesome designs out there:
http://www.architecturaldigest.com/gallery/worlds-best-pedestrian-bridges/all

https://www.google.com/search?q=best+pedestrian+bridges&espv=2&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjY37DvqurSAhXDxVQKHXSPAksQ_AUIBigB&biw=1600&bih=771

There are some that are really high and look awesome (like the Big Dam Bridge in Little Rock, but that doesnt make much sense for this crossing).  Others have multiple access points for one span.  Still others have elements that support the bridge in interesting ways (cable stay, diagonal piers, arches, etc.).  Some have amazing covers.  Still others see a bridge that is basic, but is covered in artwork that makes it amazing.  Tons of ideas to grab, combine, and come up with something Tulsa can love.

One element I would love to see incorporated (aside from usefulness as a crossing for pedestrians and cyclists) is something to draw people to the bridge itself.  Not just a crossing.  Platforms for fishing.  Observation points. Kayaking from the middle.  A central tower that you can go up in for awesome views.  An area to rent for birthday parties... whatever.    Pick one, pick them all. 

Please, oh please, not a basic design that just gets the job done. If we are removing a century old bridge with charactor, lets add something with character. 
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sgrizzle
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« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2017, 04:18:22 pm »

I vote more character. It could be a giant big mouth billy bass and I'd be okay with it. I want it to be a real focal point. The old bridge was neat but not amazing.
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« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2017, 04:47:59 pm »

We just added a rail crossing at Southwest Blvd/244.  To go along with the 2 interstate bridges, the abandoned bridge, the SW Blvd bridge and the pedestrian bridge.  I do not believe that rail line is in use or even leased out to anyone yet.  My guess is adding the requirements to carry trains would exponentially increase the expense.

A trolley is admittedly not going to happen right now.  Adding the capability to easily add a trolley later might be a reasonable expense.  Also, the requirements to add a trolley should not be as difficult to meet as providing for a train.  Trolleys run in the streets in a lot of places.  The bridge trolley to pedestrian separation could be as simple as a fence with periodic crossing points.



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sgrizzle
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« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2017, 04:57:57 pm »

A trolley is admittedly not going to happen right now.  Adding the capability to easily add a trolley later might be a reasonable expense.  Also, the requirements to add a trolley should not be as difficult to meet as providing for a train.  Trolleys run in the streets in a lot of places.  The bridge trolley to pedestrian separation could be as simple as a fence with periodic crossing points.





Technically the new rail bridge has no rails on it currently. Could run something else.
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« Reply #21 on: March 24, 2017, 12:09:48 pm »

I read through this sting yesterday, and took the opportunity to ride out onto the bridge later in the day.   I had not been out on the bridge since they closed the East side, and I had forgotten how cool it is out there.   I'm not an architect, and don't have time to put together a submssion, but here are a few thoughts from my time out there yesterday.

(In no order)

- A viewing platform, tower, or similar, out in the middle is a must-have.   It's such a neat perspective, and we want to draw people out onto the bridge, not just use it to get to the other side.

- Fishing, Kayaking, etc.  I love to fish and kayak, and some kind of water-level platform (or two, placed at "thirds" on the bridge) to provide water-level access would be amazingly cool.  But, I also have some concerns with this.  Right now, the "no go" cable is very close on the down-stream side of the bridge, between the bridge and dam.  Particularly in a higher-water situation, I could see this being a safety issue.  Now, if the new dam is safe to go over in an emergency, then the low platform would work.  Otherwise, for safety reasons, I don't see it happening.  (But seriously, this should be looked at hard.  Would be really cool.)

- Bridge is (obviously) way too narrow in its current form.  Even if were double decked, it's a bit more narrow than comfortable if restricted to pedestrian and/or bike per level.  My initial emotional opinion was "keep the bridge", but after riding out yesterday I agree that it is better to build a new bridge.

- Double deck, or wide single?  There are downsides to each option.  If a person is "actively" riding, as I was yesterday, then double-deck is the way to go.  Unlike the river trails, where walkers, etc, can stay to their lanes,  on the bridge I think we will see people switching sides, standing, fishing, whatever, and that's going to greatly restrict flow for cyclists.  However, what if I have commuter bike and I want to access the pedestrian level?  Could I walk it across on that level?  Again, if the bridge itself (with sightseeing, a tower, platforms, etc) is to be the actual destination,  movement on the bridge will be chaotic, not linear.   Also,  the upper (cycling) deck would provide needed shade for the pedestrian users below.  I'm leaning double-decker, but not sure.

- Style.  Admittedly, I don't have a firm opinion as there are so many interesting options.  I do think we need to consider some level of continuity with the Gathering Place and other bridges.  Some very modern looking structure, while in and of itself might be cool, would (to me) seem out of place.  I did have one thought.  Would it be possible to re-use certain sections of the trusses from the existing bridge an incorporate them in a new bridge purely for style/decoration?  This would work best with some kind of platform bridge as compared to a suspension, but would be a good way to stylistically blend the old with the new.  But again, I like the old bridge so maybe I'm being sentimental on this last point.

Just thoughts from a bike ride yesterday.

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« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2017, 05:11:04 pm »

Would it be possible to re-use certain sections of the trusses from the existing bridge an incorporate them in a new bridge purely for style/decoration? 

Considering the age and potential corrosion issues, it may be less expensive to duplicate the trusses.  I agree that trusses look better than plain old concrete.
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sgrizzle
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« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2017, 08:32:36 pm »

Considering the age and potential corrosion issues, it may be less expensive to duplicate the trusses.  I agree that trusses look better than plain old concrete.

Give the old ones to a metal artist, make some big sculpture.
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johrasephoenix
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« Reply #24 on: March 25, 2017, 08:02:10 am »

Speaking of bridges, is anything planned for the old Highway 66 bridge next to the I-244 bridge?  It always seems like it could be cool again.
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sgrizzle
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« Reply #25 on: March 25, 2017, 08:28:59 pm »

Speaking of bridges, is anything planned for the old Highway 66 bridge next to the I-244 bridge?  It always seems like it could be cool again.

Structurally unsafe for vehicles at the present time. There were some ideas to try to turn it into something, but there would be weight/usage limitations.
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Conan71
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« Reply #26 on: March 26, 2017, 09:55:09 am »

Structurally unsafe for vehicles at the present time. There were some ideas to try to turn it into something, but there would be weight/usage limitations.

Structurally unsafe for pedestrians as well, IIRC.
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« Reply #27 on: March 26, 2017, 10:17:59 am »

Structurally unsafe for pedestrians as well, IIRC.

I remember it that way too.
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« Reply #28 on: April 03, 2017, 08:20:03 am »

Structurally unsafe for pedestrians as well, IIRC.

And millions of dollars to rehab to make it safe.  My hope is that if the Route 66 museum is ever built that eventually they will want to have the bridge open for pedestrians as part of the overall museum/Rt 66 plaza experience. 
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« Reply #29 on: April 03, 2017, 02:55:57 pm »

And millions of dollars to rehab to make it safe.  My hope is that if the Route 66 museum is ever built that eventually they will want to have the bridge open for pedestrians as part of the overall museum/Rt 66 plaza experience. 

I hope it makes it that long.
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