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November 17, 2017, 10:39:51 pm
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Author Topic: New Striping on MLK and Detriot  (Read 1292 times)
johrasephoenix
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« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2017, 08:42:37 am »

If you are talking about the wasteland north of 244, I'm not sure what injustice you are referring to.  That wasn't gutted during the riots of 1921 if that was what you were implying.  That was all leveled in the 1980's or '90's as a result of urban renewal efforts.

Exactly.  That urban renewal was a terrible mistake, especially because it still sits empty decades later.  If those houses still stood I could see that area being rapidly improved.  It would be the only traditional neighborhood in Tulsa within walking distance of the cool parts of downtown.

I read a historic preservation study from (i think?) 1990 that described the area as being pretty awesome, like Brady Heights with a little commercial districts, just really run down.  If that area could have made it another 10 years I think the tide would have turned against large scale urban renewal and the neighborhood would have been saved.  Thank God the urban renewal people didn't decide to go bonzai blight removal on Kendall-Whittier. 
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dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2017, 09:31:24 am »

Exactly.  That urban renewal was a terrible mistake, especially because it still sits empty decades later.  If those houses still stood I could see that area being rapidly improved.  It would be the only traditional neighborhood in Tulsa within walking distance of the cool parts of downtown.

I read a historic preservation study from (i think?) 1990 that described the area as being pretty awesome, like Brady Heights with a little commercial districts, just really run down.  If that area could have made it another 10 years I think the tide would have turned against large scale urban renewal and the neighborhood would have been saved.  Thank God the urban renewal people didn't decide to go bonzai blight removal on Kendall-Whittier. 

IIRC most of that area made parts of burned out Detroit look nice. It was a crime infested, drug and prostitution area filled with a lot of abandoned torn up houses.
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Conan71
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« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2017, 09:57:58 am »

Exactly.  That urban renewal was a terrible mistake, especially because it still sits empty decades later.  If those houses still stood I could see that area being rapidly improved.  It would be the only traditional neighborhood in Tulsa within walking distance of the cool parts of downtown.

I read a historic preservation study from (i think?) 1990 that described the area as being pretty awesome, like Brady Heights with a little commercial districts, just really run down.  If that area could have made it another 10 years I think the tide would have turned against large scale urban renewal and the neighborhood would have been saved.  Thank God the urban renewal people didn't decide to go bonzai blight removal on Kendall-Whittier. 

Echoing DBacks:

Much of that was too far gone for restoration.  Gentrification would have had to have happened in the 1950's or 1960's for that area to have survived.

IMO, a wasteland is better than what was there in terms of crime but I never thought it would sit vacant as long as it has.
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"It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first” -Ronald Reagan
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« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2017, 11:36:44 am »

Very confusing to ask people to park in a street between driving lanes and bike lanes. I get that it's safer for the riders but people struggle enough driving in downtown and there is more confusion to deal with.

Takes some folks quite a while to sort through the confusion and adapt to change.  I still see cars nosed in to the back-in designed parking on Detroit across from the Rusty Crane. 
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« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2017, 11:49:18 am »



Takes some folks quite a while to sort through the confusion and adapt to change.  I still see cars nosed in to the back-in designed parking on Detroit across from the Rusty Crane.
 

True, and that's one reason for the recommendation to paint the bike lanes green.  It's more expensive, but can make a new, unfamiliar, possibly confusing roadway condition more understandable to drivers.

I've seen vehicles parked head-in on spaces clearly marked as back-in, and I've seen cars backed in to parking spaces clearly marked as head-in.  In Tulsa, the angled parking is willy-nilly, and it's very confusing to some people, because it often involves drivers making illegal U-turns, crossing the centerline of two-way streets, and similar unsafe maneuvers.

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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2017, 08:35:36 am »

So here we are.  If the streets had remained 2 way, suburbia never would have happened.   Grin

Nope.  The one way streets were largely a response to the desire of suburban citizens to get to and from work as fast as possible.  But... they did hasten the decline of downtown and the trend they reflected is beginning to be reversed, even in Tulsa.  If the freeways were never built, maybe downtown wouldn't have been gutted.  But that fate was rare in mid-sized cities, regardless of the circumstances.   Hell - there have been volumes written speculating on the whys.  (yes, I realize you were just poking me for fun, but I couldn't resist the discussion)

Quote from: Conan
If you are talking about the wasteland north of 244, I'm not sure what injustice you are referring to.  That wasn't gutted during the riots of 1921 if that was what you were implying.  That was all leveled in the 1980's or '90's as a result of urban renewal efforts.

How to Kill Main Street and Make it Look Like an Accident
http://djeffries.com/kill-thriving-main-street/

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Dspike
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« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2017, 12:16:46 pm »

Exactly.  That urban renewal was a terrible mistake, especially because it still sits empty decades later.  If those houses still stood I could see that area being rapidly improved.  It would be the only traditional neighborhood in Tulsa within walking distance of the cool parts of downtown.

I read a historic preservation study from (i think?) 1990 that described the area as being pretty awesome, like Brady Heights with a little commercial districts, just really run down.  If that area could have made it another 10 years I think the tide would have turned against large scale urban renewal and the neighborhood would have been saved.  Thank God the urban renewal people didn't decide to go bonzai blight removal on Kendall-Whittier. 

Michael Bates's article on the "steps to nowhere" has a great history of that area (link below). While it was hollowed out during urban renewal, the final bulldozing was for the proposed 4-year university that we now know as OSU-Tulsa. If that land were used to create a 20,000 student campus on the edge of downtown, it would be a big winner for municipal finances, downtown development, demand for walkable attractions, and exposing non-Tulsans to our downtown during their college years. Not sure if that is a feasible goal, but those 200 acres are almost certainly the most promising large patch of undeveloped urban landscape in any city our size.


http://thislandpress.com/2014/06/18/steps-to-nowhere/
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