Th Politics of Groceries: Gateway closed today 7/29/2014

[Hoss]

This QT has been out North for years.

QuikTrip
4545 N Lewis Ave
46th St N
Tulsa - North, OK 74110

Also. I believe the whole 7 Eleven in OKC and QT in Tulsa. Stems from a Gentleman's agreement between owners to not infringe on one another dominance in the areas. I may be wrong in what I have heard.

You may or may not be wrong but that is the gist of it.  I've never heard any thing to prove or disprove this but it does sound plausible.

[BKDotCom]

Also. I believe the whole 7 Eleven in OKC and QT in Tulsa. Stems from a Gentleman's agreement between owners to not infringe on one another dominance in the areas. I may be wrong in what I have heard.

Ditto.  There's simply no market reason for that to not be the case.

Edit:  PS.  QuikTrip's store locator sucks

[heironymouspasparagus]

You may or may not be wrong but that is the gist of it.  I've never heard any thing to prove or disprove this but it does sound plausible.

I always heard it was Love's and QT....maybe they got a 3-way going....?

[swake]

I always heard it was Love's and QT....maybe they got a 3-way going....?

Love's and QT directly compete in some cities. It's the owner of QT and 7-11 in Oklahoma City, which is not the same company as the national 7-11 chain. I heard they went to college together.

[AquaMan]

Chet Cadiuex personally told me in 2007 they would not open in areas they believed to be unprofitable or have potential for shrink and/or employee/customer safety issues.  They have an existing store at Lewis & 46th St N, he did not see them opening any other stores in North Tulsa.

An obviously more powerful post when it comes from the mouth. Still, he makes a judgement call. And I am more nervous at the QT on 15th and Denver and 11th and Utica than I am stopping in Turley.  I just get tired of the old saw that North Tulsa is just too crime ridden and poor to be considered for decent retailing. Its generalizing that people over there are somehow less civilized than the rest of the city.  Yet, Dollar General, Braums, McDonalds, anything Fried Chicken related all survive. Family Mkt has a unit at 65th street north that does well.

Gilcrease Hills and Reservoir Hill alone should have been enough to sustain a well run mkt. Throw in Brady and Owen Park and you have to wonder if its something else at play.

[AquaMan]

Hmm..Pine & Mingo would be considered north of Admiral.  Don't get your Tulsa geographical info from Sauer, please...  

I thought of that one but didn't consider it "classic" North Tulsa. More like East or Airport, but yes, I should have mentioned it and one at 46th street North and Lewis that I don't remember seeing.

[AquaMan]

There’s only about 114 in the DFW metro.  There’s also six QT's north of Admiral, including one at *GASP* 46th Noff & Lewis.

edit: Just for fun here’s where all QT is these days:

Georgia: Atlanta (130 stores)
Texas: Dallas/Fort Worth (114 stores)
Arizona: Phoenix (88 stores)
Arizona: Tucson (17 stores)
Kansas: Wichita (38 stores)
Kansas/Missouri: Kansas City (82 stores)
Missouri/Illinois: St. Louis (75 stores)
Oklahoma: Tulsa (70 stores)
Iowa: Des Moines (24 stores)
Nebraska: Omaha (12 stores)
South Carolina: Greenville/Spartanburg (24 stores)
North and South Carolina: Charlotte (26 stores)

Guilty as charged. I was trying to make the point that observations are not necessarily based on profit/loss business decisions. When someone says that its obvious that since there is no QT at Pine and Peoria it must be judged a business bad location, that is a false assumption.

Glad QT is doing well. I am a big customer.

[AquaMan]

There is also a store on the NW corner of Admiral and Delaware and a newer 3rd Gen store on N Gilcrease Rd at 412/51.  They, along with most people, consider the "danger zone" of North Tulsa to be Memorial to LL Tisdale and Admiral to Owasso.  Pine & Mingo serves the employees at the airport and surrounding industry.

Owasso the city? That's a pretty large area to consider as the "danger zone". Includes a lot of large rural areas as well.

There are some areas I drove through over there that are plain and simple badass. The locals don't care for them either. Lots of boarded up homes and shopping centers. I'm thinking ground zero over there is north and west of McClain, around 46th and MLK and of course anywhere near subsidized apartment complexes. But there are lots of average hoods sprinkled throughout North Tulsa particularly west of Memorial to Harvard and north of Admiral to Pine. Isn't Reservoir Hill east of Tisdale? That was my impression anyway and I did grow up here and worked the area the last couple years.

[Conan71]

Owasso the city? That's a pretty large area to consider as the "danger zone". Includes a lot of large rural areas as well.

There are some areas I drove through over there that are plain and simple badass. The locals don't care for them either. Lots of boarded up homes and shopping centers. I'm thinking ground zero over there is north and west of McClain, around 46th and MLK and of course anywhere near subsidized apartment complexes. But there are lots of average hoods sprinkled throughout North Tulsa particularly west of Memorial to Harvard and north of Admiral to Pine. Isn't Reservoir Hill east of Tisdale? That was my impression anyway and I did grow up here and worked the area the last couple years.

Unfortunately, those pockets of misery and crime take their toll on the nicer parts of north Tulsa when it comes to amenities.  I absolutely refuse to ride the bike trail from OSU Tulsa to Skiatook ever again.  It has nothing to do with perceived danger, it’s the broken glass and other debris deliberately strewn on the trail and young thugs hanging out in the middle of the trail who refuse to move when you approach them.  We do nice things for north Tulsa like parks and rec centers and eventually they are plagued by graffiti and become gang hang-outs.  Again, reality not perception.

I feel far safer riding Cincinnati or Peoria where at least there’s enough visibility people won’t mess with you.  Or they figure that middle-aged white boy in spandex on a bicycle riding up MLK must be crazy, so don’t mess with him.

[rebound]

I absolutely refuse to ride the bike trail from OSU Tulsa to Skiatook ever again.  It has nothing to do with perceived danger, it’s the broken glass and other debris deliberately strewn on the trail and young thugs hanging out in the middle of the trail who refuse to move when you approach them.

I used to come in from Owasso on that trail all the time, (Go Across 66th N and hit it just West of Peoria and then on into Tulsa)  and I had to quit as well.  Had two flats on one trip due to the glass everywhere.   And for me, it WAS about perceived danger.  Especially that stretch from 36thN to 51stN.  The trees aren't even cut back away from the trail, and I had a few too many situations where I felt a little too hung out there alone.  There was, I think, an attempted rape of a female cyclist 2-3 years ago.  In a group it's probably fine, but I won't ride it alone again.

[rdj]

Owasso the city? That's a pretty large area to consider as the "danger zone". Includes a lot of large rural areas as well.

There are some areas I drove through over there that are plain and simple badass. The locals don't care for them either. Lots of boarded up homes and shopping centers. I'm thinking ground zero over there is north and west of McClain, around 46th and MLK and of course anywhere near subsidized apartment complexes. But there are lots of average hoods sprinkled throughout North Tulsa particularly west of Memorial to Harvard and north of Admiral to Pine. Isn't Reservoir Hill east of Tisdale? That was my impression anyway and I did grow up here and worked the area the last couple years.

I was meaning "most people" by the statement taking north Tulsa to Owasso.

Reservoir Hill is the hill that rises on the east side of the Tisdale Pkwy between Pine & Apache.  The neighborhood association boundaries only include roughly the houses from Main west to the Tisdale and Denver Ave/Denver Blvd north to Zion.

[AquaMan]

Reservoir Hill seems to be in your danger zone. So is the Brady District.

[rdj]

Reservoir Hill seems to be in your danger zone. So is the Brady District.

For most of Tulsa it is.  When we moved to the hill in 2009 we invited a few friends over for dinner.  One our friends asked if her purse was safe in her car while parked in my driveway.  They haven't been invited back.

[rdj]

Here is what OKC is doing to eliminate one of their food deserts.

Northeast Oklahoma City area declared blighted
by Steve Lackmeyer Modified: July 30, 2014 at 4:00 pm •  Published: July 30, 2014



A large portion of northeast Oklahoma City centered at NE 23 and Martin Luther King Avenue was declared “blighted” Tuesday by the Oklahoma City Council after the panel received a new study showing the area is struggling with high unemployment and crime, plummeting home ownership, unsafe conditions and crumbling buildings and infrastructure.

The blight declaration allows the Urban Renewal Authority to pursue a redevelopment plan for an area bounded by Phillips Avenue, Sooner Road, NE 36 and NE 20. City officials also have indicated their focus will be on commercial properties, not residential, and will concentrate on a one-half mile area surrounding NE 23, N Kelley Avenue, N Martin Luther King Avenue, and Interstate 35.

Assistant Planning Director Ian Colgan told the city council the Northeast Renaissance Renewal Area study looked at whether the area met four conditions for blight — dilapidation, arrested economic development, unsafe conditions, deterioration of site or other improvements. In all four cases, the area was found to be blighted.

Population, Colgan said, dropped by 11.1 percent between 1990 and 2000 and by 4.8 percent between 2001 and 2010. Citywide population, meanwhile, grew 13.8 percent during the first 10 years and 14.6 precent during the second decade surveyed.

“In total, about 2,500 people left the study area in those two decades,” Colgan said.

The study also revealed that in 1990, the area still enjoyed a high percentage of homeownership, with 66 percent owning homes in the study area compared to 59 percent citywide. But in the past 20 years, homeownership dropped to 50 percent for the study area, while citywide homeownership increased to 61 percent.

The study also showed 139 vacant and abandoned buildings per square mile in the study area, compared to 19 citywide.

“This shows people are leaving— a decline in investment,” Colgan said. “Decline in taxable market value has been stark.”

Unemployment for the area in 2012 averaged 11.6 percent, almost twice the citywide unemployment rate of 6.6 percent the same year. The city’s own investment also was shown to be lacking, with 30 percent of streets and infrastructure in poor shape.

Homicide, rape, robbery, assault, weapons, burglary, narcotics crimes were all rated higher than the rest of the city. The area is littered with contaminated properties and illegal dumping sites.

The study is being done as the area’s Ward 7 councilman, John Pettis, is leading the charge to change the area’s direction. The city, along with The Alliance for Economic Development of Oklahoma City, is working on creation of a tax increment financing district to rebuild the area and draw new development.

Those efforts include King’s Crossing at NE 23 and Martin Luther King Avenue — a $30 million development led by the owners of Buy For Less that will include a new 58,000-square-foot Uptown Market, other new retail and space for offices, a school and housing. Construction on the store is expected to start this winter.

http://newsok.com/northeast-oklahoma-city-area-declared-blighted/article/5102325

[Townsend]

Here is what OKC is doing to eliminate one of their food deserts.

Northeast Oklahoma City area declared blighted
by Steve Lackmeyer Modified: July 30, 2014 at 4:00 pm •  Published: July 30, 2014

http://newsok.com/northeast-oklahoma-city-area-declared-blighted/article/5102325

You notice the story talks about the area's councilman taking steps to get something done?