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Author Topic: Making the Case for Medical Marijuana  (Read 395746 times)
patric
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« Reply #510 on: December 20, 2014, 02:09:20 pm »

So, do we now set up border crossings at the points of entry with Colorado?  String up a border fence?


Thousands of people are petitioning Oklahoma Attorney General Scott Pruitt and Nebraska Attorney General Jon Bruning, asking them to withdraw the lawsuit.
http://kfor.com/2014/12/20/new-petition-asks-oklahoma-attorney-general-to-withdraw-lawsuit-against-colorado/



Wallace Collins, the chairman of the Oklahoma Democratic Party, issued the following statement regarding Pruitt’s involvement with the lawsuit:

    “It is astounding that Mr. Pruitt didn’t even realize that the Republican bill passed by his colleagues last week contains language that prohibits the US Department of Justice from interfering with state marijuana laws. It is ironic that Mr. Pruitt is the crusader against frivolous lawsuits, but he personally files a significant number of them. Also, I though Mr. Pruitt campaigned on home rule and local control, but he is the first to fight local control and home rule. Did the pharmaceutical industry write this lawsuit for him?”

When speaking about the pharmaceutical industry, Collins is referring to a recent controversy involving Pruitt and his alleged ties with energy companies
( http://kfor.com/2014/12/08/i-was-stunned-ny-times-article-blasts-oklahoma-attorney-general-accuses-him-of-secret-alliance ).



https://www.change.org/p/scott-pruitt-withdraw-the-lawsuit-against-colorado-s-marijuana-legalization-laws
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« Reply #511 on: December 20, 2014, 08:00:52 pm »

According to the Whirled, Oklahoma authorities are confiscating bags of marijuana that contain from 15 to 400 pounds. A non-resident cannot legally purchase more than 1/4 of an ounce and a resident cannot purchase more than an ounce. So those buyers and sellers - if this does indeed originate in Colorado - are already breaking the law. State and federal authorities have raided a few grow operations for back door sales.

So it seems our AG's effort is an attempt to make what is illegal more illegaler. Next thing you know, he'll put Colorado on double secret probation.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/government/oklahoma-officials-say-colorado-unable-to-control-marijuana-industry/article_8d000885-d18a-5055-ab0b-a1dbb45e0d71.html
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patric
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« Reply #512 on: December 21, 2014, 11:24:52 am »

According to the Whirled, Oklahoma authorities are confiscating bags of marijuana that contain from 15 to 400 pounds. A non-resident cannot legally purchase more than 1/4 of an ounce and a resident cannot purchase more than an ounce. So those buyers and sellers - if this does indeed originate in Colorado - are already breaking the law. State and federal authorities have raided a few grow operations for back door sales.

So it seems our AG's effort is an attempt to make what is illegal more illegaler. Next thing you know, he'll put Colorado on double secret probation.

For those who dont read the Whirled, here's what your missing:


“If Colorado had merely legalized marijuana for personal use and possession then there would be no lawsuit from Oklahoma and Nebraska,” Pruitt said in a written statement.

If you really like that idea, why not suggest it for your own state?



The real problem seems to be less legal sales of Colorado marijuana and more what appear to be illegal sales of potent new strains of cannabis grown in both licensed and unlicensed facilities and in the state’s vast wilderness areas.

That's still illegal in Colorado, so the suit wants to shut down the parts that are legal?



And this gem from the Narcotics Bureau:

As (OBN spokesman) Woodward noted, some of the most potent marijuana is being grown in Colorado — so much so that pot is now being smuggled from the U.S. into Mexico.
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #513 on: December 21, 2014, 02:52:11 pm »

Guido,

Please recall that Oklahomans sued Oklahoma over the constitutionality of the anti gay legislation. Colorado didn't.

Additionally, we aren't arguing that Oklahomans have an equal protection argument to not have pot sold to Colorado citizens in Colorado.
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Conan71
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« Reply #514 on: December 21, 2014, 08:56:17 pm »

Thousands of people are petitioning Oklahoma Attorney General Scott Pruitt and Nebraska Attorney General Jon Bruning, asking them to withdraw the lawsuit.
http://kfor.com/2014/12/20/new-petition-asks-oklahoma-attorney-general-to-withdraw-lawsuit-against-colorado/



Wallace Collins, the chairman of the Oklahoma Democratic Party, issued the following statement regarding Pruitt’s involvement with the lawsuit:

    “It is astounding that Mr. Pruitt didn’t even realize that the Republican bill passed by his colleagues last week contains language that prohibits the US Department of Justice from interfering with state marijuana laws. It is ironic that Mr. Pruitt is the crusader against frivolous lawsuits, but he personally files a significant number of them. Also, I though Mr. Pruitt campaigned on home rule and local control, but he is the first to fight local control and home rule. Did the pharmaceutical industry write this lawsuit for him?”

When speaking about the pharmaceutical industry, Collins is referring to a recent controversy involving Pruitt and his alleged ties with energy companies
( http://kfor.com/2014/12/08/i-was-stunned-ny-times-article-blasts-oklahoma-attorney-general-accuses-him-of-secret-alliance ).



https://www.change.org/p/scott-pruitt-withdraw-the-lawsuit-against-colorado-s-marijuana-legalization-laws

I’m personally convinced Pruitt has bigger political ambitions and he’s padding his resume as an arch conservative the Tea Party would love to run.
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« Reply #515 on: December 21, 2014, 10:31:13 pm »

I know. But enough about Obama....


That sounds like what I heard kids say in third grade...  "I know you are, but what am I...?"


Come on, guido, I know you can do better than that!!


I am curious about one thing - from the legal view - do you or your friends feel like Pruitt has been an asset to the state from an AG standpoint?

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« Reply #516 on: December 22, 2014, 12:10:08 am »

I’m personally convinced Pruitt has bigger political ambitions and he’s padding his resume as an arch conservative the Tea Party would love to run.

I could easily be convinced to vote against him.
 
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #517 on: December 22, 2014, 01:52:32 pm »

The number's don't support the claim. QUICK over lunch style math, it seems like Oklahoma had an adaquate supply of pot before. Given that is was an unregulated "black" market, that stands to reason. But nonetheless...

In 2001 (last year data is published by the DOJ) 19,125 POUNDS of marijuana were confiscated "on Oklahoma's highways."  Presumably, a multiplier of that amount was confiscated not on highways. Shall we say 30,000 pounds to be conservative?
http://www.justice.gov/archive/ndic/pubs2/2286/marijuan.htm

At the border, the US Border Patrol estimates they manage to confiscate at most 20% of the drugs people try to smuggle across (many estimates say 5-10%). I'm guessing we do a little worse than military-grade-check-point when it gets into Oklahoma.  But sure, lets say we catch 1/5th of the marijuana coming in. That mean's there is 150,000 pounds of marijuana a year in Oklahoma.
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/05/30/18589533-experts-say-drug-mules-are-easy-to-find-hard-to-catch?lite

About 10% of the population in Oklahoma considers themselves a regular user. That's 380,000 people.
http://www.statemaster.com/country/OK-oklahoma/hea-health

So, (30000 * 5 * 16)/380000 = OZ per user.

Or 6.3 OZ of weed per user per year. Or about an eighth of an ounce per week per user. Which is TWICE the estimate of the "average" user according to some book from Cambridge...
https://books.google.com/books?id=lCbenVFNlzkC&pg=PA155&lpg=PA155&dq=average+marijuana+consumption+per+user&source=bl&ots=mbiIPA8HeV&sig=xvtaWC9gekD0BEpI9LvBbCcFgQg&hl=en&sa=X&ei=x3CYVLagDIiMyATRxIKgAw&ved=0CFoQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=average%20marijuana%20consumption%20per%20user&f=false

In Colorado, they found that average user consume .6 grams per day. Which would pretty much put my numbers of marijuana in Oklahoma on par with demand/use in Oklahoma prior to Colorado legalizing marijuana (to be fair, Colorado's use stats come out to ~7oz per user.  I'm assuming pot heads in Colorado can show us up, on average).
https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/sites/default/files/Market%20Size%20and%20Demand%20Study,%20July%209,%202014%5B1%5D.pdf
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One top of that, they destroyed 8000 outdoor plants and some indoor plants. Do you think they got half? Pretending they did that's 16,000 total plants in Oklahoma - at ~2 pounds of product per plant that's ANOTHER 32,000 pounds of marijuana that likely didn't have to risk being transported as far.
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ECONOMICS doesn't support the claim either -

IN Denver, an ounce of marijuana regualrily sells for $250 an ounce + 21% tax = $302:
https://www.coloradopotguide.com/colorado-marijuana-blog/2014/may/28/marijuana-prices-dropping-in-denver/
priceofweed.com

The DOJ says commercial-grade marijuana sells in Tulsa for $120 to $250 an ounce (trying to look at comparable grades):
http://www.justice.gov/archive/ndic/pubs2/2286/marijuan.htm
priceofweed.com

So why take the extra risk of illegal sales, trafficking, and reselling a product when any gain that is had is marginal at best, and likely non-existent on the originator's side?


Sure, it's possible and even likely that some people are exploiting Colorado's law to bring home some pot.  It is also possible that some people are using it to smuggle in hundreds of pounds - but I can't see that as a significant factor int he tens of thousands of pounds grown and consumed in Oklahoma on an annual basis.

and I simply don't buy the argument that Oklahoma HAD to sue Colorado to support Federalism. I assume that argument is a joke. "Look Colorado, we are going to sue you to overturn your law and try to make the Federal government force you to enforce their law which is contrary to your law because neither you nor the Federal government want that to happen, so we assume this will all work out when the Court orders the Federal government to enforce their law by making Colorado have its police and troopers enforce it for them. K Thx Bai, Oklahoma"



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patric
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« Reply #518 on: December 28, 2014, 05:29:37 pm »

and I simply don't buy the argument that Oklahoma HAD to sue Colorado to support Federalism. I assume that argument is a joke. "Look Colorado, we are going to sue you to overturn your law and try to make the Federal government force you to enforce their law which is contrary to your law because neither you nor the Federal government want that to happen, so we assume this will all work out when the Court orders the Federal government to enforce their law by making Colorado have its police and troopers enforce it for them. K Thx Bai, Oklahoma"


On the "Casinos will have first legal pot in Oklahoma" front:

FLAGSTAFF, Ariz. — The Navajo Nation had bitter debates when it was deciding whether to allow casinos on the reservation and if alcohol should be sold in them. The arguments focused on the revenue and jobs casinos and liquor could bring to a reservation where half the workforce is unemployed and most arrests and pervasive social ills are linked to alcohol abuse.

When the federal government announced this month that it would allow American Indian tribes to grow and sell marijuana, the same divisive discussions resurfaced. The tribal president's office talked of expanding crops to include pot for medicinal but not recreational use, while a tribal lawmaker quickly declared his opposition.

http://www.fox23.com/ap/ap/business/tribes-tread-carefully-into-marijuana-discussions/njYb9/



...and the "Feds are tired of the BS WOD" front:

New medical pot law sign of federal progress
http://www.pressherald.com/2014/12/24/our-view-new-medical-pot-law-sign-of-federal-progress

By barring the use of federal funds to prosecute patients and suppliers, Congress resolves a regulatory disconnect.

Congress recently gave an early Christmas present to residents of 33 states where medical marijuana is legal: Buried in the massive 2015 federal spending bill is a provision that bars the Justice Department from using federal funds to prosecute patients and suppliers who are complying with state regulations.

The measure expires when the spending bill does, in October. And it doesn’t make cannabis – in any form – legal under federal law. But by allowing those who need medical marijuana to use it without fear they’ll be targeted by the federal government, lawmakers have taken a small but significant step toward resolving a regulatory disconnect and making ordinary Americans’ lives easier.

In a little over four years, the Justice Department under President Obama has brought almost as many medical marijuana cases as the agency brought in eight years under President George W. Bush.
A Maine medical marijuana patient lights a joint to treat pain from surgery Oct. 9, 2012. In a little over four years, the Justice Department under President Obama has brought almost as many medical marijuana cases as the agency brought in eight years under President George W. Bush.    

In 1996, California passed the nation’s first medical marijuana law. In 1999, medical marijuana was legalized in Maine; retail dispensaries for the drug became legal here in 2009. That same year, Attorney General Eric Holder announced that the Justice Department would go after medical marijuana providers only if they violated both state and federal statutes.

That pledge, however, doesn’t seem to have stopped federal officials from zealously pursuing users and suppliers of medical cannabis. In a little over four years, the Obama administration brought 153 medical marijuana cases – compared to 163 cases in all eight years of the George W. Bush administration, the anti-marijuana prohibition group NORML reported in 2013. The U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration and several U.S. attorneys have raided hundreds of dispensaries that were following state laws. Over 335 defendants (mostly in California) have been charged with federal crimes; 158 have been sentenced to a combined 480 years in prison.

The price tag for the raids, arrests, investigations, prosecutions, incarceration and probation? Around $300 million and rising, according to the medical marijuana patient advocacy group Safe Access Now.

Though a growing number of Americans have become fed up at this level of overkill, it’s taken years to see change. Congress repeatedly rejected proposals to codify Holder’s hands-off policy into federal law. Ending the federal ban on medical marijuana has required the endorsement of pro-states’ rights Republicans like Dana Rohrabacher, who joined forces with another California congressman, Democrat Sam Farr, to craft the medical cannabis language that was approved Dec. 11.

A lot of work remains to be done at the federal level. The limits on the Justice Department’s pursuit of medical marijuana cases have an expiration date of Sept. 30, 2015. What’s more, the federal DEA still classifies marijuana as a Schedule I drug: a substance more dangerous than cocaine, with no known benefits and a “high capacity for abuse.” Long-lasting reform will entail passage of H.R. 689, which would reclassify marijuana for medical use and increase therapeutic research.

But the recently approved legislation represents progress. Sick people and their caregivers shouldn’t be in law enforcement’s crosshairs for engaging in activity that their state has recognized as legal – and it’s encouraging that federal policymakers have finally recognized this.

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« Reply #519 on: January 06, 2015, 12:56:25 pm »

GOP Lawmakers Critical of Oklahoma's Marijuana Lawsuit



http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/gop-lawmakers-critical-oklahomas-marijuana-lawsuit

Quote
OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — Several Republican Oklahoma legislators are criticizing Attorney General Scott Pruitt for his decision to join Nebraska in a lawsuit against Colorado over that state's legalization of marijuana.

A group of seven GOP legislators wrote to Pruitt, also a Republican, voicing their concern over the lawsuit asking the U.S. Supreme Court to declare Colorado's legalization of marijuana unconstitutional.

Broken Arrow Republican Rep. Mike Ritze says his concern is not about marijuana, but about the right of states to "govern themselves as they see fit."

But Pruitt maintains he's a states' rights advocate and that his lawsuit against Colorado only challenges the portions of the law that could allow for the drug to be trafficked into Oklahoma.
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RecycleMichael
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« Reply #520 on: January 06, 2015, 01:17:01 pm »

States should be allowed to pass their own laws and govern their own people. But I reserve the right to spend a bunch of taxpayer money fighting another state if such a fight allows me to hire a bunch of my lawyer friends and score some cheap political points.
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« Reply #521 on: January 06, 2015, 01:55:01 pm »

States should be allowed to pass their own laws and govern their own people. But I reserve the right to spend a bunch of taxpayer money fighting another state if such a fight allows me to hire a bunch of my lawyer friends and score some cheap political points.


Bruning and Pruitt’s crusade against Colorado’s marijuana laws conflicts with their ostensible support of states’ rights.
As attorney general of Oklahoma, Pruitt has led the next major challenge to the act, insisting that the federal government must respect states’ decisions not to set up their own exchanges and to deny their citizens cheap access to good insurance.

But when another state decides to experiment with a new drug policy, Bruning and Pruitt’s support for state sovereignty dries up. They are arguing that Congress’s prohibition against marijuana should force every state to prohibit it as well.

These attorneys general aren’t opposed to all intoxicants.
Their position on marijuana might have something to do with the fact that both Bruning and  Pruitt have received significant campaign contributions from alcohol industries.
   http://www.followthemoney.org/entity-details?eid=6583668

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2014/12/oklahoma_and_nebraska_sue_colorado_a_hypocritical_lawsuit_could_undermine.html
« Last Edit: January 06, 2015, 01:58:02 pm by patric » Logged

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patric
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« Reply #522 on: January 10, 2015, 01:51:02 pm »

Maria Rabadan has one last request, on behalf of her seriously ill son, for outgoing Gov. Pat Quinn — issue the licenses that will allow medical marijuana to be grown and sold in Illinois.

Rabadan’s 9-year-old son, Jancarlo, suffers from a rare form of epilepsy, and the family wants to use a form of non-smokeable medical marijuana known to help children who suffer from seizures.

“He has the power in his hands,” the emotional Mount Prospect mom said of the governor. “We ask that he has compassion for the kids.”

But as Quinn prepares to leave office, his administration hasn’t announced who will be granted the coveted medical marijuana business licenses. State officials blew their own deadline of issuing the limited licenses before the end of 2014. Medical marijuana is legal in Illinois for adults and children who suffer from specific conditions, but until the licenses are awarded, it can’t be grown, sold or used.

Traditional prescription medicines haven’t worked and Rabadan and her husband hope to one day give Jancarlo a product know as CBD, short for cannabidiol, a compound in cannabis that, unlike the well-known THC, does not make people feel stoned. Families with kids like Jancarlo  have moved to Colorado just to be able to use the product because for some families, it helps.


http://chicago.suntimes.com/chicago-politics/7/71/280084/mom-quinn-get-medical-marijuana-program-rolling
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« Reply #523 on: January 10, 2015, 06:17:56 pm »



Our AG, like our Governor, is for sale:

Energy Firms in Secretive Alliance With Attorney General Pruitt
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/07/us/politics/energy-firms-in-secretive-alliance-with-attorneys-general.html


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patric
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« Reply #524 on: February 01, 2015, 11:14:58 am »

Amazing how much the nation's attitude shifted. 


Five Months After Decriminalizing Marijuana, Here's What's Happened in Philadelphia
http://mic.com/articles/109466/five-months-after-decriminalizing-marijuana-here-s-what-s-happened-in-philadelphia


Rand Paul Calls Out Jeb Bush's Marijuana "Hypocrisy," And He's Not Wrong
http://www.bustle.com/articles/61681-rand-paul-calls-out-jeb-bushs-marijuana-hypocrisy-and-hes-not-wrong


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