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November 20, 2017, 03:04:11 pm
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Author Topic: Call Off the Global Drug War  (Read 2046 times)
Teatownclown
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Put the "fun" back into dysfunctional, Tulsa!


« on: June 19, 2011, 11:49:07 am »

all wars for that matter if you are serious about deficits....

Thanks Jimmy!http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/17/opinion/17carter.html?_r=2&emc=eta1

"IN an extraordinary new initiative announced earlier this month, the Global Commission on Drug Policy has made some courageous and profoundly important recommendations in a report on how to bring more effective control over the illicit drug trade. The commission includes the former presidents or prime ministers of five countries, a former secretary general of the United Nations, human rights leaders, and business and government leaders, including Richard Branson, George P. Shultz and Paul A. Volcker.

The report describes the total failure of the present global antidrug effort, and in particular America’s “war on drugs,” which was declared 40 years ago today. It notes that the global consumption of opiates has increased 34.5 percent, cocaine 27 percent and cannabis 8.5 percent from 1998 to 2008. Its primary recommendations are to substitute treatment for imprisonment for people who use drugs but do no harm to others, and to concentrate more coordinated international effort on combating violent criminal organizations rather than nonviolent, low-level offenders.

These recommendations are compatible with United States drug policy from three decades ago. In a message to Congress in 1977, I said the country should decriminalize the possession of less than an ounce of marijuana, with a full program of treatment for addicts. I also cautioned against filling our prisons with young people who were no threat to society, and summarized by saying: “Penalties against possession of a drug should not be more damaging to an individual than the use of the drug itself.”

These ideas were widely accepted at the time. But in the 1980s President Ronald Reagan and Congress began to shift from balanced drug policies, including the treatment and rehabilitation of addicts, toward futile efforts to control drug imports from foreign countries.

This approach entailed an enormous expenditure of resources and the dependence on police and military forces to reduce the foreign cultivation of marijuana, coca and opium poppy and the production of cocaine and heroin. One result has been a terrible escalation in drug-related violence, corruption and gross violations of human rights in a growing number of Latin American countries.

The commission’s facts and arguments are persuasive. It recommends that governments be encouraged to experiment “with models of legal regulation of drugs ... that are designed to undermine the power of organized crime and safeguard the health and security of their citizens.” For effective examples, they can look to policies that have shown promising results in Europe, Australia and other places.

But they probably won’t turn to the United States for advice. Drug policies here are more punitive and counterproductive than in other democracies, and have brought about an explosion in prison populations. At the end of 1980, just before I left office, 500,000 people were incarcerated in America; at the end of 2009 the number was nearly 2.3 million. There are 743 people in prison for every 100,000 Americans, a higher portion than in any other country and seven times as great as in Europe. Some 7.2 million people are either in prison or on probation or parole — more than 3 percent of all American adults!

Some of this increase has been caused by mandatory minimum sentencing and “three strikes you’re out” laws. But about three-quarters of new admissions to state prisons are for nonviolent crimes. And the single greatest cause of prison population growth has been the war on drugs, with the number of people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses increasing more than twelvefold since 1980.

Not only has this excessive punishment destroyed the lives of millions of young people and their families (disproportionately minorities), but it is wreaking havoc on state and local budgets. Former California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger pointed out that, in 1980, 10 percent of his state’s budget went to higher education and 3 percent to prisons; in 2010, almost 11 percent went to prisons and only 7.5 percent to higher education.

Maybe the increased tax burden on wealthy citizens necessary to pay for the war on drugs will help to bring about a reform of America’s drug policies. At least the recommendations of the Global Commission will give some cover to political leaders who wish to do what is right.

A few years ago I worked side by side for four months with a group of prison inmates, who were learning the building trade, to renovate some public buildings in my hometown of Plains, Ga. They were intelligent and dedicated young men, each preparing for a productive life after the completion of his sentence. More than half of them were in prison for drug-related crimes, and would have been better off in college or trade school.

To help such men remain valuable members of society, and to make drug policies more humane and more effective, the American government should support and enact the reforms laid out by the Global Commission on Drug Policy."

Jimmy Carter, the 39th president, is the founder of the Carter Center and the winner of the 2002 Nobel Peace Prize.
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Vashta Nerada
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« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2014, 05:27:37 pm »

Here is what a baby's face looks like when it is burned off by a police grenade used in a drug raid:
http://a.abcnews.com/images/US/ABC_baby_crib_1_jtm_140530_16x9_608.jpg

No drugs were found, no arrests were made, and the baby is in a coma.
Police ignored the infant furniture next to the door they kicked in, claiming they had no way of knowing children were in the home they invaded.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/05/baby-in-coma-after-police-grenade-dropped-in-crib-during-drug-raid/
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AquaMan
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Just Cruz'n


« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2014, 06:23:27 pm »

I won't look at the link. Its trading on someone else's tragedy.

Call off the war? Unilaterally? Drug fueled crime is rampant. A man pulling 4 wheelers is shot at by an sob who wants to steal them and kills his 14 year old daughter in so doing. It wasn't so he could buy food for his family.

I hate poorly trained cops. I hate that America has embraced guns, flash grenades, drones, drugs, torture, sex slaves, embezzlement and thievery as status quo. But don't put too much credibility in the idea that pulling back and letting them rampage unabated has any more chance of success than arming everyone with a .45 does.
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onward...through the fog
Vashta Nerada
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« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2015, 06:16:25 pm »


I hate poorly trained cops. I hate that America has embraced guns, flash grenades, drones, drugs, torture, sex slaves, embezzlement and thievery as status quo. But don't put too much credibility in the idea that pulling back and letting them rampage unabated has any more chance of success than arming everyone with a .45 does.





Silenced The Dissenter:


A Sheriff's deputy involved in the tragic flash-bang mutilation of a 19-month-old baby was found dead in an apparent exchange of gunfire with other members of his SWAT team.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/23/us/georgia-sheriff-shot/index.html

Andrews said he was unaware of any bad blood among Giaquinta and the sheriff and deputies who responded, but Giaquinta was "disenfranchised with law enforcement in general."

The Habersham County Sheriff's Office made national headlines last year after the department SWAT unit, based on word from an informant, conducted a drug raid at a house, throwing a flash-bang grenade and seriously burning a 19-month-old baby.




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dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2015, 08:15:20 pm »

Vashta Nerada, no Dr. Who conventions around?






Quote
On Earth, however, the Vashta Nerada were largely harmless and benign. (GAME: Shadows of the Vashta Nerada) They survived by scavenging road kill, but the Doctor suggested that they might be behind the disappearance of some who went walking in the dark. (TV: Silence in the Library)

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Vashta_Nerada
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guido911
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« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2015, 08:36:53 pm »

He's "activising" this weekend. Respect it because it's a good thing.
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Someone get Hoss a pacifier.
dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2015, 02:28:04 am »

He's "activising" this weekend. Respect it because it's a good thing.

Yeah, a good thing, like listening to Al $harpton to find truth and ju$tice.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2015, 08:43:07 pm »


Call off the war? Unilaterally? Drug fueled crime is rampant. A man pulling 4 wheelers is shot at by an sob who wants to steal them and kills his 14 year old daughter in so doing. It wasn't so he could buy food for his family.

I hate poorly trained cops. I hate that America has embraced guns, flash grenades, drones, drugs, torture, sex slaves, embezzlement and thievery as status quo. But don't put too much credibility in the idea that pulling back and letting them rampage unabated has any more chance of success than arming everyone with a .45 does.



Gotta be a middle ground somewhere.  Drug fueled crime is rampant because of one thing only - there is a LOT of money to be made.  Somewhere along the line we have to start thinking.  Try to figure out how to remove the profit from the process.  Until that happens, stalemate will continue - forever!

Maybe it will take a combination of things but since we won't even discuss the issue in this country - as with so many topics - it's not likely to get better during anyone's lifetime who reads this forum.

Here's a starting scenario... a possible first step in the process of getting rid of drug profits;

1.  Legalize marijuana nationwide.  Remove the insanity of schedule 1.

2.  Legalize anything that grows in nature and is used as harvested from that growing entity with no additional refining, synthesization, or processing.  This would include but not limited to mushrooms, coca leaves for tea and chewing, etc.  If it could be sold as organic - as in living - item in Whole Foods or Sprouts, it's legal.

3.  Decriminalize possession and use of anything else IF procured and used within the following system.  Set up a system of dispensaries where addicts of heroin, morphine, cocaine, whatever, etc....can get a prescription and supplies under a Dr's supervision - at prices commensurate to the real cost of manufacture - MUCH less than street value, or even free - no need to steal a plunder or commit other crime if you don't need the money for the habit.    You get the drugs you need for the addiction, and the system gets access to a person to give them the "sermon".  As part of the process, if someone is addicted to and/or using 'refined' recreational chemicals, actively try to steer them through some type of counseling structure to a natural element....yeah, it's not an ideal transition, but now you have a chance to get them unstuck from the really bad stuff.  And if they can't get totally free of the naturals, they are at least using relatively - as in comparison to the refined chemicals - innocuous chemicals that have essentially zero cost to the official channels.

4.  Possession and use outside of the official system - same sentencing schedule for manufacture and distribution detailed below.

5.  Manufacture and distribution of any of those "anything else" items - follow a sentencing schedule:
      a.  First offense - mandatory 15 year sentence - no parole.
      b.  Second offense - mandatory 25 year sentence - no parole.
      c.  Third offense - a capital crime, punishable by death.  If they haven't learned by this time, there is no point wasting any more oxygen on them.

After a relatively short time, the prison populations would drop like a rock - expect a 25% or larger reduction just from release of people in for pot "crimes".  And over a longer time, a steady decline would continue.  If nothing else, in about 40 years, no more prison - we start executing....

This all assumes a relatively non-corrupt system, without cronyism, favoritism, and a substantive "good ole boy" network that doesn't participate in the illicit activities.

So, ya gotta ask yourself a question... did he fire 6 shots or only 5.... oops, sorry...wrong question!!

So, ya gotta ask yourself a question - do ya wanna fix the problem or just let the corrupt, morally bankrupt and intellectually dishonest system we have today go on unabated?

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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without.

What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
Vashta Nerada
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« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2017, 06:37:25 pm »

As to the validity of "drug dogs" that are supposed to be sensitive to X-parts-per-million drug traces... what could go wrong with posing said dog with 50 pounds of said drugs?



http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagelatest/plus-pounds-of-medical-marijuana-confiscated-in-oklahoma-en-route/article_33a974fe-2200-5c90-9ed1-5d0e0ca27886.html
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Vashta Nerada
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« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2017, 06:16:38 pm »

NORMAN, Okla. (AP) - The Republican district attorney in a left-leaning Oklahoma college town said he will pursue remaining charges in a controversial drug paraphernalia case despite three acquittals and one hung jury so far.

Cleveland County District Attorney Greg Mashburn is pursuing criminal charges stemming from two 2015 raids of The Friendly Market in Norman, home to the University of Oklahoma. The now-shuttered store sold glass water pipes that Mashburn says are clearly defined under state law as drug paraphernalia. The shop owner says the pipes can be used for tobacco.

A jury on Monday acquitted store owner Robert Cox and manager Stephen Holman on several charges, including a felony charge of acquiring proceeds from drug activity. The trials of two other clerks ended in a hung jury and an acquittal.

Cox and another former clerk are still facing charges. Their defense attorney says they're not open to a plea deal.

"If they want a jury trial, we will take them to a jury trial - the ball is in their court," Mashburn said. "We've always been amenable to working this out and they haven't been willing to do that."

Mashburn's determination in pursuing the case has left some residents scratching their heads, including Holman, a popular Norman city councilman. He estimates Mashburn's office is spending $7,800 a day during trial.

"So far, 24 jurors have heard this case at three trials, and only one juror has said 'guilty' out of 24," Holman said after his acquittal. "I think it's absolutely crystal clear that the residents of Cleveland County don't support (Mashburn) in this venture. I don't know why he would continue."

The American Civil Liberties Union of Oklahoma has made an open-records request to see how much public money has been spent on prosecuting the cases.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2017, 04:34:45 pm »

NORMAN, Okla. (AP) - The Republican district attorney in a left-leaning Oklahoma college town said he will pursue remaining charges in a controversial drug paraphernalia case despite three acquittals and one hung jury so far.

Cleveland County District Attorney Greg Mashburn is pursuing criminal charges stemming from two 2015 raids of The Friendly Market in Norman, home to the University of Oklahoma. The now-shuttered store sold glass water pipes that Mashburn says are clearly defined under state law as drug paraphernalia. The shop owner says the pipes can be used for tobacco.

A jury on Monday acquitted store owner Robert Cox and manager Stephen Holman on several charges, including a felony charge of acquiring proceeds from drug activity. The trials of two other clerks ended in a hung jury and an acquittal.

Cox and another former clerk are still facing charges. Their defense attorney says they're not open to a plea deal.

"If they want a jury trial, we will take them to a jury trial - the ball is in their court," Mashburn said. "We've always been amenable to working this out and they haven't been willing to do that."

Mashburn's determination in pursuing the case has left some residents scratching their heads, including Holman, a popular Norman city councilman. He estimates Mashburn's office is spending $7,800 a day during trial.

"So far, 24 jurors have heard this case at three trials, and only one juror has said 'guilty' out of 24," Holman said after his acquittal. "I think it's absolutely crystal clear that the residents of Cleveland County don't support (Mashburn) in this venture. I don't know why he would continue."

The American Civil Liberties Union of Oklahoma has made an open-records request to see how much public money has been spent on prosecuting the cases.



We earn the reputation "hicks from the sticks..."   

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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without.

What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
patric
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These Aren't the Droids You're Looking For


« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2017, 10:30:15 am »

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/report-throws-cold-water-on-sessions-claim-softened-drug-policies-caused-jump-in-crime/article/2626553
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2017, 11:25:13 am »




Besides just being a disgusting human being, Sessions is also a pathological liar.   Gotta admire all the "morals" and "family values" being spewed all over the place by the RWRE....  Well, if you are an alt-right, immoral, bigoted racist extremist Klanner....

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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without.

What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
cannon_fodder
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« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2017, 08:21:53 am »

Unintended consequences:  the war on drugs devastated the US flower industry, which is now turning to growing marijuana.

To help fight the war on drugs the US Government subsidized Colombia flower growers.  If a farmer can make money growing carnations and not risk having his crop destroyed, going to jail, or being murdered by cartels - lets grow carnations !  So the US government provided incentives for them to grow flowers with direct subsidies as well as special trade treatment.

The plan worked and Colombians started growing flowers.  Basically, the odds are good that the cut flower you buy at the grocery store is flown in from Colombia.  Miami processes more than 180,000 tons of flowers every year and the US imports more cut flowers than it produces.  65% come from Colombia.

Victory!  Of course, the flow of cocaine surely dried up and we have won this battle on the war on drugs - right?  American cocaine use is way up. Colombia’s coca boom might be why.  Oh.  Hmm, well, at least we all have more flowers!

California Cut-Flower Industry Still On Decline.  But that's an old article, from 2004... so surely things have improved!  Wilting U.S. cut flower industry could perk up with more university research... OK, so not really, but they COULD improve if we just put in some government research dollars.

So what could the flower farmers do with their greenhouses and fallow land in sunny California, they need some kind of new cash crop.  What could it be?  Salinas Valley Is Turning Flower Farms into Cannabis GrowsYep, grow marijuana.  The war on drugs has turned some drug plantations in Colombia into flower farms and some flower farms in the US into drug plantations. So, umm, victory?

That's not to make light of the plight of the industry that is effected, the Colombian farmers trying to make a living, or to say that cocaine is something we want in this country.  Rather, its to point out that the war on drugs is so large and encompasses so many different things that keeping track of the unintended consequences is nearly impossible.  And at the end of the the average price of cocaine in the US has remained steady,
 or even dropped, so unless we really devastated the demand side of the equation, it appears we haven't changed the supply of cocaine in the direction we want...but we are growing more marijuana now.

http://www.npr.org/2017/06/23/534056792/monterey-county-helps-former-flower-growers-switch-to-marijuana
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/15/us/california-marijuana-industry-agriculture.html?mcubz=0

Also:
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/roads/2015/02/colombia_s_flower_industry_on_farms_outside_bogota_valentine_s_day_is_less.html
https://gain.fas.usda.gov/Recent%20GAIN%20Publications/The%20Colombian%20flower%20industry%20and%20its%20partnership%20with%20the%20U.S._Bogota_Colombia_2-6-2015.pdf

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I crush grooves.
Conan71
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« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2017, 01:52:13 pm »

Unintended consequences:  the war on drugs devastated the US flower industry, which is now turning to growing marijuana.

To help fight the war on drugs the US Government subsidized Colombia flower growers.  If a farmer can make money growing carnations and not risk having his crop destroyed, going to jail, or being murdered by cartels - lets grow carnations !  So the US government provided incentives for them to grow flowers with direct subsidies as well as special trade treatment.

The plan worked and Colombians started growing flowers.  Basically, the odds are good that the cut flower you buy at the grocery store is flown in from Colombia.  Miami processes more than 180,000 tons of flowers every year and the US imports more cut flowers than it produces.  65% come from Colombia.

Victory!  Of course, the flow of cocaine surely dried up and we have won this battle on the war on drugs - right?  American cocaine use is way up. Colombia’s coca boom might be why.  Oh.  Hmm, well, at least we all have more flowers!

California Cut-Flower Industry Still On Decline.  But that's an old article, from 2004... so surely things have improved!  Wilting U.S. cut flower industry could perk up with more university research... OK, so not really, but they COULD improve if we just put in some government research dollars.

So what could the flower farmers do with their greenhouses and fallow land in sunny California, they need some kind of new cash crop.  What could it be?  Salinas Valley Is Turning Flower Farms into Cannabis GrowsYep, grow marijuana.  The war on drugs has turned some drug plantations in Colombia into flower farms and some flower farms in the US into drug plantations. So, umm, victory?

That's not to make light of the plight of the industry that is effected, the Colombian farmers trying to make a living, or to say that cocaine is something we want in this country.  Rather, its to point out that the war on drugs is so large and encompasses so many different things that keeping track of the unintended consequences is nearly impossible.  And at the end of the the average price of cocaine in the US has remained steady,
 or even dropped, so unless we really devastated the demand side of the equation, it appears we haven't changed the supply of cocaine in the direction we want...but we are growing more marijuana now.

http://www.npr.org/2017/06/23/534056792/monterey-county-helps-former-flower-growers-switch-to-marijuana
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/15/us/california-marijuana-industry-agriculture.html?mcubz=0

Also:
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/roads/2015/02/colombia_s_flower_industry_on_farms_outside_bogota_valentine_s_day_is_less.html
https://gain.fas.usda.gov/Recent%20GAIN%20Publications/The%20Colombian%20flower%20industry%20and%20its%20partnership%20with%20the%20U.S._Bogota_Colombia_2-6-2015.pdf



So there is some good news in here.  If I decided now to become a coke-head it might not be as expensive in years past.  I see that as a WIN!
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"It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first” -Ronald Reagan
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