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November 19, 2017, 11:50:12 pm
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Author Topic: Find the AK-47  (Read 1625 times)
patric
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These Aren't the Droids You're Looking For


« on: April 06, 2010, 01:24:10 pm »

Do you see the people with AK-47's?
Apparently, some pilots did watching this video when they began shooting at unarmed journalists and children.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=is9sxRfU-ik[/youtube]


WASHINGTON — The Web site WikiLeaks.org released a graphic video on Monday showing an American helicopter shooting and killing a Reuters photographer and driver in a July 2007 attack in Baghdad.

An image from the video of a 2007 helicopter attack in Baghdad, released by WikiLeaks.org. Subtitles of pilot conversations and explanatory

Reuters had long pressed for the release of the video, which consists of 38 minutes of black-and-white aerial video and conversations between pilots in two Apache helicopters as they open fire on people on a street in Baghdad. The attack killed 12, among them the Reuters photographer, Namir Noor-Eldeen, 22, and the driver, Saeed Chmagh, 40.

Reuters employees were allowed to view the video on an off-the-record basis two weeks after the killings, but they were not allowed to obtain a copy of it. The news organization said its Freedom of Information Act requests were not approved.

At a news conference at the National Press Club, WikiLeaks said it had acquired the video from whistle-blowers in the military and viewed it after breaking the encryption code. WikiLeaks released the full 38-minute video as well as a 17-minute edited version.

The pilots believe them to be insurgents, and mistake Mr. Noor-Eldeen’s camera for a weapon. They aim and fire at the group, then revel in their kills.

“Look at those dead bastards,” one pilot says. “Nice,” the other responds.

A wounded man can be seen crawling and the pilots impatiently hope that he will try to fire at them so that under the rules of engagement they can shoot him again. “All you gotta do is pick up a weapon,” one pilot says.

A short time later a van arrives to pick up the wounded and the pilots open fire on it, wounding two children inside. “Well, it’s their fault for bringing their kids into a battle,” one pilot says.

At another point, an American armored vehicle arrives and appears to roll over one of the dead. “I think they just drove over a body,” one of the pilots says, chuckling a little.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2010, 12:34:58 pm by patric » Logged

"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
guido911
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« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2010, 01:28:31 pm »

What is your point, that our soldiers are murderous thugs?
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Rico
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« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2010, 01:39:12 pm »

What is your point, that our soldiers are murderous thugs?


Didn't think this would ever happen.... But I am with you on this one Guido.

This incident has been thoroughly investigated prior to the release of the video.
There were several of the individuals found to have been armed with AK's and one was found to have an RPG...
Before any one says conspiracy this report was according to NPR who I would not suspect of being a "puppet for the military".

They blended with a crowd. Unfortunate but nobody said war is pretty.
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RecycleMichael
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« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2010, 01:45:47 pm »

I have to agree with Patric. This is a very disturbing tape. I watched it early this morning and was appalled that the American soldiers kept asking for permission to shoot on the wounded. They saw they were shooting at kids, then joked that they shouldn't have been in a war zone.

It was a neighborhood with kids. The driver of the van was trying to help the wounded.

I have two relatives serving our country in the Middle East right now and I assure you they would both be appalled at the conduct and conversation of their fellow soldiers.

This is a black eye for America.
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guido911
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« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2010, 02:31:04 pm »

I have to agree with Patric. This is a very disturbing tape. I watched it early this morning and was appalled that the American soldiers kept asking for permission to shoot on the wounded. They saw they were shooting at kids, then joked that they shouldn't have been in a war zone.

It was a neighborhood with kids. The driver of the van was trying to help the wounded.

I have two relatives serving our country in the Middle East right now and I assure you they would both be appalled at the conduct and conversation of their fellow soldiers.

This is a black eye for America.

I do not think anyone would ever say I am not an advocate for children. That said, who in the f%ck takes kids with them to fetch dead bodies? This is a freakin war zone and in war, ugly things unfortunately happen. As for our soldiers' behavior, sorry, but that is G-rated compared to what I used to hear. These men and women are fighting for their very lives and if a little levity is used to get through the day, I got no problem.
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patric
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These Aren't the Droids You're Looking For


« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2010, 02:36:48 pm »

I do not think anyone would ever say I am not an advocate for children. That said, who in the f%ck takes kids with them to fetch dead bodies?

Your driving back from picking up your kids at school, and you see someone wounded on the sidewalk...




This incident has been thoroughly investigated prior to the release of the video.
There were several of the individuals found to have been armed with AK's and one was found to have an RPG...

The video you see is exactly what they were looking at when they "saw" RPG's and AK-47's, so all you have to do is look at the clock at the bottom of the video and tell us where in the video YOU see RPG's and AK-47's.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2010, 02:40:56 pm by patric » Logged

"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
CharlieSheen
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« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2010, 02:39:23 pm »


Didn't think this would ever happen.... But I am with you on this one Guido.

This incident has been thoroughly investigated prior to the release of the video.
There were several of the individuals found to have been armed with AK's and one was found to have an RPG...
Before any one says conspiracy this report was according to NPR who I would not suspect of being a "puppet for the military".

They blended with a crowd. Unfortunate but nobody said war is pretty.

I am pretty sure that the RPG and the AK47 ended up being cameras.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2010, 02:41:15 pm by Trogdor » Logged
Rico
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« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2010, 03:14:27 pm »

I am pretty sure that the RPG and the AK47 ended up being cameras.


Good thing your life does not depend on it..

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2010/04/video_of_errant_us_shootings_o.html
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Breadburner
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« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2010, 05:17:04 pm »

Looks like the shutterbugs were taking pictures for the wrong team......
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2010, 10:24:17 pm »

Apparently neither Guido or Rico actually watched the video.
You absolutely MUST be on Republicontin to see an AK or RPG in that.  There were a couple of guys with AK in the last 3 minutes or so, when they blew up the building with 3 hellfire missiles.  With about 5 or 6 unarmed.  That part of the episode, while more rational, and maybe even justifiable, was still contrary to the official rules of engagement.  No wonder they resist so hard releasing the video.

My Lai
Wounded Knee
Just a few of our favorite massacres....

Flashback to 7th Cavalry of the 1880's era.  Company policy of extermination and genocide of the resident "vermin" that inhabited this place before the western Europeans.  The Native American - free-est society/civilization this hemisphere has seen in at least a couple thousand years.

Winning the hearts and minds of the people, one .50 caliber shell at a time.









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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

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What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
Red Arrow
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« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2010, 10:41:22 pm »

The Native American - free-est society/civilization this hemisphere has seen in at least a couple thousand years.

I am under the impression that not all the Native American tribes/nations played well together even before Europeans arrived.
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guido911
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« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2010, 10:50:17 pm »

Apparently neither Guido or Rico actually watched the video.
You absolutely MUST be on Republicontin to see an AK or RPG in that.  There were a couple of guys with AK in the last 3 minutes or so, when they blew up the building with 3 hellfire missiles.  With about 5 or 6 unarmed.  That part of the episode, while more rational, and maybe even justifiable, was still contrary to the official rules of engagement.  No wonder they resist so hard releasing the video.

My Lai
Wounded Knee
Just a few of our favorite massacres....

Flashback to 7th Cavalry of the 1880's era.  Company policy of extermination and genocide of the resident "vermin" that inhabited this place before the western Europeans.  The Native American - free-est society/civilization this hemisphere has seen in at least a couple thousand years.

Winning the hearts and minds of the people, one .50 caliber shell at a time.



So now our soldiers are comparable to Lt. Calley that mindlessly massacre people. Good one.

Here are some links to folks that take the same position I do:

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/201889.php

http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/201878.php
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2010, 11:09:24 pm »

You think those guys saw an AK??  It is obvious they are shooting at one group - the ones without weapons - and talking about another group - some group somewhere else that did have weapons.  Just not there.  Yeah...that will teach them to live in a war zone...  (do you see the irony in that?) 

Saw the photo-shops of the guys that agree with you, geez... on of his "shots" shows the end of the rpg sticking around the building, with a flat end (a lot like a camera).  If you want to see some reality, google an rpg - the end is NOT flat, it IS pointy, like a very large bullet.  And if you look at the whole REAL 39 minute film (before editing), it is easy to see the two cameramen and what they are carrying without the editing.  The shapes show to be maybe 24" long, if that.  An AK is about 40" long.  And then at about 37 minutes you can see a real AK shape - like the modified screen shots.  The ones that aren't in the first group.



No the tribes didn't play well together a lot of the time.  There was constant positioning, maneuvering, feuding and war.  Lot's of individual warrior battle, many times to the death.  Stealing of horses.  Very hard, many times brutal life.  Extremely complex relationships between all the tribes.  And very free as a society - no one could tell you what to do and make it stick.

But they didn't actively, consciously, and intentionally perform genocide on their enemies.
Like Europeans did on them...for 400 years.

Saw a couple of variations of t-shirt that I will buy if ever find one in store.  Came out in response to the new found outrage and focus on terrorism.  One shows a group of braves lined up on ponies, in full war dress.  Caption says, "Fighting Terrorism for 400 years."
  
Feel the irony??




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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without.

What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
Conan71
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« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2010, 11:48:29 pm »

Hier, that's all easy speculation from the standpoint of someone who smoked dope at the "U" and protested VN.  Put yourself in the spotter's, pilot's, or gunner's seat in an Apache hovering over a hostile war zone and report back what you see at that moment in time when all you can think of is wanting to be any place other than knowing your next breath could be your last and your two year old child and wife are somewhere in North Carolina waiting for your safe return, oh and your pulse rate has become a "normal" of 150 when you are on duty.  FWIW, I saw a rifle well before the chopper engaged. 
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TeeDub
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« Reply #14 on: April 07, 2010, 08:11:18 am »


Wish we weren't there....

That said, I would rather apologize for shooting innocents than another American soldier dying thousands of miles away from friends and family.
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