(PROJECT) One Place Tower

[erfalf]

I'm sorry to see that the recent discussion on Tulsa's largest private construction project in over a decade has devolved to the same types of complaining seen in the Tulsa World's comment section.

Give it a rest. They're building an 18-story tower and a 5-story building at the same time, with more to come. The entire block doesn't have to be under construction at the same time for progress to occur... and you can blame TDA for stalling this project for so long in the first place. That block has already seen more substantial development than has happened anywhere near the BOK Center so far.

Agreed, biggest private development downtown in ages, and it is exactly what everyone has been clamoring for. Mixed use upstairs, commercial at the street level. Office, hotel, residential. Fits in with the grid. No more street parking on an entire city block that was nothing but parking before. I'm willing to be patient, that's for sure.

Speaking of the Forum, as a non Tulsa native (never been to the Forum) is the Forum the building that blocks off Main Street. If it is, has there ever been any talk of opening up Main Street again? Especially with the Brady area taking off the way it has. Course maybe it's a wast, walking across the bridges can't be the most pleasant of things. Just a thought I guess.

[dsjeffries]

Agreed, biggest private development downtown in ages, and it is exactly what everyone has been clamoring for. Mixed use upstairs, commercial at the street level. Office, hotel, residential. Fits in with the grid. No more street parking on an entire city block that was nothing but parking before. I'm willing to be patient, that's for sure.

Speaking of the Forum, as a non Tulsa native (never been to the Forum) is the Forum the building that blocks off Main Street. If it is, has there ever been any talk of opening up Main Street again? Especially with the Brady area taking off the way it has. Course maybe it's a wast[e], walking across the bridges can't be the most pleasant of things. Just a thought I guess.

I wish that would happen, but it would take either a natural disaster or an act of Congress. The Williams developments of the 70s really screwed downtown. But that's a different topic.

[rdj]

I wish that would happen, but it would take either a natural disaster or an act of Congress. The Williams developments of the 70s really screwed downtown. But that's a different topic.

I wouldn't say that it screwed downtown.  It gave us a great PAC, a downtown hotel and a nice skyscraper fit for large companies.  Could it have been done differently or better?  Sure.  But, to say it screwed downtown is hyperbole.

[dsjeffries]

I wouldn't say that it screwed downtown.  It gave us a great PAC, a downtown hotel and a nice skyscraper fit for large companies.  Could it have been done differently or better?  Sure.  But, to say it screwed downtown is hyperbole.

Is it really hyperbole? I think the creation of super blocks that limit connectivity, create blank street walls and discourage walking, in addition to tearing down some of the oldest structures in Tulsa is a pretty good definition of screwing downtown. It may just be one of many remnants of the urban renewal craze that turned downtown into a parking lot, but it's the biggest.

I'm glad to see One Place Tower sticking to the existing grid, unlike some of Tulsa's biggest, most "friendly" corporate citizens, e.g., Williams and QuikTrip.

[TheArtist]

While I do agree that we lost some great buildings and connectivity, we did gain one heck of a skyscraper canyon with the BOK tower at the end of Boston Ave there.  As for connectivity, since we are limited now, I think it's all the more important to make sure the Boulder to Brady to Elgin to 5th to Boulder grid is as pedestrian friendly as possible. 

[rdj]

Is it really hyperbole? I think the creation of super blocks that limit connectivity, create blank street walls and discourage walking, in addition to tearing down some of the oldest structures in Tulsa is a pretty good definition of screwing downtown. It may just be one of many remnants of the urban renewal craze that turned downtown into a parking lot, but it's the biggest.

I'm glad to see One Place Tower sticking to the existing grid, unlike some of Tulsa's biggest, most "friendly" corporate citizens, e.g., Williams and QuikTrip.

If I told you a new development was going to be announced that included four high rises (remember One Technology & Williams 1&2 were part of that master plan), multi-story retail, entertainment, arts, lodging, structured parking that is partially underground and public park space you'd be disappointed?

It was and is a massive development that turned what I understand to be a partially blighted area into one of the most valuable pieces of downtown real estate.  It takes up five full city blocks.

Pedestrians can still go from Third St to Archer via the park, sky bridges, etc.  It's just not a street or clear sidewalk.

I'm sure Jeff P has lots of input on this as well.

[Oil Capital]

I think the argument that staging all the materials at on off-site location in or near downtown would add signficant expense to the project is legitimate.  Currently, they own the two adjacent lots where materials are shipped.  If they can no longer use those lots for that purpose, then they will have to lease additional space somewhere downtown and incur additional costs in moving the materials as needed from the staging area to the work site.

I also agree that patience is important.  This is the biggest project downtown in terms of footprint, size and scope since the Williams Forum.  I'd rather they get it right than get in done in a hurry.  TDA has sat on land way longer than this project will take, even with the extension.

Yes, there are costs to obtaining a different staging area. BUT, if they are indeed ready to go with the other phases there are costs to delaying that too.  VERY quickly, the costs, including opportunity costs, of delaying a ready-to-go project would far exceed the cost of staging materials in a different location.  (You are quite right they currently own the adjacent properties. Carrying those properties is costing them money.  Until they build the next phases, those properties are delivering zero return to them.)

[Oil Capital]

I'm sorry to see that the recent discussion on Tulsa's largest private construction project in over a decade has devolved to the same types of complaining seen in the Tulsa World's comment section.

"We want better roads!" ...road construction begins... "I hate all this construction!!"

"We need downtown developers!" ...developer steps up... "You're only building this in PHASES?! BLASPHEMOUS!"

Give it a rest. They're building an 18-story tower and a 5-story building at the same time, with more to come. The entire block doesn't have to be under construction at the same time for progress to occur... and you can blame TDA for stalling this project for so long in the first place. That block has already seen more substantial development than has happened anywhere near the BOK Center so far.

It's evident that Tulsans are afflicted with the same short-term orientation and obsession with immediate gratification as the rest of the country. And the project has only been under construction for what, less than a year?

I don't see anyone complaining.  Just a simple observation about the cause of the delay in the next phases.  Give it a rest, indeed.

[TheTed]

Pedestrians can still go from Third St to Archer via the park, sky bridges, etc.  It's just not a street or clear sidewalk.

This is not really correct. You can only do so during business hours, not during evenings/weekends. I've tried the doors at First Street on a hot summer Saturday hoping to avoid the walk around and through a shadeless parking lot (the last place you want to walk when it's 105 degrees out.

[Jeff P]

Is it really hyperbole? I think the creation of super blocks that limit connectivity, create blank street walls and discourage walking, in addition to tearing down some of the oldest structures in Tulsa is a pretty good definition of screwing downtown. It may just be one of many remnants of the urban renewal craze that turned downtown into a parking lot, but it's the biggest.

I'm glad to see One Place Tower sticking to the existing grid, unlike some of Tulsa's biggest, most "friendly" corporate citizens, e.g., Williams and QuikTrip.

Curious why you have friendly in quotes. Are you suggesting that Williams and QuikTrip aren't friendly corporate citizens? 

If it has to do with downtown, I don't know why you would lump Williams and QuikTrip together.  Sure, I wish that QT would have their HQ downtown, but they are going to do what's best for them.  Williams, on the other hand, has maintained their HQ in downtown Tulsa since they moved here in 1918.

As for the superblock argument, I understand the argument against, but I don't see how you can say that what Williams did in the late 1970s was bad for downtown Tulsa.  Williams invested a massive amount in office space, entertainment and retail in a bad part of downtown when nobody else was.

In addition to the office space, the PAC, Williams Green and one of our only full-service convention hotels (Hyatt) were also part of the development.  Over the years, we've continued to invest in our facilities downtown, and in downtown in general.  We were/are founding sponsors of both the BOK Center and ONEOK Field, among other things.

Full disclosure - as I think I've noted before, I do work for Williams.

[rdj]

This is not really correct. You can only do so during business hours, not during evenings/weekends. I've tried the doors at First Street on a hot summer Saturday hoping to avoid the walk around and through a shadeless parking lot (the last place you want to walk when it's 105 degrees out.

You are correct on this.  The block from 2nd to 1st is blocked.  However, 3rd to 2nd is open and 1st to Archer is open.

[rdj]

We were/are founding sponsors of both the BOK Center and ONEOK Field, among other things.

I've never noticed your logo the scoreboard at the BOK Center.  You guys need to add a few.   

[Jeff P]

I've never noticed your logo the scoreboard at the BOK Center.  You guys need to add a few.   

Ha ha... yeah I know.

Not very discreet, is it?

 

[Townsend]

So I can put into perspective how tall it's going to be, how many floors have been reached?  Eight?

http://oxblue.com/open/oneplacetower

[dsjeffries]

So I can put into perspective how tall it's going to be, how many floors have been reached?  Eight?

http://oxblue.com/open/oneplacetower

They're working on the 9th floor right now. It's the one that's half-finished. And remember that it will be more than twice its current height due to the greater floor-to-ceiling heights on the actual floors of the building compared to the parking garage floors.