This is bad news for summer motorists already stung from high gas prices.
Apparently the "speed trap" designation is being lifted from Oklahoma towns.
I used to have to travel back and forth from Tulsa to Dallas, and I always hated the trip through southern Oklahoma for this reason.
The good people of Texas did get one thing right-- they built their highways around or over their small towns, not through them! It is extremely annoying to pull up to a stoplight in redneckville when trying to travel through the southern part of our state!
Now we'd better watch out! Its back to the dark ages of travel in Oklahoma.
http://www.ktul.com/news/stories/0507/423485.html
--
Looks like speed traps got the green light from our Legislature:
http://www.kotv.com/news/topstory/?id=127447
The speed traps argued that they should be able to write tickets inside their city limits -- never mind that these towns annex miles of highways (with little or no surrounding property) to make their city limits more profitable.
How did this corruption slip under the radar?
Just dont speed. [;)]
http://newsok.com/article/3054677
[q]"I look at it as a user fee," he said. "If they're not speeding, they don't have to pay. I think what I did was speak up for law enforcement. People need to learn to obey those speeding signs and not pay the fines."[/q]
so, if everyone took his advice, then how will this law "help" anything?
As we've mentioned, the sad fact is that the highways run through the towns.
So setting the cruise control on 65 doesn't cut it. You have to pay attention to each little town you come up on, or whamo! You get hit for 65 in a 50 zone, or whatever they decide to post as you approach.
Its really lame, and it all changes when you cross the red river heading into Texas.
It gives Oklahoma a bad name.
They will never take me alive.
quote:
Originally posted by DM
Just dont speed. [;)]
That is fine in reasonable speed zones.
We're talking about podunk towns that drop the highway from 65 to 25 over the course of 100 feet, usually hidden around a curve or the sign behind a bush. Redneck towns like this are just being corrupt scavenger leech-types, sucking money out of unsuspecting "city slickers" who happen to need to cross on the highway. Texas did get it right.
Its almost worth just going a little out of your way to stay on interstate highways to go to Dallas - I-44 to OKC, I-35 to Dallas instead of going south on 69/75 through the sticks.
I kinda like going through the sticks. [:D]
This stuff about speed zones going from 65 to 25 in 100 feet ... are there truly any towns like this, or is it just hyperbole?
One town I'm familiar with -- Arcadia on Route 66 -- is vigilant about enforcing its 45 mph speed zone through town and is derided as a speed trap. But you've got people constantly going in and out of Hillbillee's restaurant and B&B and seeing the Round Barn. Plus Pops is going to open in a matter of weeks.
I've talked to the mayor there, and she says that people simply drive too fast through her town and she wants people to be safe. With all the tourists around, I'm inclined to agree.
So slow down.
The designation of a speed trap was always ridiculous anyway. To be deemed a 'speed trap' city, more then 50% of your town's income has to come from traffic tickets. Doesn't matter what the tickets are for. They can all be for seatbelt violations, or no turn signals. Not one has to come from speeding violations.
For a small town who has no designated sales tax, doesn't sell water, doesn't pick up trash, ......, traffic tickets are their only income. But because they have a couple of motived police officers who write tickets, they get penalized. Tulsa Police could be the worst cheaters in the world when it comes to traffic enforcement and they will never be deemed a 'speed trap' town because traffic ticket income will never even be close to 50% of the city's income.
So what are these small towns supposed to do? Allow people driving ridiculously fast through their city and not be able to do anything about it? Shows you where people put their priorities. SAFETY BE DAMNED!
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
Doesn't matter what the tickets are for. They can all be for seatbelt violations, or no turn signals. Not one has to come from speeding violations.
Doesnt justifying ambush ticket-writing as a primary source of income detract from the moral high ground of fines being
punishment for a crime?
Even Tulsa's FOP tried to distance itself from that when it went on record against John Eagleton's proposal to use increased citations to pay police.
I was exagerrating. But surely there are restrictions on how quickly they can slow down highway traffic, and whatever those are, they drop the speeds as fast as they possibly can.
quote:
Originally posted by patric
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
Doesn't matter what the tickets are for. They can all be for seatbelt violations, or no turn signals. Not one has to come from speeding violations.
Doesnt justifying ambush ticket-writing as a primary source of income detract from the moral high ground of fines being punishment for a crime?
Even Tulsa's FOP tried to distance itself from that when it went on record against John Eagleton's proposal to use increased citations to pay police.
I totally agree (and I'm against Eagleton's proposal). What I am saying is, a small town whose only income is ticket writing, how do they avoid the 50% problem. How do they avoid being labeled a speed trap (there is no such thing) when their only source of income is from tickets?
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
So what are these small towns supposed to do? Allow people driving ridiculously fast through their city and not be able to do anything about it? Shows you where people put their priorities. SAFETY BE DAMNED!
They purposely set the limits below what is reasonable. Then they park a cop there with a radar gun pointed at you. The Tulsa Police for the most part just pull people over for driving unreasonably fast or reckless. If TPD is doing an actual "speed trap", they do it where there is already a reasonable speed limit. Like 40mph down Lewis or 65mph down the BA. You are at fault if you think you have to drive 80mph on the BA. But unsuspectingly driving 35mph through some hick town because they put a 25mph zone in for no good reason, thats not right. And those places will get you for doing 27 in a 25.
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
So what are these small towns supposed to do? Allow people driving ridiculously fast through their city and not be able to do anything about it? Shows you where people put their priorities. SAFETY BE DAMNED!
They purposely set the limits below what is reasonable. Then they park a cop there with a radar gun pointed at you. The Tulsa Police for the most part just pull people over for driving unreasonably fast or reckless. If TPD is doing an actual "speed trap", they do it where there is already a reasonable speed limit. Like 40mph down Lewis or 65mph down the BA. You are at fault if you think you have to drive 80mph on the BA. But unsuspectingly driving 35mph through some hick town because they put a 25mph zone in for no good reason, thats not right. And those places will get you for doing 27 in a 25.
Traffic engineers determine the speed limits of roads, not police. And for these state highways everyone is talking about, it is the Dept of Transportation, not Podunk's Mayor, who determines a speed limit.
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
So what are these small towns supposed to do? Allow people driving ridiculously fast through their city and not be able to do anything about it? Shows you where people put their priorities. SAFETY BE DAMNED!
They purposely set the limits below what is reasonable. Then they park a cop there with a radar gun pointed at you. The Tulsa Police for the most part just pull people over for driving unreasonably fast or reckless. If TPD is doing an actual "speed trap", they do it where there is already a reasonable speed limit. Like 40mph down Lewis or 65mph down the BA. You are at fault if you think you have to drive 80mph on the BA. But unsuspectingly driving 35mph through some hick town because they put a 25mph zone in for no good reason, thats not right. And those places will get you for doing 27 in a 25.
Traffic engineers determine the speed limits of roads, not police. And for these state highways everyone is talking about, it is the Dept of Transportation, not Podunk's Mayor, who determines a speed limit.
That suprises me. Im making assumptions based on what I think makes sense.
So the DOT sets speed limits. Perhaps it is the Podunks who decide to put a school cross-walk on a busy highway? Then lo-and-behold the DOT has to lower the speed limit? Or maybe someone gets a kickback for setting speed traps? You are positing that actual engineers set them based on strict calcuable conditions?
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
So what are these small towns supposed to do? Allow people driving ridiculously fast through their city and not be able to do anything about it? Shows you where people put their priorities. SAFETY BE DAMNED!
They purposely set the limits below what is reasonable. Then they park a cop there with a radar gun pointed at you. The Tulsa Police for the most part just pull people over for driving unreasonably fast or reckless. If TPD is doing an actual "speed trap", they do it where there is already a reasonable speed limit. Like 40mph down Lewis or 65mph down the BA. You are at fault if you think you have to drive 80mph on the BA. But unsuspectingly driving 35mph through some hick town because they put a 25mph zone in for no good reason, thats not right. And those places will get you for doing 27 in a 25.
I remember that Coweta (by the Henson restaurant), the towns of Hulbert and Morris are total speed traps.
I'd love to see the State build a new 4 lane highway to Dallas, or modify what's existing so that it bypasses these pissant towns altogether. It would cut at least 30 minutes from a road trip to Dallas and points further. Let Buford T. Justice harass his own residents for revenue.
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
I'd love to see the State build a new 4 lane highway to Dallas, or modify what's existing so that it bypasses these pissant towns altogether. It would cut at least 30 minutes from a road trip to Dallas and points further. Let Buford T. Justice harass his own residents for revenue.
"Buford T. Justice" is right on the money: definitely people who wear a badge but have no real knowledge of legal terms such as "habeas corpus" or "Miranda Warning." Yes, one of my siblings is an attorney.
quote:
Originally posted by mr.jaynes
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
I'd love to see the State build a new 4 lane highway to Dallas, or modify what's existing so that it bypasses these pissant towns altogether. It would cut at least 30 minutes from a road trip to Dallas and points further. Let Buford T. Justice harass his own residents for revenue.
"Buford T. Justice" is right on the money: definitely people who wear a badge but have no real knowledge of legal terms such as "habeas corpus" or "Miranda Warning." Yes, one of my siblings is an attorney.
My condolences[;)]
Eh, if gas gets much higher, I'll be walking through places like Arcadia, Atoka, Big Cabin, and Hulbert. Then I'll only have to make sure I don't Jaywalk. [;)]
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
quote:
Originally posted by mr.jaynes
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
I'd love to see the State build a new 4 lane highway to Dallas, or modify what's existing so that it bypasses these pissant towns altogether. It would cut at least 30 minutes from a road trip to Dallas and points further. Let Buford T. Justice harass his own residents for revenue.
"Buford T. Justice" is right on the money: definitely people who wear a badge but have no real knowledge of legal terms such as "habeas corpus" or "Miranda Warning." Yes, one of my siblings is an attorney.
My condolences[;)]
For what? I'm actually quite proud of what she has accomplished. Lives and works in New York, at a good, blue-chip law firm. I'm equally proud of my older brother the pilot (walking in dad's footsteps on that one) and my other brother the schoolteacher. In turn, I believe they're proud of me (at least when I worked as a programmer and technician, before the bottom kinda fell out on that field).
What you have to watch for in these speed traps, is WHERE you are actually clocked. I've had it happen before. Say you are in a 55 MPH zone, and it drops to 45. The cop can be sitting in the 45 MPH part, with radar gun aimed at 55 MPH zone. Instant on with the radar, get 54 or 55 MPH reading locked into gun, then back off BEFORE you even reach the 45 MPH zone. You'll be pulled over in the 45 MPH zone, but you were actually obeying the law, and not to the actual reduced speed zone yet. I've had it happen to me before, and I know exactly when the radar was on, because my radar detector alerted me, Just instant on, then back off before I reached the speed zone.
I will say though, it wasn't a small town cop that got me that time, it was an OHP officer, in 1990. If you're familar with North Peoria, I was headed south, and it was where it goes from 2 lane to 4 lanes at 76th st North. I was halfway between Delaware creek and where the speed limit drops at 76th when he clocked me. Got me for 54 in a 45...But even though I knew exactly where he clocked me at, there was no way to prove it.[:(!]
"So slow down." - rwarn
Posted like an aspiring hyper-miler.
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
65mph down the BA. You are at fault if you think you have to drive 80mph on the BA.
65 down the BA is RIDICULOUS. MOST people who have somehwere to go and something to do drive AT LEAST 75 down the BA. 65 is an unreasonable limit and there are groups of people that have been trying to get it raised for years. They always come back that its a safety issue. Well, if they would fix the ****ing CRATERS on the BA around the 15th exit they wouldn't have a safety problem.
If you want to drive 65 on the BA then get in the ****ing right lane so the rest of us can get on with our lives. You are not a do gooder when you drive 65 in the left lane.....you are an donkey.
Oh and the vigilantes of you out there who try to run us down should just quit. You don't drive a vehicle that can handle speeds over 90 so just get in the right lane and let those of us who know how to handle our machines go on.
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
quote:
Originally posted by YoungTulsan
65mph down the BA. You are at fault if you think you have to drive 80mph on the BA.
65 down the BA is RIDICULOUS. MOST people who have somehwere to go and something to do drive AT LEAST 75 down the BA. 65 is an unreasonable limit and there are groups of people that have been trying to get it raised for years. They always come back that its a safety issue. Well, if they would fix the ****ing CRATERS on the BA around the 15th exit they wouldn't have a safety problem.
If you want to drive 65 on the BA then get in the ****ing right lane so the rest of us can get on with our lives. You are not a do gooder when you drive 65 in the left lane.....you are an donkey.
Oh and the vigilantes of you out there who try to run us down should just quit. You don't drive a vehicle that can handle speeds over 90 so just get in the right lane and let those of us who know how to handle our machines go on.
Actually, the speed limit on the BA from 15th to Memorial is 60, so 65 is already speeding. And the speed drops to 55 at 15th into downtown.
Don't you just love people who think they can drive at any speed in any traffic, yet we kill 43,000 people each year because of it, and they still don't get it. They are the fools. They will either kill them self or others right along with them. How many bodies have been scraped off the BA?
quote:
Originally posted by Wilbur
How many bodies have been scraped off the BA?
all of the weak ones.
quote:
Originally posted by Hawkins
This is bad news for summer motorists already stung from high gas prices.
Apparently the "speed trap" designation is being lifted from Oklahoma towns.
I used to have to travel back and forth from Tulsa to Dallas, and I always hated the trip through southern Oklahoma for this reason.
The good people of Texas did get one thing right-- they built their highways around or over their small towns, not through them! It is extremely annoying to pull up to a stoplight in redneckville when trying to travel through the southern part of our state!
Now we'd better watch out! Its back to the dark ages of travel in Oklahoma.
http://www.ktul.com/news/stories/0507/423485.html
--
Why is it a problem if cops have speed traps?If you are not out there endangering everyone else around you by speeding then you should have nothing to worry about.SFW(so ****ing what) if cops have speed traps,there is this called a speed limit.Having a car does not give you a God given right to drive as fast as you want.
quote:
Originally posted by patric
Doesnt justifying ambush ticket-writing as a primary source of income detract from the moral high ground of fines being punishment for a crime?
If people paid attention and drove the proper speed limit they would not have to worry about a ticket.There should be more speed traps.
speedos are not accurate and neither are radar guns. speed traps are called such because people get stopped for going 1-5 over and that base ticket is enough to bring the city revenue. you are assuming all these tickets are given out for 15+ over. That is not the case. If a person sets their cruise to 65 and get pulled over for 67 or some ****, that is a travesty. And don't give me the line "oh well they can just take an affidavit to the judge that the speedo was inaccurate. I've seen that fail time and time again because the town judge is in on the racket.
quote:
Originally posted by jamesrage
Why is it a problem if cops have speed traps? If you are not out there endangering everyone else around you by speeding then you should have nothing to worry about.SFW(so ****ing what) if cops have speed traps,there is this called a speed limit.Having a car does not give you a God given right to drive as fast as you want.
As Wilbur pointed out, speed traps arent just about speeding...
quote:
Doesn't matter what the tickets are for. They can all be for seatbelt violations, or no turn signals. Not one has to come from speeding violations.
...they're about revenue.
quote:
Originally posted by patric
As Wilbur pointed out, speed traps arent just about speeding...
...they're about revenue.
Why is it a problem if cities make revenue off someone's total disregard for traffic laws?Don't want a speeding ticket then pay attention,obey traffic laws and don't speed.
a huge ticket for going one mile over is punishing no one, it is just filling their coffers.
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
If a person sets their cruise to 65 and get pulled over for 67 or some ****,
Cruise control only controlls the gas pedal.So if you want to stop or make the car slow down there is this thing called the break pedal.
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
a huge ticket for going one mile over is punishing no one, it is just filling their coffers.
I would disagree.A huge ticket might encoruage you in the future to obey traffic laws.
BTW are there any documented cases of someone getting a huge ticket for going one mile over the speed limit?Don't want a speeding ticket then don't speed.
quote:
Originally posted by jamesrage
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
a huge ticket for going one mile over is punishing no one, it is just filling their coffers.
I would disagree.A huge ticket might encoruage you in the future to obey traffic laws.
BTW are there any documented cases of someone getting a huge ticket for going one mile over the speed limit?Don't want a speeding ticket then don't speed.
you are a ****er. I hope you are stopped for a 66 in a 65, or worse, a 60 in a 65. You will be singing a different tune. More people than you think don't think they are speeding because their car's instruments tell them so, but they fall victim to the greedy money machine down at city hall.
we should not have to go down the road living in fear that your cruise or their radar gun is accurate. with speed traps, we have that fear as a reality.
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
you are a ****er. I hope you are stopped for a 66 in a 65, or worse, a 60 in a 65. You will be singing a different tune. More people than you think don't think they are speeding because their car's instruments tell them so, but they fall victim to the greedy money machine down at city hall.
we should not have to go down the road living in fear that your cruise or their radar gun is accurate. with speed traps, we have that fear as a reality.
So I take it that you do not have any documentation to prove that police in small towns are handing out tickets for going one or two miles of the limit?
As I said before if you do not want a speeding ticket then do not speed.
quote:
Originally posted by jamesrage
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
you are a ****er. I hope you are stopped for a 66 in a 65, or worse, a 60 in a 65. You will be singing a different tune. More people than you think don't think they are speeding because their car's instruments tell them so, but they fall victim to the greedy money machine down at city hall.
we should not have to go down the road living in fear that your cruise or their radar gun is accurate. with speed traps, we have that fear as a reality.
So I take it that you do not have any documentation to prove that police in small towns are handing out tickets for going one or two miles of the limit?
As I said before if you do not want a speeding ticket then do not speed.
proof has already been provided to the towns that were designated as speed traps. Check OSCN.
I was rolling into Ketchum one night anyway picked up few things I needed and was headed out of town when I was lit up.....I asked the officer what I did wrong and he told me that I was speeding on my way into town but he wanted me to get my shopping done before he gave me the ticket.....Needless to say I have not spent another dime in Ketchum....I get everything in Langley even though it's a further trip....The local Police in that area have just about put Ketchum out of buisness when I was younger that town was hopping on Friday and Saturday nights.....I have been stopped in that area (Ketchum) no less than 5 times in road blocks.....Once was after the ticket I talked about earlier although it was not in Ketchum it was the same officer....I asked him if he had some sort of crush on me or something and I had seen enough of him for one night...It kinda puts a dmaper on the weekend at the lake....I would warn anyone going through Ketchum or to Hammerhead Marina to be damn careful......
quote:
Originally posted by jamesrage
quote:
Originally posted by inteller
you are a ****er. I hope you are stopped for a 66 in a 65, or worse, a 60 in a 65. You will be singing a different tune. More people than you think don't think they are speeding because their car's instruments tell them so, but they fall victim to the greedy money machine down at city hall.
we should not have to go down the road living in fear that your cruise or their radar gun is accurate. with speed traps, we have that fear as a reality.
So I take it that you do not have any documentation to prove that police in small towns are handing out tickets for going one or two miles of the limit?
As I said before if you do not want a speeding ticket then do not speed.
Dude, please stop it, you are scaring me and the kids!
You sound like a member of the "Nightwatch" organization from Babylon 5.
Its been clearly laid out in this thread that 1)The speed limits change as you approach these small towns, 2)The towns are incorrectly laid out in the middle of hwy 75, and 3)Several towns had already received the designation of "speed trap" under the prior law--which sadly has now been overturned.
*
As they used to say in Hulbert, "If you are from out of town, your speedometer is broken."
quote:
Originally posted by South_Tulsan
Dude, please stop it, you are scaring me and the kids!
You sound like a member of the "Nightwatch" organization from Babylon 5.
Its been clearly laid out in this thread that 1)The speed limits change as you approach these small towns, 2)The towns are incorrectly laid out in the middle of hwy 75, and 3)Several towns had already received the designation of "speed trap" under the prior law--which sadly has now been overturned.
*
If you do not want a speeding ticket then pay attention to the road and signs.It is that simple.Having a driver's license and a car does not give a God given right to drive as fast as you want.
Dude, please stop it, you are scaring me and the kids!
<end clip>
I have to admit, jamesrage does sound a bit like a militaristic Cylon in his writings. [}:)]
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588
Dude, please stop it, you are scaring me and the kids!
<end clip>
I have to admit, jamesrage does sound a bit like a militaristic Cylon in his writings. [}:)]
He's also ignoring the subject and sticking to his simple view.
The abrupt CHANGE in the speed limits while trying to travel through Oklahoma are the problem, and leave the door open to creating a speed trap... particularly when a small town has little else going for it economically.
--
quote:
Originally posted by Hawkins
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588
Dude, please stop it, you are scaring me and the kids!
<end clip>
I have to admit, jamesrage does sound a bit like a militaristic Cylon in his writings. [}:)]
He's also ignoring the subject and sticking to his simple view.
The abrupt CHANGE in the speed limits while trying to travel through Oklahoma are the problem, and leave the door open to creating a speed trap... particularly when a small town has little else going for it economically.
--
Those signs comply with the law that your representatives put in place. Don't like the signs, don't b!tch at the police. Police don't place speed limits signs, traffic engineers do, and the engineers comply with state law. Don't like how the signs are place, contact your state representative and tell him/her to change the law.
And for the most part, the little towns everyone complains about in the middle of the highway were there way before the highway was.
And if you're still not satisfied, there is more then one way to get from point A to point B. Find a map!
quote:
Originally posted by Hawkins
He's also ignoring the subject and sticking to his simple view.
The abrupt CHANGE in the speed limits while trying to travel through Oklahoma are the problem, and leave the door open to creating a speed trap... particularly when a small town has little else going for it economically.
--
You don't think towns and cities should have a right to regulate how fast they want people driving in their districts?
A town should be able regulate how fast people can drive on their streets.
Hope they enjoyed writing those tickets for a day and half...
http://www.ktul.com/news/stories/0507/426012.html
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
Hope they enjoyed writing those tickets for a day and half...
(http://www.kotv.com/newsimages/640/7f9f763d-40da-49a5-9e04-dfab23d49dea.jpg)
The way Im reading the press release, the "former" speed trap towns can now resume collecting revenue until they are again designated speed traps.
...Just our legislature slapping OHP around for messin with the good old boys.
That was on the way to Big Cabin....heh...
We had a big speed trap in Ohio, in a town called New Rome. The state finally shut it down. This town was very crooked and cops would bust your tail light and give you ticket for a broken tail light and things like that. The town had 60 residents and 15 cops, It was 3 blocks ling and 2 blocks deep on highway 40, just west of Columbus, Ohio. It was listed near the top of many national speed trap web sites. They now have a web site about it after the state shut it down. The sad part is the town was crooked for 30 plus years before it was shut down by the state. Check out the web site and click around and read the stories from people who got nailed by the New Rome cops. www.newromesucks.com
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
Hope they enjoyed writing those tickets for a day and half...
http://www.ktul.com/news/stories/0507/426012.html
holy cow, that is terrific news. i must say im shocked.
quote:
Originally posted by patric
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
Hope they enjoyed writing those tickets for a day and half...
(http://www.kotv.com/newsimages/640/7f9f763d-40da-49a5-9e04-dfab23d49dea.jpg)
The way Im reading the press release, the "former" speed trap towns can now resume collecting revenue until they are again designated speed traps.
...Just our legislature slapping OHP around for messin with the good old boys.
now THAT is sweet.
quote:
Originally posted by iplaw
Hope they enjoyed writing those tickets for a day and half...
http://www.ktul.com/news/stories/0507/426012.html
That's great news.
Our state leaders undermined months of work by the OHP to let some parasites cash in on the Memorial Day turkey shoot.
How is that a good thing?