How many know that State law requires a driver of a vehicle to stop when a pedestrian is in a crosswalk? I was delighted to learn a few days ago that this was so in Oklahoma. I knew it was the case in many other states.
Why doesn't the City employ signs that educate drivers of that law at least where they have crosswalks and indicator signs in places that experience at least marginal pedestrian traffic like Cherry St. and Brookside?
I stood purposefully in the crosswalk on Cherry Street today during lunch and for at least 3 minutes and during that time could not find a break in the two way traffic big enough to safely cross and obviously not once did anyone stop to let me cross (though it's happened a few time in the several years I've lived there). I did get a few glances suggestive of some sort of bemusement that I was rediculous enough to step foot in the street.
While I don't think that the signs will result in drivers coming to a screeching halt the second my big toenail hits the pavement in the crosswalk I do think that people will find crossing the street on foot a little easier as I'm confident that at least every fourth/ fifth driver will actually stop when a pedestrian is in the crosswalk.
I've seen these signs employed in other City's and they help tremendously. At least we can educate drivers they are breaking the law when they pass a pedestrian in a crosswalk. I'm sure 90% of the people that drive pass me don't even know their breaking the law.
Quote from: OurTulsa on June 03, 2011, 06:12:54 PM
How many know that State law requires a driver of a vehicle to stop when a pedestrian is in a crosswalk? I was delighted to learn a few days ago that this was so in Oklahoma. I knew it was the case in many other states.
Why doesn't the City employ signs that educate drivers of that law at least where they have crosswalks and indicator signs in places that experience at least marginal pedestrian traffic like Cherry St. and Brookside?
I stood purposefully in the crosswalk on Cherry Street today during lunch and for at least 3 minutes and during that time could not find a break in the two way traffic big enough to safely cross and obviously not once did anyone stop to let me cross (though it's happened a few time in the several years I've lived there). I did get a few glances suggestive of some sort of bemusement that I was rediculous enough to step foot in the street.
While I don't think that the signs will result in drivers coming to a screeching halt the second my big toenail hits the pavement in the crosswalk I do think that people will find crossing the street on foot a little easier as I'm confident that at least every fourth/ fifth driver will actually stop when a pedestrian is in the crosswalk.
I've seen these signs employed in other City's and they help tremendously. At least we can educate drivers they are breaking the law when they pass a pedestrian in a crosswalk. I'm sure 90% of the people that drive pass me don't even know their breaking the law.
I have to tell you that here in Phoenix and palces I've been in CA, it's a complete opposite. There are some places here that if you look like you are going to cross the street in a crosswalk people actually slow down and if you step off the curb 98% of the time they stop. Most of the car pedestrian accidents here are usually a result of people crossing without a crosswalk. Pedestrians here take offense and will let you know if you cut in front of them while they are crossing.
Quote from: dbacks fan on June 03, 2011, 06:31:17 PM
I have to tell you that here in Phoenix and palces I've been in CA, it's a complete opposite. There are some places here that if you look like you are going to cross the street in a crosswalk people actually slow down and if you step off the curb 98% of the time they stop. Most of the car pedestrian accidents here are usually a result of people crossing without a crosswalk. Pedestrians here take offense and will let you know if you cut in front of them while they are crossing.
Street crossing 101:
Never, ever, look at the cars. If they see you looking, they know that you know the car is coming.
Don't try that on a 6 lane major arterial though. Works good on 2 lane college campus streets.
My employer put out a safety warning about walking. They essentially banned all walking in the parking lots due to the presence of automobile traffic. This came after they'd installed speed bumps in the perimeter road in an effort to slow vehicles. Now, instead of bouncing over the speed bumps, they drive at 35-40 through the parking lot - where all the pedestrians are. So the way to deal with that potential hazard is to ban pedestrians rather than do something about the idiotic drivers.
Quote from: Ed W on June 04, 2011, 10:54:55 AM
My employer put out a safety warning about walking. They essentially banned all walking in the parking lots due to the presence of automobile traffic. This came after they'd installed speed bumps in the perimeter road in an effort to slow vehicles. Now, instead of bouncing over the speed bumps, they drive at 35-40 through the parking lot - where all the pedestrians are. So the way to deal with that potential hazard is to ban pedestrians rather than do something about the idiotic drivers.
Put bigger speed bumps in the parking lot or make it impossible to get in and out conveniently as was done at Tulsa Hills.
Quote from: Red Arrow on June 03, 2011, 06:41:43 PM
Street crossing 101:
Never, ever, look at the cars. If they see you looking, they know that you know the car is coming.
Don't try that on a 6 lane major arterial though. Works good on 2 lane college campus streets.
I feel safer crossing major arterial streets at an intersection here, than crossing a residential street in Tulsa. I can cross a major intersection, six lanes on each street, and not be challanged by a car. Tulsa it seems, makes a sport of pedestrians. In the first month that I moved to Phoenix, I was ticketed by Phoenix PD for turning at an intersection infront of a pedestrian in the cross walk, cost me $50.00.
Quote from: dbacks fan on June 04, 2011, 12:38:22 PM
I feel safer crossing major arterial streets at an intersection here, than crossing a residential street in Tulsa. I can cross a major intersection, six lanes on each street, and not be challanged by a car. Tulsa it seems, makes a sport of pedestrians. In the first month that I moved to Phoenix, I was ticketed by Phoenix PD for turning at an intersection infront of a pedestrian in the cross walk, cost me $50.00.
Oh, you go to the intersections.
;D
Quote from: Red Arrow on June 04, 2011, 01:11:16 PM
Oh, you go to the intersections.
;D
Yes, I do. Otherwise you might get hit and killed by a Catholic Bishop.
In Stillwater OSU installed a new traffic light that was designed specifically for pedestrians crossing a street. It is off Hall of Fame right on the northside of the Colvin Center. I believe it is the test site for the USDOT to evaluate how well it works to see if it should be built elsewhere. From my observations it worked really well before hand you just walked across the street and hoped all the cars stopped. I know someone got hit and was either severely injured or was killed I can't remember and shortly after the campus installed this.
It is basically a stop light but as soon as you walk up to it as a pedestrian you press the button on the pole (similar to what you do when you are crossing at an intersection) and the light shortly turns red afterwards and allows the pedestrian to cross. After about 20 seconds the light starts blinking red (for the motorist) and while the light is blinking they can process if there are no more pedestrians in the crosswalk. It essentially acts as a four way stop while the light is blinking with the pedestrian having the right of way to cross the street. After about another 30-40 seconds or so the light turns off and traffic flows east and west at a normal pace.
I think this would work very well on Cherry Street because the distance between traffic lights is very far compared to say Brookside.
I'll see if I can find any pictures of this or the story from the newspaper about it. If not I will take pictures next time I am in Stillwater.
Quote from: LandArchPoke on June 04, 2011, 03:26:42 PM
In Stillwater OSU installed a new traffic light that was designed specifically for pedestrians crossing a street... It essentially acts as a four way stop while the light is blinking with the pedestrian having the right of way to cross the street.
I was stuck at a traffic light outside the Owasso High School as classes let out for the day. The right lane would normally include both right turning and through vehicle traffic, but because the crossing guards controlled the intersection, right turns were blocked while students crossed in the crosswalk. The light turned red and we waited for the next cycle. When it arrived and my light was green, the crossing guards again stopped all right turning traffic!
A better option would be to stop all vehicle traffic with a four way red, then allow the students to cross. The next cycle would permit east-west, then north-south traffic, followed by another four way red. But it would also require two more crossing guards.
Quote from: Ed W on June 04, 2011, 05:54:34 PM
I was stuck at a traffic light outside the Owasso High School as classes let out for the day. The right lane would normally include both right turning and through vehicle traffic, but because the crossing guards controlled the intersection, right turns were blocked while students crossed in the crosswalk. The light turned red and we waited for the next cycle. When it arrived and my light was green, the crossing guards again stopped all right turning traffic!
A better option would be to stop all vehicle traffic with a four way red, then allow the students to cross. The next cycle would permit east-west, then north-south traffic, followed by another four way red. But it would also require two more crossing guards.
Is there a no right turn on red sign there?
Quote from: custosnox on June 05, 2011, 03:47:05 PM
Is there a no right turn on red sign there?
Right turns on red are OK, but when the crossing guard steps out with the stop sign in her hand, no one can turn. For instance, I was going west. When the light turned green, traffic in the right hand lane should have moved, but with the crossing guard preventing right turns through the east/west crosswalk, traffic backed up in that lane. When the light changed to red, cross traffic going north and south was heavy, but the guard prevented right turns again by entering the north/south crosswalk.
The next time I had to get through there, I used the left lane. Pulling out from the HS parking lot across a line of traffic took some nerve. Of course, if I'd been on my bicycle, I would have moved into that left lane immediately too. Dunno if that's legal, but it's better than sucking up exhaust fumes.
Quote from: OurTulsa on June 03, 2011, 06:12:54 PM
How many know that State law requires a driver of a vehicle to stop when a pedestrian is in a crosswalk? I was delighted to learn a few days ago that this was so in Oklahoma. I knew it was the case in many other states.
I grew up in California and took drivers ed in high school (when it was FREE and was an elective) and that law was ingrained to us by our teacher.
A couple of years ago, my husband was driving in California with me in my old neighborhood, where I learned how to drive. We were at stop sign. A girl was about to cross the street on a crosswalk. Since she was still a bit far away, my husband was about to drive. I told him no. He kept hesitating and wanting to drive! There was a cop behind our car and I told my husband that if he were to not let the girl cross the street, he will get a ticket. People here in Tulsa don't do that. *drive drive drive ...see a pedestrian...speeed up* hehehehe
I do not think people here are prepared for a more walkable Tulsa. I am afraid for my life to cross the street unless oncoming traffic has come to a complete stop.
I remember jogging across Memorial along the trail near the Creek. North/South traffic stopped at a red light and I had the go to cross. Northbound traffic had not come to a stopping point and were yards away from reaching the light. I stopped and waited for them to come to a stop just to be safe and EVERY car that reached that light crossed the stop line and completely covered the pedestrian crossing lines on the street. And usually when one car does it, all the other cars think that is where you are suppose to stop at regardless of where the actual stop line is. Also I had to wait on a few cars who went on a power trip to turn right onto the highway. All of them looked at me like I was crazy standing and waiting to cross the last lane of Memorial. I have also had the same experiences in downtown as well, but it is nowhere near as bad as outside of downtown where margins between traffic lights grow from every 0.10 of a mile to every 1 mile and pedestrians become few and far between. It makes my day to see some people who clearly pass the traffic light sensors and then wonder why their light has been red for the past five minutes when they are the only ones waiting (81st and Highway 75 traffic light - infrared traffic sensor).
Drivers in this area don't appear to get the concept of a crosswalk if it's at a stop light either. They will stop in the middle of them waiting for a light to turn green. This is especially bad at the exits of Riverspirit Casino and their smoke shop, as well as the lights at Yale and Memorial where people will try and creep forward to pull off a right on red to get onto the Creek Turnpike eastbound.
I've had verbal exchanges with motorists over this many times. They are essentially parked on the pedestrian right of way when they do this.
IMO, Tulsa has some of the most inattentive and uncourteous drivers in the country. It's almost like driving is a passive activity people do while they play with their iPad or smart phone.
Quote from: Conan71 on June 06, 2011, 08:51:15 AM
Drivers in this area don't appear to get the concept of a crosswalk if it's at a stop light either. They will stop in the middle of them waiting for a light to turn green. This is especially bad at the exits of Riverspirit Casino and their smoke shop, as well as the lights at Yale and Memorial where people will try and creep forward to pull off a right on red to get onto the Creek Turnpike eastbound.
I've had verbal exchanges with motorists over this many times. They are essentially parked on the pedestrian right of way when they do this.
IMO, Tulsa has some of the most inattentive and uncourteous drivers in the country. It's almost like driving is a passive activity people do while they play with their iPad or smart phone.
Agreed, and I'm a Tulsan. But, I notice that if people who live here have lived/driven in larger cities (for me that was Houston; I'm guessing for you Co that would be KC) they tend to be better drivers and a little more courteous. Not trying to toot my own horn, but I guess many Tulsans don't know the concept of passing on the left and slower traffic on the right...
The crosswalk across 1st St north of the BOk Tower is damn scary in the morning.
just in my 1 block walk from the parking garage to the Tower I typically see at least two cars blow through the red light with people in the cross walk.
Even after lunch people will run the light despite the fact that there is a TPD car parked there.
Bump the tickets for running a red light when a pedestrian is waiting for or in the pedestrian crossing to $500 a pop, set up 5 motorcycle cops here and raise the city a quick $25,000 each weekday morning for a week each month. You can easily catch 50 cars a day running that light on any given morning
Quote from: Hoss on June 06, 2011, 09:05:02 AM
Agreed, and I'm a Tulsan. But, I notice that if people who live here have lived/driven in larger cities (for me that was Houston; I'm guessing for you Co that would be KC) they tend to be better drivers and a little more courteous. Not trying to toot my own horn, but I guess many Tulsans don't know the concept of passing on the left and slower traffic on the right...
Funny part is, it was actually a couple of Texans and a Missourian who were having problems with that concept on the Turner Turnpike Friday night.
Here in La Florida tonight we stopped in a parking lot to let a family in front of us pass. All of a sudden some guy in a Mustang flies past us at 30 mph or so on a one way street in a parking lot! I don't know how he didn't hit our mirror or someone in the family in front of us. What an idiot.
Saw the signs here in Tulsa yesterday. They are on typical crosswalk notification signs warning of a crosswalk over N. Sheridan Rd. in front of BizJet or Omni Air (can't remember) just before Port Rd. They look simple but are clear in their message and bolt to the same kind of pole holding up the signs currently employed on Cherry Street.
You have got to be pulling on my leg that we can get them for employees of one company (No one else uses that sidewalk on Sheridan) and we can't put them on signs in our heaviest pedestrian areas. It's not a complicated application.
Funny thing, I was behind two other cars that were stopped at that crosswalk for one person crossing the street - in a place I imagine the average driver doesn't expect a pedestrian.
The signs work - so why not employ them?
Because of this thread I'm being more conscious of peds on Cherry Street.
Three of them looked at me for a bit yesterday before they realized I'd stopped for them.
BTW, I enjoy calling them peds.
On campus in Stillwater everybody stops for you on crosswalks. You have to remember when you are in Tulsa because NOBODY stops. Is actually is dangerous for both the driver and the person trying to cross the street. People don't expect you to stop AND the pedestrian might think you are. Or the person will go around you while driving, etc.
If they don't even stop in the crosswalks in front of the courthouse, where cops drive past constantly and where the person they hit may be a lawyer, judge or just someone who likes to sue, it's pretty much a lost cause.
I prefer to continue to at least try to educate the motoring public. I don't expect that every person that experiences a ped in a marked crosswalk will stop but I have to imagine the signage will help somewhat. If we dismiss the signage there's no way we put in traffic lights at all the crosswalks or condense ped traffic to one 'super-crossing' midway - so then what else. And I'd prefer that we not publicly continue to give over our city entirely to the automobile.
I just got back from Pensacola Beach where it was only 85 degrees...;D, and I have never seen any place where it is harder to cross the street. I would step out whenever there was a gap big enough for me to cross and would see cars speed up to try to beat me. Those drivers may or may not have heard the words I yelled at them. (no cussing though) There were so many idiots. I even saw a minivan get rearended while stopped at a crosswalk because of some idiot behind them not paying attention. It's amazing how some people even got their driver's license.
So do people just not know that you wait for pedestrians at crosswalks, not speed up, honk, and flip them off? Or do they choose to ignore it? Dangerous situations like these are what discourage people from walking more often. But on the plus side, I actually thought it made it more fun to cross the street, but I don't think it was for my four year old sister, or the hundreds of parents with small children.
Quote from: ZYX on July 31, 2011, 10:36:54 PM
I just got back from Pensacola Beach where it was only 85 degrees...;D,
Your dead to me, ya hear? DEAD!
Quote from: ZYX on July 31, 2011, 10:36:54 PM
I just got back from Pensacola Beach where it was only 85 degrees...;D, and I have never seen any place where it is harder to cross the street. I would step out whenever there was a gap big enough for me to cross and would see cars speed up to try to beat me. Those drivers may or may not have heard the words I yelled at them. (no cussing though) There were so many idiots. I even saw a minivan get rearended while stopped at a crosswalk because of some idiot behind them not paying attention. It's amazing how some people even got their driver's license.
So do people just not know that you wait for pedestrians at crosswalks, not speed up, honk, and flip them off? Or do they choose to ignore it? Dangerous situations like these are what discourage people from walking more often. But on the plus side, I actually thought it made it more fun to cross the street, but I don't think it was for my four year old sister, or the hundreds of parents with small children.
It's a Florida thing. In Ft Lauderdale when the light turns green the guy behind starts honking the instant it changes, even though you are waiting for the four cars that will run the red light on cross traffic are still blasting through the intersection.
Quote from: dbacks fan on July 31, 2011, 11:13:11 PM
It's a Florida thing. In Ft Lauderdale when the light turns green the guy behind starts honking the instant it changes, even though you are waiting for the four cars that will run the red light on cross traffic are still blasting through the intersection.
Sounds a little like Houston back when I lived there.
The cross walk on 11th St. at TU between the Reynolds Center and Campus Grill is always difficult during basketball games and I've seen several people nearly get hit. It's not uncommon to see a TPD cruiser blow right by without even slowing down. With examples like that, no wonder the rest of the Tulsa population doesn't follow Oklahoma cross-walk law (same applies to changing lanes without signaling - I see TPD on the BA do that all the time).