Quote(Reuters) - The Oklahoma Senate on Wednesday approved a bill that would create criminal penalties for undocumented immigrants who work in Oklahoma and those who smuggle them into the state.
It would also give police officers more authority to question citizenship status of suspects.
The bill, approved by a 37-8 vote, originated in the Oklahoma House and underwent revisions in the Senate. The two chambers must reconcile differences in the bill before it can go to Governor Mary Fallin. Senators faced a deadline on Thursday to pass bills that originate in the House.
Oklahoma is one of several states -- including Alabama, Georgia, Indiana, South Carolina and Utah -- where Republicans are pushing immigration measures reminiscent of the one that became law in Arizona a year ago. The Arizona law required police to investigate the immigration status of anyone they detained and suspected of being in the country illegally.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/28/us-immigration-oklahoma-idUSTRE73R08T20110428?feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews&rpc=22&sp=true
Let me be the first.
Just another ignorant day in the Oklahoma State Legislature.
Why is it the electorate keeps electing these clowns?? I am beginning to think that is self-evident.
Quote from: heironymouspasparagus on April 27, 2011, 09:32:23 PM
Just another ignorant day in the Oklahoma State Legislature.
Why is it the electorate keeps electing these clowns?? I am beginning to think that is self-evident.
I'm more interested in knowing why we keep electing people that are obviously less educated and intelligent as you. Those legislators people voted for (the "electorate") to represent them are in no way as enlightened as you. Sheesh, attacking your neighbor who wants solutions to the illegal immigration problem? What are your solutions because continuing the present approach appears to not be working very well.
And again, and again, and again, and again, you show that you either are not paying ANY attention, or have NO understanding. Will you listen this time?? And remember??
What neighbor is it that wants solutions to the illegal immigration problem?? The ones that work for a living maybe. The ones that are elected - not a chance - that would mean stepping on the toes of their supporters - you know them; the ones who benefit most from the illegals.
We actually agree on one thing - the current approach isn't working at all, let alone well. I have detailed exactly what it will take - and the ONLY things that will work - to solve the illegal immigration problem. Want to hear them again??
Well, too bad, here they come....
Number 1. Quit inviting them! That is the biggest reason they come; it has been "unofficial" official policy for a couple hundred years to "invite" one ethnic group after another to come to the land of opportunity to work for what amounts to slave wages (not to even mention the real slave situation we had to endure for such a miserably long time!). (Irish, Chinese, Italians, Polish, et al...well any thinking person reading this gets the idea... do you?) Of course, we might want to take that sign down on the Statue of Liberty if this is a course we want to take. The "cheap labor" of today is the illegal immigrant from south of the Rio Grande, from a variety of countries. India looks like it is developing as a future source, too (Google John Pickle slave camp).
Number 2. Make one more teeny, tiny, simple little law (Federal) that says something along the lines of;
Any person, company, corporation or business entity that hires any person present in the United States illegally shall be guilty of a felony. The CEO, President, and Vice-President of Human Resources, or equivalents, shall be individually and collectively be responsible for said hiring and shall be guilty of felonies. Upon conviction, they shall all be subject to a prison term with a minimum sentence of 10 years and 1 day, and shall pay a fine of $50,000 per occurrence each. In addition, they shall be liable in civil court to any person who may have applied for any job and been denied for any reason. Upon finding of liability in civil court, anyone who brings a suit against them for hiring violations shall be entitled to a judgement of no less than $50,000 per occurrence. Put an emergency clause in it so it takes effect immediately without a 90 day waiting period. By the end of May we could be illegal-free.
Being a lawyer, you can pretty it up in legalese, but you get the idea. Within about a week (probably less), there would no longer be an illegal immigrant problem.
See how easy that was?? Even a caveman can do it!!
So, when the solution is soooo simple and the problem is complained about soooo loudly, WHY has nothing been done? In fact, why has there even been an amnesty to the tune of 8 or 10 million previous lawbreakers?? (You remember - George Bush I??)
Wait... deja vu all over again:
"(Reuters) - The Oklahoma Senate on Wednesday approved a bill that would create criminal penalties for undocumented immigrants who work in Oklahoma and those who smuggle them into the state.
It would also give police officers more authority to question citizenship status of suspects."
Uh, wasn't that the primary purpose of HB 1804 which stands mostly still fully intact as passed? Are they still that seriously back-logged in the House and Senate they are still stuck on their "statement" legislation for the year?
Wasting time and diluting efforts to even mention undocumented workers. And the people the smuggle them in. This is like fighting a fire by spraying the hose at the top of the flames, when everyone knows you have to get to the root of the fire. The companies and individuals that create the demand for slave wage labor.
Texas did a stupid little law a couple months ago that spelled out all these tough penalties, then made the exclusion for illegals performing household work. So, when they put on a roof, they have to come inside and dust the table and all is forgiven.
The whole immigration issue and the way it is handled has some similarities to the war on drugs. We target small time users and growers of marijuana (to the tune of spending $18 billion a year on grass law enforcement activities) which diverts attention from the real problem - the manufacture and importation of harsh toxic, highly addictive chemicals; think crack, meth, pcp, etc.
We are shooting at the top of the flames, rather than attacking the roots.
Forget marijuana, psyllicibin (sp?) and anything that grows in or on the ground. Decriminalize it and leave it alone. Forget about it. It ain't a problem.
Then, make the manufacture and distribution of the chemicals a mandatory life in prison, no possibility of parole. If user dies or hurts or kills someone else, or anyone gets property damage, on these harsh chemicals, and connections proven, then everyone in the chain from the one whole sold the s*** to the dead, up to the distributor, importer or manufacturer is guilty of felony premeditated first degree murder, with death penalty attached.
Sell some crack and the crackhead gets in a car wreck and dies or kills someone else, then everyone involved up the chain gets the death penalty.
Make a little meth, sell it to another meth-head. Second one robs a pharmacy, then both subject to the death penalty for assault with intent to kill, and the property damage (robbery).
The solutions to some of these really nasty problems is not that hard. Just got to have the will as a society to drop the hammer.
Quotehttp://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/28/us-immigration-oklahoma-idUSTRE73R08T20110428?feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews&rpc=22&sp=true
I support this.Hopefully after this passes they make one that's tougher on the scum who hire illegals.
Quote from: guido911 on April 27, 2011, 09:25:27 PM
Let me be the first.
If this was California people like you who live to spew lies about those who oppose illegal immigration would be taken seriously. Fortunately this is Oklahoma were people like you are laughed at instead of taken seriously. Instead of making fraudulent claims of racism you should actually debate why Oklahomans should tolerate illegals. Don't you people ever worry about about your bogus claims of racism making people blow off any actual claims of racism that may happen? You can only cry wolf so many times.
Quote from: Conan71 on April 27, 2011, 11:28:42 PM
Wait... deja vu all over again:
"(Reuters) - The Oklahoma Senate on Wednesday approved a bill that would create criminal penalties for undocumented immigrants who work in Oklahoma and those who smuggle them into the state.
It would also give police officers more authority to question citizenship status of suspects."
Uh, wasn't that the primary purpose of HB 1804 which stands mostly still fully intact as passed? Are they still that seriously back-logged in the House and Senate they are still stuck on their "statement" legislation for the year?
This looks like they borrow some of the stuff of Arizona sb 1070 and adds more penalties for illegals.
You really think making them criminals is going to help anything? As if we don't spend enough money on prisons..
Just want to say good luck with that law.
Quote from: nathanm on May 13, 2011, 03:00:49 PM
You really think making them criminals is going to help anything? As if we don't spend enough money on prisons..
They will get sentenced to Mexico. I hear parole from there takes anywhere from two days to six weeks ;)
Quote from: nathanm on May 13, 2011, 03:00:49 PM
You really think making them criminals is going to help anything? As if we don't spend enough money on prisons..
Illegal immigration is already a crime. A misdemeanor for the first offense and a felony for the 2nd offense.
http://americanpatrol.com/REFERENCE/isacrime.html
Under Title 8 Section 1325 of the U.S. Code, "Improper Entry by Alien," any citizen of any country other than the United States who:
Enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers; or
Eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers; or
Attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact;
has committed a federal crime.
Violations are punishable by criminal fines and imprisonment for up to six months. Repeat offenses can bring up to two years in prison. Additional civil fines may be imposed at the discretion of immigration judges, but civil fines do not negate the criminal sanctions or nature of the offense.
I thought this was the law:
Illegal immigration is considered a felony, punishable by up to two years in prison. Immigrants who are deported and attempt to re-enter can be imprisoned for 10 years. Visa violators can be sentenced to six-year terms. Those who help illegal immigrants are also considered felons.
The state can also deport legal immigrants who are deemed detrimental to "economic or national interests," violate law, are not "physically or mentally healthy" or lack the "necessary funds for their sustenance" and/or for their dependents.
Quote from: Gaspar on May 13, 2011, 04:01:50 PM
I thought this was the law:
Illegal immigration is considered a felony, punishable by up to two years in prison. Immigrants who are deported and attempt to re-enter can be imprisoned for 10 years. Visa violators can be sentenced to six-year terms. Those who help illegal immigrants are also considered felons.
The state can also deport legal immigrants who are deemed detrimental to "economic or national interests," violate law, are not "physically or mentally healthy" or lack the "necessary funds for their sustenance" and/or for their dependents.
OH! Wait! My bad, that's the law in Mexico pertaining to illegal immigration ::).
Quote from: Gaspar on May 13, 2011, 04:03:01 PM
OH! Wait! My bad, that's the law in Mexico pertaining to illegal immigration ::).
Man, they sound like a bunch of racist haters, don't they?
Quote from: Conan71 on May 13, 2011, 04:04:11 PM
Man, they sound like a bunch of racist haters, don't they?
Nahh! Ol "Phil" Felipe Calderon says our is raciest.
Quote from: jamesrage on May 13, 2011, 03:47:37 PM
Illegal immigration is already a crime.
Unauthorized border crossing is a crime, even if the person who crossed illegally is a citizen. It's difficult to prosecute without a confession, but it is indeed a crime. It is not presently a crime to be present in or work in the US without authorization. Not being a crime doesn't mean there are no penalties, however. Being present without authorization can result in a 10 year (or even lifetime) bar from entry, plus you usually get incarcerated for a few months to a few years before you actually get deported. (ICE is slow, even when there's no need of a hearing before an ALJ)
Given that US citizens already are already occasionally mistakenly deported, I'm not so sure it's a great idea to make it even easier to deport people, much less make it a crime to be present in the US without authorization.
Quote from: nathanm on May 13, 2011, 07:48:39 PM
Unauthorized border crossing is a crime, even if the person who crossed illegally is a citizen. It's difficult to prosecute without a confession, but it is indeed a crime. It is not presently a crime to be present in or work in the US without authorization. Not being a crime doesn't mean there are no penalties, however. Being present without authorization can result in a 10 year (or even lifetime) bar from entry, plus you usually get incarcerated for a few months to a few years before you actually get deported. (ICE is slow, even when there's no need of a hearing before an ALJ)
Given that US citizens already are already occasionally mistakenly deported, I'm not so sure it's a great idea to make it even easier to deport people, much less make it a crime to be present in the US without authorization.
It still dispels your notion that the new proposed Oklahoma law would turn the illegals into criminals seeing how under federal law they are already criminals.
Quote from: jamesrage on May 14, 2011, 12:29:24 PM
It still dispels your notion that the new proposed Oklahoma law would turn the illegals into criminals seeing how under federal law they are already criminals.
You say that, but they're not. A criminal is someone you can prove committed a crime. You can't prove that any given alien crossed illegally. (Most are actually overstayers, which is not criminal but you couldn't be bothered to look that up) It's also not presently illegal for someone here legally but not eligible to work to take a job. It can get them thrown out, but the penalties for them are purely administrative.
So yes, no matter how much you try to ignore the fact, this law is criminalizing behavior which is not presently criminal.
We will continue to ignore the real solution (if you consider it a problem...depends on priorities). Our priority in the United States is to invite all the people that will come to do certain jobs for us. And that invitation is issued by corporate America, with the cute little nod and wink from the Federal government. Maybe we should actually address the right questions?? And look at real 'solutions'. (Keeping in mind, certain prices for certain products will go up, or become more scarce. Remember the old concept of 'supply and demand'??)
Quote from: heironymouspasparagus on May 15, 2011, 08:00:28 PM
We will continue to ignore the real solution (if you consider it a problem...depends on priorities). Our priority in the United States is to invite all the people that will come to do certain jobs for us. And that invitation is issued by corporate America, with the cute little nod and wink from the Federal government. Maybe we should actually address the right questions?? And look at real 'solutions'. (Keeping in mind, certain prices for certain products will go up, or become more scarce. Remember the old concept of 'supply and demand'??)
With approximately 9% unemployment, I wonder why we need immigrants.
Quote from: nathanm on May 14, 2011, 12:42:42 PM
You say that, but they're not. A criminal is someone you can prove committed a crime. You can't prove that any given alien crossed illegally. (Most are actually overstayers, which is not criminal but you couldn't be bothered to look that up) It's also not presently illegal for someone here legally but not eligible to work to take a job. It can get them thrown out, but the penalties for them are purely administrative.
So yes, no matter how much you try to ignore the fact, this law is criminalizing behavior which is not presently criminal.
Here is a statute that plainly means that being here illegally is not illegal:
Quote
(a) Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection; misrepresentation and concealment of facts
Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under Title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under Title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
(b) Improper time or place; civil penalties
Any alien who is apprehended while entering (or attempting to enter) the United States at a time or place other than as designated by immigration officers shall be subject to a civil penalty of--
(1) at least $50 and not more than $250 for each such entry (or attempted entry); or
(2) twice the amount specified in paragraph (1) in the case of an alien who has been previously subject to a civil penalty under this subsection.
Civil penalties under this subsection are in addition to, and not in lieu of, any criminal or other civil penalties that may be imposed.
(c) Marriage fraud
Any individual who knowingly enters into a marriage for the purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws shall be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or fined not more than $250,000, or both.
(d) Immigration-related entrepreneurship fraud
Any individual who knowingly establishes a commercial enterprise for the purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws shall be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, fined in accordance with Title 18, or both.
8 U.S.C.A. § 1325. I'll spare you the embarrassment in not posting the numerous statutory penalties relating to illegal immigration in general.
And what do you mean you cannot prove an alien crossed illegally? Isn't that what happens every day at the border? And I am really digging your total stupidity when it comes to the word "illegal" If you are in the country unlawfully, you are here illegally. And whether you are jailed, or fined, or thrown out, that's the consequence of violating the law.
Quote from: Red Arrow on May 15, 2011, 09:31:50 PM
With approximately 9% unemployment, I wonder why we need immigrants.
We have a contingent of lazy who would rather vote for a living than work. We need illegal labor to take up the slack. ;)
Red,
We don't need illegals. We need two things - people here who want to do certain jobs (I did a lot of construction/roofing in young years and enjoyed it for the most part) and quit encouraging the circumstances that bring in lots of people we SAY we don't want. We won't do either. Because the first statement is wrong - we do need them. Because the jobs are hard work for lousy pay.
This has been up since last July and it is still there for a reason! THIS is the PROOF of the LIE of the whole "illegal immigration" argument. We invite them. The entire United States has had this opportunity - that THEY offered - to replace them. And yet, here it is...jobs and free training still available.
http://www.takeourjobs.org/
It really is a simple choice. Either continue the lies and the hypocrisy of the current system. Or develop some type of "guest worker" system. Trying to criminalize people for being here that WE INVITE and want and need is a grotesque mockery of the principals we claim to hold dear to our Republic and our society. All that stuff they shoved down your throat in school. (Remember Lady Liberty??)
Or we could go with what I proposed earlier - if we really do want them to leave (we don't!); eliminate the invitation. Criminalize corporate and management bad behavior. But that won't happen, as we have seen, since the guidos of the world run the companies and have their buddies write the laws.
Quote from: guido911 on May 15, 2011, 10:11:25 PM
Here is a statute that plainly means that being here illegally is not illegal:
8 U.S.C.A. § 1325. I'll spare you the embarrassment in not posting the numerous statutory penalties relating to illegal immigration in general.
And what do you mean you cannot prove an alien crossed illegally? Isn't that what happens every day at the border? And I am really digging your total stupidity when it comes to the word "illegal" If you are in the country unlawfully, you are here illegally. And whether you are jailed, or fined, or thrown out, that's the consequence of violating the law.
Wow, you really know how to misrepresent. A great skill for a lawyer, actually.
As I said before, presence in this country is not a crime. The only sanction is administrative. Crossing the border illegally is a crime. Luckily for most 'illegal immigrants' (there's a reason why 'undocumented' is a more accurate statement) they actually enter legally and overstay a visa, which is again not a crime.
It's much easier to work up a froth if you don't know the facts, though!
Quote from: nathanm on May 17, 2011, 02:13:01 PM
Wow, you really know how to misrepresent. A great skill for a lawyer, actually.
As I said before, presence in this country is not a crime. The only sanction is administrative. Crossing the border illegally is a crime. Luckily for most 'illegal immigrants' (there's a reason why 'undocumented' is a more accurate statement) they actually enter legally and overstay a visa, which is again not a crime.
It's much easier to work up a froth if you don't know the facts, though!
You have stats on legal crossers over-staying visas vs. those sneaking in?
Quote from: Conan71 on May 17, 2011, 02:17:27 PM
You have stats on legal crossers over-staying visas vs. those sneaking in?
The government does. I don't have the specific numbers handy, but something like 70% of illegal immigrants entered legally and were either denied permanent residency or overstayed a tourist visa. It's why we're such bastards to the Latin American people who want to come visit their family.
Of course, some of this is partly our own fault, in that we make it incredibly difficult to understand the process and officers at ports of entry don't always explain the situation well. I once knew a fellow who thought that advance parole was a visa, and didn't figure it out until he filed for an adjustment of status to become a permanent resident.
Quote from: nathanm on May 17, 2011, 02:13:01 PM
Wow, you really know how to misrepresent. A great skill for a lawyer, actually.
As I said before, presence in this country is not a crime. The only sanction is administrative. Crossing the border illegally is a crime. Luckily for most 'illegal immigrants' (there's a reason why 'undocumented' is a more accurate statement) they actually enter legally and overstay a visa, which is again not a crime.
It's much easier to work up a froth if you don't know the facts, though!
For the love of whomever, just shut up Clavin. You don't know everything about everything. And splitting hairs over the word "unlawful", "illegal", and "criminal" and the form of punishment proves exactly what point?
"In fiscal year 2006 there were 1,071,972 arrests of undocumented immigrants in the multi-state border area, according to Customs and Border Protection (CBP). The number had fallen to 705,005 in 2008, and last year's figure was 447,731, CBP data shows. Those figures represent a 58% decrease from 2006 to 2010"
http://www.cnnstudentnews.cnn.com/2011/US/05/11/immigration.arrests.decline/index.html (http://www.cnnstudentnews.cnn.com/2011/US/05/11/immigration.arrests.decline/index.html)
Quote from: guido911 on May 17, 2011, 02:30:12 PM
For the love of whomever, just shut up Clavin. You don't know everything about everything. And splitting hairs over the word "unlawful", "illegal", and "criminal" and the form of punishment proves exactly what point?
Mmmhmm. The facts disagree, so you attack me personally? Also a good skill for a trial lawyer to have. ;)
Quote from: nathanm on May 17, 2011, 02:45:40 PM
Mmmhmm. The facts disagree, so you attack me personally? Also a good skill for a trial lawyer to have. ;)
What "fact" are you blathering about? Last I read Conan asked for stats and you gave none but your belief. And quit whining about personal attacks. I recall you calling me a deadbeat recently (but I won't let that fact get in the way Clavin).
And no answer to my hair splitting question.
Quote from: guido911 on May 17, 2011, 02:55:06 PM
What "fact" are you blathering about? Last I read Conan asked for stats and you gave none but your belief. And quit whining about personal attacks. I recall you calling me a deadbeat recently (but I won't let that fact get in the way Clavin).
And no answer to my hair splitting question.
It's funny that every time you express disbelief of a given number, I come up with a reference, yet you continue to disbelieve.
From Cato, of all people:
Quote
o More than half of illegal aliens enter legally and
overstay their visas and permits. "Less than half of illegal
immigrants cross the nation's borders clandestinely. The majority
enter legally and overstay their visas" (Fix and Passel 1994, 4).
It's like you don't know how to use the Google.
And yeah, I called you a deadbeat after about 50 separate occasions where you called my integrity, intelligence, or other attribute into question rather than addressing my argument.
The Cato citation is 1994, anything more recent? At any rate, sounds closer to 50/50, not the vast majority over-stayed a visa.
Not to nit-pick or anything ;)
Quote from: Conan71 on May 17, 2011, 03:41:57 PM
The Cato citation is 1994, anything more recent? At any rate, sounds closer to 50/50, not the vast majority over-stayed a visa.
Not to nit-pick or anything ;)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/77/Kato_(The_Green_Hornet).jpg/250px-Kato_(The_Green_Hornet).jpg)
Oh..wrong Cato...
Sorry, couldn't help myself there... ;D
Quote from: Conan71 on May 17, 2011, 03:41:57 PM
The Cato citation is 1994, anything more recent? At any rate, sounds closer to 50/50, not the vast majority over-stayed a visa.
Not to nit-pick or anything ;)
A more recent Pew study put it at 50/50. There are more, but I'm on vacation in Colorado, so I'm not terribly interested in spending my day looking up studies. Either way, at least half of "illegals" haven't committed a crime. A far cry from jamesrage's statement that they're all criminals.
Quote from: nathanm on May 17, 2011, 04:54:01 PM
A far cry from jamesrage's statement that they're all criminals.
Strange. I thought they were here illegally. If that is the case then 100% are criminals.
Quote from: nathanm on May 17, 2011, 04:54:01 PM
A more recent Pew study put it at 50/50. There are more, but I'm on vacation in Colorado, so I'm not terribly interested in spending my day looking up studies. Either way, at least half of "illegals" haven't committed a crime. A far cry from jamesrage's statement that they're all criminals.
WTH are you doing on here then?
If you are within 100 miles of Pagosa Springs you MUST visit the Pagosa Brewing Co. Absolutely outstanding microbrews. Poor Richard's Ale and Pow Pow IPA are amazing brews.
Quote from: Conan71 on May 18, 2011, 02:25:56 PM
WTH are you doing on here then?
If you are within 100 miles of Pagosa Springs you MUST visit the Pagosa Brewing Co. Absolutely outstanding microbrews. Poor Richard's Ale and Pow Pow IPA are amazing brews.
He's part of the "connected 24/7/52 + the few extra days + leap day every fourth year" crowd. He can't help it.
I haven't been to the Pagosa Brewing Co but would certainly make the opportunity if reasonably possible.
Quote from: Red Arrow on May 18, 2011, 02:34:44 PM
He's part of the "connected 24/7/52 + the few extra days + leap day every fourth year" crowd. He can't help it.
I haven't been to the Pagosa Brewing Co but would certainly make the opportunity if reasonably possible.
Aside from that, if you were to travel through northern New Mexico to get there, particularly Taos, there's plenty of great Southwestern food to eat and more microbrews to drink along the way. Gazpacho's in Durango is another great eatery with Steamworks Brewpub being in the neighborhood. I'd heard a rumor Steamworks had shut down but according to the web site they are still open.
Thanks for the suggestions. On the way here, I passed through Pagosa Springs, but it was late and I was trying to make Durango before dark.
I'm not connected 24 hours a day..more like 16. I was at four corners earlier..checking TNF. It's amazing where you can get cell service these days.
Sadly, the weather has turned to smile and the snow line is down to 7500 feet (would be nice in ski season..not so much in May..I wanted to drive up to Silverton tomorrow and perhaps on to Ouray), so it seems that Steamworks is my best shot for brew. I may be able to hit Pagosa on the way back home, though I think she who must be obeyed wants to do the drive back over two days. Apparently she didn't like that we made it in less than 13 hours.
BTW, the Ore House has fantastic steak and the rum cake is to die for.
TeeDub, my entire point was that it's not a crime to be here without authorization. It's the entry that may have been illegal, but is not at leas half(ish) the time. Do try to keep up.
Quote from: nathanm on May 18, 2011, 05:12:10 PM
I'm not connected 24 hours a day..more like 16. I was at four corners earlier..checking TNF. It's amazing where you can get cell service these days.
You actually turn your phone off for about 8 hrs/day? Cool. Rebel.
Quote from: nathanm on May 18, 2011, 05:12:10 PM
Thanks for the suggestions. On the way here, I passed through Pagosa Springs, but it was late and I was trying to make Durango before dark.
I'm not connected 24 hours a day..more like 16. I was at four corners earlier..checking TNF. It's amazing where you can get cell service these days.
Sadly, the weather has turned to smile and the snow line is down to 7500 feet (would be nice in ski season..not so much in May..I wanted to drive up to Silverton tomorrow and perhaps on to Ouray), so it seems that Steamworks is my best shot for brew. I may be able to hit Pagosa on the way back home, though I think she who must be obeyed wants to do the drive back over two days. Apparently she didn't like that we made it in less than 13 hours.
BTW, the Ore House has fantastic steak and the rum cake is to die for.
TeeDub, my entire point was that it's not a crime to be here without authorization. It's the entry that may have been illegal, but is not at leas half(ish) the time. Do try to keep up.
If you get stuck in Durango around lunch time, try Gazpachos and get something with Christmas chile sauce, their red and green are excellent. Honeyville, north of Durango on the way to Silverton is a great place to find odd jams and salsas. That's one of the mandatory stops with FMC every year to get gifts for the family and friends back home.
Funny story: we thought we had plenty of time to get out to four corners, got there with plenty of daylight left at 5:45pm. Only problem was it closed at 5pm. Good idea to check ahead when driving 80 miles out of your way to see landmarks. ;)
How many illegals headed for the US can you stuff into two semi trailers?
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/americas/05/17/mexico.migrants/index.html?hpt=T1 (http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/americas/05/17/mexico.migrants/index.html?hpt=T1)
Not sure if this has been posted or not. Interesting development at the Supremes:
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110526-709928.html
Not sure if this has been posted or not. Interesting development at the Supremes (cropped):
Quote
WASHINGTON (Dow Jones)--The U.S. Supreme Court on Thursday upheld an Arizona law that imposes sanctions against businesses that hire illegal immigrants.
The court, on a 5-3 vote, said federal immigration law does not bar Arizona from suspending or revoking the licenses of businesses that employ unauthorized aliens.
"Because we conclude that the state's licensing provisions fall squarely within the federal statute's savings clause and that the Arizona regulation does not otherwise conflict with federal law, we hold that the Arizona law is not preempted," Chief Justice John Roberts wrote in a 27-page opinion.
Then-Gov. Janet Napolitano signed the Arizona law ...
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110526-709928.html
Here's some analysis which sheds some light on the potential prospects of Oklahoma's reforms surviving a constitutional challenge.
http://dailycaller.com/2011/05/26/the-supreme-courts-immigration-monkey-wrench/
Quote from: guido911 on May 29, 2011, 08:42:34 PM
Not sure if this has been posted or not. Interesting development at the Supremes (cropped):
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110526-709928.html
Here's some analysis which sheds some light on the potential prospects of Oklahoma's reforms surviving a constitutional challenge.
http://dailycaller.com/2011/05/26/the-supreme-courts-immigration-monkey-wrench/
Who knew the Supremes were so HATEFUL?
Quote from: Conan71 on May 30, 2011, 11:20:56 AM
Who knew the Supremes were so HATEFUL?
Or so Constitutionally challenged.
Quote from: Conan71 on May 30, 2011, 11:20:56 AM
Who knew the Supremes were so HATEFUL?
Raciest!
We need some
Illegal Aliens displaced foreign workers on the Supreme Court to balance things out!
We could also pay them less than the other justices and save the tax payers some money. We also wouldn't have to report taxes if we just pay them in cash.
Actually. . .I have a better idea. . .fire all federal workers and replace them with an all "displaced foreign worker" workforce. Imagine how much money we could save!!!
I thought moonbats were only supposed to come out on the night of the full moon.
Quote from: nathanm on May 31, 2011, 01:43:06 PM
I thought moonbats were only supposed to come out on the night of the full moon.
Sorry, did I beat you to it? ;D
The business sanction law is a law without a whole lot of bite to it.
"Although the legal-workers law has been controversial, questions have been raised about whether it has been effective.
Last year, The Arizona Republic reported that half of new hires in Arizona had been vetted by E-Verify and that only a third of the state's estimated 100,000 employers had signed up for the E-Verify program.
The employer-sanctions law requires that businesses use E-Verify, but there is no punishment if a business does not.
Since the law took effect in 2008, only two Arizona companies have been punished for hiring illegal workers. A case against a third company, Scottsdale Art Factory, is pending in Maricopa County Superior Court.
The County Attorneys Office enforces the employer-sanctions law and educates employers about its requirements through a business-advisory council.
Jerry Cobb, spokesman for County Attorney Bill Montgomery, said about the ruling,"It affords the county attorney a greater degree of certainty going forward."
The Scottsdale Art Factory case had been delayed, in part, because the high court had not ruled on the matter, Cobb said."
More from the article:
http://www.azcentral.com/business/news/articles/2011/05/26/20110526high-court-sustains-arizona-employer-sanctions-law.html (http://www.azcentral.com/business/news/articles/2011/05/26/20110526high-court-sustains-arizona-employer-sanctions-law.html)
Quote from: nathanm on May 31, 2011, 01:17:07 PM
Or so Constitutionally challenged.
Your innate knowledge of it is superior?
Debbie Wasserman-Schultz (my new favorite hyphenated person) and chairperson of the DNC says that the Republicans want to make illegal immigration a crime!
She's so awesome!
I look forward to more great things to come from her. :)
Quote from: Conan71 on May 31, 2011, 03:51:50 PM
Your innate knowledge of it is superior?
No, but I did learn to read and managed to score highly on reading comprehension tests in school. ;)
Scalia constantly goes on about how he's an originalist, yet he's perfectly happy to let the states enact laws in some areas reserved for the US Congress while denying them that privilege with respect to other Congressional powers outlined in the same article of the Constitution.
He's at least slightly less predictable than Thomas, though. Thomas' votes come down on his political side of any given case almost 100% of the time, even when his legal reasoning has to get creative to do it. I'm not saying that any of the others are better on this, mind you, just mostly more honest about it. They don't go around constantly crowing about how impartial they are and how wedded to the Constitution as-written they are.
Quote from: Conan71 on May 31, 2011, 03:51:50 PM
Your innate knowledge of it is superior?
He knows everything. After all, we live in Nate's world and be grateful that he allows us to live in it.
Quote from: Gaspar on May 31, 2011, 04:44:57 PM
Debbie Wasserman-Schultz (my new favorite hyphenated person)
How do you know she's a virgin?
Quote from: guido911 on May 31, 2011, 05:18:31 PM
He knows everything. After all, we live in Nate's world and be grateful that he allows us to live in it.
Your projection is getting tiresome.
Quote from: Gaspar on May 31, 2011, 04:44:57 PM
Debbie Wasserman-Schultz (my new favorite hyphenated person) and chairperson of the DNC says that the Republicans want to make illegal immigration a crime!
She's so awesome!
I look forward to more great things to come from her. :)
Here's this genius outlining the democrat plan to save Medicare.
From Debbie Wasserman-Schultz:
Quote"We have 12 million undocumented immigrants in this country that are part of the backbone of our economy and this is not only a reality but a necessity," she said. "And that it would be harmful--the Republican solution that I've seen in the last three years is that we should just pack them all up and ship them back to their own countries and that in fact it should be a crime and we should arrested them all."
They either came here illegally to begin with, or, they have over stayed their visa, which is illegal and subject to deportation. I'm not saying round them all up, but I don't want to see blanket amnesty for them either. Get in line and go through the process or go home.
Quote from: guido911 on May 31, 2011, 06:04:51 PM
Here's this genius outlining the democrat plan to save Medicare.
Translates to: "We don't have a bucking clue what we are going to do about it, so I'm simply going to deflect to some hyperbole so the GOP looks even worse than we do"
Thanks for playing, Deb.
Wow! Where did they dig her up? Miss Teen USA pageant?
I kept waiting for her to bust out: "And like the Eye-raq and so on..."
Here is the dubious website FactCheck tearing the poodle a new one.
http://www.factcheck.org/2011/05/dnc-chair-throws-truth-to-wolves/
Quote from: Gaspar on May 31, 2011, 04:44:57 PM
Debbie Wasserman-Schultz (my new favorite hyphenated person) and chairperson of the DNC says that the Republicans want to make illegal immigration a crime!
She's so awesome!
I look forward to more great things to come from her. :)
Didn't you get the email?? Congress has declared it a non-crime at least these 7 times.
1. Immigration and Reform Control Act (IRCA), 1986: A blanket amnesty for over 2.7 million illegal aliens
2. Section 245(i) Amnesty, 1994: A temporary rolling amnesty for 578,000 illegal aliens
3. Section 245(i) Extension Amnesty, 1997: An extension of the rolling amnesty created in 1994
4. Nicaraguan Adjustment and Central American Relief Act (NACARA) Amnesty, 1997: An amnesty for close to one million illegal aliens from Central America
5. Haitian Refugee Immigration Fairness Act Amnesty (HRIFA), 1998: An amnesty for 125,000 illegal aliens from Haiti
6. Late Amnesty, 2000: An amnesty for some illegal aliens who claim they should have been amnestied under the 1986 IRCA amnesty, an estimated 400,000 illegal aliens
7. LIFE Act Amnesty, 2000: A reinstatement of the rolling Section 245(i) amnesty, an estimated 900,000 illegal aliens
So, if this IS a problem in this country, what is wrong with going after the actual source of said problem? Rather than the foreseeable result of the actions of that source??
That was just Congress trying to get more voters on the rolls ;D
Immigration bill upheld by OK Supreme Court
QuoteThe state Supreme Court on Tuesday upheld a lower court's decision that determined virtually all of the state's anti-illegal immigration law is constitutional.
Related content
Links
"It is not the place of the Supreme Court or any court to concern itself with a statute's propriety, desirability, wisdom or its practicality as a working proposition," the 25-page ruling states. "Such questions are plainly and definitely established by fundamental laws as functions of the legislative branch of government."
Rep. Randy Terrill, the author of House Bill 1804, said he was pleased the high court has validated virtually all of the measure. The law makes it illegal to knowingly transport illegal immigrants, creates state barriers to hiring illegal workers and requires proof of citizenship before a person can receive government benefits.
http://newsok.com/oklahomas-high-court-upholds-states-anti-illegal-immigration-bill/article/3577093#ixzz1PNKLNyzA
Alabama is also passing an immigration bill, and I love this quote from an economics professor on the cost and futillity of the law.
QuoteJeremy Thornton, an associate professor of economics at Samford University's Brock School of Business, said from an economist's perspective, it is probably a fallacy for people to believe cracking down on immigrants will create that many jobs for Alabamians.
In reality, he said, immigrants tend to take low-paid manual labor or hard-working construction jobs that many no longer desire.
"It's an us vs. them type argument that has no basis in fact," Thornton said. "Generally these type immigration laws do not increase employment opportunities. This will add a significant cost to the recruitment of workers in construction, hotel cleaning and agriculture. I'd argue you shouldn't put more burdens on employers in who they can hire. That's federal regulators job."
http://blog.al.com/businessnews/2011/06/new_alabama_immigration_law_ra.html (http://blog.al.com/businessnews/2011/06/new_alabama_immigration_law_ra.html)
Classic egghead talk from someone who never hired a person in their life. Thanks for sharing Dback.
"I'd argue you shouldn't put more burdens on employers in who they can hire. That's federal regulators job."
"Crackdown on Illegal Labor Intensifies ."
http://tinyurl.com/3zwu7zz
(http://tinyurl.com/3zwu7zz)
QuoteThe Obama administration intensified a crackdown on employers of illegal immigrants, notifying 1,000 companies Wednesday that they will be subjected to inspections of hiring records.
The surge brings the number of companies audited by immigration authorities to 2,338 in the fiscal year that began Oct. 1, surpassing last year's record 2,196. The total amount of fines levied against employers for breaking labor and immigration laws reached $7.1 million compared with $6.9 million for the entire previous fiscal year.
So when is the US Gov't going to sue the dozen or so other states that are passing immigration laws? Where's Crazy Al Sharpton in all of this? Where's the "Boycot these states for being racist?"
She is just awesome! Awesome I tell ya!
. . .and we thought Howard Dean was the man.
Individually the DNC has a good blend of intellect, emotion, and moon-battery, but collectively, they make decisions on leadership that really shows where the concentration lies.
She is marvelous.
I do miss The Fuhrer Howard.
(http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/howard_dean.jpg)
Quote from: Gaspar on June 27, 2011, 07:27:19 AM
She is just awesome! Awesome I tell ya!
. . .and we thought Howard Dean was the man.
Individually the DNC has a good blend of intellect, emotion, and moon-battery, but collectively, they make decisions on leadership that really shows where the concentration lies.
She is marvelous.
I do miss The Fuhrer Howard.
(http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/howard_dean.jpg)
He's no more crazy than the Bachmann!
(http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/G/m/M/3/michele-bachmann-nuts.jpg)
Quote from: Hoss on June 27, 2011, 08:03:57 AM
He's no more crazy than the Bachmann!
(http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/G/m/M/3/michele-bachmann-nuts.jpg)
Hoss, are you sure that's Michelle Bachman? Looks more like Linda Lovelace in that shot to me.
Quote from: Conan71 on June 27, 2011, 08:31:09 AM
Hoss, are you sure that's Michelle Bachman? Looks more like Linda Lovelace in that shot to me.
You had to use the word "shot" didn't you.
Quote from: Gaspar on June 27, 2011, 08:56:46 AM
You had to use the word "shot" didn't you.
But I did not precede it with the word "money"
http://projects.nytimes.com/census/2010/map?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=thab1
Wow! Hispanics really don't like the cold.
I am really attempting to find the relevance in this. . . :D
Short sightedness can come back and bite you in the butt.
http://news.yahoo.com/ala-loses-workers-immigration-law-takes-effect-222404123.html (http://news.yahoo.com/ala-loses-workers-immigration-law-takes-effect-222404123.html)
Ala. loses workers as immigration law takes effect
QuoteMONTGOMERY, Ala. (AP) — Alabama's strict new immigration law may be backfiring. Intended to force illegal workers out of jobs, it is also driving away many construction workers, roofers and field hands in the country legally who do backbreaking jobs that Americans generally won't.
The vacancies have created a void that will surely deal a blow to the state's economy and could slow the rebuilding of Tuscaloosa and other tornado-damaged cities.
Employers believe they can carry on because of the dismal economy, but when things do turn around, they worry there won't be anyone around to hire. Many legal Hispanic workers are fleeing the state because their family and friends don't have the proper papers and they fear they will be jailed.
Rick Pate, the owner of a commercial landscaping company in Montgomery, lost two of his most experienced workers, who were in the country legally. He spent thousands of dollars training them to install irrigation systems at places like the Hyundai plant.
"They just feel like there is a negative atmosphere for them here. They don't feel welcome. I don't begrudge them. I'd feel nervous, too," Pate said.
Its has multiple effects, few of them good. Alabama stands to lose lots of convention business as well if Arizona and Colorado are any predictor. Then it just ripples through the state economy. However, it has popular support because they are suffering high unemployment in the state and this is supposed to open up jobs that illegals are now holding. Looks good in the polls too.
Now if they could just get Americans to work like slaves for low pay, with no benefits, require no payroll taxes and live in group homes...they would have a net positive benefit.
No one wins either way really. These issues tend to flare up during bad economies and be tolerated during good ones. Pragmatically, that is the only solution.
"I've spoken of the shining city all my political life, but I don't know if I ever quite communicated what I saw when I said it. But in my mind it was a tall, proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, windswept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace; a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity. And if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here. That's how I saw it, and see it still."
- Ronald Reagan farewell speech as President.
State Lawmaker Proposes Plan To Allow Illegals To Work In Oklahoma
http://www.newson6.com/story/16198651/state-lawmaker-proposes-plan-to-allow-illegals-to-work-in-oklahoma?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter (http://www.newson6.com/story/16198651/state-lawmaker-proposes-plan-to-allow-illegals-to-work-in-oklahoma?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
QuoteOKLAHOMA CITY - A Republican state lawmaker has filed legislation that would allow illegal immigrants to legally work in Oklahoma.
Sen. Harry Coates of Seminole filed the Oklahoma Guest Worker Program Act on Monday. Coates says the measure would stop immigrants from fleeing to Texas and other states and encourage them to return to Oklahoma and jobs that are chronically unfilled.
Coates says that since the passage of tough anti-illegal immigrant legislation in 2007, many illegal immigrants have moved to surrounding states where they pump millions of dollars into those economies.
Under the bill, people living in the country without legal permission could stay in Oklahoma if they purchase a guest worker permit for $2,000. They would have to find a sponsor to hire them and provide them with basic health insurance coverage.
Quote from: Townsend on December 06, 2011, 10:28:25 AM
State Lawmaker Proposes Plan To Allow Illegals To Work In Oklahoma
http://www.newson6.com/story/16198651/state-lawmaker-proposes-plan-to-allow-illegals-to-work-in-oklahoma?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter (http://www.newson6.com/story/16198651/state-lawmaker-proposes-plan-to-allow-illegals-to-work-in-oklahoma?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
Are the illegals he is referring to "brown people"? He does realize he has an "R" next to his name right?
Quote from: carltonplace on December 06, 2011, 10:45:50 AM
Are the illegals he is referring to "brown people"? He does realize he has an "R" next to his name right?
Must've heard from enough of his constituents who are losing a bunch o'money due to inability to find cheaper labor.
Quote from: carltonplace on December 06, 2011, 10:45:50 AM
Are the illegals he is referring to "brown people"? He does realize he has an "R" next to his name right?
I saw that this AM in the paper. He must be an infiltrator. ;D
HHS knows something about Bridenstine and they're keeping him away from minors...
Oklahoma Congressman Denied Access to Facilityhttp://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-congressman-denied-access-facility (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-congressman-denied-access-facility)
(http://publicradiotulsa.org/sites/kwgs/files/styles/card_280/public/201212/Bridenstine.jpg)
QuoteFORT SILL, Okla. (AP) — A Republican congressman from Oklahoma says he was denied access to a federal facility at Fort Sill that is housing hundreds of mostly teenage immigrant children from Central America.
Freshman U.S. Rep. Jim Bridenstine of Tulsa says he was visiting the Army post on Tuesday when he approached the facility and was told by security that he was not allowed to enter.
The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services is overseeing the children's care, and Bridenstine says an agency official told him he could schedule a visit in three weeks. Bridenstine says there is "no excuse" for denying him access to the facility.
A spokesman for HHS didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.
Gov. Mary Fallin and U.S. Sen. Jim Inhofe toured the facility two weeks ago.
Ft Sill is a closed post. Nobody can just show up at the gate expecting to be let in. If you don't have a pass, or are on the approved list for the day, you don't get in. I would think he could have made a few calls and gotten approval, but it sounds like he didn't do that, or didn't want to for political reasons.
Edit - Just re-read. If he was approved on post and already doing a tour, then he has more room to criticize.
Quote from: rebound on July 02, 2014, 12:56:51 PM
Edit - Just re-read. If he was approved on post and already doing a tour, then he has more room to criticize.
Not if he was asking for a price list.
Quote from: rebound on July 02, 2014, 12:56:51 PM
Ft Sill is a closed post. Nobody can just show up at the gate expecting to be let in.
Unless you are in this country illegally. Then, it's "Come on in!"
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 01:59:13 PM
Unless you are in this country illegally. Then, it's "Come on in!"
"...but first, let me put these shackles on you"
Quote from: Townsend on July 02, 2014, 12:33:33 PM
HHS knows something about Bridenstine and they're keeping him away from minors...
Oklahoma Congressman Denied Access to Facility
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-congressman-denied-access-facility (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-congressman-denied-access-facility)
(http://publicradiotulsa.org/sites/kwgs/files/styles/card_280/public/201212/Bridenstine.jpg)
Why was it necessary that your source point out that Bridenstine is a "freshman" Congressman? It adds nothing to the story but to somehow make it sound like he has less significance than other Congressmen or he is naively ignorant (which I know folks in here will cheer). And why isn't Gov Fallin referred to as a "freshman" governor. She's still in her first term.
Quote from: Townsend on July 02, 2014, 02:02:33 PM
"...but first, let me put these shackles on you"
The horror. People violating the law being treated like criminals!!! Assuming your freak out hyperbole of course.
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 02:03:24 PM
Why was it necessary that your source point out that Bridenstine is a "freshman" Congressman? It adds nothing to the story but to somehow make it sound like he has less significance than other Congressmen or he is naively ignorant (which I know folks in here will cheer). And why isn't Gov Fallin referred to as a "freshman" governor. She's still in her first term.
It's conspiratorial. His own website asks what Ft Sill is trying to hide.
Conspiracy.
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 02:03:24 PM
Why was it necessary that your source point out that Bridenstine is a "freshman" Congressman? It adds nothing to the story but to somehow make it sound like he has less significance than other Congressmen or he is naively ignorant (which I know folks in here will cheer). And why isn't Gov Fallin referred to as a "freshman" governor. She's still in her first term.
She's, ahem, more
experienced.
Looks like the left coast is getting a bit NIMBY.
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/07/02/mayor-pro-tem-immigration-protests-likely-every-time-buses-head-for-murrieta/
Quote from: Conan71 on July 02, 2014, 02:27:29 PM
She's, ahem, more experienced.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jE4fJnM2ed4
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 02:31:14 PM
Looks like the left coast is getting a bit NIMBY.
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/07/02/mayor-pro-tem-immigration-protests-likely-every-time-buses-head-for-murrieta/
Same folks that were tricked into passing prop 8 I'd imagine.
Quote from: Townsend on July 02, 2014, 02:35:28 PM
Same folks that were tricked into passing prop 8 I'd imagine.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_3p9o5-os8Bw/R3aHc710q9I/AAAAAAAAFeU/vLgQGK2gJZo/s320/S--DU+STUPID+POST+AWARD.jpg)
Drudge is covering the Bridenstine story now.
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/381773/hhs-bars-congressman-seeing-immigrant-children-joel-gehrke
As for Bridenstine's alleged conspiratorial thinking, barring him from where illegals are being housed will NOT help.
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 02:31:14 PM
Looks like the left coast is getting a bit NIMBY.
http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/07/02/mayor-pro-tem-immigration-protests-likely-every-time-buses-head-for-murrieta/
I'm sure there is a cattle rancher in Nevada that's looking for some ranch hands that could take them.
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 06:48:52 PM
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_3p9o5-os8Bw/R3aHc710q9I/AAAAAAAAFeU/vLgQGK2gJZo/s320/S--DU+STUPID+POST+AWARD.jpg)
Oh please, your posts are ball suckers.
Quote from: dbacksfan 2.0 on July 02, 2014, 08:42:31 PM
I'm sure there is a cattle rancher in Nevada that's looking for some ranch hands that could take them.
Ranches on federal land, rent-free?
Quote from: Conan71 on July 02, 2014, 09:48:17 PM
Ranches on federal land, rent-free?
Yeah, he's apparently this nice big hearted guy with a soft spot for the less fortunate. ;D
(http://media.washtimes.com/media/image/2014/07/02/jim-bridenstine.jpeg)
But..they all look so delicious...you must let me in...
Quote from: Townsend on July 03, 2014, 08:51:27 AM
(http://media.washtimes.com/media/image/2014/07/02/jim-bridenstine.jpeg)
But..they all look so delicious...you must let me in...
Saw BS (Bridenstine) on 6 in the morning. A special kind of stoopid.
Quote from: Hoss on July 03, 2014, 08:58:58 AM
Saw BS (Bridenstine) on 6 in the morning. A special kind of stoopid.
It'd be great if he knew he shouldn't be embarrassed to be seen reading a book.
Quote from: Townsend on July 03, 2014, 09:07:32 AM
It'd be great if he knew he shouldn't be embarrassed to be seen reading a book.
He might be misconstrued as a critical thinker.
Quote from: Townsend on July 03, 2014, 09:07:32 AM
It'd be great if he knew he shouldn't be embarrassed to be seen reading a book.
What makes you think he can read??
Come on guys, leave Baby Huey alone.
(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/32/32cf35ce2f70b3119e4db57bc88041a98e30f215c8c6f59b08c9e8b6957da6f5.jpg)
Quote from: Conan71 on July 03, 2014, 10:05:39 AM
Come on guys, leave Baby Huey alone.
(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/32/32cf35ce2f70b3119e4db57bc88041a98e30f215c8c6f59b08c9e8b6957da6f5.jpg)
Have to file that in the "unable to be unseen" category. Thanks a lot! 😕
Quote from: guido911 on July 02, 2014, 02:03:24 PM
Why was it necessary that your source point out that Bridenstine is a "freshman" Congressman? It adds nothing to the story but to somehow make it sound like he has less significance than other Congressmen or he is naively ignorant (which I know folks in here will cheer). And why isn't Gov Fallin referred to as a "freshman" governor. She's still in her first term.
Any congressman with "freshman" in front of his name means he has far more credibility in my book. ;D
Quote from: Gaspar on July 03, 2014, 12:41:09 PM
Any congressman with "freshman" in front of his name means he has far more credibility in my book. ;D
Why?
Quote from: swake on July 03, 2014, 12:53:39 PM
Why?
It only takes a few years for them to become corrupt, and a decade or two to completely forget who they represent.
Quote from: Gaspar on July 03, 2014, 01:14:32 PM
It only takes a few years for them to become corrupt, and a decade or two to completely forget who they represent.
Oh now I doubt they forget the organizations that donated money and got them elected and continue to send lobbyists throughout their tenure.
Quote from: Townsend on July 03, 2014, 01:17:27 PM
Oh now I doubt they forget the organizations that donated money and got them elected and continue to send lobbyists throughout their tenure.
You mean the lobbyists who sat him down for his first 30 days in Washington and showed him how it works?
Quote from: Conan71 on July 03, 2014, 02:45:31 PM
You mean the lobbyists who sat him down for his first 30 days in Washington and showed him how it works?
and had walked him through the candidacy, yes
Congressman Granted Immigration Facility Tourhttp://publicradiotulsa.org/post/congressman-granted-immigration-facility-tour (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/congressman-granted-immigration-facility-tour)
(http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/kwgs/files/201407/jimdenied.jpg)
"Bathe them and bring them to me."
QuoteTulsa Congressman Jim Bridenstine will tour the detention facility at Fort Sill, housing minors who have entered this country illegally, after all. In a news release, the Congressman says the tour is set for this Saturday. He calls it a "showcase tour."
JIM BRIDENSTINE: "Ordinary Americans have a right to know what is happening in these facilities, how the children are being treated, and what is being done to stop this human tragedy"
The Congressman says he will continue to make unannounced visits to the facility. He was turned away last week by security guard. He blames the problem on the President's immigration policies and failure to follow the law.
JIM BRIDENSTINE: "Human suffering is escalating because of the failure to enforce the law. The solution is to enforce the laws and stop illegal immigration."
While Bridenstine is an Oklahoma Congressman, Fort Sill is not in his congressional district.
Quote from: Townsend on July 07, 2014, 12:43:39 PM
Congressman Granted Immigration Facility Tour
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/congressman-granted-immigration-facility-tour (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/congressman-granted-immigration-facility-tour)
(http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/kwgs/files/201407/jimdenied.jpg)
"Bathe them and bring them to me."
Nice B&B reference.
Quote from: Townsend on July 07, 2014, 12:43:39 PM
Congressman Granted Immigration Facility Tour
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/congressman-granted-immigration-facility-tour (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/congressman-granted-immigration-facility-tour)
(http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/kwgs/files/201407/jimdenied.jpg)
"Bathe them and bring them to me."
QuoteWhile Bridenstine is an Oklahoma Congressman, Fort Sill is not in his congressional district.
I think 'showcase tour' could probably be changed to 'looky looky at me' in this case.
Quote from: Gaspar on July 03, 2014, 01:14:32 PM
It only takes a few years for them to become corrupt, and a decade or two to completely forget who they represent.
Inhofe has never forgotten and continues to crow about it - big oil!! And he says they should give him more, so he can represent them better!
Quote from: heironymouspasparagus on July 07, 2014, 02:27:44 PM
Inhofe has never forgotten and continues to crow about it - big oil!! And he says they should give him more, so he can represent them better!
If not for big oil, we'd probably still be at or near double digit unemployment.
Quote from: Conan71 on July 07, 2014, 02:32:46 PM
If not for big oil, we'd probably still be at or near double digit unemployment.
So diversification makes sense.
Quote from: Townsend on July 07, 2014, 03:14:47 PM
So diversification makes sense.
Our idea of diversification means sending manufacturing jobs overseas or across the border to diverse countries.
Quote from: Conan71 on July 07, 2014, 03:54:43 PM
Our idea of diversification means sending manufacturing jobs overseas or across the border to diverse countries.
Yeah, it'd be cool if Oklahoma worked on educating the populous and improving living standards in the state. That'd probably work out better then the dumbassed things we choose to rub our worry stones over.
Quote from: Conan71 on July 07, 2014, 02:32:46 PM
If not for big oil, we'd probably still be at or near double digit unemployment.
Since when has Oklahoma ever been in double digit unemployment?
Or are you talking nationally....yeah, good thing they didn't do all those layoffs about every 3 years for the last what, 40 or 50 years or so? Oh....wait....
In KWGS Interview: Governor Vents Over Immigration(http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/kwgs/files/styles/card_280/public/201406/Fallin-Immigration.JPG)
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/kwgs-interview-governor-vents-over-immigration (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/kwgs-interview-governor-vents-over-immigration)
QuoteGovernor Fallin says it is unconscionable that the federal government places some of the undocumented minors with sponsors who themselves are in the country illegally. The Governor says often, these sponsors are relatives who themselves are illegal immigrants. The sponsor is given a date on which they are asked to return with the child to immigration court. However, only slightly more than half of the children ever return for that court date.
MARY FALLIN: "Because of the president's amnesty policies, families in Central America are sending their children to make a dangerous journey alone across Mexico and eventually to our southern border. We know that some of those children don't make it. They are abducted by traffickers, abused, and sometimes killed. By not getting serious about border control, and by pursuing policies that amount to amnesty, we are encouraging this dangerous journey and the atrocities that often accompany it."
Fallin says the current influx of immigrant children is unfairly burdening states and taxpayers. Minors from facilities like Fort Sill who are placed with sponsors are, under federal law, entitled to be educated in public schools.
MARY FALLIN : "Many of our public schools are already at capacity and need additional funding. Our health care system is strained as it is. Now, instead of allowing us to address those needs for Oklahomans, President Obama is forcing us to add an unspecified number of illegal immigrants to our public education and public health systems."
Fallin said she agreed that the border crisis was, in part, a humanitarian issue, but that the administration's policies were making the humanitarian crisis worse.
Aside from all the crazy-assed spin she vomits, something that stuck out was - Now she worries about public school education?
Biggest freakin' loser governor we have ever had. Spin it baby.
I think its a drinking game with her ilk. Someone suggests an inane, totally unrelated subject to Obama and Democrats in general. First person to spin it as an evil directly related to Obama......chugs the Capn' Morgan.
Quote from: AquaMan on July 17, 2014, 03:03:34 PM
Biggest freakin' loser governor we have ever had. Spin it baby.
I think its a drinking game with her ilk. Someone suggests an inane, totally unrelated subject to Obama and Democrats in general. First person to spin it as an evil directly related to Obama......chugs the Capn' Morgan.
That would explain some posts on here.
Quote from: AquaMan on July 17, 2014, 03:03:34 PM
Biggest freakin' loser governor we have ever had. Spin it baby.
I think its a drinking game with her ilk. Someone suggests an inane, totally unrelated subject to Obama and Democrats in general. First person to spin it as an evil directly related to Obama......chugs the Capn' Morgan.
She's Oklahoma's version of Sarah Palin. Someone too stupid to even remember last week, let alone the history of where the law came from - Dec 2008, signed by Bush - that set the stage for this mess. But since she is also the champion of the dumbing down of the kids in this state, I guess ya really can't expect much more than the most basic ability to read "The Script".
Quote from: AquaMan on July 17, 2014, 03:03:34 PM
Biggest freakin' loser governor we have ever had. Spin it baby.
I think its a drinking game with her ilk. Someone suggests an inane, totally unrelated subject to Obama and Democrats in general. First person to spin it as an evil directly related to Obama......chugs the Capn' Morgan.
Do you ever listen to yourself. You wrote this about me recently as to Obama: "Your hatred and distrust of Obama's leadership or your insistence of lack of leadership is truly blinding to reality."
How do you rationalize that comment with your and other your libs in this forum's hatred for Fallin?
Quote from: guido911 on July 18, 2014, 02:55:49 AM
Do you ever listen to yourself. You wrote this about me recently as to Obama: "Your hatred and distrust of Obama's leadership or your insistence of lack of leadership is truly blinding to reality."
How do you rationalize that comment with your and other your libs in this forum's hatred for Fallin?
I don't suppose you happened to read what Failin' said....?
Quote from: heironymouspasparagus on July 18, 2014, 05:52:23 AM
I don't suppose you happened to read what Failin' said....?
Not a chance he did.
There is no comparison with the limited criticism of Fallin for her tea party behavior during the last couple of years and the overwhelming ODS exhibited here for the last 7 years on a daily basis. Reality G. Its more than a concept.
Well Perry's got it handled.
All will be fine now.
He's got his smart glasses on too.
One of the reasons I can't take him seriously is that damned picture...
Legislator Doctor Wants Minors Quarantined(http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/kwgs/files/201402/Mike_Ritze.jpg)
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/legislator-doctor-wants-minors-quarantined (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/legislator-doctor-wants-minors-quarantined)
QuoteOKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — A state legislator who is one of two doctors in the Oklahoma Legislature says state officials are ignoring his request that unaccompanied immigrant minors being housed at Fort Sill be quarantined.
Republican state Rep. Mike Ritze of Broken Arrow said Tuesday he's received no response from Gov. Mary Fallin, Attorney General Scott Pruitt and Commissioner of Health Terry Cline to a letter Ritze sent them last week requesting the quarantined.
More than 1,000 children are being housed at the southwest Oklahoma Army post near Lawton. During a media tour of the facility earlier this month, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Public Health Service said all the children at the facility undergo medical screenings before their arrival and that none are believed to pose a health risk.
Quote from: Townsend on July 23, 2014, 12:42:07 PM
One of the reasons I can't take him seriously is that damned picture...
Legislator Doctor Wants Minors Quarantined
(http://mediad.publicbroadcasting.net/p/kwgs/files/201402/Mike_Ritze.jpg)
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/legislator-doctor-wants-minors-quarantined (http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/legislator-doctor-wants-minors-quarantined)
Looks like he's been pulled a bit tight.
At least he didn't call the children murderous gang members like this fun congressman from Florida
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/politics/2014/07/21/congressman-says-minors-who-have-crossed-us-mexico-border-are-gang-affiliated/
Quote from: swake on July 23, 2014, 01:47:46 PM
At least he didn't call the children murderous gang members like this fun congressman from Florida
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/politics/2014/07/21/congressman-says-minors-who-have-crossed-us-mexico-border-are-gang-affiliated/
That's ridiculous. Only a tiny percentage are murderous gang members.
Quote from: swake on July 23, 2014, 01:47:46 PM
At least he didn't call the children murderous gang members like this fun congressman from Florida
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/politics/2014/07/21/congressman-says-minors-who-have-crossed-us-mexico-border-are-gang-affiliated/
It's Nugent's Todd Akin moment.
QuoteOn the bright side, this kind of talk should distract immigration advocates from complaining about lawmakers' continued use of the term "illegal immigrants."
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2014/07/congressman-border-minors-are-not-children.html
Everyone seems in agreement there are MS-13 members crossing the border. But, no one, not even the DHS will put numbers to it.
Quote from: Conan71 on July 23, 2014, 02:45:23 PM
It's Nugent's Todd Akin moment.
Everyone seems in agreement there are MS-13 members crossing the border. But, no one, not even the DHS will put numbers to it.
Well considering, per the FBI, they started in Los Angeles...
http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2008/january/ms13_011408 (http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2008/january/ms13_011408)
QuoteMS-13 originated in Los Angeles, but when members migrated eastward, they began forming cliques that for the most part operated independently.
I expected the worse if 'Bama was re-elected and I'm not surprised, he has nothing to lose by going full out radical in a 2nd term, he can't run for office again. 'Bama wanted open borders and amnesty as do many democrats - he could not get amnesty thru a republican house, So no problemo he'll just open up the borders and let anyone in totally unchecked and spread them out across the 50 states- All low skilled un-educated people, importing the worlds poverity. I'm waiting for 'Bama's war on oil & coal that he'll no doubt do before his term ends. Watch pump prices skyrocket. The Keystone Pipeline? Forget it, 'Bama will never approve it, that oil will be going to China. If Romney won things would be much bettet today. Texas wants to send the National Guard to the border, good luck with that- Look what 'Bama did to Arizona when that state tryed to enforce immigration laws Obama took 'em to court.
Quote from: sauerkraut on July 23, 2014, 05:01:24 PM
I expected the worse if 'Bama was re-elected and I'm not surprised, he has nothing to lose by going full out radical in a 2nd term, he can't run for office again. 'Bama wanted open borders and amnesty as do many democrats - he could not get amnesty thru a republican house, So no problemo he'll just open up the borders and let anyone in totally unchecked and spread them out across the 50 states- All low skilled un-educated people, importing the worlds poverity. I'm waiting for 'Bama's war on oil & coal that he'll no doubt do before his term ends. Watch pump prices skyrocket. The Keystone Pipeline? Forget it, 'Bama will never approve it, that oil will be going to China. If Romney won things would be much bettet today. Texas wants to send the National Guard to the border, good luck with that- Look what 'Bama did to Arizona when that state tryed to enforce immigration laws Obama took 'em to court.
When did Alabama come into power?
Quote from: sauerkraut on July 23, 2014, 05:01:24 PM
I expected the worse if 'Bama was re-elected and I'm not surprised, he has nothing to lose by going full out radical in a 2nd term, he can't run for office again. 'Bama wanted open borders and amnesty as do many democrats - he could not get amnesty thru a republican house, So no problemo he'll just open up the borders and let anyone in totally unchecked and spread them out across the 50 states- All low skilled un-educated people, importing the worlds poverity. I'm waiting for 'Bama's war on oil & coal that he'll no doubt do before his term ends. Watch pump prices skyrocket. The Keystone Pipeline? Forget it, 'Bama will never approve it, that oil will be going to China. If Romney won things would be much bettet today. Texas wants to send the National Guard to the border, good luck with that- Look what 'Bama did to Arizona when that state tryed to enforce immigration laws Obama took 'em to court.
You do realize don't you.... and I am sure you don't....that the only amnesties we had for Latinos were from Reagan and Bush...??
You obviously never eat fruits or vegetables, 'cause you are so blatantly full of sh$t...but without those low paid workers, the rest of us wouldn't get our fruits and veggies. And if you REALLY want to contribute to the solution, there has been a standing off by the United Farm Workers to train you and guarantee you get a job at the same time!! Want to make a real contribution? No,....I thought not...
Keystone pipeline - well, you are so confused, you have no clue that the company has already SAID that most of the oil is going to China anyway - through a channel that guarantees that NO ONE gets any tax benefits from the effort - it's going through a tax free zone process. But hey, I wouldn't expect you to have anything to do with reality anyway....
More Keystone - and I bet you are also one of those listening to Herman Cain and all the other KRMG ilk making all those mouthing noises about all the jobs that are going to be created! When the company itself has said it will be less than 50! Yeah, BIG boon to the states where it goes through! That's less than 1 days hiring at the company I'm at - every workday for the last several years!
Am curious about what SPECIFICALLY you think would be better than an extended economic growth period?? You are great at really inane glittering generalities but let's hear some thought out specifics!! Come on, you can do it!! Well, actually, no you can't!
The increase in debt has slowed to 25% of the rate from the previous regime. And you think that is a bad thing!!
Stock market is at all time record highs! In your world, I bet that is a bad thing, right??
We are out of Iraq, which means the squandering of $2 + trillion dollars there is over. And we are having our soldiers killed at the lowest rate there since the start of that nonsense. Another bad thing for you, no doubt!
Quote from: sauerkraut on July 23, 2014, 05:01:24 PM
I expected the worse if 'Bama was re-elected and I'm not surprised, he has nothing to lose by going full out radical in a 2nd term, he can't run for office again. 'Bama wanted open borders and amnesty as do many democrats - he could not get amnesty thru a republican house, So no problemo he'll just open up the borders and let anyone in totally unchecked and spread them out across the 50 states- All low skilled un-educated people, importing the worlds poverity. I'm waiting for 'Bama's war on oil & coal that he'll no doubt do before his term ends. Watch pump prices skyrocket. The Keystone Pipeline? Forget it, 'Bama will never approve it, that oil will be going to China. If Romney won things would be much bettet today. Texas wants to send the National Guard to the border, good luck with that- Look what 'Bama did to Arizona when that state tryed to enforce immigration laws Obama took 'em to court.
You really shouldn't talk this much in public.
Quote from: dbacksfan 2.0 on July 23, 2014, 05:07:02 PM
When did Alabama come into power?
"The Nazis bombed Pearl Harbor?"
"Forget it. He's on a roll."
Quote from: Ed W on July 23, 2014, 09:26:51 PM
"The Nazis bombed Pearl Harbor?"
"Forget it. He's on a roll."
(http://img.fark.net/images/cache/850/4/4r/fark_4rVZvI_GOAR2G6D88MpVEvS6BIY.jpg?t=Sdm8ADsQBx6COuOtQ1foXQ&f=1406520000)
Quote from: sauerkraut on July 23, 2014, 05:01:24 PM
I expected the worse if 'Bama was re-elected and I'm not surprised, he has nothing to lose by going full out radical in a 2nd term, he can't run for office again. 'Bama wanted open borders and amnesty as do many democrats - he could not get amnesty thru a republican house, So no problemo he'll just open up the borders and let anyone in totally unchecked and spread them out across the 50 states- All low skilled un-educated people, importing the worlds poverity. I'm waiting for 'Bama's war on oil & coal that he'll no doubt do before his term ends. Watch pump prices skyrocket. The Keystone Pipeline? Forget it, 'Bama will never approve it, that oil will be going to China. If Romney won things would be much bettet today. Texas wants to send the National Guard to the border, good luck with that- Look what 'Bama did to Arizona when that state tryed to enforce immigration laws Obama took 'em to court.
Speaking of "low skilled and un-educated" who the he!! let you in?
Quote from: dbacksfan 2.0 on July 23, 2014, 05:07:02 PM
When did Alabama come into power?
When Nick Saban was hired.
Seriously, Sauer. Who or where are you getting this stuff from? I have never seen so much wrong, uninformed or just plain dumb in one paragraph.
Quote from: AquaMan on July 24, 2014, 09:36:16 AM
Seriously, Sauer. Who or where are you getting this stuff from? I have never seen so much wrong, uninformed or just plain dumb in one paragraph.
I'm still wondering if it's AA or some other old poster just coming on here to F with those of us left.
Quote from: Townsend on July 24, 2014, 09:45:25 AM
I'm still wondering if it's AA or some other old poster just coming on here to F with those of us left.
Does have a tone of fakery to it. (those of us left!) If so, mission accomplished.
Quote from: AquaMan on July 24, 2014, 09:36:16 AM
Seriously, Sauer. Who or where are you getting this stuff from? I have never seen so much wrong, uninformed or just plain dumb in one paragraph.
(https://carlcymru.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/983838_561778007206823_662955356_n.jpg)
edited because previous picture was too stomach turning.......