Hopefully they can get this streetscape funded...unfortunately doesn't include upgrading sidewalks and crosswalks. The area could use some street trees too, especially where those planter beds are shown. Maybe Phase II can include those things.
(http://www.tulsaworld.com/articleimages/2011/20110426_A9_A12cherry0426.jpg)
(http://www.tulsaworld.com//articleimages/2011/A9parking0426.jpg)
La Madeleine will also open a Tulsa location at 15th & St. Louis in November. Mi Cocina will open in August. Both are nice additions even if they are regional chains. They both bring something different to our market. Funny thing is last time I was in Dallas I went to both, Mi Cocina for dinner and La Madeleine for breakfast.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20110426_16_A9_CUTLIN162807 (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20110426_16_A9_CUTLIN162807)
Quote from: SXSW on April 26, 2011, 10:00:54 AM
Hopefully they can get this streetscape funded...unfortunately doesn't include upgrading sidewalks and crosswalks. The area could use some street trees too, especially where those planter beds are shown. Maybe Phase II can include those things.
(http://www.tulsaworld.com/articleimages/2011/20110426_A9_A12cherry0426.jpg)
(http://www.tulsaworld.com//articleimages/2011/A9parking0426.jpg)
La Madeleine will also open a Tulsa location at 15th & St. Louis in November. Mi Cocina will open in August. Both are nice additions even if they are regional chains. They both bring something different to our market. Funny thing is last time I was in Dallas I went to both, Mi Cocina for dinner and La Madeleine for breakfast.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20110426_16_A9_CUTLIN162807 (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20110426_16_A9_CUTLIN162807)
I was wondering why you hadn't posted this yet, it's right up your alley ;)
They really went all out on motorcycle parking....
The article stated the building where La Madeleine is going is currently occupied by three local businesses. I love progress but hate seeing a local shopping district being overrun by local shops. I hope Cherry Street maintains a good mix of local and national tenants. I would hate to see an influx of national tenants causing issues with the multiple events & festivals that call Cherry Street home. According to Google Street View this building was occupied by LaDonna's Fine Foods, Boston Artists Gallery and Clausen Gallery. I'm 99% sure LaDonna's has moved a few blocks east. I can't recall what the other stores are in that building. Anyone else know? Did the building owner terminate leases or where they are on month to month?
I'm glad they're giving up the part time traffic lanes. They have never worked. I realllllly wish something like this could happen on 15th between the BA and Harvard. Originally, there was on street parking, I don't know when it was removed, sometime since the 1960's. There are all sorts of buildings built up to the curb, but they are all suffocating due to lack of parking. I've posted about this before. Those of us in the Florence Park/Renaissance neighborhoods would really benefit from the traffic calming, too.
Quote from: tulsa1603 on April 26, 2011, 10:57:44 AM
I'm glad they're giving up the part time traffic lanes. They have never worked. I realllllly wish something like this could happen on 15th between the BA and Harvard. Originally, there was on street parking, I don't know when it was removed, sometime since the 1960's. There are all sorts of buildings built up to the curb, but they are all suffocating due to lack of parking. I've posted about this before. Those of us in the Florence Park/Renaissance neighborhoods would really benefit from the traffic calming, too.
Agreed. That could possibly help spark more and better development and attract a wider variety of tenants and perhaps some restaurant business. Having to park around back or on a side street seems to be a disincentive to shop along there. It's right in the middle of a very desirable demographic.
Quote from: rdj on April 26, 2011, 10:41:51 AM
The article stated the building where La Madeleine is going is currently occupied by three local businesses. I love progress but hate seeing a local shopping district being overrun by local shops. I hope Cherry Street maintains a good mix of local and national tenants. I would hate to see an influx of national tenants causing issues with the multiple events & festivals that call Cherry Street home. According to Google Street View this building was occupied by LaDonna's Fine Foods, Boston Artists Gallery and Clausen Gallery. I'm 99% sure LaDonna's has moved a few blocks east. I can't recall what the other stores are in that building. Anyone else know? Did the building owner terminate leases or where they are on month to month?
La Donna's moved at least 3 years ago. Wasn't "We Buy Ugly Houses" in some of this space? As I recall, most of this space has been empty or of marginal use (from the standpoint of drawing in traffic) for several years. I always prefer local to chains, but the recent addition of chains to Cherry St. is a pretty good indicator of the quality and perception of this area.
Quote from: DTowner on April 26, 2011, 12:18:45 PM
La Donna's moved at least 3 years ago. Wasn't "We Buy Ugly Houses" in some of this space? As I recall, most of this space has been empty or of marginal use (from the standpoint of drawing in traffic) for several years. I always prefer local to chains, but the recent addition of chains to Cherry St. is a pretty good indicator of the quality and perception of this area.
Hopefully they can at least keep it regional/local chains and not Starbucks, etc. The chains that have gone in recently haven't been so bad (Chipotle/Genghis Grill).
I do wish a streetscape with some trees would be added along 15th. It would help shade the sidewalks in the summer and cut down on the cluttered look the powerlines give the street. Something like Knox-Henderson (very similar area in Dallas):
(http://www.haynsworthrealty.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Knox_Henderson2.jpg)
Genghis Grill is a rip off.
Looks great!
Personally I think Cherry Street needs some of these...
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/51/121235940_4865237bd6.jpg)
Quote from: Conan71 on April 26, 2011, 01:27:30 PM
Genghis Grill is a rip off.
Aren't all chains really a rip-off of each other? How many different yogurt stores do we have now? Luckily food doesn't have patents..
As usual, the planning morons cater to motorists by providing angled parking. Business likes it because more cars can park in the available space.
But angled parking is anathema to bicyclists and motorcyclists. It vastly increases the hazard of the Sorry-Mate-I-Didn't-See-You collision when a motorist pulls out without looking. SMIDSY is used as an excuse rather than a straight forward admission of guilt.
Nice, pretty plans drawn up by stupid people.
Quote from: SXSW on April 26, 2011, 10:00:54 AM
.unfortunately doesn't include upgrading sidewalks and crosswalks.
You can build crosswalks on every block in town but it won't do any good unless TPD suddenly started enforcing the laws related to crosswalks.
Quote from: Ed W on April 26, 2011, 03:28:32 PM
As usual, the planning morons cater to motorists by providing angled parking. Business likes it because more cars can park in the available space.
But angled parking is anathema to bicyclists and motorcyclists. It vastly increases the hazard of the Sorry-Mate-I-Didn't-See-You collision when a motorist pulls out without looking. SMIDSY is used as an excuse rather than a straight forward admission of guilt.
Nice, pretty plans drawn up by stupid people.
Kind of what I was thinking. But everyone else seems to like it. When you back out of those spaces, you pretty much have to start backing and hope nobody's back there. You can't see anything if you're in a car and there's a big okie truck/SUV parked in the space to your right.
Most places I've seen angled parking are much less traveled streets than this. I kind of wonder how that will work. Maybe it'll calm the traffic as drivers realize there's a good chance somebody will be backing out in front of them at some point on their drive down that stretch.
And as a cyclist, it's just gonna piss off motorists behind me when I'm in the left of the lane to stay clear of the backing car dangers.
Quote from: Ed W on April 26, 2011, 03:28:32 PM
As usual, the planning morons cater to motorists by providing angled parking. Business likes it because more cars can park in the available space.
But angled parking is anathema to bicyclists and motorcyclists. It vastly increases the hazard of the Sorry-Mate-I-Didn't-See-You collision when a motorist pulls out without looking. SMIDSY is used as an excuse rather than a straight forward admission of guilt.
Nice, pretty plans drawn up by stupid people.
It's never been a bicycle-friendly stretch. I sure wouldn't ride a bike down that stretch of Cherry St. as it is now either. Too easy to ride into a car door or have someone pull out of a side street unable to see you because of a car parked on the corner. Far better off on the side streets or BA frontage road on that one.
Quote from: stageidea on April 26, 2011, 03:27:24 PM
Aren't all chains really a rip-off of each other? How many different yogurt stores do we have now? Luckily food doesn't have patents..
No I mean $$ rip-off, not concept rip-off. $8.99 for one trip through the line, leave a dollar tip for the cook, $2.39 or $2.99 for a soft drink, then a $2 tip for the waiter and you've dropped over $15.00 on lunch. As well the bowls are fairly small serving sizes.
I'll go back to my burrito down at Chipotle when I want something to eat in that area.
Quote from: Conan71 on April 26, 2011, 04:01:36 PM
It's never been a bicycle-friendly stretch. I sure wouldn't ride a bike down that stretch of Cherry St. as it is now either. Too easy to ride into a car door or have someone pull out of a side street unable to see you because of a car parked on the corner. Far better off on the side streets or BA frontage road on that one.
Not a fan of angled parking either. But it may work here if traffic is slowed down. I think the effect of wider sidewalks, street trees, planters and paved crosswalks could help, which is why I hope they eventually do those things.
Downtown Norman it's awful because there are 3 lanes one-way that you back into and there is always lots of traffic as Main is a major thoroughfare. It works better on Asp in Campus Corner, or on Brady/Main downtown. Cherry Street is sort of a blend of both with high traffic counts but narrower width.
Quote from: SXSW on April 26, 2011, 04:48:45 PM
Not a fan of angled parking either. But it may work here if traffic is slowed down. I think the effect of wider sidewalks, street trees, planters and paved crosswalks could help, which is why I hope they eventually do those things.
Downtown Norman it's awful because there are 3 lanes one-way that you back into and there is always lots of traffic as Main is a major thoroughfare. It works better on Asp in Campus Corner, or on Brady/Main downtown. Cherry Street is sort of a blend of both with high traffic counts but narrower width.
Norman, for being a "bike friendly" city sure has a lot of asshats who apparently didn't get that message.
Quote from: SXSW on April 26, 2011, 04:48:45 PM
Not a fan of angled parking either. But it may work here if traffic is slowed down. I think the effect of wider sidewalks, street trees, planters and paved crosswalks could help, which is why I hope they eventually do those things.
Downtown Norman it's awful because there are 3 lanes one-way that you back into and there is always lots of traffic as Main is a major thoroughfare. It works better on Asp in Campus Corner, or on Brady/Main downtown. Cherry Street is sort of a blend of both with high traffic counts but narrower width.
I would expect a significant portion of thru traffic to divert to 11th or 21st if it's not too inconvenient.
I was in Fayetteville yesterday and noticed they have this same parking arrangement planned for Cherry Street all through their downtown area, except with one-way streets. 15th is also a lot busier than any of their streets. It would be nice though to see the sidewalks rebuilt with the brick pavers at the curb and intermittent street trees...it really enhanced the pedestrian experience there.
Block St in Fayetteville
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/bg918/fayetteville.jpg)
http://kjrh.m0bl.net/w/local/story/37225775/
This project could as soon as the end of next month. Too bad it doesn't include a bike lane...
Overall, I like this project, although I have NEVER noticed a parking problem on Cherry Street.
Quote from: ZYX on August 29, 2011, 10:09:21 PM
Overall, I like this project, although I have NEVER noticed a parking problem on Cherry Street.
I like the project too.
We tend to see a parking problem if we can't walk straight to the door of a business in this town. We've been Walmart trained.
"A blooooooooock? Oh maaaaaan, I can't waaaaaalk a bloooooooooooock." etc
Quote from: Townsend on August 30, 2011, 08:52:09 AM
I like the project too.
We tend to see a parking problem if we can't walk straight to the door of a business in this town. We've been Walmart trained.
"A blooooooooock? Oh maaaaaan, I can't waaaaaalk a bloooooooooooock." etc
I attempted to "slip" into the Wal*Mart in Sand Springs Sunday afternoon. My walk from my parking spot to the front door was much longer than any walk I've ever encountered at a midtown/downtown establishment.
Quote from: rdj on August 30, 2011, 09:48:09 AM
I attempted to "slip" into the Wal*Mart in Sand Springs Sunday afternoon. My walk from my parking spot to the front door was much longer than any walk I've ever encountered at a midtown/downtown establishment.
Yes but you could see the door, you never left the premises, didn't cross a street, etc.
I'm in total agreement.
When people catterwall about DT or midtown parking I remind them how far they walk to get into the mall and ask how much they'll drive around the lots looking for parking.
I'm a Southie now so I'll have to become one of them but for now I still have midtown blood coursing through my veins.
Quote from: Townsend on August 30, 2011, 09:59:30 AM
Yes but you could see the door, you never left the premises, didn't cross a street, etc.
I'm in total agreement.
When people catterwall about DT or midtown parking I remind them how far they walk to get into the mall and ask how much they'll drive around the lots looking for parking.
I'm a Southie now so I'll have to become one of them but for now I still have midtown blood coursing through my veins.
Crossing a street is actually safer than a Wal*Mart parking lot. The cars on a street tend to drive in a linear pattern...the Wal*Mart parking lot, not so much!
Quote from: rdj on August 30, 2011, 10:05:45 AM
Crossing a street is actually safer than a Wal*Mart parking lot. The cars on a street tend to drive in a linear pattern...the Wal*Mart parking lot, not so much!
You know that and I know that but...
Has anyone else noted that driving down Cherry Street is getting trickier every day? Its much easier to walk it. Adding slanted parking may be an improvement but mostly it is just a minefield of traffic hazards. West bound is the worst. Lanes end at Utica heading West where a busy Panera entertains left turns. Marquette twice a day lefts with pre-occupied busy parents. Left turn at Peoria makes you swerve to the right then McDonalds lefts line up. Add in the bars, restaurants, car wash and visitors looking for same and you have a perfect storm.
They should do drivers license testing over there.
Oh, yeah. What is the purpose for parking meters over there? It must be for city revenue rather than parking management. They can't possibly pay for themselves. Get rid of them!
Conan71, just saying my wife, our girls and I have never had a bad experience with Genghis Grill "yet", it is one of our top favorite places to go eat and we always leave stuffed. I am not affiliated with them in any way, just saying we like the place, its prices and the variety it has brought to the Tulsa food scene, for what its worth.
Quote from: Reynardine on August 30, 2011, 02:03:35 PM
Conan71, just saying my wife, our girls and I have never had a bad experience with Genghis Grill "yet", it is one of our top favorite places to go eat and we always leave stuffed. I am not affiliated with them in any way, just saying we like the place, its prices and the variety it has brought to the Tulsa food scene, for what its worth.
Point well-taken, and welcome aboard! Obviously there are others who like the place better than I do as the parking lot is usually full. Part of my issue might be I'm comparing it to a family-owned Mongolian BBQ I go to in Midwest City which allows you to use a bigger plate and the prices are a little more modest.
Agree on the trees, both Brookside and Cherry Street need trees planted to soften the visibility of the power lines.
I have never had a problem with biking on 15th there. I'd rather do it there than on brookside. Anyway, yep, it seems we are wasting another oportunity to put some legit bike lanes down. However, what will be fantistic is taking it down to two lanes will cause people to slow down. I wonder how all of this will affect the farmers market?
Quote from: Conan71 on August 30, 2011, 02:14:25 PM
Point well-taken, and welcome aboard! Obviously there are others who like the place better than I do as the parking lot is usually full. Part of my issue might be I'm comparing it to a family-owned Mongolian BBQ I go to in Midwest City which allows you to use a bigger plate and the prices are a little more modest.
At the insistence of a friend I visited Hu Hot for lunch the other day. I found it better than Genghis Grill. Seemed to be a better value, considering it is all you can eat.
Quote from: rdj on August 30, 2011, 03:12:24 PM
At the insistence of a friend I visited Hu Hot for lunch the other day. I found it better than Genghis Grill. Seemed to be a better value, considering it is all you can eat.
Where is Hu Hot? Never heard of it.
Quote from: Conan71 on August 30, 2011, 03:13:56 PM
Where is Hu Hot? Never heard of it.
It occupies the space formerly held by Ruby Tuesday at 71st & Hell.
Quote from: Conan71 on August 30, 2011, 03:13:56 PM
Where is Hu Hot? Never heard of it.
http://www.huhot.com/Locations/Oklahoma/Tulsa (http://www.huhot.com/Locations/Oklahoma/Tulsa)
HuHot Mongolian Grill
6746 S. Memorial
Tulsa, Oklahoma
(918) 459-5346
Hours
Lunch: 11AM-4PM
Dinner Sunday-Thursday: 4PM-9PM
Dinner Friday-Saturday: 4PM-10PM
Quote from: rdj on August 30, 2011, 03:15:14 PM
It occupies the space formerly held by Ruby Tuesday at 71st & Hell.
Nevermind. Ruby Tuesday's couldn't make it?
Quote from: Conan71 on August 30, 2011, 03:16:12 PM
Nevermind. Ruby Tuesday's couldn't make it?
I guess even Tulsa has a limit for how many massive menu American style dining chain establishments its obese population can support.
Quote from: rdj on August 30, 2011, 03:18:24 PM
I guess even Tulsa has a limit for how many massive menu American style dining chain establishments its obese population can support.
So instead we brought in another Asian buffet (oops, I mean Mongolian Restaurant). The obese population would never support one of these...
Quote from: stageidea on August 30, 2011, 03:27:29 PM
So instead we brought in another Asian buffet (oops, I mean Mongolian Restaurant). The obese population would never support one of these...
If a Montana franchisor thinks it is smart to allow a franchisee to drop a million or two in opening a new restaurant in south Tulsa I'm not going to stop them. That's at least a couple hundred grand in sales, real estate & income tax revenue just to get opened...
Not a fan of this at all. I agree with the barista from Seattle [in the KJRH article], I would rather see bike lanes. I live in the adjacent neighborhood and don't mind people parking on the streets. Luckily it will just be angled parking on one side and not both. Still looking forward to the day a real streetscape is put in with new sidewalks and trees.
This is the problem of Tulsa. All this talk about walkable areas and in the end the only thing we are concerned about is more parking. I live in Maple Park are Cherry Street is a complete fail to me because it is horrrible to walk to and through. The sidewalks on Cherry are about 5 feet wide with parking signs 2 feet in from the street. We need sidewalks that are double in with. It is so narrow you cant even walk next to someone. How can a place be walkable if you cant walk next to someone to enjoy it. Plus after a few pops at the pub you can either get your head knocked off with one of these signs or get racked by the parking meters because the sidewalks are so narrow you are constatly avoiding these signs and meters.
When I first moved to Maple Park I tried to walk to Cherry but its too stressful. Isnt a walkable area supposed to be relaxing. I try not to get killed by the meth heads turning into McDs, then at Peoria, then at the 3 parking openings in front of Chimis, Jasons, and the coffe place. Then you get to the 4 foot wide sidewalk in front of Does. Thats just describing the beginning of the south side of 15th. Im sorry its pathetic. Honestly a shopping center in south tulsa is just as walkable as Cherry.
Before even worrying about parking spaces they need to do three things. First make sure the zoning doesnt allow parking in front of the buildings. I wont walk near the subway because there is no sidewalks and people turn right into you. Second the sidewalks need to be redone completely and doubled in width. I want to walk next to people not in a single file line. Third plant trees and a ton of them. They block the 3rd world nation power lines, make the area even nicer, and most important provide shade. I went to 1 farmers market this summer. The reason is it so hot even at 9 am that its not enjoyable. shade would make a huge difference. The only way an area becomes walkable is its safe and enjoyable to walk at. Cherry Street is horrible but parking will fix that. This crap gets so old.
QuoteWhen I first moved to Maple Park I tried to walk to Cherry but its too stressful. Isnt a walkable area supposed to be relaxing. I try not to get killed by the meth heads turning into McDs, then at Peoria, then at the 3 parking openings in front of Chimis, Jasons, and the coffe place. Then you get to the 4 foot wide sidewalk in front of Does. Thats just describing the beginning of the south side of 15th. Im sorry its pathetic. Honestly a shopping center in south tulsa is just as walkable as Cherry.
I think that might be a little harsh. Walkable not only means being able to get around within it, it also means that you can get there. Try living in the area behind woodland hills and walking there. then try walking to cherry street. While I agree that the sidewalks need to be widened and the signs moved off the sidewalks, I have never been nearly killed by signs or motorists on cherry street. Even after I have had a few rounds. While I think that adding more parking is NOT the solution, removing two of the lanes will help to change the street by slowing people down. Also, I wish I was in your position. Maple park area is freggin awesome. Oh and I think that you guys as home owners in the maple ridge area should get a petition together to get rid of that Mcd's. It has bothered the crap out of me for a long time. The A&W too. So get on it.
QuoteI agree with the barista from Seattle [in the KJRH article], I would rather see bike lanes.
Just as a note, he LIVED in seattle. He is from here. Ryan is a VERY cool dude.
Did someone have a few too many rounds last night and wake up a bit cranky?
Sure it could be improved but Cherry St is an example of how organic, urban shopping & entertainment districts grow and evolve. If you want these massive sterilized sidewalks with picturesque trees it will be Disneyland full of chains.
I have my doubts that areas like Cherry Street are ever going to be easily walkable, organic, authentic neighborhood districts. At least not until they get rid of the curb parking and run a by God real trolley through the middle of the street. Yes, you can walk them but they were designed at the beginning of the last century when cars were narrow, short and tall and mass transit was reality. Then they were mangled, re-habbed, suburbanized and generally prone to miserably short sighted planning processes. Expanding 15th street for cars at the expense of sidewalks makes walking from Maple Park to Utica an exercise in faith. You snake between telephone poles, guide wires, parking signs, overgrown bushes, and retaining walls while hoping the lady on her cell phone turning left actually sees you. Strangely they do. Most people drive to Cherry Street bars and never get to experience all that.
Still, they stand out in comparison to Woodland or Southroads as more unique, more fun and, ironically, safer than crossing an intersection on foot in those areas.
Quote from: jacobi on August 31, 2011, 08:03:34 AM
I think that might be a little harsh. Walkable not only means being able to get around within it, it also means that you can get there. Try living in the area behind woodland hills and walking there. then try walking to cherry street. While I agree that the sidewalks need to be widened and the signs moved off the sidewalks, I have never been nearly killed by signs or motorists on cherry street. Even after I have had a few rounds. While I think that adding more parking is NOT the solution, removing two of the lanes will help to change the street by slowing people down. Also, I wish I was in your position. Maple park area is freggin awesome. Oh and I think that you guys as home owners in the maple ridge area should get a petition together to get rid of that Mcd's. It has bothered the crap out of me for a long time. The A&W too. So get on it.
Its "walkable" but not much I want to walk to/from.
Quote from: rdj on August 31, 2011, 08:12:12 AM
Did someone have a few too many rounds last night and wake up a bit cranky?
Sure it could be improved but Cherry St is an example of how organic, urban shopping & entertainment districts grow and evolve. If you want these massive sterilized sidewalks with picturesque trees it will be Disneyland full of chains.
Disagree, and I fully agree with swampee. Cherry Street is not a pedestrian-friendly district in its current form. It has the bones to be but is being held back by a lack of consistently wide sidewalks and shade trees.
And Cherry Street already is full of chains: Subway, Hideaway, Genghis Grill, Panera, Chipotle, Jason's Deli, soon-to-be Mi Cocina, La Madaleine, Lululemon...
Brookside is much more local and 10x more walkable, although it could be improved as well (mainly due to there being 4 lanes of traffic on Peoria).
I also agree that Cherry Street is not very walkable. Have fun trying to cross 15ht anywhere between Peoria and Utica. There's a crosswalk or two, but getting hit by a car is equally painful whether or not you have the right of way.
I walk there occasionally from downtown. Navigating that intersection at 15th and Peoria is also frightening. Fast traffic a foot away from you. Turning drivers not yielding. Then you have to navigate all the fast food driveways.
When I finally make it to the bridge over the BA (with its wall between speeding cars and peds, I feel much better). All of downtown is much more pleasant to walk down (lack of businesses notwithstanding). At least you don't have to worry about speeding drunks/cell phone users. I'm normally out and about at night, so that paints my perception. Cherry Street is busy at night, while most of downtown is desolate, so no worries about traffic.
And I don't see need for more parking. On the busiest night of the year, you can still park within two blocks of your destination in the residential neighborhood there.
Quote from: TheTed on August 31, 2011, 12:51:55 PM
I also agree that Cherry Street is not very walkable. Have fun trying to cross 15ht anywhere between Peoria and Utica. There's a crosswalk or two, but getting hit by a car is equally painful whether or not you have the right of way.
I try to stop for every pedestrian that is obviously trying to cross on that part of 15th but many times I don't see them due to signs, parked cars, or other obstructions.
Then there's the other side of the issue where I stop for people so they can cross and they just stare at me until I go.
Then there are the times I stop for them but the opposite traffic doesn't.
Agree agree agree. 15th isn't walkable so much as it's only slightly less desirable to drive on.
It isn't a master planned development so until the landowners give up some real estate and the city has the funds it won't change on a wholesale basis. In many areas the sidewalk goes all the way to the building. Are you advocating the street be made more narrow? Personally, I find it just fine. I've walked from one end to the other (and past North Maple Ridge) during markets, lunch time, evening, way late night. Never felt unsafe even with the kids in a stroller, only during the day time mind you.
The fact chains are coming to Cherry St is a positive sign for the district and midtown Tulsa. As a localphile it isn't may favorite thing, but it shows the area is healthy, has plenty of income and the traffic to make a franchise work. You have to remember people are attracted to places that feel comfortable and for most of the population visiting the Tulsa version of a Dallas based restaurant makes them feel comfortable in visiting or living in the area. My hope is that the chain development on Cherry St will push the local eateries north towards 11th St & the Pearl District. That's how organic urban renewal, infill, gentrification, etc works. The cutting edge, risk taking locals take the risk on an area and the national chains follow. Its like when you were a teenager and you had the band you loved that no one knew about, then they had a radio hit and the QB of the FB team and the head cheerleader suddenly thought they were awesome and then you burned the album and moved on to the next big band.
Quote from: Townsend on August 31, 2011, 01:15:37 PM
I try to stop for every pedestrian that is obviously trying to cross on that part of 15th but many times I don't see them due to signs, parked cars, or other obstructions.
Then there's the other side of the issue where I stop for people so they can cross and they just stare at me until I go.
Then there are the times I stop for them but the opposite traffic doesn't.
I like playing Frogger with the pedestrians on Cherry St.
Speaking of the area: the Eats 2 U building between 13th & 14th on Peoria looks great!
Quote from: Conan71 on August 31, 2011, 02:34:09 PM
I like playing Frogger with the pedestrians on Cherry St.
Quote from: rdj on August 31, 2011, 02:10:26 PM
It isn't a master planned development so until the landowners give up some real estate and the city has the funds it won't change on a wholesale basis. In many areas the sidewalk goes all the way to the building. Are you advocating the street be made more narrow? Personally, I find it just fine. I've walked from one end to the other (and past North Maple Ridge) during markets, lunch time, evening, way late night. Never felt unsafe even with the kids in a stroller, only during the day time mind you.
The fact chains are coming to Cherry St is a positive sign for the district and midtown Tulsa. As a localphile it isn't may favorite thing, but it shows the area is healthy, has plenty of income and the traffic to make a franchise work. You have to remember people are attracted to places that feel comfortable and for most of the population visiting the Tulsa version of a Dallas based restaurant makes them feel comfortable in visiting or living in the area. My hope is that the chain development on Cherry St will push the local eateries north towards 11th St & the Pearl District. That's how organic urban renewal, infill, gentrification, etc works. The cutting edge, risk taking locals take the risk on an area and the national chains follow. Its like when you were a teenager and you had the band you loved that no one knew about, then they had a radio hit and the QB of the FB team and the head cheerleader suddenly thought they were awesome and then you burned the album and moved on to the next big band.
I definitely agree. Biggest thing hurting Cherry St. "walkability" is lack of stop lights or stop signs between Utica and Peoria. This creates constant traffic flows that make it very difficult to cross the street and encourages higher traffic speeds.
Maybe it's just because I live where you can't walk to anything, but I honestly think Cherry Street is pretty walkable. The sidewalks aren't very wide but it's not that big of a deal. I honestly don't see how Cherry Street is not walkable.
Quote from: ZYX on August 31, 2011, 04:34:16 PM
Maybe it's just because I live where you can't walk to anything,
I'm there with ya Bixby. What'd your address score as far as "walkability"?
Could you beat my "8"?
I know we're almost neighbors :D.
No, actually I can't, I got a 17. Yeah, but judging by where you said you moved to, I can see why you got an 8.
Quote from: Townsend on August 31, 2011, 01:15:37 PM
I try to stop for every pedestrian that is obviously trying to cross on that part of 15th but many times I don't see them due to signs, parked cars, or other obstructions.
Then there's the other side of the issue where I stop for people so they can cross and they just stare at me until I go.
Then there are the times I stop for them but the opposite traffic doesn't.
The thought may be noble, but wrong imo, for I personally hate it when someone does that. (I wouldn't stop and stare, I am the one who would curse at you and flip you off lol) My expectation is that traffic is going to flow normally so that as I am looking left and right before I cross I can judge where my opening is going to be. Occasionally you get the speeder which is an added factor to be on the look out for, but what really messes one up is the person who stops, or kinda stops, but then your messed up and trying to figure out if they are going to stay stopped while you watch for traffic from the other direction, then just as you get ready to go, the person behind the stopped car looks like they are going to try and pull around, then the stopped car decides not to wait any longer, all the while your on the curb doing this little dance, step off the curb, on the curb, on , off, on, off, etc. as your trying to figure out the situation the person has so "kindly" created for you. It's just far, far, far easier not to have to mess with that. I have no problem crossing streets, even busy, fast moving ones, which Cherry Street really isn't.
Quote from: rdj on August 30, 2011, 10:05:45 AM
Crossing a street is actually safer than a Wal*Mart parking lot. The cars on a street tend to drive in a linear pattern...the Wal*Mart parking lot, not so much!
I must have an invisible (to me) billboard that says "Don't drive stupid around this guy". I don't have the supposed difficulties in suburban parking lots and I usually park away from the buildings to keep from getting parking lot dings in my car doors. I just don't see the problem myself.
I don't have a problem crossing streets either. Maybe I will when I get to be
really old and cannot cross a street in a reasonable time.
Quote from: jacobi on August 30, 2011, 02:37:47 PM
However, what will be fantistic is taking it down to two lanes will cause people to slow down. I wonder how all of this will affect the farmers market?
Anyone have some numbers on how slow it can get before discouraging casual traffic?
If you remember the Camille's had a curb cut for parallel parking along 15th. Mi Cocina has filled that in presumably for more outdoor seating, which is a great idea. It looks they are getting pretty close to being finished.
Palace Cafe, which was closed for renovations, opened back up this past weekend just in time for Restaurant Week. They have a nice bar now and more contemporary decor.
They are working on the La Madelaine and Lululemon. Lululemon is supposed to open later this month and La Madaleine by December (Though I think that's optimistic).
I don't know how to feel about La madaline knocking down the small building behind their space. I know that it wasn't a great space, but it just seems like they are a (Dallas!) company that is catering to the automobile.
Quote from: SXSW on September 12, 2011, 12:46:26 PM
If you remember the Camille's had a curb cut for parallel parking along 15th. Mi Cocina has filled that in presumably for more outdoor seating, which is a great idea. It looks they are getting pretty close to being finished.
Palace Cafe, which was closed for renovations, opened back up this past weekend just in time for Restaurant Week. They have a nice bar now and more contemporary decor.
They are working on the La Madelaine and Lululemon. Lululemon is supposed to open later this month and La Madaleine by December (Though I think that's optimistic).
As a Southie I think I'm supposed to demand pictures from you.
As a former mid-towner I'd like to request an opportunity to live vicariously through you by seeing pictures of which you speak.
Whichever works.