So a friend told me that the old May's Drug (or was it Drug Warehouse?) on SW corner of 21st and Harvard, along with the restaurant just to the south were going to be razed for a new CVS drug store. This same friend has a tendency to not have his facts straight, and since I hadn't heard anything about it, I didn't take him seriously. I noticed today that there are ARK Wrecking trucks parked on the site, and utilities have been marked out on the ground. I remember plans to turn it into a divided space previously, which I would prefer to a big CVS. Anyone know anything? Tried searching this site but couldn't find any info.
Found a building permit. CVS going in. Interesting.
https://secure2.cityoftulsa.org/TimeLine4/PlanReview.aspx?ApKey=407396&Impersonate=yes
Just what we need.......Gag....
Too bad. I'd heard there was supposed to be a restaurant and small retail on that site for it's re-development. Not happy about the CVS, but it's better than what's been sitting abandoned there for 4-5 years.
It would be better if the CVS would face the corner but without the zoning or City making them I'm sure there will be a big parking lot right there. It will likely follow the same footprint as the old vacant Med-X. Just like Office Depot at 15th & Lewis. Gag.
Quote from: SXSW on January 03, 2011, 11:22:32 AM
It would be better if the CVS would face the corner but without the zoning or City making them I'm sure there will be a big parking lot right there. It will likely follow the same footprint as the old vacant Med-X. Just like Office Depot at 15th & Lewis. Gag.
Like the 15th & Lewis site, they had been using it as temporary flower sales, and the place actually looked good a few weeks of the fall and spring.
As far as CVS, I seem to recall their national designs call for a lot of annoying and blinding lighting to attract customers (not that the Burger Street across Harvard doesnt have issues with their football stadium-like lights).
I remember the owner holding out for a restaurant, too, and would have preferred that.
Quote from: SXSW on January 03, 2011, 11:22:32 AM
It would be better if the CVS would face the corner but without the zoning or City making them I'm sure there will be a big parking lot right there. It will likely follow the same footprint as the old vacant Med-X. Just like Office Depot at 15th & Lewis. Gag.
Yep. Can probably expect a design exactly like two miles up the road at 41st.
Quote from: patric on January 03, 2011, 11:52:53 AM
Like the 15th & Lewis site, they had been using it as temporary flower sales, and the place actually looked good a few weeks of the fall and spring.
As far as CVS, I seem to recall their national designs call for a lot of annoying and blinding lighting to attract customers (not that the Burger Street across Harvard doesnt have issues with their football stadium-like lights).
I remember the owner holding out for a restaurant, too, and would have preferred that.
Most of the CVS stores are not 24 hours and unlike most other stores they actually TURN THE LIGHTS OFF when they're closed.
Well it's less of an asskicker than the McDonalds was at 15th and Peoria.
How does the market support so many pharmacy/grocery stores? One on every corner might make sense if people were walking to them.
Quote from: YoungTulsan on January 03, 2011, 01:23:11 PM
How does the market support so many pharmacy/grocery stores? One on every corner might make sense if people were walking to them.
Pseudoephedrine and Holiday cards
Quote from: patric on January 03, 2011, 11:52:53 AM
Like the 15th & Lewis site, they had been using it as temporary flower sales, and the place actually looked good a few weeks of the fall and spring.
You probably know this, but it also served as a farmer's market of sorts, and there was a lot of fresh fruits/veggies on sale throughout the season. One of the better uses of an empty parking that I've seen in awhile.
Walgreens and CVS both serve less as classical drug stores and more as corner stores, or small supermarkets. A CVS on that corner is a glancing blow to at least a portion of Quik Trip's business.
Quote from: YoungTulsan on January 03, 2011, 01:23:11 PM
How does the market support so many pharmacy/grocery stores? One on every corner might make sense if people were walking to them.
Simple, the sales people for the drug companies which used to be known as physicians are selling more and more meds to an ever-aging population and those who don't take proactive care with their bodies.
Would it be so hard to orient the building toward the street corner? You wouldn't even need the door to be at the corner, it could face the parking (not preferred) but at least you wouldn't have a parking lot at a busy corner where it's a ***** to turn out of. Something like this CVS in Atlanta:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1f/CVS,_ATL.jpg/800px-CVS,_ATL.jpg)
The stretch of Harvard from 21st up to 11th is somewhat urban but will never be pedestrian-friendly with developments like this.
The frustrating part for me is that, as you point out, CVS has designs in the box for all kinds of urban scenarios. It just depends on the zoning. But until the PlaniTulsa recommendations are implemented, they and others will keep up business as usual in their building forms.
That's two corners of a midtown intersection that have been renovated recently, and both can be considered missed opportunities to tighten up the space and make it more approachable and pedestrian-friendly.
Quote from: Floyd on January 03, 2011, 02:09:22 PM
The frustrating part for me is that, as you point out, CVS has designs in the box for all kinds of urban scenarios. It just depends on the zoning. But until the PlaniTulsa recommendations are implemented, they and others will keep up business as usual in their building forms.
That's two corners of a midtown intersection that have been renovated recently, and both can be considered missed opportunities to tighten up the space and make it more approachable and pedestrian-friendly.
Hey you never know...CVS might prove us all... (snort, spit take) oh man, I tried to keep it together. Yeah, it'll be way back with parking in front and any trees they had to plant will be dead inside 6 months.
Quote from: Townsend on January 03, 2011, 02:20:32 PM
Hey you never know...CVS might prove us all... (snort, spit take) oh man, I tried to keep it together. Yeah, it'll be way back with parking in front and any trees they had to plant will be dead inside 6 months.
Don't they need zoning changed to do the kind of development you're asking for?
Why spend months fighting through the clunky system to do a nice design when you can drop the standard store in without any hassle?
Just what we need another Pharmacy......
Quote from: Breadburner on January 03, 2011, 02:25:12 PM
Just what we need another Pharmacy......
Look at it this way, less of a chance you wind up having to use Saran Wrap for a condom at 2 am...
Quote from: sgrizzle on January 03, 2011, 02:24:37 PM
Don't they need zoning changed to do the kind of development you're asking for?
Why spend months fighting through the clunky system to do a nice design when you can drop the standard store in without any hassle?
Planitulsa can make the recommendation but a zoning change will still be needed, correct?
The developers should be the ones leading the charge but what's their motivation? There are very few examples in Tulsa where new construction has been built in an urban form. I really wish and hope the zoning is someday changed so midtown can be urban but it is already heavily scarred by Office Depot, McDonalds, dental offices, pharmacies, etc.
I don't think PlaniTulsa has any bite at all as far as this is concerned unless they've morphed into an entity with some sort of zoning authority. That was merely the process in making a recommendation on the next 30 years community planning. Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. SFAIK, we are still stuck with a delveoper-driven bastard of a planning commission.
I'm okay with it. When I lived in Dallas, every Walgreens had a CVS right across the street, and I always considered CVS to be superior. It's not like that corner is part of a pedestrian mall or anything anyway, so I don't really see any downside as far as development. If anything, its an upgrade from an ugly and outdated Mays building to a newer and nicer CVS store.
Quote from: Floyd on January 03, 2011, 02:09:22 PM
The frustrating part for me is that, as you point out, CVS has designs in the box for all kinds of urban scenarios. It just depends on the zoning. But until the PlaniTulsa recommendations are implemented, they and others will keep up business as usual in their building forms.
That's two corners of a midtown intersection that have been renovated recently, and both can be considered missed opportunities to tighten up the space and make it more approachable and pedestrian-friendly.
This may not be a PUD...I havent been able to find any public exhibits that show what type of layout they are planning.
Given its location, that corner will already be zoned commercial, so I would not expect much in the way of thoughtful, quality design.
Until the zoning changes recommended by Planitulsa get implemented, status quo will reign. The City Council will soon be discussing the hiring of a planning director and funding an overhaul of the zoning code... so there's hope for the future.
Drove by this morning. The Mays is gone and the restaurant between it and Brownie's appears to be gone as well.
That's going to be a bunch of parking for all of us.
Quote from: Townsend on January 06, 2011, 08:30:49 AM
Drove by this morning. The Mays is gone and the restaurant between it and Brownie's appears to be gone as well.
That's going to be a bunch of parking for all of us.
Oh Hell yes! More fair parking! Just what we need!
Quote from: Townsend on January 06, 2011, 08:30:49 AM
Drove by this morning. The Mays is gone and the restaurant between it and Brownie's appears to be gone as well.
That's going to be a bunch of parking for all of us.
Most of which will never be used, just like the Office Depot at 15th & Lewis. There is already a wall of businesses including Empire Optical and Umberto's Pizza on 21st, a CVS at the corner could continue that wall and better define the street. Same for on Harvard, with all of the parking required by code behind the store north of Brownie's. Like I said the main entrance could even face the parking lot to the south and it wouldn't be any different than what is likely going in. In fact the way they are likely doing it with parking at the corner will make parking even more of a pain because getting out of a parking lot at an intersection sucks; much easier a few hundred feet down on Harvard...
Any way we can see what the site plan looks like? I would think Florence Park neighborhood behind would definitely be interested.
Quote from: SXSW on January 06, 2011, 11:41:07 AM
Any way we can see what the site plan looks like? I would think Florence Park neighborhood behind would definitely be interested.
+1. Florence Park
South and Bryn-Mawr would both be interested.
I forgot about the restaurant, it was the first to be demolished. Used to be a Long John Silvers then a BBQ place.
Quote from: patric on January 06, 2011, 12:07:31 PM
+1. Florence Park South and Bryn-Mawr would both be interested.
I forgot about the restaurant, it was the first to be demolished. Used to be a Long John Silvers then a BBQ place.
...and a Jamaican restaurant then a succession of Mexican food restaurants. ;D
Quote from: OSU on January 06, 2011, 12:50:26 PM
...and a Jamaican restaurant then a succession of Mexican food restaurants. ;D
I really liked the Jamaican restaurant. Glad we have Hibiscus in Brookside but we could more Jamaican/Caribbean places in Tulsa. :)
Quote from: SXSW on January 06, 2011, 03:47:34 PM
I really liked the Jamaican restaurant. Glad we have Hibiscus in Brookside but we could more Jamaican/Caribbean places in Tulsa. :)
So not impressed with Hibiscus. I might be if I were smoking what they are in the kitchen.
Quote from: Conan71 on January 06, 2011, 04:16:06 PM
So not impressed with Hibiscus. I might be if I were smoking what they are in the kitchen.
It was great when it opened. Had two blah experiences in a row and I've taken my liver elsewhere to eat.
Quote from: Townsend on January 06, 2011, 04:31:10 PM
It was great when it opened. Had two blah experiences in a row and I've taken my liver elsewhere to eat.
I had what was billed as jerk chicken there one night. More like a rude chicken if you ask me.
Quote from: Conan71 on January 07, 2011, 01:22:36 AM
I had what was billed as jerk chicken there one night. More like a rude chicken if you ask me.
I too was not impressed with the jerk chicken. It tasted like someone sprinkled some store brand seasonings and put it in the oven. But i'm a bit jaded because I was in Jamaica for my sister's wedding some years ago and the jerk chicken was out of this world. I'm not sure anyone would be able to match that. It was marinated, re-seasoned, and cooked on an open grill right in front of us. Deliciousl.
Quote from: DowntownDan on January 07, 2011, 09:29:47 AM
I too was not impressed with the jerk chicken. It tasted like someone sprinkled some store brand seasonings and put it in the oven. But i'm a bit jaded because I was in Jamaica for my sister's wedding some years ago and the jerk chicken was out of this world. I'm not sure anyone would be able to match that. It was marinated, re-seasoned, and cooked on an open grill right in front of us. Deliciousl.
Real jerk seasoning isn't hard to do once you play with it enough but you need fresh ingredients like whole ginger, all spice, and scotch bonnett peppers, not powdered stuff that's been in a can or bottle for a year.
We have too many oceans of concrete in this town, and the drainage problems that go with them. I for one am going to contact CVS to complain that they are ignoring the pedestrian/bike friendly nature of our neighborhood by putting in another architectural monstrosity. By refusing to build a store that conforms to the PLANit Tulsa master plan, they are basically telling Tulsa to shove it.
Quote from: Dogzilla on January 22, 2011, 09:40:46 PM
We have too many oceans of concrete in this town, and the drainage problems that go with them. I for one am going to contact CVS to complain that they are ignoring the pedestrian/bike friendly nature of our neighborhood by putting in another architectural monstrosity. By refusing to build a store that conforms to the PLANit Tulsa master plan, they are basically telling Tulsa to shove it.
Contact CVS all you want, the people you really need to be telling is the zoning board.
I know it's off topic here, but I had a friend who worked at Hibiscus and was fired by text message. Classy.
Quote from: tulsascoot on January 23, 2011, 01:32:15 PM
I know it's off topic here, but I had a friend who worked at Hibiscus and was fired by text message. Classy.
Another good reason not to text.
Quote from: Hoss on January 22, 2011, 09:54:10 PM
Contact CVS all you want, the people you really need to be telling is the zoning board.
Very true. Will there be a hearing about this proposed development or has it already happened? And how would you know? I know if they are changing the zoning, for instance from residential to commercial, they put yellow signs indicating when meetings to discuss/approve the change.
The Florence Park neighborhood should be ones concerned. It is right next to them.
They haven't started any actual work on the building yet.
Quote from: SXSW on January 23, 2011, 02:45:10 PM
Will there be a hearing about this proposed development or has it already happened? And how would you know? I know if they are changing the zoning, for instance from residential to commercial, they put yellow signs indicating when meetings to discuss/approve the change.
It's zone the way they want it, so they can do as they please.
Letter to the Editor in the TW about this CVS...I haven't been by there in a couple weeks, have they started construction?
http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/article.aspx?subjectid=62&articleid=20110201_62_A13_CSPamc522648 (http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/article.aspx?subjectid=62&articleid=20110201_62_A13_CSPamc522648)
Hoss, I'm getting really worried about you. Do you really believe there is a zoning board??? In Tulsa????
Quote from: SXSW on February 01, 2011, 11:53:18 AM
Letter to the Editor in the TW about this CVS...I haven't been by there in a couple weeks, have they started construction?
Not yet. CVS just put up a sign, but it's just flat dirt now.
Quote from: patric on February 01, 2011, 01:41:34 PM
Not yet. CVS just put up a sign, but it's just flat dirt snow now.
Sorry, couldn't resist.
Instead of condemning the company wouldn't it be easier to write/call/email and ask for the plans of the site?
They just installed their new LED digital sign this week.
Don't remember that being done on the 41st street store.
Quote from: patric on June 08, 2011, 11:32:48 PM
They just installed their new LED digital sign this week.
Don't remember that being done on the 41st street store.
Super. That'll be a pleasant distraction right by a school zone and busy intersection.
I'm sure they'll be pleased to be partially responsible for pedestrian deaths.