To save our way of life and the society we strive to live in it is time we return to the values of the founding fathers and revert back from the socialism governmental tactics to capitalism as was intended. By the outsourcing of the need of the city to private contractors it would restore accountability to the citizens through increased performance of monitored employees.
How many dollars would have been used for machinery to clean up the ice storm in 07 and would the city have been finished with it today?
How many city employee are merely non productive standby employees?
When we have an increase in unemployment is the city supposed to increase their employment?
Quote from: shadows on February 19, 2010, 09:33:04 PM
To save our way of life and the society we strive to live in it is time we return to the values of the founding fathers and revert back from the socialism governmental tactics to capitalism as was intended. By the outsourcing of the need of the city to private contractors it would restore accountability to the citizens through increased performance of monitored employees.
How many dollars would have been used for machinery to clean up the ice storm in 07 and would the city have been finished with it today?
How many city employee are merely non productive standby employees?
When we have an increase in unemployment is the city supposed to increase their employment?
I wasn't aware that outsourcing civic jobs was a major trend in the 18th century in the United States.
There are some very intelligent persons that have posted on this form. It has now come down to "mom his piece of pie is bigger than mine". It can be readily sustained that in the 1800's the productive was among the independent operation where capital investors (the industrial revolution) were the producers of the items for a balanced economy. In today's world we are depending on foreign production for items that were once produced locally. The landscape of the city has made a drastic change in the last 75 years as the producers have left town to be replaced with the debt ridden aging population to a socialism system that is dependent on the working poor to provide them with above standards of livelihoods.
The established 8 hour work day has been increased to 10 hours in some of socialism departments. The plea to the capitalism employer that and employee working 5/8 hour days punching a time clock is under stress and strain which could be relieved if he were given a week of free time with pay in order for him to sustain a continued equality of life he works for all the others week of the year. Under the socialism system this stress and strain is bank rolled to be paid in a lump some at some future date.
The FD on 24 off 48 in order to be more efficient should be changed to 8 hour shifts as even in my experience working on one time jobs for 24 continues hours it was almost impossible to maintain being alert the entire time. During the 30's where the rules were established to benefit labor in the labor relations acts the established 8/5/40 was defined as to be under the best physical ability for performance of labor. The same conditions should apply to the police department.
There is not one function preformed by Tulsa socialism that could not be preformed by privatizing the departments bring much of the functions under budget. In watching the filling of the pot holes the process used by the city of not drying out the hole and sealing it with hot tar is only like placing a Band-Aid on a well soaped wound on one's person. If the city wants to use the asphalt paving that within a very short time cracks appear, these cracks should be sealed with hot tar before the rains filled them with water froze creating pot holes. The city should be divided in street repair districts and privatized like the trash pickup, which would save millions of dollars. The functions to maintain the city, under privatizing departments would reduce unneeded employees. The federal government is just jumping up and down to print some more unemployment funds taking the burden off the aging citizens.
I am not aware of anywhere in the labor/relations act was there a requirement where the city was required to enter into contracts with unions representing city employees that could demand that the city debit spend beyond the legal established amount budget for the year. Nor is there any part where they can demand that a tax on citizens be raised to increase bloated salaries. In fact there are statutes that prohibit it. The solution has got to come to where the organizations of employee are shown the amount of money that is budgeted to the department and let the employee representatives decide how to cut the pie in different pieces.
I am not aware for sure if the union has a check-off system in force but if one is available the amount that the city pays as taxpayer funds be subject open records.
At one time the papers published the daily fire runs. It seem that due to the curtailment of news in the daily paper this would be a point of interest of most citizens now.
So you hate city workers because your mom gave you a small piece of pie?
Calling Dr. Freud...
Quote from: RecycleMichael on February 20, 2010, 06:35:48 PM
So you hate city workers because your mom gave you a small piece of pie?
Calling Dr. Freud...
You missed the strike again. Roll the ball again and see if you hit the pins you missed.
The scenario used is that the city employees are not descendants of Roman Gods therefore the time has come to reevaluate the product of which the taxpayers are paying for. There is no part of city government that cannot be improved and cost effective if it were privatized whereas cost could be reduced as it would be imperative to the limitation of the funds that would effect the output increasing the production.
We should all stand behind the allotting of the budget funds and their limitations (of decreasing revenues) whereas we could give the budgeted monies to the employees organizations and let them distribute it. Course this is a simple form of privatization. If the organization cuts the pie surely the taxpayer would not be accused of disliking the employees of their own organization.
Quote from: shadows on February 20, 2010, 08:33:02 PM
There is no part of city government that cannot be improved and cost effective if it were privatized...
Do you think we should privatize 911 operators? The police force? How about the job of Mayor?
Would you go with low bidder?
How is Tulsa's city government socialist?
Quote from: RecycleMichael on February 20, 2010, 09:29:13 PM
Do you think we should privatize 911 operators? The police force? How about the job of Mayor?
Would you go with low bidder?
Many cities are operated by a city manager appointed by a republic form. 911 operators are mortal not Roman Gods and it would be very simple to privatize it. Read the story of Robert Peel and how he changed the police department in England. There are hundreds of security guards that are privatized. It would be very easy to change "security guards" to "Police" being also they are mortals.
Socialism=production and distribution of economy controlled by government. First step to communism. Was it not Paul Getty when the union demanded a closed shop, did close it and sold all supplies by auction and Tulsa lost a prime industry? ;D
Quote from: shadows on February 20, 2010, 11:01:26 PM
Many cities are operated by a city manager appointed by a republic form.
I am not sure you know what privatizing is. What is the difference of of hiring a city manager and hiring a department head like a police chief?
Quote from: shadows on February 20, 2010, 11:01:26 PM
Many cities are operated by a city manager appointed by a republic form. 911 operators are mortal not Roman Gods and it would be very simple to privatize it. Read the story of Robert Peel and how he changed the police department in England. There are hundreds of security guards that are privatized. It would be very easy to change "security guards" to "Police" being also they are mortals.
Socialism=production and distribution of economy controlled by government. First step to communism. Was it not Paul Getty when the union demanded a closed shop, did close it and sold all supplies by auction and Tulsa lost a prime industry? ;D
I don't think you have considered the downside of privatizing police, didn't you see Robocop?
Quote from: swake on February 21, 2010, 09:10:36 AM
I don't think you have considered the downside of privatizing police, didn't you see Robocop?
Shadow, even though I suspect you were around in the 1800's to see how business operated, you didn't pay much attention. It wasn't socialist, that is true. It was more GOB Fascist. The government gave the rights to public properties to their friends (railroads, factory owners, real estate developers etc.) in exchange for development. Huge populations of our ancestors were herded up and moved to lands considered of little value. Oklahoma. Too bad they didn't just privatize that operation. We'd have no Indian Nation today.
Those private companies then persuaded the government to allow millions of low wage immigrants into the country to do the work "our people didn't want to do". No unions, no 40 hour work weeks, no health care, no minimum age limits, no minimum wage. Ahh, privatization is sweet. It spawned disgusting ghettos and crime waves still reverberating today. Golden Age? Old people like you and me lived on the streets begging food and getting robbed. All sound familiar? That government is best that governs least. Privatization. Socialism. Anti-union. Blah, blah, blah.
If you're going to quote history and yearn for its return, you should learn more about it.
Quote from: swake on February 21, 2010, 09:10:36 AM
I don't think you have considered the downside of privatizing police, didn't you see Robocop?
That was one of the best Blu-Ray purchases I've made. It was great to be able to see the magic behind all the cheesy SFX. Guide wires on missles, that sort of thing.
And it's one of the best satirical movies of all time.
RM: There is a distinct difference between an administrator, without a policing background, representing and delegating to the employee of the taxpayers than one who has a trained background in policing who rewards a subordinate, intoxicated, pointing a gun at a civilian that is rewarded with an extended vacation with pay. There is the old folks saying that it is only one bad apple but one apple will contaminate the whole barrel. If such incidents happened under privatization where it was not subject to socialism how long would he have before he had his final check in hand? Have you ever researched the creating of a police state?
Swake: Hoss: Did see Robocop, also the "Day After"; "2012" but we should be aware that this country with all its promises of a future is following the path taken by others before us that has lead to the death of thousands of our youth is from a mere spark that burst into flames of undeclared wars. We must maintain vigilance to even the sign of smoke.
Waterboy: Most of the jobs taken by the immigrants were financed by England. The war of 1860 was a war between two nation the United Southern States and the Northern United States. The immigrants were gathered into the Northern part as they were unemployed remnants of the British prison colonies that England had established here. Roosevelt turn the country into a socialism system in the 40's and the government took control of all wages, production, supplies and purchased all items produced. Under the present city government each day we are going down the path of the same socialism as we bloat the budget well beyond the accounts receivable that is almost now double inflation. Today's question "How much can you afford to pay to maintain socialism?
Socialism may be the answer to this faulted society. The younger generation would look forward to nothing but entertainment with the city sending them a check each month, full health care, two weeks paid vacations to accumulate as extra money to travel on, and a pension if they would sleep in a city owned building.
If one wants to know about our history they would have to learn it from England, Spain, or France as we immortalize persons liken Paul Revere who was so drunk when he was to warn Hancock the British were coming to seize the gun powder that he rode into the marching redcoats yelling the British are coming. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Yeah, well Revere is not here to contest your assertion. Never heard that story myself. Whitey Ford, Mickey Mantle and Babe Ruth were drunk or hungover during their record setting years in baseball. So what? They never had to call press conferences to apologize. :)
Roosevelt merely continued the path of progress started at the turn of the 20th century this country needed to flatten out the whipsaw depressions/panics that were common to the gilded age you so revere. The industrial age created massive problems and huge opportunities that required the cooperation of business and government. It seems to have turned out pretty well even though our highways, our parks, our bridges, our school systems, our health departments, our communication systems, our power systems.....are all the result of socialistic planning! Damn those socialists and their unholy alliances with capitalism! They will doom us I tell you.
That starts with S and it rhymes with Mess and it stands for Socialism! Right here in River City friends! TULSA-HOTBED OF SOCIALISM.
F. Roosevelt started his term of "socialization" in the thirties though. And you can't really blame him for exerting the control the government needed to win WWII. Well, I guess you will anyway. Also enjoyed your take on the Civil War and England subsidizing immigration. Your head must be swimming with alternate realities.
Socialism?
"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."...Inigo Montoya, a great....Spaniard.
There won't be need to privatize anything when ROBOTS RULE THE WORLD!
Quote from: TURobY on February 22, 2010, 10:09:15 AM
There won't be need to privatize anything when ROBOTS RULE THE WORLD!
Webster's Collegiate Dictionary--Socialism: A stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done.
It seems that I should be on the TW opinion form as on this one most seem to receive their income from some form of city expenders believing they are indispensable and should be paid, not according to work done. The opinion form moves very rapid but it give a good cross section of the citizens response to the actual conditions of the city.
Whether we want to realize it or not we are in a robot controlled world. My granddaughter is here with her wireless laptop is in the second year at Phoenix university. The robot controlled degree will be the same as if she attended classes except she is taught by a robot professor who retains the intelligence of hundred organic professors .
The world's richest man could hack the robot systems that would bring disaster to the planet within moments. The writers of Flash Gordon's rockets and Dick Tracy's wrist TV are now a reality.
There are only 100 pennies to the dollar. How does one divide them up? If property taxes are increased then it is counter productive as the increase reduces the value of the home as it becomes another liability on home ownership. If the sales taxes are raised then that is a tax burden on the elderly and poor.
We are at the point where we must reduce the cost to government, city, state and federal as more that the 100 pennies have already been allotted. The cry that "I am indispensable to the city' must fall on deft ears as we must move forward into a government that we can afford.
The choice is up to the taxpayer. Stand up for a reform or watch the population move into the suburbs taking with them the 100 pennies.
me needs me one of them wrist TVs...where do they sell them?
So if I understand this right, under socialism we'd all have social diseases? This is SO confusing.
I think Funk & Wagnalls is more accurate in description.
Socialism n.1. Public collective ownership or control of the basic means of production, distribution, and exchange, with the avowed aim of operating for use rather than for profit, and of assuring to each member of society an equitable share of goods, services, and welfare benefits.
The key is in who owns the means of production and in what %. We are not even close to this description. I think you practice amatuer demagoguery. I don't work for the feds, city, county or state either.
Quote from: waterboy on February 22, 2010, 08:25:34 PM
I think Funk & Wagnalls is more accurate in description.
Socialism n.1. Public collective ownership or control of the basic means of production, distribution, and exchange, with the avowed aim of operating for use rather than for profit, and of assuring to each member of society an equitable share of goods, services, and welfare benefits.
The key is in who owns the means of production and in what %. We are not even close to this description. I think you practice amatuer demagoguery. I don't work for the feds, city, county or state either.
I think Funk & Wagnall's mixed up their definitions of Socialism and Communism. Not that we're anywhere near either, in this country.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on February 22, 2010, 07:53:20 PM
me needs me one of them wrist TVs...where do they sell them?
Saw a woman with the advanced Dick Tracy wrist TV the other day. It had a screen about 1&1/8 by 1&3/8th.. It projected the picture of the person who you were talking to, took still pictures, took moving pictures, could see favorite TV soap operate or just used as a telephone. She didn't have the wrist straps but I am sure the are available on the internet.
The Mid-East is producing them but they are demanding something in exchange other than the no-value stimulus dollars we are running off in maxim production.
Now wait a minute. If I told you how to purchase over the internet then you might not pay the use tax due on cost and use as a phone which would cause the city to start looking for a position's name for another $100,000 plus desk jockey to check on seeing if you were paying the use tax due. Seems they are strapped for money already.
In defining socialism I suppose the nation has been led falsely about Russia. Seems since December of 1922 The Soviet Socialist Republic that was pursued by Trotsky, to expedite socialism in the home land, was only a figment of our imagination as by fact, not definition, has not been a threat to our non existing democracy that Jefferson defined as would have been mob rule.
In the great depression it took three years before the citizens had exhausted their savings and walked off from their houses because they could not pay the payments and taxes on them.
Quote from: nathanm on February 22, 2010, 08:30:57 PM
I think Funk & Wagnall's mixed up their definitions of Socialism and Communism. Not that we're anywhere near either, in this country.
Hubris.
Geez... what a mess! Apparently old enough to have lived through the depression, but didn't notice anything around him at the time.
Well, let's go with Shadow's definition of Socialism. Apparently he thinks Socialism should be eliminated..?
Webster's Collegiate Dictionary--Socialism: A stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done.
EXACTLY what we have today with the Big Banks and Big Oil. The few who are distinguished by the salaries and bonuses totaling billions; those that have ridden on the backs of the majority of us taxpayers, receiving grotesquely disproportionate goods and pay according to disproportionately small work done. With our bailouts.
Just like the Robber Baron era. So according to Shadows definition, Big Banks and Big Oil are obviously Socialist and Communist and should be controlled, if not eliminated. Perhaps just something as simple as reinstatement of Glass-Steagall.
Quote from: heironymouspasparagus on February 25, 2010, 07:31:51 PM
EXACTLY what we have today with the Big Banks and Big Oil. The few who are distinguished by the salaries and bonuses totaling billions; those that have ridden on the backs of the majority of us taxpayers, receiving grotesquely disproportionate goods and pay according to disproportionately small work done. With our bailouts.
Just like the Robber Baron era. So according to Shadows definition, Big Banks and Big Oil are obviously Socialist and Communist and should be controlled, if not eliminated. Perhaps just something as simple as reinstatement of Glass-Steagall.
I was not able to see the cause and length it took from the time of the crash in '29 that was a spinoff of the roaring '20. This incident let depositors think that the deposited money would be safe available when needed was offset with the unscrupulous banking investment industry, which turned into a precarious in-secured investment market of stocks, bond, loans and mortgages being the products of the roaring '20's. This increased of the paper shuffling which reflected a near atmosphere of a blind fraud showed increased incomes allowing the increasing of unwarnted bonuses. From the crash of '29 until the '32's I was some three years of a rollercoaster market before the runs on banks by the depositors become sever causing many bank to close their days forever with the depositors money.
Socialism is an effect of uncontrolled monetary practices where a society separates breaking off in two societies which include the taking over ownership of individual holding to administrate them by salaries and bonuses for a non-producing second society. The individual becomes where he is no longer tbe owner of person property but it subject to "render into Caesar that which is Caesar's" as he owes "his soul to the County Store". He is able to use his property as long as the contributions are made in taxes each years. If he fails to submit this rendition them the property will be taken from him and sold to some one else.
The CSA established and amended in 1933 was installed by Roosevelt in an effort to eliminate the investment banking from borrowing funds from the commercial banks investing them which establish confidence again in investing banks. After some 67 years this protection in part was repealed by Clinton which in the last decade has brought us face to face with that part of the monetary crisis we have created world wide today. A greater part of the world is demanding that we stop printing the stimulus money and back up that shuffling of paper, floating in the air, that has no landing place.
We have passed our place in time where we can let big corporations and conglomerates in tri-state banking control our world standing as a economy guideline as some 21 world leader met recently to discuss our economy.
The replacement of the Gramm-Leach-Buley Act for the CSA was no more than a cop-out instituted by big banks to insure the continued raiding of the taxpayer to furnish the million dollar bonuses and salaries. This country a thousand years before Cortex use strings with knots to show wealth. Gold was used only for ornaments, Today it is shown by salaries and perks given to by the societies socialism of government expenders.
So by the summer with the great dust storm beginning the poor were struggled for jobs, The government increased socialism by creating jobs but the great depression had be began which was to last for a decade.
continued
By 1934 the full effects of this socialism's golden area was in its full force as an after of the 1918 war the banks started laying the foundation to include the heydays of the golden 20's. In doing this the lending of money produced an overabundance of food products. Thus the great depression was built on the foundations of an over zealous money lending socialistic system who's purpose was to accumulated more wealth.
Even the made work available to the unemployed in the great depression was no more than the stimulus outlay being tried today that is only making available the outlay of a increase to the wealth of the wealthy.
The first signs of the ending of the great depression was when we, as a warring nation, sought to enter into the war of Europe in 1938. Soon after
Roosevelt placed a lid on all of the price structure but perpetrators of socialism had no trouble getting around it.
Then as the men were drafted " Rosie the Riveter" disposed the kitchen apron to enter into the industrial fields once dominated by the male species. Today she is not about to put the apron on again so she becomes a added threat to the employment causing the ominous cloud over recovery. The indications that she would work cheaper has propelled her advancement. The workforce today is almost double that of the year 2000 with the ever increasing unemployment.
The end of the Great Depression came under full mobilization where under the powers of socialism was the sole purchasers of products. One could not even buy a hammer unless he had a government permit to buy it.
We wanted to float the dollar thinking they would fear our mighty forces to would keep it afloat. We have spread the un-backed paper to where it has lost much of its value. We have bars if gold and silver that seems to being held to insure those pensions, perks, golden parachutes and bonuses of the socialist.
The billions in the promise to pay legal tender is being return to the nation in purchasing stocks in the blue chip line of utilities which is the life line to our way of life and would be the last to go under.
The steel workers union was able to raise their waged to where the industry could not compete so they moved off shore to cheaper labor. Now we are crying that the steel pipe produced is being subsidized by China and want a tariff, When oil is $70 dollars a barrel and gasoline is $2,30 a gallon who is subsidizing the oil industry?
We have come a long way only to be standing on the rim of the cliff waiting for a shove.
Tulsa should wake up because the coffee is burning and there is tough times ahead as we could slip into another great depression.
I don't doubt your conclusion that we may be on the edge of another depression, but how you got there is conjecture on your part. In earlier posts, Roosevelt was your prime mover in bringing Socialism to America. In this latest post he is an obstacle to the socialists. You also seem to ignore the effect of increased techology used to increase yields of produce in the early part of the 20th century, without an understanding of good farming techniques or the managing of markets. That caused not only an overabundance of staple goods, which drove down prices and bankrupted farmers, but also ravaged the land increasing the negative effects of cyclical droughts. Major components of that depression. Your conclusion is that greedy bankers, unions and growing socialism were more at fault.
Respectfully, someone needs to say it, you're full of aged cow manure. Write a book if you feel your insights are so much better than historians of the era, but get yourself a good, sober editor.
The production of technology has very little effect on the lack of a work force when that which is develop is grab up and taken to foreign countries to increase their work force as we have increased our cost of labor to where it is no longer equitable to produce it here. We are eating the seed needed to produce the fields of corn at present. Technology is a wonderful advancement to advance societies but it is a poor filler in making a sandwich
Our entire system today is production of a monetary system whereas we produce less each day but depend on the credit issued by the banks as our principal commodity for employment and world trade. As you are aware the once sought after dollar is less desired than the euro in the East today.
I am sure the people are aware of the lines that formed to withdraw their deposits that were invested in a stocks of the golden 20's that was to be loaned to increase jobs whereas the money bankers who were distributing it knew it did not belong to them, thus it was of little value to them. After the repeal of the Roosevelt enacted (GSA) which restricted the banking policies, being repealed by Clinton on pressure from the banking industry to self control of themselves, leading to the golden 2000, only for us to come face to face again with another monetary crisis. We are faced again to either buy the banker mistakes or see another crash like that of 1929 because of very reckless lending policies .
Being well aware of improved farming from a family of farmers, in the sale of a brother-in-law estate, it contained 100 tractors with the highest price one bringing $85,000 dollars. He plowed rows of corn 7 miles long. As was written "the tractor pulls the plow".
This time we are doling out the money to any foolish concepts presented on the pretense of creating more jobs. But much of the so called stimulus money is diverted again to the promoter in absurd salaries and bonuses.
One could write and has written volumes of books on the subject but how would one write today that could only say "Those foolish ones are at it again".
OK, shadows, time to step up or shut up ...
As president, what would you do that would improve the economy in a real way, get through the Congress, and still pass constitutional muster?
You seem to think a lot of policies suck; what policies would you implement wouldn't cause a huge disruption to the national and world economy?
Quote from: rwarn17588 on February 28, 2010, 09:51:46 AM
OK, shadows, time to step up or shut up ...
As president, what would you do that would improve the economy in a real way, get through the Congress, and still pass constitutional muster?
You seem to think a lot of policies suck; what policies would you implement wouldn't cause a huge disruption to the national and world economy?
Since we have a living constitution that grows each day and if I were president the first order of the day would be "keep those engines running on Airforce 1", then "make reservations in several countries that might be friendly", then "load about a dozen of those gold bars on board", and put a sign on the door saying "on vacation".
Second I would consider the gravitation pull of the sun that is holding the planets of our solar system in orbit and the hundreds of year old prediction of the aligning of the planets in 2012, that may cause disrupting earthquakes to increase along with massive hurricanes and say "what to hell there is no place to run as on earth we keep the wars going since we started recording time". Then lets get aboard and head for Hawaii.
The conditions that exist today duplicate the condition of wealth v. poverty v. slavery since the days of the building of the great pyramids. Only by wars have we been able to momentarily solved our problems. The circle cannot be broken.
^^ Well, so much for a serious discussion, then. ::)
Unless you truly are serious. Then it's a case of insanity.
Quote from: rwarn17588 on March 01, 2010, 09:06:43 AM
^^ Well, so much for a serious discussion, then. ::)
Unless you truly are serious. Then it's a case of insanity.
Being the solution of barter of exchange has escaped reality through the recorded centuries contributing to the insanity of this species of animals, then I should fit well within that category. One is unable to pick one's self up before they have fallen. Any solution I would have would be a change of government and monetary system which would create more conversation that would be allowed on this form. It will come to pass and those who perpetrate it will object to it also. ;D
Quote from: shadows on February 28, 2010, 10:53:05 PM
Since we have a living constitution that grows each day and if I were president the first order of the day would be "keep those engines running on Airforce 1", then "make reservations in several countries that might be friendly", then "load about a dozen of those gold bars on board", and put a sign on the door saying "on vacation".
Second I would consider the gravitation pull of the sun that is holding the planets of our solar system in orbit and the hundreds of year old prediction of the aligning of the planets in 2012, that may cause disrupting earthquakes to increase along with massive hurricanes and say "what to hell there is no place to run as on earth we keep the wars going since we started recording time". Then lets get aboard and head for Hawaii.
.....dude, what?
Quote from: shadows on March 01, 2010, 09:58:05 AM
Being the solution of barter of exchange has escaped reality through the recorded centuries contributing to the insanity of this species of animals, then I should fit well within that category. One is unable to pick one's self up before they have fallen. Any solution I would have would be a change of government and monetary system which would create more conversation that would be allowed on this form. It will come to pass and those who perpetrate it will object to it also. ;D
I think we need the bunny with a pancake photo. ::)
Quote from: TURobY on March 01, 2010, 09:58:25 AM
.....dude, what?
All he is saying, all he ever says is, government is bad and I don't want to pay taxes. He doesn't give a crap about anything other than not paying taxes.
Quote from: rwarn17588 on March 01, 2010, 10:07:55 AM
I think we need the bunny with a pancake photo. ::)
Ask and ye shall receive
(http://img72.exs.cx/img72/9428/PlayboyBunny.jpg)
Quote from: swake on March 01, 2010, 10:10:38 AM
All he is saying, all he ever says is, government is bad and I don't want to pay taxes. He doesn't give a crap about anything other than not paying taxes.
One cannot believe that government is bad when ours is possibly the worlds largest employer.
What is bad is that taxpayers supporting them are becoming the minority.
Quote from: Hoss on March 01, 2010, 10:24:24 AM
Ask and ye shall receive
(http://img72.exs.cx/img72/9428/PlayboyBunny.jpg)
Hmmmm, a non fattening pancake.........
Any one have some maple syrup? You know, for the pancake?
Question of the day; what color is the sky in Shadow's world?
There WERE a couple sentences in all those that were almost coherent....almost. Not.
Reminded of a song; "whiskey, whiskey, my old friend...I've come to visit you again." And from that era, too.
Couple of things. From 1932 to 1936 (approx), the policies Roosevelt started made significant progress. The problem is the problem was WAY TOO big. "Official" unemployment compliments of Hoover was over 25%. After 4 years of Roosevelt, it was around 12%. Still horrendous, and still worse then we see today, but considering the "give the store away" approach that government allowed the robber barons, it was a heck of a change.
And just think, if it had not been for the Civilian Conservation Corp of later '30s, you would have spent much more and had tremendous delays to build the National Park system and most of the state park systems you enjoy today.
And getting off the precious metal standards was the biggest single item that has allowed the growth of our economy that we have all enjoyed since then. The magic of the discount rate and minimum reserve and the federal money supply...M1 through M3 and MZM. (Metro-Zoldwyn-Mayor??)
And regulation of bank excesses...until 1999.
Quote from: swake on March 01, 2010, 10:10:38 AM
All he is saying, all he ever says is, government is bad and I don't want to pay taxes. He doesn't give a crap about anything other than not paying taxes.
Then if he's a Tulsan, he must have voted against the BOK Center.
Quote from: heironymouspasparagus on March 04, 2010, 07:50:14 PM
And getting off the precious metal standards was the biggest single item that has allowed the growth of our economy that we have all enjoyed since then. The magic of the discount rate and minimum reserve and the federal money supply...M1 through M3 and MZM. (Metro-Zoldwyn-Mayor??)
And regulation of bank excesses...until 1999.
When we went off the backing of currency with metal we only made available the debit spending of which is today approaching or has already passed those of governments that have defaulted. We have an over abundance of workers in the work force that has been caused by the outsourcing of our once world industrial standing. Our balances of trade with unsecured currency has gotten to where the dollar must be exchanged for the euro in the world bank in payments for imports. Congress in 1933, under direction of Roosevelt, deleted the gold standard. In 1934 Roosevelt devaluates the dollar. This leaves the children who will inherent the debit with a fist full of paper but the foreign investors can use them to buy the lands the children should inherent.
The removal of the banking act in 1999 that restricted the banks from over extending their assets, contributed to this monetary crisis that is not going away and the bailouts only contribute to the cause.
Finally, a rational statement. The Glass-Steagoll act should be reinstated now.
As for the first paragraph, yes. Exactly. That is what gave us the economy that gave us the best standard of living in the world. Losing gold as reference is what allowed us to grow.
It has been estimated that all the gold mined up to 2006 totaled 158,000 tonnes.(Wiki) At a price of US$1000 per oz., one ton of gold has a value of approx. US $32.15 million. The total value of all gold ever mined would exceed US$5 trillion at that valuation. Or only about 1/3 of the value of our economy. Not to mention the rest of the world - and they would probably have some of that, too. (And the ton in that estimate may be 16 oz lbs, so the estimate would be even higher than reality.)
So, all the clowns out there who are peddling gold right now (listen to KRMG!) are completely oblivious as to how the world economy works. And works pretty well, until governments allow the robber baron in the corporate world to run rampant all over us.
IMO it's a combo of things, the loss of jobs and many jobs are lost because of goverment high taxes & regulations that chase companies overseas, the corp. tax rate should be cut form 35% to 10% that would help our economy alot- The USA has one of the worlds highest corp. tax rates. Too many unskilled foreign workers coming in from all over the globe both legal & illegal that flood the labor market. The "Cap & trade" thing that Obama wants will kill our economy, they even admit that passing it will cost another 2.5 million more jobs. The gold craz thing is also a rip off, and the buying gold coins is even worse, gold is over priced as it is and is due for a big correction. It's a mess. :o
The only people who want to see us back on the gold standard are people who own a bunch of gold. Think about it. If they get the rubes to force Congress to do that, the price of gold will necessarily have to increase. Great for people who own it. Terrible for all the industries that require it to make things.
Quote from: nathanm on March 11, 2010, 02:11:40 PM
The only people who want to see us back on the gold standard are people who own a bunch of gold. Think about it. If they get the rubes to force Congress to do that, the price of gold will necessarily have to increase. Great for people who own it. Terrible for all the industries that require it to make things.
Or people who buried gold and silver certificates in Mason jars in their backyard like Shadows.
Quote from: Conan71 on March 11, 2010, 02:52:15 PM
Or people who buried gold and silver certificates in Mason jars in their backyard like Shadows.
I bet Shadows has Confederate Script in the original Mason Jars in his backyard.
Quote from: Hoss on March 11, 2010, 04:06:46 PM
I bet Shadows has Confederate Script in the original Mason Jars in his backyard.
Even I used to have a few bucks confederate. They've rotted away by now. Damn southerners used crappy paper.
Another one of the RWRE, Cheney/Rove/Murdoch lie factory items. Cap and trade.
Anyone with a brain and who lived there would remember that cap and trade started under a Republican president. Can you spell John Sununu?
It has been happening for 20 years. Not new. And not Obama's idea. It was crappy idea then, and is still today.