In addition to all the attention the BOK center gets through Pollstar, I thought I might point out the website for Pelli Clarke Pelli Architects which has the BOK center displayed as one of their featured projects. They also have the BOK Center listed under Athletics and Performing Arts in their Projects section with a few outstanding photos of the exterior and interior.
This is the link to the Athletics Projects section of the website: http://www.pcparch.com/#/projects/athletic/bok-center/
Someone should take new pictures showing all the street lights turned off and a guy running around with a flamethrower and no police or fire officials contesting his rampage.
Quote from: YoungTulsan on January 13, 2010, 12:25:26 AM
Someone should take new pictures showing all the street lights turned off and a guy running around with a flamethrower and no police or fire officials contesting his rampage.
(http://64bitarmy.com/lol//bunny-pancake.gif)
It's a budget cut thing, I think. Though YT has posted some strange stuff after mid night before
Believe it or not, there are people who, when they come to Tulsa, wish to see the Boston Ave Church, and now also the BOK Center. Imo its one of this countries new architectural treasures. We should be proud to have such a large and strikingly beautiful structure. Its great to walk around it on a sunny day and enjoy seeing how the light reflects, shimmers and and slips across its undulating surfaces.
An "artsy night pic" I took that I kinda like. Have a sweeping, horizontal version that would look killer, sofa sized and in a contemporary setting. May have to print some up to sell at Blue Dome if I do that this year.
(http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/6150/aimg4051mfw.jpg)
Artie,
Tourism should not be perceived as economic development. It's a loss leader.
How long before the budget cuts start hurting the BOK? Maybe it should be privatized. Put a for sale sign on it and city hall....
Quote from: FOTD on January 13, 2010, 01:15:20 PM
Artie,
Tourism should not be perceived as economic development. It's a loss leader.
How long before the budget cuts start hurting the BOK? Maybe it should be privatized. Put a for sale sign on it and city hall....
I made no mention of Tourism.
Quote from: FOTD on January 13, 2010, 01:15:20 PM
Artie,
Tourism should not be perceived as economic development. It's a loss leader.
Compared to what? It's well-documented that tourism has a big multiplier effect in local economies.
You want tourists to stay away from Tulsa???
Quote from: TheArtist on January 13, 2010, 01:29:07 PM
I made no mention of Tourism.
Yes, you did: " Believe it or not, there are people who, when they come to Tulsa, wish to see..."
Quote from: FOTD on January 13, 2010, 01:41:30 PM
Yes, you did: " Believe it or not, there are people who, when they come to Tulsa, wish to see..."
There's a big difference between
a) someone coming to Tulsa to see x and do y
b) someone who's found thyself in Tulsa... now what..
Quote from: FOTD on January 13, 2010, 01:15:20 PM
Artie,
Tourism should not be perceived as economic development. It's a loss leader.
How long before the budget cuts start hurting the BOK? Maybe it should be privatized. Put a for sale sign on it and city hall....
Loss leader? It's fresh outside money in an economy.
Quote from: Conan71 on January 13, 2010, 04:05:28 PM
Loss leader? It's fresh outside money in an economy.
Right....keep telling yourself that.
How much investment have we made over the years trying to attract those outside dollars? What outlay does the city make each year to subsidize, maintain, and market tourism? What's our loss? Significant.
In light of the current budgetary nightmare (which will last for years), it's easy to see where the city has gone way overboard with municipal spending that will never have a decent return....BOK Center included.
They need to privatize everything from IT to property. Only education, law and order, and public werks should remain under city control.
Quote from: BKDotCom on January 13, 2010, 02:49:09 PM
There's a big difference between
a) someone coming to Tulsa to see x and do y
b) someone who's found thyself in Tulsa... now what..
It's not the roll of government to babysit a bored family member or boring business people....
"How much investment have we made over the years trying to attract those outside dollars?"
Good question. Do you know? (btw, imo the BOK Arena wasnt primarily, or even substantially, about Tourism unless you call local people going to local events Tourism)
"What outlay does the city make each year to subsidize, maintain, and market tourism? "
Boy I wish I knew, aparently not much if any at all.
What's our loss? Significant.
Loss? What loss?
"In light of the current budgetary nightmare (which will last for years), it's easy to see where the city has gone way overboard with municipal spending that will never have a decent return....BOK Center included."
Whats your judge of a "decent return?" not everything is directly or readily quantifiable in dollar terms.
"They need to privatize everything from IT to property. Only education, law and order, and public werks should remain under city control."
Thats your opinion, which has obviously been out-voted (and apparently this same thing is true in every other city I can think of in the world through out all time, etc.). Apparently there were plenty of people (like me) who wanted the BOK Center, wanted to pay for it, and dont mind that it doesnt "make a profit" lol. The law is such that people can vote to tax themselves and pay for the things they want. Some things you or may want, some not,,, and they may not be the same things I want. But in order for this to be a city for everyone we all have to abide by the vote and do our duty to make sure that when a vote is made and tax dollars are being spent, that they are spent in the most efficient manner possible. I wanted an above average, shiny, swanky bauble of an Arena... and got it. You didnt,,, sucks to be you.
Quote from: FOTD on January 13, 2010, 04:49:22 PM
It's not the roll of government to babysit a bored family member or boring business people....
It sure as heck is if "we the people" vote for it to be.
Quote from: TheArtist on January 13, 2010, 06:21:49 PM
It sure as heck is if "we the people" vote for it to be.
And considering this all started with "Believe it or not, there are people who, when they come to Tulsa, wish to see the Boston Ave Church,"
Which was interpreted as pro-Tourism..
Apparently Boston Ave Church is now government run?
Quote from: FOTD on January 13, 2010, 04:47:20 PM
Right....keep telling yourself that.
How much investment have we made over the years trying to attract those outside dollars? What outlay does the city make each year to subsidize, maintain, and market tourism? What's our loss? Significant.
In light of the current budgetary nightmare (which will last for years), it's easy to see where the city has gone way overboard with municipal spending that will never have a decent return....BOK Center included.
They need to privatize everything from IT to property. Only education, law and order, and public werks should remain under city control.
There are so many holes in that argument, I don't know where to start.
First off, the City of Tulsa has no control over the area education system.
Second, you make an assumption that the city spends too much on tourism, without giving any hard facts on how much. It seems like you have no idea yourself, but even if you don't know, it's gotta be too much anyway. ???
Then there's the real and robust multiplier effect of tourism, which you ignored.
Wasn't the BOK Center built with a separate, dedicated tax? Isn't it turning a healthy profit right now? What's the loss to the city with operating expense if it's making a profit?
FOTD, you're slipping, man.
rewarn, FOTD was speaking towards city priorities be they delegated to boards or chambers or relegated to in house.... So funny that pols think government intervention is bad unless those pols and their elitist benefactors can siphon off the public to the detriment of education, infrastructure, law and order and public health. The city is broke. Why?
Slipping? Me? Is that like what's happened to our city? Maybe it's that environmental effect. It's dark out there....