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Originally posted by daddys little squirt
When I go to a coffee house I don't expect talkative patrons to enlighten me on their coffee preferences either.
So if you were waiting for your latte in Starbucks and someone else waiting said "I've always found their mocca to be really good here, but I've never had luck with their lattes" you're reply would be something along the lines of berating them for affording chocolate in their coffee and then ranting about their political affiliation? Nice. Your analogy really sums it up for me.
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Daddy wroteNo one said anything about the economy
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Amp wrote on 6/2Just appears from all indicators of the physical look of the area that things are not good in Tulsa financially and they appear to be getting much much worse daily
You need to read the threads you participate in more closely.
As a point of order (upcoming pun intended), it was AMP who brought up the commercial closings in the area. To which Conan responded and began an discussion with AMP about the area that transitioned into an economics discussion. Then you interjected - to which I replied. So if you want to try and place blame for thread deviation there is the primary order that led me into the conversation.
Also, I find this to be strange. You wrote:
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Life is too short and I need no new enemies
Shortly after writing that IPLaw, Conan and I
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should leave and start [our] own circle jerk thread.
Seems to be a bit of a contradiction. However, I am confident that you will go back and edit it to match your current position.
and finally:
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daddy wrote: the whole idea of a forum is discussion whether its comfortable or not.
After initiating the discussion with:
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ho asked for your advice?
On to the misguided heart of your comment:
1. Fortuna Caeca Est. I never said the vast majority of comments you attributed to me. The gods have nothing to do with reward nor punishment for a persons deeds. Good, hardworking people are unemployed and on the street. It happens, yes. But more often than not such a person can utilize the programs in place and get back on his feet quickly. Thus, most of the chronically unemployed are such for some reason. For whatever reason that is, they have nothing to sell in the labor market.
I never said, as you implied, that all people are unemployed because they are stupid and lazy. I've been unemployed and will likely be so again at some point. I've had my fair share of crap jobs, I've been fired and currently I work in a job I am over qualified for because I couldn't find the job I really wanted. Entrepreneurs are among my most respected people and they fail more often than not and land in unemployment and/or bankruptcy. They usually settle up, dust off, and move on. Being unemployed means nothing, but being chronically unemployed in a robust economy signifies a problem.
2. The economy is good, I have shown you the numbers and then explained them to you. Unemployment down, unemployment claims down, total jobs up, real wages up, retail sales up, plants struggling to fill job openings. Your particular field may not have something that is up to your standards, but by and large, it is BOOM times. I'm not sure what you see that indicates otherwise and you do not see fit to enlighten us.
3. Long term businesses are ALWAYS closing and new ones reopening. That is what makes our economy function. Companies are not guaranteed life, if you are no longer the best or no longer offer products anyone wants - you will close and whoever is doing it better will take your place. The market decides what defines the best and rewards it accordingly.
It is not necessarily their FAULT for not seeing what consumers wanted... but that really doesn't matter. A business is not rewarded for anything other than what pleases consumers. If consumers want cheap and disposable products from a high school kid that doesn't know anything about it, then that is what they will get. A business owner that holds out can either try to find a niche to fill or fade away.
Business has to be able to fail for the economy to be healthy. It is not a sign of overall weakness when some fall to competition or changes in the market. More and stronger businesses will take their place.
Bare in mind you brought this discussion into the context of Macro economics with your reference to 80% national employment. For the neighborhood business closings are rarely a good thing.
4. Ed Meese had some of his economic issues correct, but fiscally, socially, judicially, and on other points I do not agree. I more closely associate him with the comment about the adult bookstore in this thread than anything else. But kudo's on the obscure reference.
All that said;
NO, you are not in the wrong place. I enjoy hearing other points of view and even like to be proven wrong. I am always willing to learn and to try and understand someone else's thought process and views. I may not agree with you, but at least if I understand WHY you think that way I will respect your opinion. That is not likely to stop me from trying to persuade you otherwise... nor should my opinion stop you.
You posts today seem intelligent and well thought out, for whatever reason the other day you went around posting random negative quips and uneducated jabs. I hope it was just a bad day. I look forward to seeing more posts from you and many heated discussions in the future.