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December 16, 2019, 01:43:44 am
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Author Topic: Wider residential driveways  (Read 4968 times)
Hoss
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« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2018, 09:45:31 am »

One of three things needs to happen here with most people in Tulsa now owning more than two vehicles, RV's, or boats.

1) Enforce no curbside parking longer than four hours. (Will never happen. Waste of police resources.)
2) Widen residential streets so vehicles can park by the curb, on both sides, and it not be a visibility hazard. Happening already in some new neighborhoods but not others.
3) Widen driveways to allow for three vehicles to park side by side.

They're all poison but, one has to be chosen.

Where I currently live the north ingress to get to my house from the closest major arterial (Admiral) is a nightmare.  It travels about 2.5 blocks south (straight south) before it bends southeastward for about a block before a 3 way tee stop that I turn right to get to my home.

Way too many cars park in the street here and it's like automobile slalom course to survive it with that bend in the road.  Add to that on weekends I deal with Flea Market traffic as well (I live not far from the Traffic Circle) and most weekends I'd almost rather stay home untll 5pm or later, which is when the flea market closes and traffic subsides.  I try and travel south to 11th and deal with it that way but sometimes that's not an option.  I'd agree that wider driveways would be a plus.  And it's not just a hazard driving with all the cars parked in the streets.  There have been several times these cars conceal playing children who all of a sudden appear from behind one of these cars and my brakes get a test.

About 25 years ago because of just this hazard, my father (passed away now) hit a 6 year old on a bicycle who popped out from behind a vehicle parked in the street.  Didn't hurt her too badly, but he felt guilty about it for months.  I dare say years.  And it really wasn't his fault.  Not necessarily the girl's fault either.  At some point, parenting has to play a role, but I digress.
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2018, 09:50:31 am »

One of three things needs to happen here with most people in Tulsa now owning more than two vehicles, RV's, or boats.

1) Enforce no curbside parking longer than four hours. (Will never happen. Waste of police resources.)
2) Widen residential streets so vehicles can park by the curb, on both sides, and it not be a visibility hazard. Happening already in some new neighborhoods but not others.
3) Widen driveways to allow for three vehicles to park side by side.

They're all poison but, one has to be chosen.

I like your train of thought. But I disagree. If every house has three vehicles, nearly every house has a garage and 2 spaces in the driveway.  If they have 4, there is room for at least one vehicle from every house to park on one side of the road (and thereby not clog the road entirely, which we also don't enforce).  If every household has 4 or more vehicles, plus boats or RVs, then its time for them to find a storage solution for their toys. "I have too much crap" is a lousy reason to downgrade livability.


#1 is a no-go.  We can't even enforce the "don't park in your dang front yard" ordinance. Heck, we haven't figured out parking meters efficiently yet.

#2 is something I would vehemently fight. I have zero interest in paying for wider streets or giving up my yard for the purpose of helping people with too much crap find a place for it all.  Heck, in my neighborhood we would have to move meters, cut down trees, and, of course, actually pay to redo streets that haven't been redone since the 1950s. Not gonna happen.

#3 is giving in that because people want to have too much crap and can't be mildly inconvenienced we just need to put up with ugly.

For some reason we have been able to survive without fully paved front yards for 100 years in Tulsa. Suddenly this is a necessity?  Here's a solution, build your garage taller...

https://www.amazon.com/Auto-Lift-Car-Park-8-Storage-Parking/dp/B00KQZYAO6

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PonderInc
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« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2018, 10:08:20 am »

Actual facts:
Approximately 9% of Tulsa households do not own a single vehicle.
In 2016, the average number of vehicles per Tulsa household was 1.6.

Thus, ďmost peopleĒ do not in fact own more than two cars.

I donít think the census counts boats and RVs, but I can also say that very few people in my neighborhood store boats or RVs at home.

As for residential streets, I challenge you to find a steeet that is not already wide enough for two parked cars and a travel lane. Residential streets are between 20-30 feet wide, depending on when they were built.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2018, 10:23:00 am »

Actual facts:
Approximately 9% of Tulsa households do not own a single vehicle.
In 2016, the average number of vehicles per Tulsa household was 1.6.

Thus, ďmost peopleĒ do not in fact own more than two cars.

I donít think the census counts boats and RVs, but I can also say that very few people in my neighborhood store boats or RVs at home.

As for residential streets, I challenge you to find a steeet that is not already wide enough for two parked cars and a travel lane. Residential streets are between 20-30 feet wide, depending on when they were built.


Most residential additions have covenants to prevent boats, trailers, etc.  At least for a couple dozen years until the covenants expire....

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RecycleMichael
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« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2018, 01:41:49 pm »


I donít think the census counts boats...

People care about the homeless. Nobody cares about the boatless.
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« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2018, 02:03:41 pm »

People care about the homeless. Nobody cares about the boatless.


Hey!  I care about the boatless...I am one and I 'need' a boat!!  Small hunting/fishing boat with a 10 hp motor would be great!


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« Reply #21 on: June 14, 2018, 05:54:47 am »

I work in plenty of homes that have more than a 2 car garage, sometimes up to 5 or more car garages or multiple garages and they have 1 or 2 car "wide" driveways.  They have little court yards or parking areas offset from the driveway or garages.  There is no need for a wider cut through the curb or through sidewalk areas.
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« Reply #22 on: June 14, 2018, 10:24:17 pm »

As for residential streets, I challenge you to find a street that is not already wide enough for two parked cars and a travel lane. Residential streets are between 20-30 feet wide, depending on when they were built.

Richmond, Sandusky, Toledo, Urbana, Vandalia, etc

Ever been in the neighborhood south of the fairgrounds during the state fair?
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #23 on: June 15, 2018, 07:08:29 am »

Richmond, Sandusky, Toledo, Urbana, Vandalia, etc

Ever been in the neighborhood south of the fairgrounds during the state fair?

You mean the ones that do not allow parking on at least one side during the state fair?  Those are all 26 feet wide.  Just like PonderInc said. 

And designing/modifying all city streets to cope with a location specific once a year event would be goofy.  Just like the north parking lot at Target on Yale, we could pave a ton of extra space for parking and then watch it sit empty 99% of the time.  Bad use of resources.
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