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July 20, 2018, 04:59:03 am
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Author Topic: Should We Abolish ICE?  (Read 173 times)
patric
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« on: June 30, 2018, 04:57:56 pm »

Even some ICE officials see that as a good idea to stem the abuse from above.

The child of a forced marriage between two defunct federal agencies ó The United States Customs Service and the Immigration and Naturalization Service ó ICE has long struggled to balance its dual roles of transnational criminal investigations and deportations.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/28/us/politics/ice-immigration-eliminate-agency.html


...and there is a fair amount of momentum:

From L.A. to N.Y., hundreds of thousands join nationwide rallies to protest Trump's immigration policies
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-rally-family-separation-20180629-story.html


As thousands of protesters gathered across the country to protest President Donald Trumpís immigration policies and the chorus of voices calling to abolish ICE grows, the president is going on the offensive. Heís warning of an America overrun by MS-13 ó an America that doesnít exist.
https://www.vox.com/2018/6/30/17521298/trump-abolish-ice-ms-13





We already have a chaw-spittle poster boy for the cause:



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"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
guido911
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« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2018, 12:15:47 pm »

Poster boy for dbaggery...

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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2018, 01:20:35 pm »

Poster boy for dbaggery...





Joining BB for late night methane/nitrous sleepovers...??

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"So he brandished a gun, never shot anyone or anything right?"  --TeeDub, 17 Feb 2018.

I donít share my thoughts because I think it will change the minds of people who think differently.  I share my thoughts to show the people who already think like me that they are not alone.
guido911
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« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2018, 02:29:49 pm »



Joining BB for late night methane/nitrous sleepovers...??



Late night? You have problems telling time? I responded to your stupid thread and even stupider post about 3 hours ago. That's when daylight happens.
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Hoss
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I might be moving to Montana soon...


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« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2018, 04:00:48 pm »

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Somebody find Guido an ambulance to chase...
heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2018, 04:15:38 pm »

Late night? You have problems telling time? I responded to your stupid thread and even stupider post about 3 hours ago. That's when daylight happens.



No...I wasn't referring to the time of your post.   Just going by the symptoms you are exhibiting that so closely resemble the other.

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"So he brandished a gun, never shot anyone or anything right?"  --TeeDub, 17 Feb 2018.

I donít share my thoughts because I think it will change the minds of people who think differently.  I share my thoughts to show the people who already think like me that they are not alone.
erfalf
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« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2018, 07:35:28 pm »

I totally think the Democrats should latch on to this position. Let's abolish ICE so it can be replaced with a new acronym-ed department that essentially has the same failings as the one we already have. Vision.
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patric
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These Aren't the Droids You're Looking For


« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2018, 07:53:47 pm »

I totally think the Democrats should latch on to this position. Let's abolish ICE so it can be replaced with a new acronym-ed department that essentially has the same failings as the one we already have. Vision.

As the ICE investigators themselves noted when recommending it be abolished, we would not be abandoning legal immigration but rather divesting the country of  out-of-control private (Trump) storm troopers.
What if we recycled The United States Customs Service and the Immigration and Naturalization Service?  There might even be some old stationary around.


WASHINGTON ó At least 19 Immigration and Customs Enforcement investigators are seeking to dissolve the agency, concerned that the Trump administrationís crackdown on illegal migrants has limited their ability to pursue national security threats, child pornography and transnational crime.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/28/us/politics/ice-immigration-eliminate-agency.html
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"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
cannon_fodder
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« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2018, 08:11:27 am »

I totally think the Democrats should latch on to this position. Let's abolish ICE so it can be replaced with a new acronym-ed department that essentially has the same failings as the one we already have. Vision.

I'm largely agreeing with Erfalf on this one. 

ICE wasn't a thing before 2003.  I don't think anyone would argue that immigration and customs enforcement has been markedly improved since then, but neither has it markedly gone downhill. Yes, I get that most people do not like the Trump administration's recent policy changes, but that wasn't ICE taking a stand.  It was a policy directive and they should follow it unless and until Ordered not to by a Court (unless it given an obviously and shockingly illegal directive). Changing the name of the agency or putting it in a different box isn't a solution to any problems that people are pointing out. It's basically just a slogan.

But it is also strange to me that some on the right are so offended by the idea, like criticizing the government is un-American.  The next thing you know those crazy leftists are going to be appropriating Native American cultural garb and polluting Boston Harbor by tossing in the product of free enterprise.  Crazy hippies have no idea what it means to be a patriot.  Smiley



Also probably a good place to discuss the disparity between the American public's opinions and our government action on these issues:

67% oppose the policy of family separation.

79% think the Dreamers should remain and be able to apply for citizenship.

58% oppose building a border wall.

67% think illegal immigrants current in the country should be allowed to stay and eventually apply for citizenship (Republicans 48%, with another 9% saying they should stay but not be able to apply, and only 36% wanting to deport them all).

17% want legal immigration to the US to be cut back.

Quinnipiac University Poll, June 18, 2018. 
https://poll.qu.edu/images/polling/us/us06182018_uwsf18.pdf/
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