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October 20, 2018, 04:24:01 pm
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Author Topic: Terence Crutcher  (Read 32104 times)
Bamboo World
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« Reply #105 on: September 22, 2016, 03:12:09 pm »


There wasn't a class for him to leave.

The videos are from around 7:45pm.

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dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #106 on: September 22, 2016, 03:13:54 pm »

That seems reasonable to me.

What doesn't make sense is why Officer Shelby's camera wasn't activated.  Her light bar appeared to be flashing, which means the lights were toggled to 2 or 3, as explained in cannon_fodder's description.



Technology fails. In twenty years in the tech field I have had stuff fail out of the box, after first use, and then again had things run constantly for years and not fail. Equipment in police cars tend to have short life spans because it's in a harsh enviroment. Now if it's proven that it was tampered with that's a different issue.
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« Reply #107 on: September 22, 2016, 03:18:12 pm »

There wasn't a class for him to leave.

The videos are from around 7:45pm.

https://banweb.tulsacc.edu/PROD/bwckschd.p_disp_dyn_sched

Select fall, then select after 430 and fri sat and sun evening and tell me there was no class for him to be leaving. Sorry I would screenshot but there are far to many classes for that.
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Bamboo World
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« Reply #108 on: September 22, 2016, 03:59:50 pm »



https://banweb.tulsacc.edu/PROD/bwckschd.p_disp_dyn_sched

Select fall, then select after 430 and fri sat and sun evening and tell me there was no class for him to be leaving. Sorry I would screenshot but there are far to many classes for that.
 

Yes, there are many scheduled classes, but Mr. Crutcher's particular class was cancelled.  He didn't get the message beforehand according to TCC spokeswoman Nicole Burgin. 

A 5:30pm cancelled class would have "begun" and "ended" around 5:30pm.  The police dispatch about Mr. Crutcher's vehicle was around 7:36pm, or about two hours after Mr. Crutcher reportedly showed up for his cancelled class.

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Bamboo World
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« Reply #109 on: September 22, 2016, 04:09:08 pm »



Every official who has discussed it and every report I have heard on it says the same thing. Tulsa police emergency system has a three toggle system:

0 = off
1 = rear lights (direction lights)
2 = overhead lights and camera
3 = all lights, siren, and camera

She parked and put her car in #1.


Says who?  The helicopter video indicates #2 or #3, not #1.


Technology fails. In twenty years in the tech field I have had stuff fail out of the box, after first use, and then again had things run constantly for years and not fail. Equipment in police cars tend to have short life spans because it's in a harsh enviroment. Now if it's proven that it was tampered with that's a different issue.


I agree that technology fails sometimes.  What I'm doubting is the statement that Officer Shelby parked her vehicle and toggled on to #1.  That doesn't jibe with the helicopter video.  It was toggled to #2 or #3 in the helicopter video, or so it seems to me and to others on this forum.

« Last Edit: September 22, 2016, 07:23:13 pm by Bamboo World » Logged
dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #110 on: September 22, 2016, 04:19:25 pm »

Says who?  The helicopter video indicates #2 or #3, not #1.

I agree that technology fails sometimes.  What I'm doubting is the statement that Officer Shelby parked her vehicle and toggled on to #1.  That doesn't vibe with the helicopter video.  It was toggled to #2 or #3 in the helicopter video, or so it seems to me and others on the this forum.



Not disagreeing with that, just commenting on a possible equipment failure. We had similar technology failures in police cars at the municipality I worked for from the computer, radios, and cameras.
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #111 on: September 22, 2016, 04:32:07 pm »

I've been warned by 3 separate different people this afternoon that "riots" are expected at 71st and Hwy 169. All cited a third party who "heard it from the Police." Two mentioned the same church "being evacuated" ahead of time (even though that Church is well away from the supposed "riot" area).

Twitter has a few people talking about a protest at 169... they all heard it from someone, usually someone close to someone important. Blathering about stores closing early and hospitals calling in extra staff.

Sounds like people wanting there to be "excitement" with no actual issues going on. Hopefully it stays that way.
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« Reply #112 on: September 22, 2016, 04:57:33 pm »



Not disagreeing with that, just commenting on a possible equipment failure. We had similar technology failures in police cars at the municipality I worked for from the computer, radios, and cameras.
 

I'm not disagreeing with a possible equipment failure, but I'm seriously doubting that Officer Shelby parked her vehicle and toggled lights on to #1, as explained by cannon_fodder.  Four police videos indicate otherwise.

If equipment failure is the true reason that there's no video available from Betty Shelby's dashcam, then so be it.  We don't need a false explanation about how TPD's three toggle system "works" and why Betty Shelby's camera was not recording during the incident last Friday.

From The Frontier:
Quote

Shelby’s dash cam was not functioning during the shooting. Tulsa police vehicles work on a three toggle system — when the switch is flipped to “level one,” as Shelby’s car was that night, only the lights in the rear window are active and the siren and camera remain off.

At level two, the overhead lights and camera activate. At three, all lights are on, as are the camera and the siren.

“She had it on one, because it appeared she just thought she came up on a stalled car,” Public Information Officer Shane Tuell said. “You can hear it in her voice, she says, ‘I just came up on an abandoned car.’ ”


In my opinion, Public Information Officer Shane Tuell is incorrect.  Officer Shelby did not have her toggle switch flipped to "level one."  The helicopter video and the dash cam videos from Officers Turnbough's, Dunn's, and Roy's vehicles all indicate that Officer Shelby's toggle switch was flipped to level two or three.  That's how it appears to me in all four videos.

From the Tulsa World:
Quote

Shelby turned on her police car's rear flashing lights only when stopping to approach Crutcher, which meant her dash camera did not turn on, Sgt. Shane Tuell told reporters Monday.

Attorney Scott Wood, who has represented Shelby so far, said there are about two unrecorded minutes of interaction between Shelby and Crutcher.


  
« Last Edit: September 22, 2016, 06:54:24 pm by Bamboo World » Logged
Ed W
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« Reply #113 on: September 22, 2016, 07:28:29 pm »

I've been warned by 3 separate different people this afternoon that "riots" are expected at 71st and Hwy 169. All cited a third party who "heard it from the Police." Two mentioned the same church "being evacuated" ahead of time (even though that Church is well away from the supposed "riot" area).

Twitter has a few people talking about a protest at 169... they all heard it from someone, usually someone close to someone important. Blathering about stores closing early and hospitals calling in extra staff.

Sounds like people wanting there to be "excitement" with no actual issues going on. Hopefully it stays that way.

My son is an armed security officer. He was called to work early on the basis of this rumor. I'm  hoping he has a very quiet, even boring night.
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« Reply #114 on: September 22, 2016, 08:55:34 pm »

My son is an armed security officer. He was called to work early on the basis of this rumor. I'm  hoping he has a very quiet, even boring night.

I hope he gets paid for the extra time.
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davideinstein
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« Reply #115 on: September 22, 2016, 11:09:17 pm »

That charge seems to properly fit what happened.
Agreed.
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dioscorides
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« Reply #116 on: September 23, 2016, 08:52:44 am »

I've been warned by 3 separate different people this afternoon that "riots" are expected at 71st and Hwy 169. All cited a third party who "heard it from the Police." Two mentioned the same church "being evacuated" ahead of time (even though that Church is well away from the supposed "riot" area).

Twitter has a few people talking about a protest at 169... they all heard it from someone, usually someone close to someone important. Blathering about stores closing early and hospitals calling in extra staff.

Sounds like people wanting there to be "excitement" with no actual issues going on. Hopefully it stays that way.

Someone took those rumors and made something good out of it.  He is up to 105k views, as of right now.  Stuff like this makes me proud to be a Tulsan.
https://www.facebook.com/GeraldHurricaneHarris2/videos/903623119744404/?pnref=story
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« Reply #117 on: September 23, 2016, 01:11:55 pm »

Says who?  The helicopter video indicates #2 or #3, not #1.

I agree that technology fails sometimes.  What I'm doubting is the statement that Officer Shelby parked her vehicle and toggled on to #1.  That doesn't jibe with the helicopter video.  It was toggled to #2 or #3 in the helicopter video, or so it seems to me and to others on this forum.


It could very well have been an incredibly coincidental equipment failure, but there's ways to find out one way or another.
Being a homicide case, investigators would have secured and write-blocked the memory cards, then done a forensic file extraction to recover the buffered video. 

Like that time you got drunk on vacation and accidentally deleted half your photos, and had to shell out for recovery software. Yeah, that.

I havent heard any mention of this being done with Shelby's dashcam... not that they have to announce every step in the investigation, of course.
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Bamboo World
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« Reply #118 on: September 23, 2016, 01:39:38 pm »



... not that they have to announce every step in the investigation, of course.


No, TPD doesn't have to announce every step.

But to me, it sounds silly for their public information officer to explain toggle levels one, two, and three, then say that Betty Shelby set hers on level one (and therefore her camera was not functioning), and then for the department to release four different videos from four different vantage points, all which seem to indicate Shelby had toggled to level two, at a minimum, not to level one.

Maybe I'm missing something ... but TPD's explanation of why Shelby's dash cam wasn't recording makes no sense to me.

Also, the videos indicate other non-police vehicles nearby.  Perhaps there will be some witnesses willing to come forward who saw and/or heard what happened before Officer Turnbough arrived.
 
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« Reply #119 on: September 23, 2016, 01:52:02 pm »

I honestly don't know that the dash cam would make all that much difference in the end. Does anyone really think something on their is going to move this up a degree in charges? I know it seems to create a sense that the force is hiding something, but does anyone really think this cop just flipped and went targeting Mr. Crutcher? Seems pretty unlikely to me.

Similarly, the fact that Mr. Crutcher has a less than stellar record or may have been high as a kite really has little bearing as to whether Officer Shelby deserves to be convicted of Manslaughter or not.
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