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Author Topic: Terence Crutcher  (Read 15963 times)
davideinstein
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« on: September 18, 2016, 10:20:27 pm »

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/family-north-tulsa-leaders-view-fatal-shooting-video-pastor-expects/article_5b449b2b-d722-563e-b6db-1777a5d2d881.html

This can't happen in our city. Obviously, more details will emerge. But I will live in a city where a black man coming home from a class at TCC doesn't get shot dead when because his car breaks down. It's not negotiable.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2016, 08:57:52 am »

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/family-north-tulsa-leaders-view-fatal-shooting-video-pastor-expects/article_5b449b2b-d722-563e-b6db-1777a5d2d881.html

This can't happen in our city. Obviously, more details will emerge. But I will live in a city where a black man coming home from a class at TCC doesn't get shot dead when because his car breaks down. It's not negotiable.


Well, you better just pack up and get to moving right now...!  I hear Belgium is a nice place!

'Murica...love it or leave it!!



And yeah, you know I am kidding...


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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

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shavethewhales
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« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2016, 12:14:08 pm »

This story is nuts. It's the first one of these cases where I've thought a massive demonstration/riot would actually be in order. Other police shooting cases have had various obfuscating issues over whether or not there was any justification, but this is completely different. They literally just gunned this guy down because he was a big black guy and they were scared.

The thing is, I still doubt much will come of it... Maybe they'll get rid of that particular officer, but nothing will really change and it will happen again with someone else.

Also, I'm ashamed at how this is dragging out the racism in this town. So many older white people are jumping to find something wrong with this guy so they can justify his death. They can't handle the truth.
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2016, 12:43:02 pm »

Live news conference:

http://www.fox23.com/live-breaking


Life tweeting by The Frontier:

https://twitter.com/readfrontier
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2016, 12:56:13 pm »

This is going to be bad. Really bad.

The Mayor, the DA, the DOJ Councilor Henderson and the Chief of Police all basically asked people not to riot.

The news conference was professional. Can't comment on the facts because it might become a criminal investigation. Proper deference to the family.  Trust the system etc. Video will be out in ~30 minutes, family has already seen it. But again, the sentiment was strongly emphasized to trust the justice system, that protests will be tolerated, but basically... don't riot.

They also referred to the dead man as the "suspect." Which means the report, when it comes out, will likely to refer to the shooter as "the victim." Which is standard MO on the form but will certainly anger people. The only fact that was confirmed is that the dead man had no weapons on him or in the car.

None of this bodes well for the original official version of the story.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2016, 01:00:52 pm by cannon_fodder » Logged

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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2016, 01:34:17 pm »

Video one is out.

Shows a man with his hands up walking away from a female police officer who has a gun drawn on him. It appears he had walked over to her vehicle when she pulled up. Another police officer shows up, quickly followed by 2 more (as well as the helicopter). The man approaches the drivers side of his stalled vehicle, the female officer appears to jump back and shoot him. He falls to the ground, the officers take cover positions and back away... leaving the "suspect" on the ground as another police car pulls into frame.

Not good. No sudden movements. No indication that he was acting erratically or threatening.  It is a somewhat obstructed view, but this isnt going to calm things down.

http://www.tulsaworldtv.com/Graphic-Video-Tulsa-Police-officer-shoots-Terence-Crutcher-31411497?vcid=31411497&freewheel=91468&sitesection=tulsa

The video from the copter and from the shooter's dashboard might give more info. But it looks at the moment like the female officer got scared and when she flinched for some unknown reason she shot him.
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swake
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« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2016, 01:42:49 pm »

Video one is out.

Shows a man with his hands up walking away from a female police officer who has a gun drawn on him. It appears he had walked over to her vehicle when she pulled up. Another police officer shows up, quickly followed by 2 more (as well as the helicopter). The man approaches the drivers side of his stalled vehicle, the female officer appears to jump back and shoot him. He falls to the ground, the officers take cover positions and back away... leaving the "suspect" on the ground as another police car pulls into frame.

Not good. No sudden movements. No indication that he was acting erratically or threatening.  It is a somewhat obstructed view, but this isnt going to calm things down.

http://www.tulsaworldtv.com/Graphic-Video-Tulsa-Police-officer-shoots-Terence-Crutcher-31411497?vcid=31411497&freewheel=91468&sitesection=tulsa

The video from the copter and from the shooter's dashboard might give more info. But it looks at the moment like the female officer got scared and when she flinched for some unknown reason she shot him.

Why did she have her gun drawn in the first place? It was just a disabled car. He's got his hands up and is very calm and not threatening anyone. This is really bad. I hope the DA will bring charges quickly.
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CharlieSheen
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« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2016, 01:44:50 pm »

This doesn't make a difference.  I just wonder why a car stalls and ends up in the middle of both lanes. Odd.

Do we know why they showed up like he was a threat in the first place?  Just a call about a guy with his car in the middle of the road? Police shoot people so people get pissed off and attack the police.  Then when the police go out they are jumpy because officers are getting attacked.  This leads to more people getting accidentally shot which takes us back to the first part. Repeat 
« Last Edit: September 19, 2016, 01:47:06 pm by CharlieSheen » Logged
Conan71
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« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2016, 01:57:09 pm »

This is just crazy, it should have been a simple "motorist needs assistance” call.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2016, 02:31:58 pm »


Also, I'm ashamed at how this is dragging out the racism in this town. So many older white people are jumping to find something wrong with this guy so they can justify his death. They can't handle the truth.



Not entirely true - I'm an old white guy - mostly - and as far as I am concerned, after watching those videos, that is cold blooded murder!!  This isn't new, either.  I was also a young white guy and was enraged by TDP incidents in the deep dark past!


You are right about it happening again - the wheel just keeps on turning!  Is it comforting to know that not much has changed in 50+ years?



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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

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What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
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« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2016, 02:37:37 pm »

All the videos except the first officer on scene:

https://vimeo.com/183327146
(videos have since been removed)

People are already digging into the guys past, or what they say is this man's past under several variations on the spelling of Terrence/Terence/Terance Crutcher. But neither of the 911 callers reported a tag number so it wouldn't seem like the police would have known who the guy was anyway. Ergo, hard to say the police response was based on any knowledge of his history anyway, for better or for worse (be he a convict or a preacher, it seems they didn't know when he was shot).
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CharlieSheen
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« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2016, 02:42:15 pm »

All the videos except the first officer on scene:

https://vimeo.com/183327146
(videos have since been removed)

People are already digging into the guys past, or what they say is this man's past under several variations on the spelling of Terrence/Terence/Terance Crutcher. But neither of the 911 callers reported a tag number so it wouldn't seem like the police would have known who the guy was anyway. Ergo, hard to say the police response was based on any knowledge of his history anyway, for better or for worse (be he a convict or a preacher, it seems they didn't know when he was shot).

Yeah, everybody tries to link any police interaction in the past with it being ok to shoot you. Its pretty sickening
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cannon_fodder
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« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2016, 02:58:39 pm »

Not going to help either:

The guy in the helicopter, was very likely the shooter's husband. Not sure if he is the one giving commentary or not, hopefully he wasn't flying that day, but his job is as an observer for the copter. If her husband is the one giving the ill-advised commentary about how the guy looks, well, just another angle to the story.

Article saying they are husband and wife:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagelatest/officer-involved-in-crutcher-shooting-got-her-start-in-law/article_5a4ef13f-00ba-5249-b7d2-39a5f7af9b4e.html

Article on David serving as the spotter for the TPD copter:
http://www.newson6.com/story/28487399/news-on-6-views-pursuit-from-tulsa-police-helicopter

Not to belittle the death and aside from who's at fault, but what a really crappy day for David too. Sure, it's bad for his wife no matter what (and obviously beyond tragic for Crutcher's family), but at least it can be said she is the one that made the decision to pull the trigger. Even if David was the one who jumped to some conclusions and said thoughtless things on tape, he didn't pull the trigger and his life is messed up too... another person hurt in this situation. Just no winners here. Sucks all around.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2016, 03:11:56 pm »

Not going to help either:

The guy in the helicopter, was very likely the shooter's husband. Not sure if he is the one giving commentary or not, hopefully he wasn't flying that day, but his job is as an observer for the copter. If her husband is the one giving the ill-advised commentary about how the guy looks, well, just another angle to the story.

Article saying they are husband and wife:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagelatest/officer-involved-in-crutcher-shooting-got-her-start-in-law/article_5a4ef13f-00ba-5249-b7d2-39a5f7af9b4e.html

Article on David serving as the spotter for the TPD copter:
http://www.newson6.com/story/28487399/news-on-6-views-pursuit-from-tulsa-police-helicopter

Not to belittle the death and aside from who's at fault, but what a really crappy day for David too. Sure, it's bad for his wife no matter what (and obviously beyond tragic for Crutcher's family), but at least it can be said she is the one that made the decision to pull the trigger. Even if David was the one who jumped to some conclusions and said thoughtless things on tape, he didn't pull the trigger and his life is messed up too... another person hurt in this situation. Just no winners here. Sucks all around.


Yeah, I guess....but shows an attitude that would seem to be all too widespread throughout the department, so maybe the sentiment that lets him have those thoughts and express them so eloquently will shield him emotionally from the worst of it.  So, the level of his life being "messed up" is kinda relative.  He got a very mild indigestion compared to what the other family got/gets.  Plus they got to hear his pronouncements and judgement on their loved one!  Bonus!  It could get worse for him depending on what happens with his wife.  Maybe.


Yep.  I admit it - I am extremely jaded AND cynical !!  That is also called 'experienced'....



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“When you wage war on the public schools, you're attacking the mortar that holds the community together. You're not a conservative, you're a vandal.”    - Garrison Keillor

Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without.

What you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.
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« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2016, 03:24:00 pm »


Yeah, I guess....but shows an attitude that would seem to be all too widespread throughout the department, so maybe the sentiment that lets him have those thoughts and express them so eloquently will shield him emotionally from the worst of it.  So, the level of his life being "messed up" is kinda relative.  He got a very mild indigestion compared to what the other family got/gets.  Plus they got to hear his pronouncements and judgement on their loved one!  Bonus!  It could get worse for him depending on what happens with his wife.  Maybe.


Yep.  I admit it - I am extremely jaded AND cynical !!  That is also called 'experienced'....





From what I've read, they said he had a criminal record.  Carrying a concealed weapon....in 1996.  Twenty years ago.  He was 20.  Also, they made sure to note he had some traffic violations...some as recent as....wait for it...2005. Really?  Bring up traffic stops from 11 years ago.

SMFH.
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