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November 22, 2017, 03:24:46 am
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Author Topic: Cops with big guns at Promenade  (Read 8487 times)
DolfanBob
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« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2013, 08:16:20 am »

News Chopper 6 was there. Does that count?  Huh
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Conan71
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« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2013, 08:28:27 am »

putting innocent bystanders at risk?

So was the dude driving the Civic.  If he’s firing at the po-po, it would be nothing for him to run over or shoot a civilian.  Makes sense you’d want to get this clown off the streets as quick as possible.  Turns out he was kind enough to spare the taxpayers hundreds of thousands in future prosecution and incarceration costs.
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"It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first” -Ronald Reagan
patric
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« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2013, 09:20:51 am »

News Chopper 6 was there. Does that count?  Huh

There's got to be hours of dashcam video.
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"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
Gaspar
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« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2013, 11:13:36 am »

There's got to be hours of dashcam video.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhvURdKktV8[/youtube]
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BKDotCom
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« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2013, 02:04:41 pm »

I've found that taunting people form helicopters rarely makes them surrender. The only exclusion is if said helicopter was Airwolf, or if you're in a pinch, Blue Thunder.

I've found people are easier to catch if they don't know they're being followed. 
Back off, let the guy think he's out-maneuvered ya.
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nathanm
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« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2013, 02:59:20 pm »

So was the dude driving the Civic.  If he’s firing at the po-po, it would be nothing for him to run over or shoot a civilian.

According to the TW story posted yesterday, he wasn't shooting until after he fled from QT and they had already pursued for a mile or two.
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"Labor is prior to and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration" --Abraham Lincoln
sgrizzle
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« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2013, 07:02:22 pm »

Was something wrong with the helicopter, or do they just enjoy driving around town GTA style, putting innocent bystanders at risk?

Would you prefer the cops only chase people traveling under 55mph? Above that, and they're free to go?

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Vashta Nerada
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« Reply #22 on: December 05, 2013, 07:36:17 pm »

Was something wrong with the helicopter, or do they just enjoy driving around town GTA style, putting innocent bystanders at risk?



The police helicopter was sold to the taxpayers with the promise that it would end high-speed chases.
That and the fact that police chose the time and place to light the fuse of another deadly high-speed pursuit through rush-hour midtown, it's a legitimate question.
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nathanm
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« Reply #23 on: December 05, 2013, 10:46:46 pm »

Would you prefer the cops only chase people traveling under 55mph? Above that, and they're free to go?

Are you being intentionally obtuse or do you really not understand that there is a possible response between a high speed chase and letting people go? Perhaps following them in the chopper keeping ground units out of sight until the fleeing suspect stops/ditches the car/whatever and then apprehend them without putting everyone else on the road at risk. Again, the shooting didn't start until after the pursuit began.

If you're worried about them crawling into a drain, that's what the dogs are for.
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"Labor is prior to and independent of capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration" --Abraham Lincoln
patric
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« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2013, 12:10:18 am »

They were flying red south past 36th & Yale while I was waiting on 36th to turn north on Yale.  MC nearly got clobbered by a brown unmarked unit that turned west off Darlington onto 27th Pl, ostensibly trying to intercept at Yale.  She said even more units were flying west on 31st once she got to Hudson.

I suspect this was an all units call-out.  Must have been at least 30-40 units when I crossed Yale on I-44 30 minutes later.  Wild how many people just on here saw or heard the procession going by. 

Only two days before, another chase went like this:
"Getting up to a speed of about a hundred miles an hour here at 71st and Riverside," said Capt. Cathy Reynolds, of Tulsa Police.
The officer stopped chasing the car, due to the danger of pursuing the car in the middle of afternoon traffic.


Even TCSO is on record with something rational:
"What we do know in law enforcement, if they run you'll chase them, if you quit chasing them, they'll stop running. Sometimes you have to weigh your options on what's the best for public safety," said Maj. Shannon Clark.

So what was so different about this one that it ended up snowballing?
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"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
Conan71
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« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2013, 12:12:17 am »

Are you being intentionally obtuse or do you really not understand that there is a possible response between a high speed chase and letting people go? Perhaps following them in the chopper keeping ground units out of sight until the fleeing suspect stops/ditches the car/whatever and then apprehend them without putting everyone else on the road at risk. Again, the shooting didn't start until after the pursuit began.

If you're worried about them crawling into a drain, that's what the dogs are for.

Of course your superior logic over-rides that of people trained in law enforcement.  I'm pretty sure TPD policy has been derived from years of failed and successful pursuits.  Ostensibly, this was a successful operation. 
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dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2013, 01:22:40 am »

News Chopper 6 was there. Does that count?  Huh

Yeah, let the news choppers do the air chase......

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTIijI32vA0[/youtube]
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dbacksfan 2.0
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« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2013, 01:32:16 am »

True that sometimes backing off and letting the helicopter follow will result in an arrest without incident. But sometimes, and from I read about this piece of work was on Tulsa's most wanted list, and you can wind up with this instead of a shoot out where the baddy takes his own life.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xyio0bv6Qp8[/youtube]
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patric
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« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2013, 02:26:54 am »

Turns out he was kind enough to spare the taxpayers hundreds of thousands in future prosecution and incarceration costs.

Only to cost the taxpayers hundreds of thousands in future lawsuits and wrongful death settlements.
But I only know what I read:
http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/law-enforcement-bulletin/march-2010/evidence-based-decisions-on-police-pursuits
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"Tulsa will lay off police and firemen before we will cut back on unnecessarily wasteful streetlights."  -- March 18, 2009 TulsaNow Forum
MyDogHunts
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« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2013, 04:59:06 am »

Only to cost the taxpayers hundreds of thousands in future lawsuits and wrongful death settlements.
But I only know what I read:
http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/law-enforcement-bulletin/march-2010/evidence-based-decisions-on-police-pursuits
This article states:
".../one person dies every day as a result of a police pursuit. On average, from 1994 through 1998, one law enforcement officer was killed every 11 weeks in a pursuit, and 1 percent of all U.S. law enforcement officers who died in the line of duty lost their lives in vehicle pursuits. Innocent third parties who just happened to be in the way constitute 42 percent of persons killed or injured in police pursuits. Further, 1 out of every 100 high-speed pursuits results in a fatality."

The future is all autos will have a kill switch that can be activated by cops?  Orwell was right?  Or, there is no solution?  How do you feel about an eye for an eye?  If you run from the cops and kill a kid; can we put you under?  I say yes.
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Left OK over 40-yrs. ago with Williams Bro. Passing through 4-yrs. ago I saw downtown's potential. I've lived in 200 places & love good citiies.  Tulsa's phoenix rise is reason enough to stick around.  Besides,myou can't fully be an Okie except in Oklahoma.
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