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November 21, 2017, 11:26:25 am
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Author Topic: Keystone XL Pipeline  (Read 22874 times)
patric
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« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2012, 01:36:19 pm »

The reason the pipeline goes all the way to the gulf coast is so they can sell the refined product overseas. If America was going to get the product, the pipeline would go as far as a midwest refinery.

I don't understand why we want this. A Canadian company wants to build a pipeline across America so it can sell gasoline to Asia. All we get are the assembly jobs and the risk of a spill.

Perhaps the same thinking involved with Tulsa refining gasoline to be sold out-of-state, that we cant even use ourselves. 
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Townsend
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« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2012, 01:43:11 pm »

The reason the pipeline goes all the way to the gulf coast is so they can sell the refined product overseas. If America was going to get the product, the pipeline would go as far as a midwest refinery.

I don't understand why we want this. A Canadian company wants to build a pipeline across America so it can sell gasoline to Asia. All we get are the assembly jobs and the risk of a spill.

I wondered that too.

Interesting spin from their lobbyists making the Muricans believe it'll lower our costs instead of increase them by removing the glut in Cushing.
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Jammie
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« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2012, 03:53:42 pm »

No lie. Across the entire country, there were 603 pipeline leaks last year, resulting in 17 fatalities, 70 injuries, almost $326 million in damage, and the net release of 114,195 barrels of hazardous liquids. (around 25,000 barrels were cleaned up after spills)

http://primis.phmsa.dot.gov/comm/reports/safety/AllPSI.html

Interesting topic and those stats make me happy that we didn't just go into this so fast. As far as the aquifer, I had no idea that it covered that much area.

No idea how legit this site is, but it pretty much falls in line with the others that say the only purpose of the XL is to get it to a huge port to ship overseas.

http://www.tarsandsaction.org/spread-the-word/key-facts-keystone-xl/
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Conan71
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« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2012, 04:00:50 pm »


I would like to see DOT put some new regulations in place - poison to many - that would require pipeline operators to do timely inspections and maintenance and replacement of old pipes.  In addition to the $326 million nathanm mentioned, there has to be some cost associated with the 17 deaths and the 70 injuries above and beyond that.  The old "value of human life" discussion...


Isn't that how TD Williamson makes a lot, if not all, their money, doing timely inspections on pipelines with their pigs?

Think of how many died or were injured by tanker trucks and train derailments as well.  Moving hazardous materials is a, well, hazardous business.
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heironymouspasparagus
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« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2012, 06:50:26 pm »

Isn't that how TD Williamson makes a lot, if not all, their money, doing timely inspections on pipelines with their pigs?

Think of how many died or were injured by tanker trucks and train derailments as well.  Moving hazardous materials is a, well, hazardous business.

Yes, they do.  As well as quite a few other items related to pipeline service (Hot tapping and stopple - check out their website).  And they do it well, too.

The problem is that one of the predominant attitudes of pipeline operator/owners is kind of a don't ask, don't tell approach.  Many pipelines are unable to have pigs run, so they miss the whole cleaning/inspection cycle.  As a due diligence thing, if they can't pig a line, then they can't be held "as" responsible when it catastrophically fails, since they didn't know it was about to rip open.  So, when there are tight bends that cannot be traversed, instead of installing large sweeping curves in the pipe, do nothing.

Changes are and have been happening - pipelines are being upgraded.  Just on a schedule that lets those accidents keep happening.





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we vs us
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« Reply #20 on: March 07, 2012, 11:05:08 am »

Transcanada has a revised pipeline path ready to submit.  It reportedly bypasses the aquifer altogether.  My bet is that it gets approved ASAP.

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/TransCanada+seek+approval+Keystone+route/6259130/story.html
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Teatownclown
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« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2012, 11:38:37 am »

The oil biness is fraught with criminals...

can't wait to see the Rolling Stone article due out this month on gasland's Harold Hill.
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Gaspar
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« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2012, 10:06:02 am »

Bill to expedite approval for the Keystone pipeline failed again yesterday but the margins were slimmer coming short by only 4 votes to pass.

I think this effort is pointless until after the election.  The president is not going to sign the STOCK Act, he's not going to take any actions that might be deemed as bold, controversial, or involve any degree of leadership until after he is re-elected.  Heck, he's willing to give perhaps billions of dollars to Isreal in the form of planes, bombs and technology if they will just promise to wait until after the election to smoke Iran.

This president is the whole package. . .99% politician, 1% leader.

LOL!  According to MSNBC the actual pipeline was defeated!
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AquaMan
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« Reply #23 on: March 09, 2012, 10:14:51 am »

You ever get dizzy in the spin zone?

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Townsend
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« Reply #24 on: March 09, 2012, 10:16:34 am »

Bill to expedite approval for the Keystone pipeline failed again yesterday but the margins were slimmer coming short by only 4 votes to pass.

I think this effort is pointless until after the election.  The president is not going to sign the STOCK Act, he's not going to take any actions that might be deemed as bold, controversial, or involve any degree of leadership until after he is re-elected.  Heck, he's willing to give perhaps billions of dollars to Isreal in the form of planes, bombs and technology if they will just promise to wait until after the election to smoke Iran.

This president is the whole package. . .99% politician, 1% leader.

LOL!  According to MSNBC the actual pipeline was defeated!

Ah, got your morning Fox fix.

Here's some more about how you can't blame the president about these sorts of things.

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/06/10591314-covering-gas-prices-in-2008

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UzEnKdBAb_o&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]

Quote
In the early summer of 2008, when the average price of a gallon of gas in the U.S. topped $4, a wide variety of Fox News figures were quick to push a simple message: don't blame the Bush/Cheney administration.

Indeed, Fox News was rather explicit on the issue, telling its viewers, "[N]o president has the power to increase or to lower gas prices."

For the record, I think Fox News was entirely right -- at the time. Though the network has shifted gears, and has somehow reached the conclusion that President Obama can singlehandedly affect gas prices, Fox News' 2008 position was the correct one.

I'd just add, as an aside, that long-time readers may recall that I gave Bush/Cheney some grief about this at the time, but the details and context matter. I never said the Republican White House had the power to lower gas prices, but I did argue that Bush was wrong to promise, as a candidate, that he could reduce the cost of gas by "jawboning" countries in the Middle East.

My beef was with candidate Bush making promises in 2000 he knew he couldn't keep, not President Bush's inability to snap his fingers and lower prices
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Hoss
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« Reply #25 on: March 09, 2012, 10:34:51 am »

Watch out townie. Gas may start following you around blowing 'rasberries' at you.
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AquaMan
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« Reply #26 on: March 09, 2012, 10:50:30 am »

You ever get dizzy in the spin zone?



You piqued my interest. Here are just some reasons why Obama made some calls about the pipeline. I'm sure you know there were good reasons and just neglected to tell the whole story.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/09/senate-rejects-gop-proposals_n_1334409.html

Boehner and friends were wanting to "fastrack" the legislation by ignoring environmental problems that the administration has had and decided to change lots of other stuff in the transportation bill like eliminating mass transit funding. But you missed all that cause Fox and Friends neglected to mention it?
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Townsend
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« Reply #27 on: March 09, 2012, 11:04:40 am »

You piqued my interest. Here are just some reasons why Obama made some calls about the pipeline. I'm sure you know there were good reasons and just neglected to tell the whole story.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/09/senate-rejects-gop-proposals_n_1334409.html

Boehner and friends were wanting to "fastrack" the legislation by ignoring environmental problems that the administration has had and decided to change lots of other stuff in the transportation bill like eliminating mass transit funding. But you missed all that cause Fox and Friends neglected to mention it?

Man, they suck.

I should add that I think almost all of them suck.  Don't trust them to do anything for anyone but themselves.

Equal opportunity suckage.
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we vs us
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« Reply #28 on: March 09, 2012, 01:38:23 pm »

Wow, Gassy, you want to talk politics?  Fast tracking anything of this nature -- ie with the potential to be a major environmental hazard -- is ridiculous.  Do the due diligence.  It's important.  The Republicans would be up in arms if we tried to force a private business to make a decision on the fast track.  Not just because it would be meddling, because being prudent about risk is not only smart business, it's essential business.  So:  look at this period as the business of government deciding how and when to go forward with a risky venture. 

Or would you rather the government -- who is essentially selling our nation's resources to a multinational out of Canada -- just throw it at them without a second thought?
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Hoss
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« Reply #29 on: March 09, 2012, 01:50:11 pm »

Wow, Gassy, you want to talk politics?  Fast tracking anything of this nature -- ie with the potential to be a major environmental hazard -- is ridiculous.  Do the due diligence.  It's important.  The Republicans would be up in arms if we tried to force a private business to make a decision on the fast track.  Not just because it would be meddling, because being prudent about risk is not only smart business, it's essential business.  So:  look at this period as the business of government deciding how and when to go forward with a risky venture. 

Or would you rather the government -- who is essentially selling our nation's resources to a multinational out of Canada -- just throw it at them without a second thought?

ruh roh..now you've done it.  Common sense.
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Libertarianism is a system of beliefs for people who think adolescence is the epitome of human achievement.

Global warming isn't real because it was cold today.  Also great news: world famine is over because I just ate - Stephen Colbert.

Somebody find Guido an ambulance to chase...
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