The Tulsa Forum by TulsaNow

Location(s) Being Reviewed:Brookside (33rd & Peoria)
Date/Time of Visit: Sunday, February 22nd ~ 7:00 pm
Quality of Food (1-5):5

Meal for my wife and I consisted of "The Classic" and a "Big Daddy" as well as fries & Fried Pickles. Burgers were both delicious with excellent mixtures of meat and cooked perfectly. Fried pickles (and pickles in general) were excellent except batter got soggy quickly. Sauce was good also. Fries suffered the same soggy fate as the pickles. Hopefully it was the understudy filling in for the fry man.

Menu/Food Options (1-5):3

There are a fair amount of burger choices although it seemed several were so similar that it didn't warrant another spot on the menu. That, and who in their right might puts ketchup on a hamburger (outside of Burger King). While I did not drink it did appear that they captured most of the popular brews on the menu however.

Quality of Service (1-5):3

Servers were very attentive, but seemed inexperienced (cooks that weren't busy or something) and also like they were trying to hard to make conversation, which just made us somewhat uncomfortable.

Atmosphere (1-5):5

Very nice restaurant. I believe it used to be the Wolfgang Puck restaurant, which I never went to but I assume would be nice. All glass gives excellent views of the heart of Brookside. Awesome looking bar. TV's with sports to be expected. It looks like a serious investment was made in the place.

Overall Rating (1-5):4

I had reserved expectations as I had read some negative reviews. Although most negativity was focused on the cost, which arguably is quit high. My opinion of the pinnacle of this category of restaurant is Twisted Root, based out of Dallas, and this in no way comes close to that in nearly every aspect. That being said, it is quit good, although my wife tells me she though Five Guys was easily as good of quality for burgers.

Price ($-$$$$$):$$$

Quite pricey, burgers ranged from $9-$11 with no sides. Twisted Root's for comparison range from $7-$9. I'm sure the alcohol would have really bolstered the bill. Total damage for us was nearly $40 after tax/tip, and we both drank water.

What makes this restaurant unique:

Seems to be a high class Smashburger. However, for the price it better be.

Tell us about your experience:

I hope it lasts, I enjoyed what I ate. It was not busy at all, of course it was Sunday night and nasty weather, so maybe that is par for the course. Brookside in general looked pretty deserted, which I didn't think to much of given the bitter cold wind.

No pictures of my own. Peruse the internet if you care to see it.

They are not a very friendly bunch.....To some of their fine neighbors on Brookside....I wont darken this joints door.....

I care neither for Five Guys nor Smashburger, so the bar is pretty low on your comparisons.

I've never been to either.  Is rumor true that Smashburger is the place to go if you like a little food with your salt?
 
 ;D

I went about six months ago, and I didn't notice it being real salty, although I've heard people say they toned it down a little.  I was underwhelmed actually.  I like Fat Guys and any number of the pre-requisite old style burger joints in town (Ron's, Freddie's, Hank's, etc).

I've not been to hopbunz, but Smashburger spares no salt.

Saltburger is not edible.

My horse likes to lick the patties.

That's another one of those places I've been to once, and have no desire to go back.

12 of us went last night.
Service was great. Price was about right for what it was, IMO.

For my tab we had:
3 Cheeseburgers, 1 Caliente, 3 fries, 1 OR, 1 chips and queso, and 6 beers for $100.
Food was outstanding.


The only thing I was surprised about was them not asking how you wanted the burger cooked. They all came out medium/medium well. Mine was more medium so I was happy.

HopBunz is now closed.  Wonder what will replace it?

Saw where Yolotti Frozen Yogurt is also closing Sep 30.

Overpriced burgers and craft beer, it’s ubiquitous.  Apparently they did it worse than everyone else.  That location is starting to get a black eye.  Anyone else have any ideas what’s going on there? 

The rent is overpriced on Brookside.

Not that I am incredibly disappointed about this one in particular, but am I off base on my thinking that it seems restaurant turnover is higher in Brookside than Downtown or Cherry Street? Is rent that much higher? Are there other reasons?

Also, don't they have another location? South Memorial I'm thinking. I can't remember, I just recall thinking I didn't realize they had another location as I drove by in south Tulsa somewhere. If so, is that one still open.

I didn't think they were terrible, just overpriced for what it was. There are competitors doing it better than they were.

http://hopbunz.com/find-us/

The Bixby location closed in Nov
http://www.tulsaworld.com/blogs/scene/restaurants/table-talk-hopbunz-crafted-burgers-beer-closes-southside-location/article_a763c37b-7e40-5e57-9e97-27f58087fa97.html

Ah what? Maybe an unpopular opinion, but I loved Hop Bunz and ate there every time I was in Brookside.

I'm about to give up on that district now...

Conan and erfalf both basically summed it up.  Overpriced burgers and beer is definitely not unique and they were fine, but nothing special.   I ate there twice and it was pretty good, but overpriced for what it was.  Never went back, and apparently neither did a lot of other people.

If you liked it, then you liked it... doesn't matter how anyone else feels about it....


I like Bill's and Lot-A-Burger.  Many others seem to agree, since both are still there....some don't and that's ok, too.

Hell, even the Lot-a-Burger on North Mingo is still there despite looking like a ghost town every time I drive past it.

Usually go to the 43rd and Mingo one.  Or west 23rd if in that area.  Usually in evening or Saturdays.  Had the occasion to go at noon on a Thursday a couple weeks ago and the place was really busy!  Definitely a 'lunch crowd' kind of place.

The only thing I can  think of that might keep that place open is brisk business from AA workers.  That's still a bit of a drive though.

Rent is cheap in Downtown, moderately priced on Cherry Street and way overpriced on Brookside.

Could just be the money laundering activity going on... no telling...

Brookside is pretty stable, IMO.  Leon’s only left as they were made a pretty good offer to leave, or I believe that was the circumstance.  BBD has been in their spot for at lest 20-25 years, In The Raw for at least 15, Keo for 5+, The Brook for 15-20, Senior Tequila’s for 10+, Sonoma for close to 10, Doc’s for 3-5, R-Bar for at least 3-4 years and Cafe Ole goes back nearly 30 years, I think.  Only the space with Hop Bunz and the strip to the north of where Hop Bunz was are the only ones with somewhat regular turn-over.

Also Cosmo Café has done well next door.

I don't get how Cosmo does well, consistently mediocre food and poor service. I love Laffa, but Cosmo is just bad. My daughter drags me there constantly, maybe I'm too old to get Cosmo.

We have had different experiences. I've been there at least 40 times and only once have I had to send something back - mainly because I didn't like it/it was not what I expected. I think it's consistently good food and service.

Leon's wasn't making what they used to make. Miss that place.

Add to that Ida Red started up in 2008, right at the start of the recession, and has stayed open. Blue Moon Cafe has been there a long time. We notice the new stuff opening and closing because it is news and (like the previous occupant of HopBunz), it has great visibility at that spot.

It is tough to thrive with such high rent (translates to high prices). The food wasn't bad there. It was tasty, but it just wasn't good value and in my opinion, and apparently many others', it wasn't worth the price. Especially for a place that felt like a Dave'n'Busters or some other chain.

We went there and for 2 burgers, 1 cheese fry and 2 beers, it was around $50. We can get the same at just about any joint in Tulsa for $25-$35 (plus usually fries are included with a $10+ burger, example of bad value there). There weren't that many beers for having a name based on beer and the burgers weren't that creative or distinguished. I expected them to close up eventually.

Fat Guyz is an example of great-priced distinguished burgers with tons of options you can't really get elsewhere. It is downtown so maybe they have a much better deal on rent to help with that plus a much smaller space to make those tough early years more affordable (and they recently expanded). They've had Burn Co burgers and always have interesting specials. I think they have more beer options than Hop Bunz (maybe not on as many on tap, but more in cans/bottles).

You distilled that perfectly.

Burgers and craft beer are ubiquitous in Tulsa these days.  You really have to set yourself apart like Fat Guys with unique burger or sauce offerings, or truly offer a great list of craft beer like McNellie’s or Roosevelt’s.  A $10 burger better be made with a really great cut of beef or something different like a beef and sausage patty.  Your “craft” beer list better have more than Land Shart, Shock Top or Sam Adams to woo me.

Ain't no such thing as a $10 burger.  They are all $5 burgers with stupid price tag...

20 years ago the grill in the Brown Palace Hotel in Denver served a $10 burger made from ground prime rib.  I guarantee it was worth every last penny.

OUCH!  What beers did you have?

I thought a few times about trying the Hop Bunz down here near 111th & Memorial.  I'm glad I didn't get around to it.

Ming's has also closed.   :(

Anybody know how Bricktown Brewery is doing?

Maybe it was just the night she and some friends were down there, but my wife was saying the last time they went to Brookside she didn't feel safe. It was a Saturday night and there were three other girl's she went with. They started at R Bar for dinner and drinks and then intended to walk around hitting some of the other bars. Said they went into the Brook and it was "full of shady characters." They stayed for one drink and then while walking elsewhere were accosted buy someone wanting them to give him $20 and who was quite aggressive about it.

The ended up leaving Brookside and going downtown.

I haven't been on Brookside in ages. Is it really falling on that hard of times?

That's Denver.  Not Oklahoma....


I do that - grind prime rib - fairly often - using rib-eye and chuck.  The rib-eye doesn't have enough fat, so get a whole bone-in chuck to mix (contaminate??) a little and gets a very nice product!!  If I wasn't so lazy, I would try to get some beef fat or leaf lard from a meat shop to use but the chuck works well.  Double grind most of the time, but a single grind brings good things to the table, too!! 

I would be more willing to pay $10 if it tasted like what I make...  Otherwise, $5.



There was an OLD (1880's) hotel in Longmont, CO, I used to visit from time to time decades ago.  They had a restaurant with menu or buffet.  The buffet was the most amazing think I had ever seen since the Grand Canyon!!   And not like any buffet, let alone hotel food!   They had real cooks as opposed to can opener's and microwave jockeys!  I think it was in the Imperial Hotel, but cannot remember for sure.... If time travel were possible, you can keep your dinosaurs or meeting famous people - I'm going to that buffet first!!

Break down the raw material costs of the burger, add in labor + overhead, then the barest of profits for the owner.

Will have to do that.  Have analyzed some other food items that I sell from time to time and the margins are adequate for me.  Smoked turkey legs are a "favorite" that I would like to get into - each leg, already smoked is about $1 ready to go.  Selling at the Fair for $6 or 7...?  Nice!  My overhead cost structure would make it a "happy dance" event.  Just too many of them around, so can't do that.


Ron's.  Bill's.  Lot-A-Burger.  They at least appear to be doing ok with a $5 burger (or less).  And better than the "boutique" burger places....

We had 2 burgers, 1 specialty (about $13) and 1 cheeseburger (~$9) I believe. Cheese fries were $7. Beers were local craft beers (Marshall and Dead Armadillo) and were $6 and $7 each which is just way too much for local craft beer when most everyone else is selling those for $4-5. That comes out to ~$46 with tax and after tip was over $50. I was shocked... Well I guess that is what a $25 a person meal is!

We tried Bricktown Brewery and loved it! We were "regulars" at the original for years when we would be in OKC. It used to be decent but not great but we just liked going to a brewpub for the novelty. The food is drastically better than it used to be! They have some interesting combinations. We got Chicken and Waffles, wings and meat loaf. All were good. Wings are big with lots of sauce. The chicken and waffles were tasty with well make chicken.

The beer is still mostly not great, but the stout is really good and they are all drinkable and reasonably priced.

Basically, food cost needs to be about 33% of your retail price to make a decent profit.

Whew!  Or less.... I watch that Bar Rescue show and the bar guy keeps harping about 20%...I don't run a restaurant, so don't know, but I would be upset if my little "goat-rope" adventure had food costs anywhere near 33% !!  But I don't have much volume either, so that could make the difference.

That would mean you either have to use pure crap for ingredients or over-charge your customer.  Either one is a bad recipe for success.

From my time in restaurant management many, many years ago food cost of 20% to 25% as a percentage of revenue overall is where you want to be, food cost of any menu item vs menu price of 33% to 40% is correct too. Drinks, with and without liquor bring down the food cost as a percentage of revenue.

There has always been a fair amount of turnover on Brookside, especially bars and restaurants.  It's had to change into more of a retail district with all of the new bars and restaurants downtown.  The same goes for Cherry Street.  Downtown should naturally be the center of nightlife with the other districts secondary.

Depending on the night there can definitely be some shadier types in bars like Sharkey's and Another Round; haven't noticed them in the Brook but I also haven't been there in awhile.  I really like Brookside and want to see restaurants do well there, and want to see it further develop as a pedestrian-oriented area further south outside the "core" between 33rd and 35th.  I am excited for future Crow Creek connection to the river and Gathering Place.  Neighborhoods on both sides are doing well and have the highest concentration of new infill in midtown.  So there is a lot of upside and I certainly don't think it's falling on hard times but rather just changing.

I still miss Ciao and will miss Ming'S.  HopBunz not so much.

Soft drinks are what I would choose to sell exclusively if I didn't need food to bring the sale in the first place!  There is no better profit generator I can see in my little tunnel vision world than a fountain machine!  Well, except maybe the equipment to make "Sonic Ice" for sale!! 

Iced Tea is even better

Yeah....just can't sell as much of that...!!

Coke runs about $3.00 a gallon mixed retail (Sam's Club) - 50 cents for about a 32 oz foam cup.  Iced tea is about 50 cents or so....

Non-liquor establishment should run 22-25% these days. Labor is where the expense is more challenging.

I'm currently buying stock in Brookside. Gathering Place, better traffic options, etc. bode well long term. Short term will struggle though. Retail is down for various reasons.

Also demographics are favorable especially if the neighborhoods west of Peoria continue to revitalize like they have been for 10+ years east of Peoria, and that spreads south of 41st toward I-44..

Too bad TheArtist ran off D.E.....

Non substantive post to revive ea long dead thread. 

Locked.