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Not At My Table - Political Discussions => National & International Politics => Topic started by: Vashta Nerada on January 24, 2015, 06:54:35 pm



Title: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on January 24, 2015, 06:54:35 pm
One afternoon in August 2012, Mandrel Stuart was driving with his girlfriend into Washington, D.C., when a Fairfax County cop pulled him over on Interstate 66, ostensibly because the windows of his SUV were too dark. Lacking the device necessary to check whether the tinting of the windows exceeded the legal limit, Officer Kevin Palizzi instead cited Stuart for having a video running within his line of sight. While Palizzi was filling out the summons, another officer arrived with a drug-detecting dog. Claiming the dog alerted to the left front bumper and wheel of Stuart’s GMC Yukon, the cops searched the car and found $17,550 in cash, which they kept, assuming that it must be related to the illegal drug trade.

Stuart, who had planned to use that money to buy equipment and supplies for his barbecue restaurant in Staunton, Virginia, was astonished that a routine traffic stop could so easily turn into grand theft. But as Washington Post reporters Michael Sallah, Robert O’Harrow Jr., and Steven Rich explain in a revealing and troubling series of stories that ran this week, taking Stuart’s hard-earned money was perfectly legal, thanks to civil forfeiture laws that turn cops into highway robbers.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/jacobsullum/2014/09/11/how-cops-got-a-license-to-steal-your-money







Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: guido911 on January 24, 2015, 07:58:17 pm
I use heavy cream in my mashed potatoes instead of milk. Big difference.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on May 11, 2015, 06:48:42 pm
County Sheriff Attacks Civil Asset Forfeiture Reform Bill

Canadian County Sheriff Randall Edwards says an attempt to stop the seizure of personal property by law enforcement even though the property’s owner is not charged with a crime is counterproductive and “asinine.”

In an email, Edwards attacks Senator Kyle Loveless and the reform bill he has introduced, the “Personal Asset Protection Act,” that will be studied in the interim.

Edwards claims drug interdiction programs will collapse if the bill becomes law.

Wrote Edwards in defense of the highly-criticized practice of civil asset forfeiture:

“Senator Kyle Loveless has authored a bill that will deregulate drug cartel traffic throughout our state. The bill takes all the drug monies and  proceeds from asset forfeitures away from local law enforcement, who make the majority of the seizures, and gives it to the state.

“This is without a doubt the single worst, most damning, most asinine and devastating bill I have ever seen for this State and local law enforcement.

This bill, if passed, will set the war on drugs back twenty years and will literally shut down the drug interdiction in this state, allowing drug traffic to run with 10 to 15 percent regulation, compared to the total state and local drug interdiction units now working interdiction in the state.

“Although the bill allows the state to continue to keep its share of the funds, it forces the local agencies to turn over its proceeds to the state. 

Local agencies will no longer be able to afford to work drug interdiction as a result of this bill.

“The State has not paid a penny of my Drug Interdiction program, I don’t know why they or anyone else in their right mind would think the state would be entitled to my agencies (sic) proceeds from it. The proceeds Kyle Loveless is proposing to take fund close to half of my cash funds, funds that support all my public safety programs, ranging from investigating on-line child sexual predators, to supporting nine K-9 Units and four full time drug interdiction units. These drug funds also account for a large part of my agency’s equipment, cars, radars, cameras and a multitude of other public safety equipment that Sheriffs will no longer will be able to buy, as well as jobs paid for and funded through these cash funds.

“Words can’t adequately express how this bill poses a serious and imminent threat to public safety and most directly the war on drugs in this state and nation. It’s completely asinine.”


http://mccarvillereport.com/archives/29222


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Hoss on May 12, 2015, 12:10:28 am
Once again, this guy is on it.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kEpZWGgJks[/youtube]


Title: Re:
Post by: Ed W on May 12, 2015, 07:05:50 am
Do I understand this right? He's arguing that he can take someone's property even if the person isn’t convicted. Does that mean the property committed a crime?


Title: Re:
Post by: dbacksfan 2.0 on May 12, 2015, 07:51:41 am
Do I understand this right? He's arguing that he can take someone's property even if the person isn’t convicted. Does that mean the property committed a crime?

Correct. They don't even have to arrest you. All they need is reasonable suspicion that it's involved in criminal activity. No arrest, no warrant, no trial.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: dbacksfan 2.0 on May 12, 2015, 08:23:08 am
https://www.ij.org/foreword-2 (https://www.ij.org/foreword-2)


Title: Re:
Post by: patric on May 12, 2015, 10:02:32 am
Correct. They don't even have to arrest you. All they need is reasonable suspicion that it's involved in criminal activity. No arrest, no warrant, no trial.

Some bizarre circular logic at work here.
Courts have ruled that probable cause exists to search something when a police dog "alerts" its handler.
Handlers get police dogs to "alert" through voice and hand cues,
essentially inventing the probable cause they need to conduct a search.

Because some of the dogs training involves funding drugs,
any money that the dog finds is considered by police to be "drug money"
and "drug money" is guilty of a crime by its mere existence,
so the police can pocket it without due process.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: dbacksfan 2.0 on May 12, 2015, 11:00:56 am
Yes, and a routine traffic stop, goes from a ticeket to "Before I let you go, may I search your car? You can say no and I will detain you while I get a canine here because I believe you have drugs in the car. Or you can say yes and I will detain you while I get a canine here. You're not under arrest, but by me citing you for a tail light out that gives me the right to detain you while I search all of your belongings in the car and the car as well. Do I have your permission to search your car?"


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on May 12, 2015, 01:29:15 pm

"This bill, if passed, will set the war on drugs back twenty years and will literally shut down the drug interdiction in this state, allowing drug traffic to run with 10 to 15 percent regulation, compared to the total state and local drug interdiction units now working interdiction in the state."

"The State has not paid a penny of my Drug Interdiction program, I don’t know why they or anyone else in their right mind would think the state would be entitled to my agencies (sic) proceeds from it. The proceeds Kyle Loveless is proposing to take fund close to half of my cash funds, funds that support all my public safety programs, ranging from investigating on-line child sexual predators, to supporting nine K-9 Units and four full time drug interdiction units. These drug funds also account for a large part of my agency’s equipment, cars, radars, cameras and a multitude of other public safety equipment that Sheriffs will no longer will be able to buy, as well as jobs paid for and funded through these cash funds."

That sheriff couldnt have done a better job of showing how corrupt the "War On Drugs" really is, except maybe:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/05/11/how-the-dea-took-a-young-mans-life-savings-without-ever-charging-him-of-a-crime

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/05/07/dea-asset-forfeiture-joseph-rivers_n_7231744.html


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on May 12, 2015, 09:26:52 pm
Been going on a long time.  Similar to the falsely labeled "Patriot Act".



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on May 12, 2015, 10:33:34 pm
Oh forgot one:

http://www.fox23.com/videos/news/new-law-may-change-what-happens-to-seized-drug/vDSC5r/

Its ironic that a law intended to take away the incentive to act criminally, itself needs another law to take away the incentive to criminally exploit it.


Title: Re:
Post by: Vashta Nerada on May 30, 2015, 05:33:16 pm
Do I understand this right? He's arguing that he can take someone's property even if the person isn’t convicted. Does that mean the property committed a crime?



Vehicle forfeiture efforts could be lucrative, but difficult in Twin Peaks shooting

As if they weren’t busy enough pursuing charges against some 170 suspects in the deadly Twin Peaks shooting, local criminal justice officials also face the question of what to do with their belongings.

Waco police have impounded about 135 motorcycles and 80 cars and trucks from the parking lot where nine people were shot dead on May 17. Police have said the vehicles were needed for evidence.

It’s possible some of the vehicles could be declared illegal contraband associated with a crime, and ownership transferred to the county through a process known as civil forfeiture. The collective value of the vehicles likely exceeds $1 million, assuming typical vehicle values.

As of Friday afternoon, McLennan County District Attorney Abel Reyna had not filed any civil forfeiture notices with the McLennan County district clerk. But Reyna is known for aggressive pursuit of civil forfeiture, and defense attorneys are watching his moves in this case where so much property is at stake and so many owners are in jail.

Some 170 people remain in the McLennan County Jail, each on $1 million bond, on charges of engaging in organized criminal activity in the Twin Peaks shooting. But, the arrest warrant affidavits are practically identical and don’t point to any one person’s specific role in the shootings.

Civil forfeitures are “extremely profitable” for district attorneys, who on average spent $702 prosecuting a forfeiture case in return for $15,182 in proceeds, according to a December 2014 report to the Texas Legislature by the Public Policy Research Institute.

Since Reyna was took office in 2011 he has boasted of taking more than $1 million of contraband through forfeiture, including cars, computers, even fancy hubcaps. He used the process to acquire a 2004 Freightliner trailer-tractor rig that was seized by state troopers in 2011, a truck that ended up with County Commissioner Ben Perry’s precinct.

Reyna’s office uses 30 percent of the proceeds from the forfeitures and shares 70 percent with the agency that seized the goods.

Stan Schwieger, a Waco defense attorney who has fought civil forfeiture cases here, said he sees challenges in using the procedure in the Twin Peaks case. “I don’t know parking a bike on a public parking lot and showing up for a couple of bad wings and some beer, how that renders property to be contraband,” he said.

http://www.wacotrib.com/news/twin-peaks-biker-shooting/vehicle-forfeiture-efforts-could-be-lucrative-but-difficult-in-twin/article_117085cd-2edf-57bc-b3b0-09e4cc90dfea.html

(http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/wacotrib.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/0/95/095719ec-be79-5a7b-a868-2cf0483621eb/555fe002224cd.image.jpg)



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Conan71 on June 01, 2015, 10:02:26 am
I’d always heard that 1% clubs like the Bandidos require prospects and members to sign over the title of their bike to the club.  If that’s the case and the Texas Bandidos, the Scimitars, and whomever the third club were are brought up on a RICO action, they may not have such a hard time successfully confiscating the bikes if they are titled as club, rather than individual property.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on June 01, 2015, 01:55:00 pm
I’d always heard that 1% clubs like the Bandidos require prospects and members to sign over the title of their bike to the club.  If that’s the case and the Texas Bandidos, the Scimitars, and whomever the third club were are brought up on a RICO action, they may not have such a hard time successfully confiscating the bikes if they are titled as club, rather than individual property.


Reading past the spokesman's narrative, there were about a dozen (99%'ers) motorcycle groups there to talk about upcoming legislation, with the Banditos in the minority.
Police basically scooped up anyone wearing a black T-shirt, mostly weekend hobbyists who cant afford to sit in jail for the estimated weeks/months it will take just to get a bond reduction hearing.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on July 26, 2015, 06:45:53 pm
Been going on a long time.  Similar to the falsely labeled "Patriot Act".


Funds and property seized by Oklahoma law enforcement agencies have gone missing or have been used for personal or other improper purposes, state audit records reveal.

Among the violations were using seized money to pay on a prosecutor’s student loans and allowing a prosecutor to live rent-free in a confiscated house for years, records show.
The cases were cited in a state commission hearing Tuesday in which police unions objected to new legislation aimed at curbing abuses of civil asset forfeiture by state and local law enforcement agencies. The bill, sponsored by Sen. Kyle Loveless, R-Oklahoma City, has spurred heated opposition from district attorneys and sheriffs.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagelatest/oklahoma-watch-law-enforcement-seizures-misspent-missing/article_a1620c4e-55d1-586d-88d4-1b6ea74232c0.html


"When asked about it, law enforcement said, 'Well, he's a DA and he prosecutes bad guys, so therefore it's law enforcement,' " he says. "Wait a minute. I'm sorry, but I just don't believe that that passes the smell test."
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-takes-hard-look-what-police-seize-and-how-its-spent


Aggressive police take hundreds of millions of dollars from motorists not charged with crimes

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/2014/09/06/stop-and-seize/?hpid=z3



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on July 27, 2015, 08:17:31 am

Funds and property seized by Oklahoma law enforcement agencies have gone missing or have been used for personal or other improper purposes, state audit records reveal.

Among the violations were using seized money to pay on a prosecutor’s student loans and allowing a prosecutor to live rent-free in a confiscated house for years, records show.
The cases were cited in a state commission hearing Tuesday in which police unions objected to new legislation aimed at curbing abuses of civil asset forfeiture by state and local law enforcement agencies. The bill, sponsored by Sen. Kyle Loveless, R-Oklahoma City, has spurred heated opposition from district attorneys and sheriffs.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagelatest/oklahoma-watch-law-enforcement-seizures-misspent-missing/article_a1620c4e-55d1-586d-88d4-1b6ea74232c0.html


"When asked about it, law enforcement said, 'Well, he's a DA and he prosecutes bad guys, so therefore it's law enforcement,' " he says. "Wait a minute. I'm sorry, but I just don't believe that that passes the smell test."
http://publicradiotulsa.org/post/oklahoma-takes-hard-look-what-police-seize-and-how-its-spent


Aggressive police take hundreds of millions of dollars from motorists not charged with crimes

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/2014/09/06/stop-and-seize/?hpid=z3





Noooooo....!!!  Say it ain't so...!!  How could this be??



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on August 16, 2015, 05:41:16 pm
Court Declares Air Fresheners, Pro-Police Stickers as Reasonable Suspicion for Cops to Pull You Over
The ruling upholds the idea that police officers can profile and detain people who aren’t actually committing any crimes.
http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/court-declares-air-fresheners-pro-police-stickers-reasonable-suspicion-cops-pull

Kingsville, TX — Last Thursday, the Fifth Circuit US Court of Appeals ruled that it is suspicious for a vehicle to have air fresheners, rosaries, or pro-police bumper stickers.

The ruling stems from a 2011 Texas court case in which a couple was pulled over for having rosaries hanging from the rearview mirror, as well as air fresheners, and a DARE sticker on the back of the vehicle.

Nohemi Pena-Gonzalez was pulled over by Police Officer Mike Tamez when she was driving just 2 MPH over the speed limit. The officer did not pull her over because she was speeding, but because he suspected that she was trafficking drugs, and found the contents of her vehicle and the sticker to be suspicious.

Eventually, the officer questioned her husband, Ruben Pena-Gonzalez, who agreed to allow the officer search to their vehicle. The officer did not find any drugs, but did find a large sum of cash that he confiscated, and then sent Ruben Pena-Gonzalez to jail.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: TeeDub on August 26, 2015, 12:31:37 pm

http://mccarvillereport.com/archives/32755

Senator Anthony Sykes has yet to respond to a question about his relocation of an interim study hearing on civil asset forfeiture from the Capitol to a remote Tulsa Police Department facility. Sykes is chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee.

Twenty-four hours ago, The McCarville Report asked Sykes’ office to answer this question: “Why was the civil asset forfeiture interim study assigned to a Tulsa PD facility rather than the normal place, the Capitol?”

The controversial issue has drawn reform support from conservative and liberal think tanks and constitutionalists and opposition from some in law enforcement.

The interim study hearing is on September 1st.

Senator Kyle Loveless, sponsor of the bill, has invited out-of-state experts on the issue to testify. Several are due in the state, paying their own way to get to Oklahoma City. Now, they are being forced to hastily change flight plans or make arrangements for ground transportation from Oklahoma City to Tulsa to get to the non-neutral site.

Loveless thus far has declined comment on the development, viewed by some as a move by Skyes as a way to limit news coverage of the hearing, by others as a way of making the hearing as difficult as possible for supporters of the reform measure. Sykes, who aspires to be elected attorney general, is viewed as a “friend” of law enforcement.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on November 17, 2015, 11:23:27 pm
A proposed Oklahoma law would take the profit out of police and DAs confiscating money from people without due process.  Here's what our DA has to say about that:
http://www.fox23.com/news/news/local/debate-over-confiscated-money/npKDd/



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: cannon_fodder on November 18, 2015, 01:39:48 pm
Well of course he's not happy, it directly takes money away from his budget.

That property can be seized without due process just seems crazy. "This now belongs to the Tulsa County Sheriff and a kickback to the DA. If you don't like that, show up in court and try to stop us." Seriously, that's how it works.

I understand the point, and I support the general idea. But you still have to err on the side of the citizen. The whole 4th Amendment thing is important.

My plan:

- Police can still confiscate assets with "probable cause," as it stands.
- If no charges are filed, the citizen gets their property back just by filing an affidavit saying it is legit.
- The burden is then shifted, and if the DA wants to keep the property they have to convince a judge by a civil "more probable than not" standard that the asset is ill-gotten. If the DA fails to prove that standard, the State pays the attorney fee to the citizen.

He idea being that the burden should pass to the State if no charges are filed. Also - if the funds were from a drug cartel or otherwise dubious, most people would not bother coming back to pick them up. Happy to just lose the cash and walk away.

Decent compromise IMHO.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on November 18, 2015, 02:49:09 pm

That property can be seized without due process just seems crazy. "This now belongs to the Tulsa County Sheriff and a kickback to the DA. If you don't like that, show up in court and try to stop us." Seriously, that's how it works.

I understand the point, and I support the general idea. But you still have to err on the side of the citizen. The whole 4th Amendment thing is important.

My plan:

- Police can still confiscate assets with "probable cause," as it stands.
- If no charges are filed, the citizen gets their property back just by filing an affidavit saying it is legit.
- The burden is then shifted, and if the DA wants to keep the property they have to convince a judge by a civil "more probable than not" standard that the asset is ill-gotten. If the DA fails to prove that standard, the State pays the attorney fee to the citizen.

He idea being that the burden should pass to the State if no charges are filed. Also - if the funds were from a drug cartel or otherwise dubious, most people would not bother coming back to pick them up. Happy to just lose the cash and walk away.


The DA is attacking the reform under the false pretense it favors drug cartels, which could be true if we were talking millions (and not the $100 here -- a thousand there -- that occurs on a daily basis) but we have to wait for the feds to wash their hands before they start cleaning up the states.

An American Civil Liberties Union report earlier this year found that the median amount seized in forfeiture actions in Philadelphia amounted to $192.
In most states the typical forfeiture amount is very small. The median forfeiture case in Illinois is worth $530, according to the report. In Tennessee, it's $502. In Minnesota, $451. Those are hardly kingpin-level hauls.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/11/10/report-in-lean-times-police-start-taking-a-lot-more-stuff-from-people/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on November 20, 2015, 07:14:57 pm
“The nature of this idea that you have to a crime in connection with seized property is dangerous to Oklahoma. I call it the Drug Cartel Protection Act,” said Kunzweiller.

So basically anyone with cash in their possession is fair game.  That pretty much tells us all we need to know about DA Kuntzweiller.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on November 30, 2015, 03:03:32 pm
A proposed Oklahoma law would take the profit out of police and DAs confiscating money from people without due process.  Here's what our DA has to say about that:
http://www.fox23.com/news/news/local/debate-over-confiscated-money/npKDd/




Same as Tim Harris.... Didn't really expect anything different did ya...?


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on December 15, 2015, 07:24:36 pm

Same as Tim Harris.... Didn't really expect anything different did ya...?



When Norman, OK. Councilman Stephen Holman Questioned the police chief's request to buy a $280,000 armored vehicle using money seized from citizens by local police, the council decided to look at both the vehicle purchase proposal and the city's use of seizure funds more closely.

Angered by the idea a city councilor would interfere with the affairs of the department, police raided the smoke shop owned by Holman, where officers seized the bank deposit from his briefcase and cash from the register totaling about $2,000.

Police also took varous pipes from the smoke shop, as well as rolling papers, and the sign on his door that stated that the former were to be used with tobacco
only.


http://www.reddirtreport.com/red-dirt-news/courteous-raid-norman%E2%80%99s-friendly-market-causes-backlash
http://newsok.com/article/5465987
http://kfor.com/2015/12/09/they-took-all-the-money-in-the-store-city-councilman-angry-after-police-raid-norman-pipe-shop/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on December 15, 2015, 10:07:14 pm

When Norman, OK. Councilman Stephen Holman Questioned the police chief's request to buy a $280,000 armored vehicle using money seized from citizens by local police, the council decided to look at both the vehicle purchase proposal and the city's use of seizure funds more closely.

Angered by the idea a city councilor would interfere with the affairs of the department, police raided the smoke shop owned by Holman, where officers seized the bank deposit from his briefcase and cash from the register totaling about $2,000.

Police also took varous pipes from the smoke shop, as well as rolling papers, and the sign on his door that stated that the former were to be used with tobacco
only.


http://www.reddirtreport.com/red-dirt-news/courteous-raid-norman%E2%80%99s-friendly-market-causes-backlash
http://newsok.com/article/5465987
http://kfor.com/2015/12/09/they-took-all-the-money-in-the-store-city-councilman-angry-after-police-raid-norman-pipe-shop/



And we are said to be a land of free citizens...!

Wonder why I try to stay so anonymous....?


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on December 15, 2015, 10:33:35 pm

And we are said to be a land of free citizens...!

Wonder why I try to stay so anonymous....?





Dear Scott Rowland,

I had $10K, little more, in the car when I heard you on All Things Considered. You were defending civil asset forfeiture. This is a practice cops engage in and which you endorse.

A driver with funds in his Hyundai pays real attention when law enforcement professionals explain on national radio why cops should continue taking away property from people during routine traffic stops where those people aren't charged with a crime. Your defense, I had to notice, backfired. You didn't defend forfeiture at all. I realize you thought you did, you wanted to. But your comments provided a rich illustration of why forfeiture must be abolished.

Counselor, this is forfeiture in brief: Cop finds money. Cop takes money.

The end.

Cop has only to say, "I think this money is crime-related." He proves nothing. Brings no charges. Gets no warrant. Unlike criminal forfeiture ?-- ?which takes place when someone's convicted of actual crime? -- ?the charges in civil forfeiture are formally brought against the property itself, not against its (former) owner. Because property has no rights, it has no presumption of innocence. Violated owners can recover their possessions only after proving that the items are not crime-related. In this version of justice, exoneration means proving a negative. So the burden is on the accused.

This detail alone makes forfeiture a perversion in a free land. I refer you to the Fifth and the Fourteenth Amendments. But the thing gets kinkier.

Thanks to John Oliver, the Washington Post, and the Institute for Justice, many of us know by now where the proceeds of forfeiture go: directly into the discretionary budgets of the police agencies that seize the assets and of their buddies, the district attorneys. The process is: find it and keep it. Cops are incentivized to steal.

In the story I listened to, Counselor, reporter Kate Greer noted that an Oklahoma D.A. had used forfeiture proceeds to pay off his own student loans. I heard this on the radio and scoffed. What a joke. And then you came on.

You said that anyone in your business "knows" (knows, you said) that large amounts of money are "a key indicator of illegal activity." My scoffing grew hoarse at this point. I thought of the locked car safe bolted to the floor below my seat.

This was two days ago -- Sunday. I was driving to meet my kid and her mama for dinner with friends at their house. Cops should seize money when they find it (you said) because the alternative is to "send it on back to the cartel. Or send it on back to al Qaeda or ISIS."

You were speaking specifically of the Sooner State? -- ?where you're First Assistant D.A. in the state's most populous county? -- ?so you were claiming, in effect, that the Islamic State is among the likeliest sources of funds in a random driver's car in Oklahoma.

This is not an argument for civil asset forfeiture. You made an argument for due process, without knowing it.

Government officials as recklessly ignorant as yourself, as devoid of any aptitude for probabilistic reasoning? -- ?officials capable of arguing that large cash holdings, in a state with 124 casinos (Oklahoma has the second largest tribal gambling market in the country), can correctly be inferred to come from ISIS? -- ?are the reason due process is needed. You're not a cop but you work with cops and you the share the cop mentality. The mentality of certainty, of knowing. If cop certainty could be relied upon, the courts would be superfluous.

They're not.

At dinner, the kids played? -- ?meaning my daughter bit at our friends' son's head and was pulled away shrieking. These were white-looking kids in a posh-looking house. When her tears had gone and the toddlers were together again on the couch, leaping and throwing pillows, there was an interval of peace and reflection, a reflexive instant where I observed myself and my family in that environment and noticed my awareness of the loveliness there. This vanished, Counselor, as I thought of you -- and I suddenly recalled that I'd lied to my daughter a few days before.

We'd been driving. Passed a police vehicle. She likes anything with flashers or a siren attached. And I'd told her that the police help people? -- ?that this was their job? -- ?and if she ever got lost she should flag down a cop. But I realized in the brightness of our friends' living room that if my child were a dark-looking boy instead of a white-looking girl, such a speech would be impossible. And irresponsible. Cops, I would tell him, help some people; they steal from others; you they might kill.

We live in an era out of all patience with deferring to the certainties of cops. Your assertion of the likely connection between cash in Oklahoma and such groups as the Islamic State is just another reason we, the people, must remain skeptical of you and your kind.

As to what I was doing with a couple-few straps in my car, that's a private matter, Counselor. I'll only add that anyone in my business knows that large amounts of money are a key indicator of diligence, competence, hard work, good fortune, success.

Yours? -- ?as sincerely as it gets.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/josh-axelrad/an-open-letter-concerning_b_7896754.html







Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on December 15, 2015, 11:05:05 pm
What can ya say.... It's Oklahoma...!!   And the entire rest of the country!!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc11mJGre10


Truth is truth, whether 1960's or 2015's....

Not much has changed for the better since that little episode.... And a lot of things have been getting worse in the last 35 years...!







Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on December 17, 2015, 10:42:02 am
More good work by Ziva Branstetter and The Frontier:

https://www.readfrontier.com/investigation/sheriffs-office-seizes-citizens-cash-guns-through-unclaimed-property-law/

The Tulsa County Sheriff’s Office has been allowed to seize cash and guns from nearly 1,000 citizens during searches and arrests under a law designed for dealing with unclaimed property rather than using the state’s forfeiture process, an investigation by The Frontier has found.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on December 27, 2015, 07:45:27 pm

Same as Tim Harris.... Didn't really expect anything different did ya...?



http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/crimewatch/search-seize-and-settle-anatomy-of-a-forfeiture-case/article_40f11d53-7833-52af-ab8b-9675cee160a5.html


(Canadian County) Deputy Mike Stilley, working drug interdiction, clocked the car at 76 mph in a 70 mph zone on Interstate 40. He gave chase as he called in the vehicle’s out-of-state plate, pulled the car over and, after approaching on foot, began questioning the Yangs.

"Rolling No" Consent

Eventually, Stilley wrote Moua Yang a warning for speeding and told him the traffic stop was complete. However, as Yang started to get out of the cruiser, Stilley told him his job was to investigate criminal activity through traffic enforcement. He asked whether Yang and his father were transporting any illegal drugs, weapons or large amounts of currency, court records say. Yang replied they were not. Stilley asked to search the vehicle and said Yang agreed.

 He looked in the back seat and found a duffel bag with several articles of clothing and a towel that smelled strongly of laundry detergent. Wrapped in the towel was $25,690 in cash, most of it in bundled $1,000 stacks. Moua Yang said he and his family had been saving the money for a long time.

Stilley reported the cash smelled slightly of marijuana, and a K-9 dog reacted to the money. However, a subsequent analysis by the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation crime lab yielded no drug residue.

The case went on until 2013, when the parties reached a settlement and $12,845 was returned to the Yangs.
“It doesn’t make sense, It’s either drug money or it’s not. If it’s not, then give them the money back. Why would someone want to do a 50-50 split?



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on December 28, 2015, 11:38:48 am

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/crimewatch/search-seize-and-settle-anatomy-of-a-forfeiture-case/article_40f11d53-7833-52af-ab8b-9675cee160a5.html


It looks like the Sheriff's office had the money spent before it was even confiscated.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: cannon_fodder on December 28, 2015, 02:40:48 pm
Quote
Stilley asked to search the vehicle and said Yang agreed.

Ding ding ding!  We have a loser!

Police will almost never ask you questions or ask to search your home/vehicle/office/whatever in order to do you a favor or in an attempt to get evidence NOT to arrest you. While police don't want to waste their time, their job is to find crimes and arrest people. Respectfully decline to answer intrusive questions and always decline a search. Obviously, if the officer is investigating a break-in nearby, a vandal, or a significant crime you are aware of - it is in your interest to cooperate and send the criminal to jail. We want police to catch bad people! But you should be suspicious of government, and police are government.

Remember, the government is allowed to lie to you and it is considered good policing: "we just need to clear some things up," "everyone else cooperated and went home, you're the holdout," "just need this for my report," "if you don't answer the questions, I might have to arrest you."  Whatever they can say to get you to answer questions. But lying to the government is a crime.  And even if your answers are innocent and make sense to you - they may appear to incriminate you to the officer (civil vs. traditional weddings, large amounts of cash as savings instead of in a bank, the fact that driving to California takes ~24 hours and some people will take 3 days to drive that much). In many instances you are required to give identifying information (and that would include while driving, must show ID), everything else is voluntary.

Quote
Stilley reported the cash smelled slightly of marijuana, and a K-9 dog reacted to the money. However, a subsequent analysis by the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation crime lab yielded no drug residue.

Same ole' story, same ole' song and dance. I smell drugs! Search... finds a gun... "I knew it!" Smelling marijuana is the panacea for searching, many officers I know would be fine with marijuana being legal as long as they could still use it as a pretext to search. It used to be the same with "smelling a meth lab," just magic words to negate the 4th Amendment.

And drug dogs can be utterly worthless from an investigation standpoint too. The Supreme Court says the effectiveness of drug dogs is beyond challenge. Even if it can be PROVEN that the particular dog in question is wrong more than right, it is still a free pass on the 4th Amendment. So, if you have a choice between A) a drug dog that is 98% correct and the 2% failure is when they *should* have detected drugs and didnt, or B) a dog that is wrong 75% of the time, but always errs on the side of allowing a search... which drug dog would the police choose to accomplish their goal of searching and catching as many people as possible?

That no trace of drugs was found on the currency is actually kind of surprising, considering nearly all money is "used" and some of it is likely to be in contact with some drugs at some point. But if 9/10 people couldn't detected the same smell of marijuana as the dog, I wouldn't be surprised.

However, given the confusion, divergent stories, and finding $25k wrapped up with two unemployed people in a rental car - I understand the officers suspicion. I may have seized the money too, under current laws. But then the system should have taken over to get a better result. What are the odds that these two people, bringing drug money with them fro a drug purchase, lost $25k in drug money and then hired an attorney to fight for four years to get it back?  Seems doubtful. It is clear the government couldn't prove the money was related to a crime, or they'd be charged. When in doubt, the citizen should win and the government shouldn't be able to take their property.

My proposal (not sure if I have posted this before):

1) Reasonable suspicion standard stays the same, seize suspicious cash.
2) Money is then assumed to be drug money, as it is now, and the DA can move to deem the money forfeit to the State (same as now).
3) Citizen can file an affidavit swearing the money is theirs and they obtained it legally (NEW step).
4) Burden then shifts and the DA must prove that the funds are for or proceeds of illegal activity, can request a hearing but the burden is on the state
5) Judge can set a hearing or release the money - if a hearing is set, the DA has the burden of proof. Hearings must be timely, say ~90 days from the date of seizure.
6) If the burden of proof is not met, the State pays the court costs of the citizen whose assets they seized and time they wasted.

Seems unlikely a cartel would file an affidavit and go through that process. Also seems less likely that a citizen would lose money simply because they couldn't afford to continue fighting the man.

Who are we kidding anyway... the cartels aren't short on cash. Clearly the program isn't that effective at starving the cartels. But it does provide an incentive for departments to up their funding...







Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on January 04, 2016, 11:28:30 pm

Who are we kidding anyway... the cartels aren't short on cash. Clearly the program isn't that effective at starving the cartels. But it does provide an incentive for departments to up their funding...


The Tulsa Whirled weighs in:



Asset Forfeiture: Much energy and time has been spent since the end of the last legislative session, lobbying the public for restricting how law enforcement agencies can seize assets suspected of being part of drug crimes.

We have no doubt that millions are being transported across the state by drug gangs, and have no sympathy for pushers who lose their profits. But we also recognize that there is room for abuse as the laws are currently written.

We say the state needs uniformity in how assets are seized and how those seizures are reported to the state.

We can support a higher level of proof for relatively small seizures, but are comfortable that current rules are justified for very large amounts of cash. We will add that if the Legislature is going to be aggressive in cutting police and prosecutors off from this stream of funding, it is responsible for making up the lost revenue.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/editorials/tulsa-world-editorial-tulsa-world-legislative-agenda-for/article_22dcd1ed-1048-53d5-9e1d-7a1693f4ad68.html



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: cannon_fodder on January 05, 2016, 08:05:50 am
The Tulsa Whirled weighs in:


We can support a higher level of proof for relatively small seizures, but are comfortable that current rules are justified for very large amounts of cash...


That's very childish logic:

Quote
Yes, we feel the government is abusing its authority and stealing money from citizens. If they want to steal a little bit, they need more proof. But if they are stealing a lot, they probably have a good reason for stealing that much.

That is illogical from a constitutional, fairness, or legal perspective. But it sure feels good, because it seems like you are punishing the rich and mighty drug cartels and protecting Joe Littleguy. The fact is, if they seize $200k - they are more likely to be able to prove either drug involvement, or tax evasion.

The government either has proof that the funds are ill-gotten gains and should be seized, or they don't. Not sure why that's complicated by anything except greed.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on January 05, 2016, 10:49:37 pm

And drug dogs can be utterly worthless from an investigation standpoint too. The Supreme Court says the effectiveness of drug dogs is beyond challenge. Even if it can be PROVEN that the particular dog in question is wrong more than right, it is still a free pass on the 4th Amendment. So, if you have a choice between A) a drug dog that is 98% correct and the 2% failure is when they *should* have detected drugs and didnt, or B) a dog that is wrong 75% of the time, but always errs on the side of allowing a search... which drug dog would the police choose to accomplish their goal of searching and catching as many people as possible?




Drug dogs are cash cows.

Most can find drugs (or drug residue thats on all paper currency) and make "alert" gestures that indicate a "hit" that give police probable cause to take over the search.  If the dog fails to find anything, the trainer can still prompt the dog with hand or voice gestures to perform that very same "alert," effectively creating their own probable cause with the dog just acting as a theatrical prop.

Chances are if you are stoped by police who want you to wait for a drug dog, they have already made the decision to rob you.





Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on January 06, 2016, 02:38:36 pm
The Tulsa Whirled weighs in:

We say the state needs uniformity in how assets are seized and how those seizures are reported to the state.

We can support a higher level of proof for relatively small seizures, but are comfortable that current rules are justified for very large amounts of cash. We will add that if the Legislature is going to be aggressive in cutting police and prosecutors off from this stream of funding, it is responsible for making up the lost revenue.



Tulsa World has been idiotic for decades - now they use their own words to prove it...


Wonder what they consider to be large amounts of cash, since most of the thefts I hear about are under $10,000.  Way under what it would take to buy a car....



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Ed W on January 06, 2016, 06:34:26 pm
I found this, saying that civil forfeitures greater than $10,000 comprise less than 5% of the cases, and the average is much lower. I recall reading that in Baltimore, the average is more like $300. That's not law enforcement. It's a shakedown.

"According to the Institute for Justice, law enforcement in Minnesota seized more than $6.6 million worth of goods in 2012, 90 percent of which was used to supplement law enforcement budgets. The nonprofit law firm also noted that the police officers were not exactly seizing Ferraris and mansions from drug kingpins, as less than 4 percent of property seized in the state between 2003 and 2010 was worth more than $5,000.

In fact, the average value of property seized by law enforcement was only worth around $1,250, and it costs an average of $2,500 to challenge civil asset forfeiture in court."

http://www.mintpressnews.com/report-show-police-using-asset-seizure-to-bolster-budgets/192748/ (http://www.mintpressnews.com/report-show-police-using-asset-seizure-to-bolster-budgets/192748/)


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on January 07, 2016, 09:59:56 pm

Tulsa World has been idiotic for decades - now they use their own words to prove it...

Wonder what they consider to be large amounts of cash, since most of the thefts I hear about are under $10,000.  Way under what it would take to buy a car....



Rhetoric heats up on proposed civil assett forfeiture changes
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/capitol_report/rhetoric-heats-up-on-proposed-civil-assett-forfeiture-changes/article_98403a2e-82fa-5a7e-a544-a19fa4fec662.html


The leading voice for change is Sen. Kyle Loveless, R-Oklahoma City. He has filed Senate Bill 838, which would make dramatic changes to a law that allows law enforcement to seize property and cash suspected of being used in a crime. The current process does not require a conviction.

Prosecutors statewide strongly oppose the measure.
On Tuesday, the Oklahoma District Attorneys Association sent lawmakers a letter voicing its concerns with the bill.

“Enactment of Senate Bill 838 will dramatically hinder law enforcement efforts aimed at stopping the drug trade in Oklahoma,” said the letter, signed by association President Mike Boring and Mike Fields, the group’s president-elect.

“It is estimated that $5 (million) to $10 million per year of the drug enforcement efforts in Oklahoma are funded by the forfeited proceeds of drug dealers, traffickers, criminal street gangs, and drug cartels. Limiting the use of this valuable tool will place the burden of funding this effort on the taxpayers — hard working innocent Oklahomans.”

On Wednesday, a coalition supporting the changes fired back with a letter of its own.

“The United States has had unjust laws — slavery, poll taxes, and citizens being denied the right to vote,” the letter said. “Now is the time to add civil asset forfeiture to that list of outdated, unjust laws. We believe the pendulum has swung too far from due process and the principle of innocent until proven guilty.”

The coalition includes the ACLU of Oklahoma, Oklahoma Council of Public Affairs, Oklahoma Policy Institute, the Oklahoma Second Amendment Association and the NAACP, Oklahoma City branch.

Loveless said the letter from prosecutors was not unexpected.
His plan would require a conviction before property could be forfeited to the government, with some exceptions.

He would institute a timeline for charges to be brought against property owners to ensure the timely return of property if the government doesn’t have enough evidence to prove a crime was committed.

The plan would remove the direct profit from forfeiture by creating a panel to determine how the seized funds and property would be allocated to drug treatment, drug courts and drug interdiction.

The bill also would raise the burden of proof that would allow law enforcement to keep the property.

The District Attorneys Council recently appeared before a legislative committee to discuss its budget. Lawmakers are expected to have at least $900.8 million less with which to craft the upcoming fiscal year budget.

Lawmakers were told that less than half of a district attorney’s budget comes from legislative appropriations. The rest comes from federal grants, supervision fees, bogus checks, child support activities and drug asset forfeitures.

“The notion that Oklahoma prosecutors and law enforcement officers are routinely violating Oklahomans’ rights so they can buy things used to combat the drug trade is very offensive to Oklahoma prosecutors and law enforcement,” Fields said.





Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on January 09, 2016, 04:09:15 pm

Oklahoma District Attorneys Association sent lawmakers a letter voicing its concerns with the bill...
"Limiting the use of this valuable tool will place the burden of funding this effort on the taxpayers — hard working innocent Oklahomans"



...instead of on the backs of the poor who cant afford attorneys or trust banks, like it is now.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on January 10, 2016, 07:38:22 pm
Old Charlie stole the handle and
The train it won't stop going
No way to slow down.




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on January 12, 2016, 07:30:13 pm
Quote

“The notion that Oklahoma prosecutors and law enforcement officers are routinely violating Oklahomans’ rights so they can buy things used to combat the drug trade is very offensive to Oklahoma prosecutors and law enforcement,” Fields said.[/font]


Poor babies.  Ill bet the people who are watching armed robbers stuff their life savings into their uniform pants got a little more than just their feelings hurt.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on January 19, 2016, 08:26:59 pm

America's Dirtiest Cops:  http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/americas-dirtiest-cops-cash-cocaine-texas-hidalgo-county-20150105



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on February 13, 2016, 08:21:36 pm
"Were not shaking grandma and granddad off the road...and taking them out of their motor home and seizing all of their hard-earned assets"  
http://www.fox23.com/news/news/local/rogers-county-traffic-stop-turns-credit-fraud-bust/nqCkT/






OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) - An Oklahoma legislator who wants to restrict when police can seize cash and other assets from people they suspect of drug-trade involvement - even without a conviction - fears his colleagues won’t have a chance to take up his idea this session.

The bill by Sen. Kyle Loveless, R-Oklahoma City, has been referred to the Senate Judiciary Committee, but Loveless says efforts to reach chairman Sen. Anthony Sykes have gone unanswered. He’s turned to his constituents to help plead his case, asking them to call the Senate leadership to request that his bill be heard.
 
Sykes did not return requests for comment Thursday or Friday.

Loveless claims government agencies have taken money and other assets from law-abiding citizens, using civil forfeiture laws to fund local agencies. District Attorney Mike Fields, whose district runs from the western Oklahoma City suburbs to the Kansas border, is critical of Loveless’ bill, saying the implication that police would benefit improperly was “frankly offensive” and he’s asking the legislator to provide concrete evidence of systemic problems.

The legislator turns the request around.

“I think it’s ironic that the DAs are asking for me to provide evidence, which is more than what they’re required (to provide) to take someone’s property,” Loveless said. “I’m not going to do their homework for them. They’re the ones that took the money from the people, or property from the people, so they have that information.”

The bill, if it became law, would require the state to convict most suspects of a crime before their assets are subject to forfeiture. The proposal does allow for exceptions: If the property is valued at more than $50,000, for instance, the state could seize and retain it without a conviction. Still, under the proposal, the state would have to meet a higher burden of proof than is currently required to do so.

The state must meet a preponderance of the evidence test to subject seized assets to forfeiture. This proposal would increase that burden of proof to require “clear and convincing” evidence.

Under the proposed law, funds raised through seized property would be designated for grants to law enforcement agencies and drug treatment facilities. Currently, money goes directly to the agency that seizes it. The money would also be allocated by an independent board.

“My intent of rerouting the money to a neutral, independent party is to reduce the appearance of impropriety of agencies and law enforcement growing their budgets by how much they seize,” Loveless said.

The bill also aims to require local agencies to report asset forfeitures to the state auditor, and to make these reports available to the public.





Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on March 29, 2016, 06:33:57 pm
The feds have resumed a controversial program that lets cops take stuff and keep it
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/03/28/the-feds-have-resumed-a-controversial-program-that-lets-cops-take-stuff-and-keep-it/


The Justice Department has announced that it is resuming a controversial practice that allows local police departments to funnel a large portion of assets seized from citizens into their own coffers under federal law.

The "Equitable Sharing Program" gives police the option of prosecuting some asset forfeiture cases under federal instead of state law, particularly in instances where local law enforcement officers have a relationship with federal authorities as part of a joint task force. Federal forfeiture policies are more permissive than many state policies, allowing police to keep up to 80 percent of assets they seize.

Asset forfeiture is a contentious practice that lets police seize and keep cash and property from people who are never convicted of wrongdoing — and in many cases, never charged. Studies have found that use of the practice has exploded in recent years, prompting concern that, in some cases, police are motivated more by profit and less by justice.

A wide-ranging Washington Post investigation in 2014 found that police had seized $2.5 billion in cash alone without warrants or indictments since 2001.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/investigative/collection/stop-and-seize-2/?tid=a_inl


POLICE NOW STEAL MORE THAN BURGLARS
(https://img.washingtonpost.com/wp-apps/imrs.php?src=https://img.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/files/2016/03/Screen-Shot-2016-03-28-at-3.06.30-PM.png)


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on March 29, 2016, 09:38:25 pm
Deputy Allegedly Used Stolen Items To Bribe Witnesses
http://sfist.com/2016/03/29/mission_district_beating_deputy_all.php



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Conan71 on March 31, 2016, 02:04:31 pm
Wagoner County will likely have a new sheriff soon, accruing to breaking news from the Tulsa World:

Quote
Wagoner County sheriff indicted by multicounty grand jury on three felony counts

Previous story: At least four Wagoner County Sheriff's Office employees appear before multicounty grand jury

WAGONER — A multicounty grand jury on Thursday indicted Wagoner County Sheriff Bob Colbert and a sheriff's office captain on three felony counts and recommended his removal from office.

A multicounty grand jury that had been working since September indicted Colbert and Capt. Jeff Gragg, alleging in one count that they either conspired to receive a bribe or committed extortion through threats. The second count claims Colbert and Gragg received a bribe or in the alternative committed extortion through threats, while the third count states they committed extortion through threats.

The pair are accused of conspiring to bring two people by taking $10,000 in exchange for not pursuing drug charges in 2014. Gragg initiated a traffic stop of a vehicle driven by Torell Wallace and a 17-year-old passenger.

"Gragg conducted a search of the vehicle in which he found $10,000 in cash, of which Wallace and the passenger both claimed ownership," a news release from Attorney General Scott Pruitt states. "Wallace and the passenger were arrested for possession of drug proceeds. After being taken to the Wagoner County Jail, Colbert and Gragg accepted a bribe from Wallace and the passenger when Wallace disclaimed any interest in the cash. They were then released and their records were deleted. The cash was placed in a Sheriff’s Drug Forfeiture account with the Wagoner County Treasurer’s Office."

The grand jury recommended Colbert's removal based on counts of extortion, willful neglect of duty and failure to produce and account for all public funds in his hands at a settlement required by law, according to the release.

Colbert and Gragg could face up to 25 years in prison each and be ordered to pay fines of up to $10,000.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on April 01, 2016, 09:04:34 am
Wagoner County will likely have a new sheriff soon, accruing to breaking news from the Tulsa World:



Gragg performed a traffic stop of a vehicle driven by Torell Wallace and a 17-year-old passenger. During the traffic stop, Gragg conducted a search of the vehicle in which he found $10,000 in cash, of which Wallace and the passenger both claimed ownership. Wallace and the passenger were arrested for possession of drug proceeds. After being taken to the Wagoner County Jail, Colbert and Gragg accepted a bribe from Wallace and the passenger when Wallace disclaimed any interest in the cash. They were then released and their records were deleted. The cash was placed in a Sheriff’s Drug Forfeiture account with the Wagoner County Treasurer’s Office.

So basically this is because he didnt offer the DA his cut?


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Conan71 on April 01, 2016, 09:33:59 am
So basically this is because he didnt offer the DA his cut?


Kind of sounds like someone got left out.  What I’m not understanding though is it does not appear from the story that the sheriff nor his deputy embezzled the money then used it for personal purposes, unless I read that wrong.  It sounds like the money went directly to the WC Treasurer’s office.

What CF had to say about confiscations like this is chilling.  I can think of times I’ve had large amounts of cash on hand to purchase a vehicle.  When my sole business was dealing in antique Harleys, having large sums of cash on me driving along an interstate was not an uncommon occurrence.  The idea that a cop can simply say: “That’s got to be drug money, so I’m seizing it and I’m arresting you” never ran across my mind.  At large antique motorcycle or auto swap meets, there’s easily hundreds of thousands of dollars in cash moving around at any given time.  That could be a target-rich environment for rogue cops.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on April 01, 2016, 11:49:08 am
Kind of sounds like someone got left out.  What I’m not understanding though is it does not appear from the story that the sheriff nor his deputy embezzled the money then used it for personal purposes, unless I read that wrong.  It sounds like the money went directly to the WC Treasurer’s office.

What CF had to say about confiscations like this is chilling.  I can think of times I’ve had large amounts of cash on hand to purchase a vehicle.  When my sole business was dealing in antique Harleys, having large sums of cash on me driving along an interstate was not an uncommon occurrence.  The idea that a cop can simply say: “That’s got to be drug money, so I’m seizing it and I’m arresting you” never ran across my mind.  At large antique motorcycle or auto swap meets, there’s easily hundreds of thousands of dollars in cash moving around at any given time.  That could be a target-rich environment for rogue cops.

Farmers and ranchers seem to get hit a lot, those that dont use banks and come into town to buy a bull or a piece of equipment with cash, and dont have the means to fight to get their cash back when they are pulled over.


Gragg told him the only way he would be free that day was to disclaim ownership of the $10,000. It additionally alleges that once Wallace did so, Colbert told Wagoner County detention officers to stop Wallace’s booking process and delete his records from the system.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/communities/wagoner/news/local/wagoner-county-sheriff-indicted-by-multicounty-grand-jury-on-three/article_7e1e6332-8fd0-5c44-b676-171f640686b2.html


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on April 01, 2016, 07:01:31 pm
OKLAHOMA CITY – Attorney General Scott Pruitt announced Thursday that the Fifteenth Multicounty Grand Jury returned an accusation of removal for Wagoner County Sheriff Robert Steven Colbert. Additionally, the grand jury indicted Colbert and Deputy Jeffrey T. Gragg on bribery and extortion charges.

Pressure from the police unions on the state AG "Blank Check" Pruitt to keep the forfeiture industry looking legitimate.




Deputy Gragg two days later opened a sheriff's drug forfeiture account in the Wagoner County treasurer's office and deposited the $10,000, according to the indictment.

Colbert was elected sheriff in 2008 after retiring from the Oklahoma Highway Patrol, where he often participated in drug stops.

Sen. Kyle Loveless pushed for legislation requiring a criminal conviction before property could be forfeited. He later agreed to some exceptions in an effort to meet law enforcement concerns. His bill died anyway this year.



http://newsok.com/grand-jury-indicts-wagoner-county-sheriff-calls-for-his-removal/article/5488745


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on April 04, 2016, 08:49:43 am
Kind of sounds like someone got left out.  What I’m not understanding though is it does not appear from the story that the sheriff nor his deputy embezzled the money then used it for personal purposes, unless I read that wrong.  It sounds like the money went directly to the WC Treasurer’s office.

What CF had to say about confiscations like this is chilling.  I can think of times I’ve had large amounts of cash on hand to purchase a vehicle.  When my sole business was dealing in antique Harleys, having large sums of cash on me driving along an interstate was not an uncommon occurrence.  The idea that a cop can simply say: “That’s got to be drug money, so I’m seizing it and I’m arresting you” never ran across my mind.  At large antique motorcycle or auto swap meets, there’s easily hundreds of thousands of dollars in cash moving around at any given time.  That could be a target-rich environment for rogue cops.



As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be....Graft/corruption without end.  Amen,...Amen...!



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on April 04, 2016, 07:12:27 pm

As it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be....Graft/corruption without end.  Amen,...Amen...!







http://dailysignal.com/2016/02/29/inside-the-push-to-make-it-harder-for-government-to-steal-property-cash-in-americas-heartland/

Apache, Okla., Chief of Police Stephen Mills had his Ford F-250 seized by law enforcement in 2010. He’s since come out as a vocal opponent of civil forfeiture.



After months of public promotion, Sen. Kyle Loveless,’ R-Oklahoma City, civil asset forfeiture reform package died Tuesday at the Capitol at the hands of the judiciary committee, which refused to hear the bill.
http://www.normantranscript.com/news/government/judiciary-committee-refuses-to-hear-sen-loveless-asset-seizure-reform/article_00bfd82e-5c0a-56f3-ada1-e72a2f3475eb.html

(http://dailysignal.com/wp-content/uploads/160226_policing-profit-map_v2.png)



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: AquaMan on April 05, 2016, 08:35:52 am
Its certainly no secret why they are along 40. I bet there are plenty on 35 as well. These are high traffic arterials for drug smuggling. Of course the locals depend on that trade to fund their communities.

Several analogies come to mind: highwaymen from feudal times, Jesse James' comment about why he robbed banks, and of course the Watergate character Deep Throat, "follow the money".

And of course, "the more things change, the more they stay the same".


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: RecycleMichael on April 05, 2016, 09:52:01 am
I always speculated that highway drug stops were just covering intelligence from some snitch. Now the perp thinks he was stopped because of a taillight and snitch gets to live.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: cannon_fodder on April 05, 2016, 12:28:38 pm
Its certainly no secret why they are along 40. I bet there are plenty on 35 as well. These are high traffic arterials for drug smuggling....

Other than I-40, I-44, I-244, I-35, US 69, the Indian Nations, and highways 54, 56, 64, 69, 81, 83, 169, 287, and 412... there aren't any highways in Oklahoma known for drug smuggling that I know of. But we also suspect private an 149 private airports, rail, and river ports.

https://www.justice.gov/archive/ndic/pubs2/2286/overview.htm

When everything is known to be arterials for drug smuggling, it is meaningless.  Every major highway coming from Mexico is a "known drug trafficking route." And every road branching out from those. While obviously there is truth to it, on a deeper level its utter nonsense. 


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on April 05, 2016, 01:31:30 pm
I always speculated that highway drug stops were just covering intelligence from some snitch. Now the perp thinks he was stopped because of a taillight and snitch gets to live.

Today its more illegal wiretaping, since Homeland Security apparently hands out Stingrays and DRT boxes to police departments like throwing candy in a parade.  Part of the licensing agreement is they are never allowed to talk about it -- to judges, lawyers, media, anyone, or they revoke the license and remotely "brick" the fake cell site device.
"You should think of some reason to stop this car on this highway around this time, but you didnt hear that from us."

"Broken taillight" is just "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" for "I cant tell you how I know this,"  yet I still get a kick when I see on TV some naive crime reporter not connecting the dots when all these million-dollar drug busts seem to start with that pesky broken taillight.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: cannon_fodder on April 05, 2016, 02:19:35 pm
Broken Taillight, failure to turn into the near lane, "erratic driving," swerving onto the shoulder - whatever excuse they want to use is fine. Pretextual stops have been ruled legal. Meaning it is OK for them to pull you over as long as they can voice a semi-reasonable explanation even if the true intention of pulling you over is something illegal ("black guys always have drugs"). 

And yep. The cell phone tracking is well documented. Which is probably illegal, but isn't my main point. My main point is that the police and district attorneys are told to lie about it to the defense and to judges. And they do.  I will say it again: the federal government told police and district attorney offices to lie about the source of their data so defendants cannot use it to obtain a fair trial, and police and district attorneys comply with that request.

Prosecutors are required by law to disclose the information, and when asked about it they assert that they do. And I believe prosecutors are many times more likely to do so than police. Then again, prosecutors work as closely with police as anyone... and rarely if ever manage to "crack" corruption probes. I don't know if TPD uses such devices, and the people I know at the Tulsa County District Attorney office are good people - but the temptation to get the job done and the need to work tomorrow with law enforcement sure would make it hard to cross them.

Quote
“I am astounded at the extent to which police have been so aggressively using this technology, how long they’ve been using it and the extent to which they have gone to create ruses to shield that use,” Stephen Mercer, the chief of forensics for Maryland’s public defenders, said.

Prosecutors said they, too, are sometimes left in the dark. "When our prosecutors are made aware that a detective used a cell-site stimulator, it is disclosed; however we rely upon the Police Department to provide us with that information," said Tammy Brown, a spokeswoman for the Baltimore's State's Attorney. "We are currently working with the Police Department to improve upon the process to better obtain this information in order to comply with the law.”

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/08/23/baltimore-police-stingray-cell-surveillance/31994181/

Here's an idea. When you use wiretaps to obtain an arrest, you tell the DA in your probably cause affidavit "we used a wiretap/cell phone grabber to obtain our probably cause."  Which is, you know, required by the US Constitution.

This article tells how its done:

Step 1: Without the probable cause needed for a warrant, obtain permission to seek "limited data" from the cell phone company
Step 2: Use that "limited data" to hack into cell phone transmissions and gather whatever information you want, including call and text intercepts
Step 3: Come up with some other reason to arrest the person
Step 4: Lie to the Court, the defense attorney, and the public

The only City that has been investigated in this regard is Baltimore, and they used it to arrest more than 2000 people. Usually illegally:
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/03/maryland-stingray-appeals-court-opinion

This has been going on for years:
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/03/police-hid-use-of-cell-phone-tracking-device-from-judge-because-of-nda/

But don't worry citizen, we are violating your Constitutional rights to keep you safe. Big Brother has your back. Right comrade?


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on April 05, 2016, 02:51:18 pm
Like I said....as it was in the beginning....




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on April 11, 2016, 06:53:13 pm
Kind of sounds like someone got left out.



The indictment against the officers alleges Gragg opened a Sheriff's Drug Forfeiture Account on Dec. 15, 2014, and deposited the $10,000 there, but that Gragg did not deliver a forfeiture affidavit for the money to the District Attorney's Office until Dec. 3, 2015, two days after he testified before the grand jury,

Colbert agreed to be suspended with pay as of Thursday during a court appearance on the jury's accusation for removal, which accuses him of extortion, willful neglect of duty and mismanagement of public funds.

Chief Deputy Shannon Clark, the county's spokesman, said after the meeting that the department hopes a resolution will be reached soon.


http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/state/wagoner-county-holds-off-on-appointing-acting-sheriff-during-bob/article_8fc9dae3-a9a0-5a4e-8d2c-812581169ada.html



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Townsend on April 25, 2016, 03:48:49 pm
Always nice when Oklahoma makes international news for our fine acts of righteousness:

Muskogee County to refund $50,000 raised for Asian orphans, students that was seized in traffic stop

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/muskogee-county-to-refund-raised-for-asian-orphans-students-that/article_81e97275-db64-5fc5-8568-bf0d680bb2e3.html (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/muskogee-county-to-refund-raised-for-asian-orphans-students-that/article_81e97275-db64-5fc5-8568-bf0d680bb2e3.html)

Quote
MUSKOGEE — The Muskogee County District Attorney on Monday said he dismissed criminal charges and a civil asset forfeiture case in which law enforcement seized $53,000 from a man during a Feb. 27 traffic stop.

Eh Wah, who lives in Dallas and is originally from Myanmar, told authorities the money was for a Thai orphanage and a nonprofit Christian school in Myanmar. Law enforcement seized the money and indicated it would not be returned. On Monday, Muskogee County officials said the money would be given back.

A Washington Post story reported on the issue ahead of a press release issued by the man’s attorneys Monday.

District Attorney Orvil Loge told the Tulsa World he has dismissed a felony drug-related charge and efforts to keep cash belonging to Eh Wah, the tour manager for Burmese Christian rock band The Klo & Kweh Music Team. Money also will be refunded to the band, its bassist, an Omaha-Nebraska-based church and an orphanage. Loge said his office will mail a check for the full balance of what was seized to Eh Wah's attorneys, and that he made his decision Monday afternoon based on information that came to light in media reports.

"I looked at the case today and spoke with the officers, and we agreed that now that we've filed the case, our burden of proof had been elevated," Loge said of the felony matter. "We thought we would not be able to meet our burden of proof, so we had to act. And that's what I did this afternoon."

Eh Wah was pulled over on U.S. 69 for having a broken brake light about 6:30 p.m. Feb. 27. A probable cause affidavit in the felony case against Eh Wah, 40, states a deputy's K-9 dog had a positive alert on Eh Wah's vehicle, which prompted deputies to search the car, where they found $53,234 in cash. The affidavit does not state the deputy found any drugs or other contraband, but that the money was seized "due to the inconsistent stories and Wah (being) unable to confirm the money was his."

Loge said Eh Wah agreed to a search of the vehicle after telling the deputies he did not have contraband or associated proceeds inside. He added that what the deputies found "wasn't consistent with normal carrying of cash transactions."

Attorneys from the Institute for Justice, a Virginia-based nonprofit libertarian-leaning law firm, say Eh Wah had a hard time communicating with deputies because he speaks imperfect English. The Institute for Justice's website states the cash came from ticket sales, offerings and donations made during the band's tour in such places as Illinois, New York and Texas.

Institute for Justice senior attorney Matt Miller told the Tulsa World that deputies questioned his client for about an hour on the side of the road before taking him in for a nearly five-hour interrogation. Miller said Eh Wah received a warning for the tail light and questioned why the department would release someone they suspected of committing drug offenses.

The District Attorney's Office filed a notice of seizure and forfeiture March 11, which Eh Wah, the Klo & Kweh Music Team, the Omaha, Nebraska-based Karen Christian Revival Church Inc., the Hsa Thoo Lei Orphanage and bassist Saw Win Ston challenged formally on Friday. Eh Wah was charged April 5 with acquiring drug proceeds, which Miller claimed was a way for prosecutors to get leverage in the forfeiture case.

Eh Wah appeared in Muskogee County for his criminal case on Monday and had been told to return in July before Loge dismissed his case Monday afternoon. In a phone interview with the Tulsa World on Monday morning, Wah said the situation was "the most unpleasant, terrifying experience you can imagine."

"I was shocked and scared the first time I learned I had a warrant on me," Eh Wah said. "My parents, they were terrified. We never thought any time in our lives we'd see something like this. We didn't do anything that would be close to this kind of thing, the drug thing. ... You wake up in the morning, and it's the first thing in your mind."

Miller said his client explained to the deputies that he was with a Christian rock band from Myanmar and had accompanied the band on its U.S. tour, which reached 19 churches by that point. He said Eh Wah put the deputies in touch with the band's leader, who confirmed the money was raised lawfully.

"There were no drugs in the car. There was no drug paraphernalia. He had a perfectly legitimate reason to be in possession of all that cash," Miller said.

Eh Wah said in court documents that he owns $2,000 of the seized cash but that he had all of it in his possession for safekeeping during the band's tour. But Muskogee County Sheriff Charles Pearson said Monday that Eh Wah's explanation had "some inconsistencies" that led his deputies to believe the cash was possibly related to drug proceeds.

Pearson said the Sheriff's Office isn't trying to deprive citizens of their civil rights or their cash from charity proceeds but asserted he needs to keep the community safe. He didn't comment on specifics about Eh Wah's case, however, deferring such requests to the district attorney.

"You've got (U.S.) 69 running north and south all the way to Galveston, then you've got I-40 going east and west," he said. "Muskogee County is a major transfer point. We get a lot of drugs. It's just a major thoroughfare. ... I think we did our due diligence to investigate this case in particular."

But Miller said Muskogee County's drug issues have nothing to do with Eh Wah, whom he described as "the straightest, narrowest guy you would ever hope to meet" because he does not drink or smoke and has only received one parking ticket in his life.

Miller said the use of civil asset forfeiture in this case amounted to "policing for profit," citing Oklahoma's related laws that allow law enforcement to use seized funds without proper oversight from a legislative body of elected officials.

Oklahoma State Sen. Kyle Loveless last year introduced a bill to reform the state's civil asset forfeiture laws, which ultimately died in committee. The Institute for Justice's report on the issue assigned Oklahoma a D-minus grade in part because authorities only need to meet the preponderance of evidence standard in order to seize assets from citizens.

When asked about the use of civil asset forfeiture laws in Eh Wah's case, Loge maintained the justice system served Eh Wah properly.

"Civil forfeiture laws are designed to take criminal proceeds off the streets, and they're also designed to protect those that legitimately make money," he said. "We had probable cause to act as we did, and in the world of justice things come to light. In this case, it did. Mr. Wah was without his money for almost two months. And that's a lot of money. Ultimately he's getting his money back, and the justice system worked."

Damn...how guilty does Muskogee County sound?


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on April 25, 2016, 07:19:21 pm
Always nice when Oklahoma makes international news for our fine acts of righteousness:

Muskogee County to refund $50,000 raised for Asian orphans, students that was seized in traffic stop

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/muskogee-county-to-refund-raised-for-asian-orphans-students-that/article_81e97275-db64-5fc5-8568-bf0d680bb2e3.html (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/muskogee-county-to-refund-raised-for-asian-orphans-students-that/article_81e97275-db64-5fc5-8568-bf0d680bb2e3.html)

Damn...how guilty does Muskogee County sound?


This guilty


Law enforcement agencies in Oklahoma are upset with attempts in their state legislature to reform the practice known as civil asset forfeiture, the legal tool that allows law enforcement officers to seize property suspected of being involved in, or derived from, illegal activity.

These groups have laid out a parade of horribles so extreme that Oklahomans have been led to believe that reforming forfeiture will lead to decapitated bodies swinging from bridges in Tulsa and Oklahoma City, as Mexican drug cartels spread throughout the state like an unchecked cancer.

Worse, the law enforcement groups say that without lax forfeiture laws, Oklahoma would be powerless to stop money from reaching, of all things, ISIS.


http://dailysignal.com/2016/02/02/oklahoma-law-enforcement-use-outrageous-claims-to-prevent-reform-legislation/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: dbacksfan 2.0 on April 25, 2016, 07:34:15 pm

This guilty


Law enforcement agencies in Oklahoma are upset with attempts in their state legislature to reform the practice known as civil asset forfeiture, the legal tool that allows law enforcement officers to seize property suspected of being involved in, or derived from, illegal activity.

These groups have laid out a parade of horribles so extreme that Oklahomans have been led to believe that reforming forfeiture will lead to decapitated bodies swinging from bridges in Tulsa and Oklahoma City, as Mexican drug cartels spread throughout the state like an unchecked cancer.

Worse, the law enforcement groups say that without lax forfeiture laws, Oklahoma would be powerless to stop money from reaching, of all things, ISIS.


http://dailysignal.com/2016/02/02/oklahoma-law-enforcement-use-outrageous-claims-to-prevent-reform-legislation/


Good to see the copsterbater is doing their usual good job of turning this into "COPSBEHAVINGBADLY.COM" Woohoo. How many other states will you bag on that have no relation?

Yeah, we get it, you have an agenda. Create your own website for it. God, you bitched at me, but Christ, you crucify every LEO and agency in the US. So are you following the money hungry unjust meter maids? I'm sure that they are totally out of line in your eyes.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on April 27, 2016, 12:03:11 pm
Good to see the copsterbater is doing their usual good job of turning this into "COPSBEHAVINGBADLY.COM" Woohoo. How many other states will you bag on that have no relation?

Yeah, we get it, you have an agenda. Create your own website for it. God, you bitched at me, but Christ, you crucify every LEO and agency in the US. So are you following the money hungry unjust meter maids? I'm sure that they are totally out of line in your eyes.


Thanks for balancing this discussion with the police perspective.  The "How dare you raise public attention to us getting caught stealing from a church when we risk our lives every day protecting you worthless people from ISIS" adds a lot....really, it does.

'DA Orvil Loge explained that after "meeting with the officers" it was decided that the legal team "would not be able to meet the burden of proof in the criminal case and in the civil case"'  but where is that due dilligence when the world media isnt looking over your shoulder?

They only got their money back after being shamed by the Washington Post.  ....and they do have a website:

Why Oklahoma cops are returning $53,000 to a Christian band, an orphanage and a church
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/04/26/why-oklahoma-cops-are-returning-53000-to-a-christian-band-an-orphanage-and-a-church/


So what happened in humble Oklahoma is now a national news item, http://oklahomawatch.org/2016/04/25/washington-post-state-deputies-seize-christian-bands-money/
Even the former Soviet Union is rubbing our nose in our corruption  https://www.rt.com/usa/340922-oklahoma-police-money-charity/


but why should we care enough to discuss it in TulsaNow?

"The real tragedy is not what happened in this case, but it's what happens in all the other cases when there isn’t a national public interest law firm to represent people, and there isn’t story in The Washington Post and other outlets that explain what's going on, and instead somebody can’t fight this."



"Law enforcement was saying a month or two ago that there is no forfeiture abuse in Oklahoma, and I think this case illustrates that's dead wrong."
"This case is just the highlight of all of that -- no drugs, no priors, no reason to take their money, none whatsoever."

"In Oklahoma and the United States of America, the government should not be able to take your stuff unless they can prove it's tied to a crime," he said. "And that's just not happening."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/oklahoma-civil-forfeiture-christian-band_us_571e54bee4b0d0042da9e0f8


http://reason.com/blog/2016/04/25/oklahoma-deputies-seize-thousands-raised
http://gawker.com/oklahoma-sheriffs-deputies-took-53-000-from-a-christia-1772887400




Its stealing. They interrigated him roadside. They interrogated him 6 hours at booking.  They watched the church videos, looked at the concert proceeds, and Facebook, talked to the band and the orphanage.  They knew what they were doing and who they were stealing from. There was no "were only human" mistakes but rather conspiracy from the D.A. on down.

Also, knowing that the sheriff in the next county got busted for the same thing didnt seem to phase them one bit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_1t_8buFzw


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on May 03, 2016, 06:40:32 pm
A former FBI agent pleaded guilty this week to stealing more than $136,000 in cash that was seized in the course of drug investigations and admitted to using the money to buy two cars and to pay for his wife’s plastic surgery.
Scott M. Bowman of Moreno Valley, California stole the money over a two-month period in 2014 while he was assigned to an anti-gang task force, according to his plea agreement.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/3/scott-bowman-former-fbi-agent-pleads-guilty-steali/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on May 08, 2016, 06:14:05 pm
Neenah police raided Eagle Nation Cycles in 2012 in an attempt, shop owner Steven V. Erato has alleged, to put the shop out of business, seize the building and profit from its resale to a developer. Hoffer, a former undercover drug cop, participated in that raid. Significant evidence exists that while in the shop Hoffer planted drugs in the shop office then erased about 30 seconds from the security video that showed him doing it. Police seemed to consider the bike shop a public nuisance as well as a policing for profit opportunity.

Wisconsin Attorney General Brad Schimel, ruled that SWAT officers Craig Hoffer and Robert Ross were innocent of killing hostage Michael L. Funk during a standoff last December, because he believed their excuse for murdering the man in cold blood.

Hoffer and Ross were innocent because of what they imagined. The men imagined that there were no hostages and that the call to police was part of a conspiracy to lure them into a trap.

http://www.agingrebel.com/14197


We watched more than 90 videos related to officers shooting a hostage outside Eagle Nation Cycles on Dec. 5, and have come to one conclusion: We have no confidence the leadership of the Neenah Police Department can run a force that protects its citizens.

Most of all, we are outraged about the fact that a police officer gunned down a man and laughed about it.

http://www.postcrescent.com/story/opinion/editorials/2016/05/06/neenah-police-department-violates-trust/84034648/

http://www.postcrescent.com/story/news/2016/05/06/attorney-general-releases-videos-neenah-shooting/84025308/



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on May 13, 2016, 09:33:35 am
Trying to seize the property might have been a goal (and certainly at the heart of a feud) but ambushing the owner (and laughing as he bled out) makes it hard to argue that it was a mistake. 

https://photographyisnotacrime.com/2016/04/video-proves-wisconsin-police-lied-about-shooting-and-killing-hostage-during-standoff/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on June 09, 2016, 11:29:39 pm

The Oklahoma Department of Public Safety has purchased several devices capable of seizing funds loaded on to prepaid debit cards to aid troopers in roadside seizures of suspected drug-trafficking proceeds.

The portable card scanners are designed to be carried in law enforcement vehicles, allow troopers to freeze and seize money loaded onto a prepaid debit card, and to return money to an account whose funds were seized or frozen.

The vehicle-mounted scanners are also capable of retrieving and storing limited account information from other cards as well, such as banking debit cards, credit cards and “payment account information from virtually any magnetic stripe card."

(The card-reader manufacturer) ERAD Group, will receive a 7.7 percent cut of all funds seized via the card readers.



http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/state/new-front-in-civil-forfeiture-authorities-get-devices-to-seize/article_4a16da04-374b-51fe-aeab-2ad804b6b83a.html




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on June 10, 2016, 08:12:42 pm
Oklahoma Forfeiture Furor


A furor has erupted in the last two days over the use of open loop debit card readers by the Oklahoma Highway Patrol.

Oklahoma has a sordid history of using civil forfeiture laws to steal from citizens in order to enrich police departments and individuals connected to the law enforcement industry. In 2013, an anonymous district attorney in the state used $5,000 from a forfeiture fund to pay off his student loans. Another unnamed, Oklahoma prosecutor lived rent free in a seized house for five years and paid his utility bills with forfeited money. Two months ago, Wagoner County Sheriff Bob Colbert and Deputy Jeffrey Gragg were indicted for illegally seizing $10,000 in cash from a driver after a “routine traffic stop.” On February 27, greedy and crooked Oklahoma cops seized $53,000 from the manager of  Christian rock band. The manager planned to donate the money to an orphanage in Myanmar. Cops accused him of being a drug dealer. The case became a national scandal.

Asset forfeiture is the euphemism that describes the seizure of private property and money from people accused of drug crimes. The key word is “accused.” In order to get their money or property back victims of asset forfeiture must hire a lawyer and sue. It has become a major source of funding for police departments all over the country. The cops get to keep what they steal. Seventy percent of forfeiture expenditures in Oklahoma are used to pay cops.

The Good News

The Oklahoma card readers will be used by traffic cops who patrol Interstate Highway 40. Numerous commentators have expressed outrage that police in Oklahoma could simply contrive a traffic stops, accuse their victim of drug trafficking, pull the debit cards from their victim’s wallet and use the new card readers to steal all the money in a victim’s bank account. Wednesday in the Washington Post, Radley Balko reported “the Oklahoma Highway Patrol has a device that also allows them to seize money in your bank account or on prepaid cards.”

“Here’s how it works. If a trooper suspects you may have money tied to some type of crime, the highway patrol can scan any cards you have and seize the money.”

Then Balko quoted a cretinous Oklahoma Highway Patrol spokesman who explained, “We’re gonna look for different factors in the way that you’re acting. We’re gonna look for if there’s a difference in your story. If there’s someway that we can prove that you’re falsifying information to us about your business.”

The good news is that things aren’t quite that bad yet. Balko got it wrong.

Some Details

First, police cannot touch your cards until after they arrest you. Then, as part of what is often called a post-arrest “inventory search,” while they make a list of the belongings on your person, they can scan your debit card.

Secondly, the card readers do not allow police to steal your bank accounts. The seizures can only be made on prepaid debit cards – cards that are “loaded” in advance with some amount of money at an outlet like Green Dot or Walmart. Those are an alternative to carrying cash. The readers cannot interact with cards connected to a legitimate bank account.

Prepaid debit cards come in two flavors – called open loop and closed loop. Closed loop cards are your prepaid Starbucks or Target card. They can only be used instead of cash for purchases at one business. Open loop prepaid cards can be used anywhere, wherever – for example – Visa or MasterCard are accepted. For the last four years, the Department of Homeland Security has been encouraged to think of open loop cards as a tool of criminals and terrorists. For example, one common argument goes, buying an airplane ticket with cash raises immediate alarms but buying an airplane ticket with an open loop card does not.
T. Jack Williams

And, the principal alarmist behind this fear that open loop debit cards are a national threat is a man named T. Jack Williams. Williams is currently the president of a company called Paymentcard Services, Inc. According to his resume, Williams clients “include multiple federal and state law enforcement agencies including DHS, ICE, and USSS, all of which utilize Mr. Williams as a payment card subject matter expert. His expertise ranges from global infrastructure to forensics, targeting the criminal use of prepaid cards to launder money or finance terrorists.” At a hearing in Carson City, Nevada in March 2015 Williams described himself as “the inventor of the prepaid card.”

In 2012, Williams started another company called ERAD Group, Inc., which is named after the Department of Homeland Security Science and Technology Directorate’s Electronic Recovery and Access to Data (ERAD) initiative. The readers have been around since 2012. Williams landed a contract with Homeland Security that year. According to Homeland Security, the card readers are supposed to be used to detect “fraudulent cards.”

“The ERAD Prepaid Card Reader is a small, handheld device that uses wireless connectivity to allow law enforcement officers in the field to check the balance of cards,” the Department states. “This allows for identification of suspicious prepaid cards and the ability to put a temporary hold on the linked funds until a full investigation can be completed.”

Oklahoma is buying its card readers from ERAD Group, Inc., and according to the contract the state signed with ERAD, Williams will get 7.7 percent of the money seized using the card readers. And it is all perfectly legal.

The Law

Earlier this year, in a “proprietary and confidential” brochure aimed at law enforcement agencies:

Williams argued that according to US v. Alabi and US v. Bah “interrogating the magnetic stripe of a confiscated credit, debit or prepaid card does not violate an individual’s Fourth Amendment rights.” He reads Riley v. California to mean “individuals do not have privacy rights with magnetic stripe cards.” And he tells his potential police customers that the cases Oklahoma v. Eighty Three (83) Walmart Gift Cards and various MasterCards and Visa Cards and US v. Ross William Ulbricht, ak/a “Dread Pirate Roberts,” a/k/a “DPR,” a/k/a “Silk Road” instruct that “prepaid cash cards are…currency.”

The bad news is that this is just the beginning.  http://www.agingrebel.com/14314


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on June 14, 2016, 06:39:57 pm
Apparently some corporations have already banned employees from traveling to Oklahoma as a result.
“We simply cannot risk seizure of our employees’ and our company’s assets based upon the whims of an honorable, dedicated, and well-intentioned Oklahoma

Highway Patrol Officer,”
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/state/concerns-come-from-out-of-state-on-oklahoma-s-civil/article_1b61ff35-57f3-5103-be72-09773ad2ee69.html



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on June 14, 2016, 06:43:08 pm
http://www.freedomworks.org/content/elderly-oklahoma-couple-experienced-government-overreach-first-hand-botched-raid


Mannford Couple Allege Malicious Prosecution in Botched Drug Raid
http://www.wirthlawoffice.com/tulsa-attorney-blog/2013/12/mannford-couple-allege-malicious-prosecution-botched-drug-raid.  A Wirth Law Office client has filed a federal civil rights suit alleging malicious prosecution when police raided her home based on a search warrant that targeted a nearby residence. The woman and her husband filed the federal case against Creek County after a court dismissed bogus charges stemming from the raid. Wirth Law Office Attorney Peter Knowles had asked the court to dismiss the case because of the faulty search warrant.

The Mannford couple’s civil rights claim details a nightmarish chain of events that could happen to anyone. Nothing in the case suggests Donald Goss – a disabled veteran – or his wife Linda Goss ever did anything to provoke the police invasion of their residence. Their federal case says prosecutors filed charges against the couple to cover up sloppy police work.

Their misfortune was to live down the street from a residence that a confidential informant had allegedly identified as the home of a marijuana dealer. The errant drug raid unfolded when two digits in the street number of the real target house were transposed.
Investigators Added Insults to Injuries

When police pepper sprayed the family dog then barged into her home on March 31, 2012, Linda Goss was home alone. She spent the next three days in jail, deprived of medication, food, adequate clothing and legal counsel before she returned home.

By then, she and her husband had posted $100,000 bond. Mr. Goss had been battered by a fellow inmate and berated by investigators. Police tried to bargain a false confession for his wife’s freedom, then demeaned his manhood when he refused.

The couple was released from jail around midnight with no cash and no vehicle. Their money and family truck had been impounded. They never saw the truck again.

Police warned them not to try to get it out of impound, yet a credit company foreclosed on a loan and auctioned the truck.

Camping gear and a generator the unlikely defendant had been carrying in his truck when he arrived home during he raid were taken and never returned. His fishing boat was seized only to be returned with holes in the hull. Some firearms seized from his home were returned damaged. Others were not returned at all.

Police never provided the couple an inventory of property seized during the unwarranted raid on the their Creek County home. Instead, the couple was charged with possession of methamphetamine, maintaining a place for sale of controlled substances and possession of a firearm during commission of a felony.

The only evidence prosecutors could muster to justify terrorizing the Mannford couple was a small amount of an innocuous substance found in a bag near the couple’s couch. Police claimed a field test indicated it might be a methamphetamine, but the cops’ drug dog found no evidence of drugs.

Police found none of the marijuana or scales they were seeking in a warrant that described a residence regularly used for drug sales. Nonetheless, the police raiding party refused to call off their search when Mrs. Goss insisted she did not know the person named in the warrant.
Evidence Lost, Hearings Delayed

A key piece of evidence — the original search warrant that showed police had raided the wrong house – mysteriously disappeared from court files. The case dragged on for months, with prosecutors repeatedly delaying a hearing where Knowles could contest prosecutors’ lack of evidence.

Meanwhile, the couple provided prosecutors results of hair-follicle drug tests that showed they had not used illegal drugs, but prosecutors forged ahead with their case. Knowles only learned the substance taken from their home tested negative for drugs when a lab report was released four and a half months after the raid – on same day a preliminary hearing had been rescheduled for the third time.

Even then, prosecutors refused to admit their error. Wirth Law Office’s Creek County criminal defense attorney filed a motion to suppress evidence seized in the illegal search. With no evidence to support their case, prosecutors also filed a motion to dismiss, but prosecutors wanted the case dismissed without prejudice, holding out the threat that they could refile the case later. Prosecutors claimed subsequent tests might prove the innocuous substance entered into evidence was an illegal drug.

When Wirth Law Office defense attorney Peter Knowles persisted in arguing for dismissal with prejudice so the case could not be re-opened, prosecutors threatened to charge the elderly couple with selling “turkey dope” — apparently the prosecution’s term for counterfeit drugs. Problem with that threat was, nobody had claimed the couple ever sold drugs to anybody. Police had simply raided the wrong house.

No Excuse For Mistaken Raid

Although police claimed they had mistaken the house based on a transposed street number, they also claimed someone had already shown them the right house.

Their confidential informant had pointed to the alleged marijuana dealer’s house down the street but they still got it wrong.

Ms. Goss repeatedly told police did not know the person named in the warrant. Instead of considering her statement, they jailed her and for three days while she was in jail deprived her of her right to an attorney.

The couple is seeking compensation in excess of $75,000 on each of 10 counts in their civil rights claim. Their charges against the county include:

    Unlawful search and seizure
    Unlawful and degrading detention
    Trespass
    Assault and battery
    False arrest and imprisonment
    Taking personal property without due process
    Damage to personal property
    Negligent and intentional infliction of emotional distress
    Malicious prosecution

The couple’s malicious prosecution claim rests on the fact that police and prosecutors refused to check the search warrant after it became evident person named in the warrant did not live at the house police raided. Instead, they attempted to contrive a case against the couple, then used seizure of their property and the threat of prosecuting the man’s wife to get him to plea guilty to crimes he did not commit.

Botched Raids Put Everyone At Risk

The Mannford couple’s nightmare could happen to anyone when police and prosecutors refuse to admit their own mistakes. The couple’s civil rights case says police tried to cover up sloppy police work by coercing innocent citizens to take the rap for police mistakes.

The couple’s nightmare is still not over. They are out tens of thousands of dollars. They lost a truck, a boat and other belongings. Most people’s sense of trust in police would be forever shattered by such an unexpected and relentless assault on their home and their freedom.

The problem started in an instant, but it took weeks and months to unravel the malicious case the county filed to cover up its mistake. Getting compensation for their lost property might take even longer – if they are ever fairly compensated for the offensive behavior their county government imposed on them.

The Goss’s aren’t the only ones who’ve been victimized in recent years by errant police raids. Victims of botched raids are left to pay bond or sit in jail, pay attorney fees, lose personal property and suffer traumatic stress from being treated as criminals by no fault of their own. There have even been cases where citizens died as the result of botched police raids.

When police are more eager to make a case than to be sure they’re doing their public job correctly, taxpayers can be left holding the bill for damages caused by careless police actions. The simple solution is for police agencies to hire qualified officers who take time to verify that they are targeting the right address before they launch raids that can be far more dangerous than any outlawed drug they might hope to find.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: AquaMan on June 18, 2016, 07:16:53 am
Four years ago. Any coverage in local media or response by local/state "leaders" who insist the safety of their constituents is their prime concern?


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: MyDogHunts on June 18, 2016, 08:07:32 pm
USA, USA, USA...  We are #1, Wooo! (Stephen Colbert:  "Wooo!")

I'm an old tool.  I no longer own a car. I keep a low profile.  Shi*t happens way too often.  Frankly, I'm scared.  I just want to hang out long enough to see either a metiorite, an earthquake, political insanity, or zombies.

I have personal knowledge of a case where property was siezed by police with no cause.  pancakes.  Corporations have more protection than citizens.  $$$ rules, rocks, & rolls.

Wooo!




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on June 21, 2016, 11:36:52 am
Good to see the copsterbater is doing their usual good job of turning this into "COPSBEHAVINGBADLY.COM" Woohoo. How many other states will you bag on that have no relation?

Yeah, we get it, you have an agenda. Create your own website for it. God, you bitched at me, but Christ, you crucify every LEO and agency in the US. So are you following the money hungry unjust meter maids? I'm sure that they are totally out of line in your eyes.



Really?  Just showing the reality is turning it into "COPSBEHAVINGBADLY.COM" ?  Yeah, he is a single topic radical protester, but he doesn't make all the LEO's bad - the ones spotlighted are doing it themselves.  He just shows what they do, which IS the actual bad stuff here.  We need more rabble rousers in this country!!




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on June 21, 2016, 11:37:47 am
USA, USA, USA...  We are #1, Wooo! (Stephen Colbert:  "Wooo!")

I'm an old tool.  I no longer own a car. I keep a low profile.  Shi*t happens way too often.  Frankly, I'm scared.  I just want to hang out long enough to see either a metiorite, an earthquake, political insanity, or zombies.

I have personal knowledge of a case where property was siezed by police with no cause.  pancakes.  Corporations have more protection than citizens.  $$$ rules, rocks, & rolls.

Wooo!




*Like*




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on June 23, 2016, 02:07:54 pm

Really?  Just showing the reality is turning it into "COPSBEHAVINGBADLY.COM" ?  Yeah, he is a single topic radical protester, but he doesn't make all the LEO's bad - the ones spotlighted are doing it themselves.  He just shows what they do, which IS the actual bad stuff here.  We need more rabble rousers in this country!!



We do need more watchdogs, but chances are its going to be print media (rather than TV) because officials cant dangle sound byte access over their heads as punishment for asking tough questions (now its only fair to point out that it was an OKC TV station that broke the story   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d1orO7nUu8).

The Department of Public Safety said the devices are not used to access personal banking or credit card information but are used to read financial information on things such as gift cards and hotel key cards.

DPS sought to use the readers to gain access to bank accounts; however, the vendor declined that request because that would have violated federal banking and privacy laws.


http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/capitol_report/groups-ask-gov-mary-fallin-for-executive-order-to-stop/article_eb25854b-c8d6-5096-a646-2f27b88e289b.html

They were designed to copy anything with a magnetic stripe, save that data, or use it to clone another card... but we have their word they wont.

A few days ago Gov. Failin justified the card readers saying  "More than 25 states use the card-reading devices"  but the same number of states have legal medical marijuana so whats the holdup?  ;)


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on June 23, 2016, 02:54:35 pm


The Department of Public Safety said the devices are not used to access personal banking or credit card information but are used to read financial information on things such as gift cards and hotel key cards.

DPS sought to use the readers to gain access to bank accounts; however, the vendor declined that request because that would have violated federal banking and privacy laws.




For now.  Anyone think that is where they will stop?  I got some swamp land I would just love to sell...!


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on August 11, 2016, 10:17:06 am

Anyone think that is where they will stop?  I got some swamp land I would just love to sell...!





WASHINGTON — Federal drug agents regularly mine Americans’ travel information to profile people who might be ferrying money for narcotics traffickers — though they almost never use what they learn to make arrests or build criminal cases.

Instead, that targeting has helped the Drug Enforcement Administration seize a small fortune in cash.
Most of the money was passed on to local police departments that lend officers to assist the drug agency.

“They count on this as part of the budget,” said Louis Weiss, a former supervisor of the DEA group assigned to Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport. “Basically, you’ve got to feed the monster.”



http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016/08/10/dea-travel-record-airport-seizures/88474282/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on October 09, 2016, 07:46:24 pm

I have personal knowledge of a case where property was siezed by police with no cause.  pancakes.  Corporations have more protection than citizens.  $$$ rules, rocks, & rolls.




Officer Ted Nelson has recently undergone a slight change in his career. The police officer formerly in charge of training Michigan’s law enforcement on civil asset forfeiture in the 1980s, Ted is now a member of Law Enforcement Against Prohibition (LEAP), a non-profit group of former police officers and judges who oppose the drug war. Ted agreed to speak to me on behalf of himself; his opinions do not necessarily represent those of LEAP.

TLO: Ted, you were in charge of training Michigan’s law enforcement about how to use civil asset forfeiture back in the 1980s. Would you mind telling me a bit about that?

I was on a narcotics enforcement team at the time and was very interested in asset forfeiture and became the instructor for all the state police in Michigan to learn about it. At the time, I thought it was a great tool for law enforcement in the war on drugs. It was a way to go after assets obtained illegally by the sale of illegal drugs, and it seemed to be a valid use of police power.

Asset forfeiture puts the burden of proof onto the victim, the person who has assets taken. It can be hard to launch a defense if you have your cash seized. I remember a case years ago where a trooper found a briefcase with $450,000 in cash. They took it assuming it was drug related, with no proof. They brought it to me since I was in charge of forfeiture and they had me look into it. I found no connection and told them to return it immediately.

The money can be used to enhance narcotics enforcement. This is both very vague and very broad. Taking someone’s house over raising seedlings will breed ill-will and will ruin a forfeiture law that was working fine. Sometimes police stretch a law so far that it gets taken away.

I was involved in federal seizures, and those seizures share the proceeds with the states who help. Adopted forfeiture is what the Feds used to do, where locals would bring the case to the Feds to have them handle the paperwork. Eric Holder stopped this practice back in January before leaving office. There used to be a threshold on how much a state could be take, but the feds had no limit. I am not personally against asset forfeiture as a tool but I saw two main problems with it.

Problem 1: When you don’t know everything about a law you tend to overstretch the intent of that law. Drug teams would take lots of assets from homes, any items of value, electronics; all taken under forfeiture law. These would be used as a bargaining chip to plea bargain in the criminal case: ‘we’ll give you your TV back if you plead guilty.’ That wasn’t the intent. The intent was to take the goods obtained from drug sales only. Over time, this became ‘let’s take everything and sort it out later’ approach. I could tell back in the 80s that this would get the forfeiture law in trouble, but it’s hard to convince people to fix something before it is broken.

Problem 2: Kids going to Florida for spring break with a small amount of drugs and lots of cash would be stopped by cops and have their vehicle and cash seized if they found any drugs. These kids would then get stranded in far off states while on vacation and lose lots of money. Police took advantage of that. And it still happens today; there are officers out there who stretch it beyond its intent. There needs to be some kind of review, prosecutorial or administrative, something to create objectivity and oversight. There’s no oversight.





http://theleafonline.com/c/politics/2015/06/asset-forfeiture-words-wisdom-leap-officer-ted-nelson/


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Vashta Nerada on December 03, 2016, 08:17:33 pm
A Tulsa man filed a lawsuit Friday against the Tulsa County Sheriff’s Office, the District Attorney’s Office and the County Clerk’s Office seeking reparations on claims that they lost two Harley-Davidson motorcycles seized from him in 2014.

John H. Coday, 53, was in the Tulsa Jail on Jan. 3, 2014, when prosecutors filed notice to seize his 2003 and 2007 Harleys and a 1997 Ford truck on allegations that Coday had used the vehicles to sell drugs, according to court documents.

It is unclear under what circumstances Coday was jailed, but online court records indicate that he wasn’t charged with a crime during that period.

The county also seized $2,870 and various guns, cellphones and a surveillance camera, according to court records.

More than seven months later, District Judge Carlos Chappelle ordered the county return the two motorcycles to Coday, saying there wasn’t evidence they were used to sell drugs — although he contended there was evidence to support the other forfeitures.

However, one Harley — which was originally listed as a 2007 model and carried a unique VIN — was at that time referred to as a 1997 model, sometimes shown to have the same VIN as the Ford, according to the lawsuit.

The Ford, which was originally referred to as a 1997 model, was then listed as a 1993 model, the lawsuit says.

The Ford was later sold for $800 to Arnie’s Auto Sales, 4625 E. 11 St., at a public auction, and $590 from the sale was deposited into the district attorney’s revolving fund, according to court documents.

After the truck was sold, Coday’s attorney, Scott B. Goode, attempted multiple times to contact the district attorney about the motorcycles and was told he’d hear back from office personnel when they found them, according to the court documents.

In the summer of 2015, Goode was told that the Harleys were lost and were believed to have been “inadvertently sold by Tulsa County,” the lawsuit alleges.

Coday is suing for in excess of $200,000 on claims of loss or damage to property, multiple counts of negligence, inconvenience and annoyance, deceit, supervisor liability, civil conspiracy and punitive damages.

The suit names as defendants County Clerk Pat Key, District Attorney Steven Kunzweiler, Sheriff Vic Regalado, former District Attorney Tim Harris, former Sheriff Stanley Glanz, as well as the Tulsa County Sheriff’s Office, the Tulsa County District Attorney’s Office and the Tulsa County Clerk’s Office.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/courts/tulsa-county-officials-sued-for-more-than-for-now-missing/article_da01383e-b708-5b87-b3cf-0adc54fdb59d.html


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on December 07, 2016, 01:07:16 am
A Tulsa man filed a lawsuit Friday against the Tulsa County Sheriff’s Office, the District Attorney’s Office and the County Clerk’s Office seeking reparations on claims that they lost two Harley-Davidson motorcycles seized from him in 2014.

John H. Coday, 53, was in the Tulsa Jail on Jan. 3, 2014, when prosecutors filed notice to seize his 2003 and 2007 Harleys and a 1997 Ford truck on allegations that Coday had used the vehicles to sell drugs, according to court documents.

It is unclear under what circumstances Coday was jailed, but online court records indicate that he wasn’t charged with a crime during that period.

The county also seized $2,870 and various guns, cellphones and a surveillance camera, according to court records.

More than seven months later, District Judge Carlos Chappelle ordered the county return the two motorcycles to Coday, saying there wasn’t evidence they were used to sell drugs — although he contended there was evidence to support the other forfeitures.

However, one Harley — which was originally listed as a 2007 model and carried a unique VIN — was at that time referred to as a 1997 model, sometimes shown to have the same VIN as the Ford, according to the lawsuit.

The Ford, which was originally referred to as a 1997 model, was then listed as a 1993 model, the lawsuit says.

The Ford was later sold for $800 to Arnie’s Auto Sales, 4625 E. 11 St., at a public auction, and $590 from the sale was deposited into the district attorney’s revolving fund, according to court documents.

After the truck was sold, Coday’s attorney, Scott B. Goode, attempted multiple times to contact the district attorney about the motorcycles and was told he’d hear back from office personnel when they found them, according to the court documents.

In the summer of 2015, Goode was told that the Harleys were lost and were believed to have been “inadvertently sold by Tulsa County,” the lawsuit alleges.

Coday is suing for in excess of $200,000 on claims of loss or damage to property, multiple counts of negligence, inconvenience and annoyance, deceit, supervisor liability, civil conspiracy and punitive damages.

The suit names as defendants County Clerk Pat Key, District Attorney Steven Kunzweiler, Sheriff Vic Regalado, former District Attorney Tim Harris, former Sheriff Stanley Glanz, as well as the Tulsa County Sheriff’s Office, the Tulsa County District Attorney’s Office and the Tulsa County Clerk’s Office.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/courts/tulsa-county-officials-sued-for-more-than-for-now-missing/article_da01383e-b708-5b87-b3cf-0adc54fdb59d.html



And the 'hits' just keep rollin' on....!!

I suspect there is little hope now for at least a while, since the new Pedophile in Chief is such a shill himself!!  This kind of stuff just trickles down.






Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on December 07, 2016, 01:09:59 pm

And the 'hits' just keep rollin' on....!!

I suspect there is little hope now for at least a while, since the new Pedophile in Chief is such a shill himself!!  This kind of stuff just trickles down.


A friend at work raised an interesting question.
The most organized opposition to reforming Asset Forfeiture abuse comes from the D.A. unions, since prosecutors have developed a dependency on their cut of confiscations.  But is that "income" considered an official part of their budget?  

My closest analogy would be the state looking at the meager income schools get from casinos and rationalizing educators can absorb cuts to their regular funding since casinos are such cash cows.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on December 07, 2016, 08:19:48 pm
A friend at work raised an interesting question.
The most organized opposition to reforming Asset Forfeiture abuse comes from the D.A. unions, since prosecutors have developed a dependency on their cut of confiscations.  But is that "income" considered an official part of their budget?  

My closest analogy would be the state looking at the meager income schools get from casinos and rationalizing educators can absorb cuts to their regular funding since casinos are such cash cows.


It's a form of slush fund funding as popularized by clandestine "black ops" in the military....does anyone actually believe in the '$600 hammer' ??  It's a $25 hammer with $575 left for 'other activities'.  But the idea is the same - extra money left over from outside the box sources to do stuff Congress/City Councils/County governments would never approve.






Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on January 24, 2017, 11:51:46 am

It's a form of slush fund funding as popularized by clandestine "black ops" in the military....does anyone actually believe in the '$600 hammer' ??  It's a $25 hammer with $575 left for 'other activities'.  But the idea is the same - extra money left over from outside the box sources to do stuff Congress/City Councils/County governments would never approve.



If the argument in favor of seizing property without cause is its necessary to "fight the War on Drugs," then I see an oportunity to fix two problems.

http://newsok.com/oklahoma-legislators-line-up-to-debate-police-property-seizures/article/5535239




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: AquaMan on January 25, 2017, 12:29:45 pm
Is it such a bizarre premise that someone should have to be convicted of a crime to have their property seized? When did we start to confuse the presumption of innocence with the accumulation of wealth? Billionaires everywhere are suddenly nervous to visit Oklahoma.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: Red Arrow on January 25, 2017, 05:22:46 pm
Billionaires everywhere are suddenly nervous to visit Oklahoma.

They'll just have to fly over like everyone else.
 
 ;D


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: AquaMan on January 25, 2017, 06:03:38 pm
Until they land to collect campaign contributions! Then we can get 'em.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on January 25, 2017, 06:09:31 pm
Is it such a bizarre premise that someone should have to be convicted of a crime to have their property seized? When did we start to confuse the presumption of innocence with the accumulation of wealth? Billionaires everywhere are suddenly nervous to visit Oklahoma.

Entitlement is a powerful motivator.



This week in asset forfeiture: Tulsa DA warns that reform will bring headless bodies swinging from bridges

There has also been some talk of reform in Oklahoma, where a state senator has introduced a bill similar to the new law in New Mexico. That legislation inspired this amusingly deluded response from Tulsa County District Attorney Steve Kunzweiler.

    “What we’re talking about is inviting some of the most violent people on the history of this planet,” he said on the Pat Campbell Show on KFAQ. “You see what goes on in Mexico, you see people’s bodies decapitated and hung from bridges. And if you want to bring that drug cartel ideology to Oklahoma, do exactly what Senator [Kyle] Loveless’ bill is suggesting,”

Eric Dalgleish, a major in the Tulsa Police Department, also got in on the act.
    “What it will do is enhance the drug trafficking organizations — that’s who’s supporting his bill is the drug trafficking organizations,” he said. “They are
politically savvy. They are political activists. If you think they’re not watching this and deciding what state to set up business in, we’re being naive and we’re being ignorant.”

I don’t think Dalgleish and Kunzweiler fully understand how illegal cartels operate. It’s the “illegal” part that allows them to exist, allows them to get rich, and creates the violence they seem so certain is soon to be visited upon the Sooner state. If they really want to keep cartels out of Oklahoma, they should look at easing up on the drug war, not fighting efforts to mitigate some of its more unjust and harmful consequences.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2015/11/18/this-week-in-asset-forfeiture-tulsa-da-warns-that-reform-will-bring-headless-bodies-swinging-from-bridges/


All the Constitutional protections that you think that we have as citizens are not present in civil asset forfeiture.
http://www.tulsatoday.com/2015/09/08/sen-loveless-studies-civil-asset-forfeiture/



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on February 15, 2017, 02:37:14 pm
Entitlement is a powerful motivator.



This week in asset forfeiture: Tulsa DA warns that reform will bring headless bodies swinging from bridges

There has also been some talk of reform in Oklahoma, where a state senator has introduced a bill similar to the new law in New Mexico. That legislation inspired this amusingly deluded response from Tulsa County District Attorney Steve Kunzweiler.

    “What we’re talking about is inviting some of the most violent people on the history of this planet,” he said on the Pat Campbell Show on KFAQ. “You see what goes on in Mexico, you see people’s bodies decapitated and hung from bridges. And if you want to bring that drug cartel ideology to Oklahoma, do exactly what Senator [Kyle] Loveless’ bill is suggesting,”

Eric Dalgleish, a major in the Tulsa Police Department, also got in on the act.
    “What it will do is enhance the drug trafficking organizations — that’s who’s supporting his bill is the drug trafficking organizations,” he said. “They are
politically savvy. They are political activists. If you think they’re not watching this and deciding what state to set up business in, we’re being naive and we’re being ignorant.”

I don’t think Dalgleish and Kunzweiler fully understand how illegal cartels operate. It’s the “illegal” part that allows them to exist, allows them to get rich, and creates the violence they seem so certain is soon to be visited upon the Sooner state. If they really want to keep cartels out of Oklahoma, they should look at easing up on the drug war, not fighting efforts to mitigate some of its more unjust and harmful consequences.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-watch/wp/2015/11/18/this-week-in-asset-forfeiture-tulsa-da-warns-that-reform-will-bring-headless-bodies-swinging-from-bridges/


All the Constitutional protections that you think that we have as citizens are not present in civil asset forfeiture.
http://www.tulsatoday.com/2015/09/08/sen-loveless-studies-civil-asset-forfeiture/




Just so much stupid in this state - and it appears to be spreading like a virus...or Rock Snot algae...!!



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on April 30, 2017, 01:58:06 pm

Just so much stupid in this state - and it appears to be spreading like a virus...or Rock Snot algae...!!


Here's some more:

OKLAHOMA CITY, Okla. - An Oklahoma lawmaker said he wants to use money seized by authorities to help pay for a border wall between the United States and Mexico.

State Rep. Bobby Cleveland, R-Slaughterville, released a statement Thursday about his proposal. He said Oklahoma law allows law enforcement to seize property, including money, believed to be used in criminal activity.

He said unless the owner can claim the money wasn’t used improperly, it often stays with the department.

“This money is drug money. They vast majority of it is either coming from Mexico or headed there. By redirecting this cash to construction efforts, Mexico will be paying for the wall just as promised,” Cleveland said.

It’s unclear exactly where all money seized in law enforcement sweeps comes from.

Cleveland said he hopes to have an amendment ready before the end of the legislative session.


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on May 02, 2017, 12:11:37 pm
Here's some more:

OKLAHOMA CITY, Okla. - An Oklahoma lawmaker said he wants to use money seized by authorities to help pay for a border wall between the United States and Mexico.

State Rep. Bobby Cleveland, R-Slaughterville, released a statement Thursday about his proposal. He said Oklahoma law allows law enforcement to seize property, including money, believed to be used in criminal activity.

He said unless the owner can claim the money wasn’t used improperly, it often stays with the department.

“This money is drug money. They vast majority of it is either coming from Mexico or headed there. By redirecting this cash to construction efforts, Mexico will be paying for the wall just as promised,” Cleveland said.

It’s unclear exactly where all money seized in law enforcement sweeps comes from.

Cleveland said he hopes to have an amendment ready before the end of the legislative session.





Oklahoma Stupid.



Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on July 18, 2017, 12:58:06 pm
Is it such a bizarre premise that someone should have to be convicted of a crime to have their property seized? When did we start to confuse the presumption of innocence with the accumulation of wealth? Billionaires everywhere are suddenly nervous to visit Oklahoma.

Billionaires are safe since asset forfeiture only targets those who cant afford lawyers.

Legalized marijuana is making it harder for police to search your car
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/06/26/legalized-marijuana-is-making-it-harder-for-police-to-search-your-car/?utm_term=.ed82288745c1


So Jeff Sessions wants to re-live the failures of the past:

Attorney General Jeff Sessions on Monday said he'd be issuing a new directive this week aimed at increasing police seizures of cash and property.
The practice is ripe for abuse. In one case, Oklahoma police seized $53,000 owned by a Christian band, an orphanage and a church after stopping a man on a highway for a broken taillight. A few years earlier, a Michigan drug task force raided the home of a self-described “soccer mom,” suspecting she was not in compliance with the state's medical marijuana law. They proceeded to take “every belonging” from the family, including tools, a bicycle and her daughter's birthday money.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/07/17/jeff-sessions-wants-police-to-take-more-cash-from-american-citizens/?utm_term=.e19dd21f5e61


...but Philadelphia resists:

“The amount of forfeiture must bear some relationship to the gravity of the offense that it is designed to punish,” Pennsylvania Supreme Court Justice Debra Todd wrote.
http://www.philly.com/philly/business/law/pa-supreme-court-makes-it-harder-for-the-d-a-to-seize-your-home-20170526.html




Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on September 07, 2017, 07:26:22 pm
Former Wagoner County sheriff receives deferred sentence on reduced charge related to cash seizure during 2014 traffic stop

http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepagelatest/former-wagoner-county-sheriff-receives-deferred-sentence-on-reduced-charge/article_6f4a8eea-7f28-5b86-a1b9-d6b366128415.html


Title: Re: License To Shill: Highway Robbery
Post by: patric on September 11, 2017, 10:32:53 am

Oklahoma Stupid.


To be fair, here's some California stupid (from the people who brought you endless cop-gassing-peaceful-protesters memes)


A video showing a UC Berkeley bicycle officer citing a bacon hot dog vendor on campus and removing cash from his wallet for operating without a permit has gone viral. “He doesn’t have a permit,” the officer responds. “Yep, this is law and order in action ... Thank you for your support.

http://www.berkeleyside.com/2017/09/10/university-california-police-looking-viral-hot-dog-vendor-video-berkeley/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_TvG_ZNvQo