The Tulsa Forum by TulsaNow

Just watched this documentary regarding the 1921 race riots. I am now convinced that every negative thing to have befallen an African American in this community is due to the riots--even those 100 years from the event. Hell, the fact Obama didn't win a single county in 2008 in Oklahoma was brought up.

I didn't even move here until 1996 and apparently I need to make reparations.

You most certainly do.  That'll teach you to move to Tulsa (area).

Perhaps you will come to a different conclusion if you spend much of your life facing systematic oppression and having your concerns casually dismissed by people who can't bother to open their eyes to the world around them.

The race riots were a terrible thing for all of Tulsa, and there are definitely lessons to be learned from those awful days.   However, there are some important lessons that could also be learned about how those black Tulsans, amazingly, incredibly, in far more difficult circumstances than exist today, rebuilt the Greenwood district.  Like the proverbial Phoenix rising from the flames, they rebuilt that community into one that was arguably grander than what existed before.  They rebuilt a rich community full of black owned businesses, hotels, restaurants, stores, churches, entertainment venues, etc. etc.  People who remembered the times after the riots recount a community that was something to really be proud of.  So indeed, learn the lessons that must be learned about the riots, but it must be considered worthy of taking some time to figure out how the heck these people did what they did afterwards.  I think that could hold some important lessons for today.  Also what really did ultimately destroy Greenwood?  If we don't also learn those two lessons, I think we do a great disservice the people who came before and for those looking to create a better tomorrow.  

Or, maybe my eyes will be opened by actually DOING SOMETHING like bringing civil rights violations claims on behalf of those victimized by discrimination or bigotry rather than being a keyboard kommando. Tell us, what have you done to get out there and vindicate the rights of minorities?

Whew. I never knew how bigoted I was until I moved here--being from near EAST ST. LOUIS. You know, the place that had race riots before yet don't blame everything wrong on them.

Learn something new every day.
 
 :D

Legal rights or the lack thereof aren't really the problem. The problem is much more a social one than a legal one. That said, there are still people out there who think it's OK to ignore the fact that everyone has the same civil rights, and good on you for helping communicate that to them in a hopefully memorable way.

Not according to that documentary Artist. Those persons responsible for that POS doc painted the image of an almost demilitarized zone. Oppressed black communities, whites taking advantage of whatever development occurred, screams for reparations. Even the knew ball park appeared targeted as a benefit to white business.

Having been in and around Greenwood in the 60's, the single most divisive event to hurt North Tulsa after the area rehabed itself from 1921 was the planning and construction of the ODL and I 244. If this interchange had been located just 2 miles north, North Tulsa would still be a united community. I want to tell you that a story needs to be written on how this diaspora came about. It was intentional. Who?

What about my question: "[W]hat have you done to get out there and vindicate the rights of minorities?"

And I am not "communicating" anything. I am actively working in the one forum where equality is supposed to be found: the courts.

A civil rights lawsuit is in itself a message.

I have spent many a day in north Tulsa.

Growing up, my mother worked for the first black judge in Oklahoma, Amos T. Hall. She left that job to work as a reporter for the Oklahoma Eagle, a black owned newspaper. That led me to hang out after school and play football and basketball with kids who didn't look like me.

The first home I ever purchased was over by Pine and Peoria. I loved my neighbors who were a great mix of black, hispanic and white families. We would host block parties that were truly legendary for making new friends.

My son now goes to Carver Middle School. The majority of his school football team is black and the majority of his school soccer team is hispanic. I am clearly not an expert on race relations, but hanging in the stands watching our kids and babbling on and on like I do, I have some opinions on current relations.   

Tulsa clearly still has some race issues. We are mostly segregated by race in our churches, restaurants, and community events. Times have been worse and I think the new police chief has done a masterful job in working in north Tulsa to repair relationships. I was also impressed that I saw groups of Tulsans from north Tulsa churches come down to Mayfest after the Sunday services.

Diversity is a strength, always.

 

RM & Artists visions of Tulsa race relations is what I suspect is more the norm than the insipid, bias take in that "documentary". Again, if you watch it, one would think North Tulsa had been cordoned by armed Klansman.

We are the tale of two cities, the north city and the south city.  We tread on very slick grounds even today when we dare address the riot.  When in the contracting business was told not to come over to the north city after 4:00 PM. In the 70’s. when working on an AC water tower with silver paint said to the black helper “lets go over to restaurant and ill buy us some dinner and we will be able to cool off”.   His reply was “they will fix me a table in the kitchen and it is not air condition“.  In the late 20’s my dad had a business in the 2200 block of 11th street and had a black man working for him.  The black man had to were a red tag hanging on his chest to be able to be in that part of town. 

Once in addressing the council I mention “the black people on the north side” and after the meeting was adjourned the black councilor accosted me with,  “we are not black people we are just people”. 

The riot is over and the greedy whites have pilfered the north city and stood in the way of it being rebuilt.  I could tell some stories about the businesses that never got off their feet in the north city but also I could get dropped in the Arkansas river wearing a pair of concrete boots.   It is time to let the sleeping dog lie and delete all of this .     

As I've said in the past, seemingly color blind policies can be racist in effect. Sort of how a law can be unconstitutional as applied to a given set of facts. Our criminal justice system is racist, not because people set out to imprison more minorities as a goal, but because perfectly reasonable policies like concentrating patrols in higher crime areas leads to minorities and the poor being arrested and imprisoned on drug charges far out of proportion to actual drug use.

I can understand how, from the perspective of those on the receiving end, it may be cold comfort that society did not set out with the goal of imprisoning minorities more than whites. After all, that is what is happening. If you're a white drug user, you're a lot less likely to go to prison and lose your right to vote than you are if you are a black drug user. I don't have a solution, only the observation.

Good comments. I haven't seen the documentary and probably won't. It has succeeded though if it made someone angry enough to start discussions like these. I would like to share a conversation I had with a co-worker recently. Draw your own inferences.

I said to him that I wouldn't feel afraid to walk through any neighborhood in Tulsa during reasonable hours. All four corners including Turley and Oakhurst. I am a native and did just that in my teen years. He said he felt the same way. He came to Tulsa from New Orleans after Katrina. He commented that the worst areas of north Tulsa were an improvement over where he grew up. He loves our city. His whole congregation moved here and set up far north.

"But you need to be more careful of that than I do," I told him. "When I walk thru a neighborhood no one pays much attention. I am a slight, white, middle aged male. They figure I work for the government, own rental property, am looking for drugs or women. At any rate, not much of a threat. In fact I have always been treated with respect. But you are a 6'3" 350lb young black man whose pants sag a bit. I assure you that if you walk the neighborhoods between 91st and 101st, Memorial and 169, you will be considered a threat and patrol cars will be dispatched to chat with you." I observed that personally when I worked in that area.

He smiled and said, "yeah, probably right."

I truly hope there would be a zero probability of him being shot.

Calling the police over a perceived threat is a reasonable course of action.  I have occasionally seen vehicles cruising slowly in our area that are obviously not from the neighborhood.  I give anyone a free pass once or twice.  Too many repeats will cause a phone call.

I couldn't speak to the probability of him being shot. I'm sure its small. I'm just commenting on how paranoid we've all become. Walled in communities, security services that can over react to justify their presence and profiling that comes from media portrayals are causing some aberrations in our behavior. There is nothing inherently wrong in driving slow or walking/biking thru an interesting hood. I would do that if I were looking to see if a neighborhood had any garage sales or homes for sale. Calling a cop is overkill. Monitoring, being alert and making notes are prudent.

Truth is the picture I painted is just a guy walking thru a hood. He is likely perceived as a threat, whereas I probably would not be.

Which is why I give anyone a few free passes.


Unfortunately true.