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Not At My Table - Political Discussions => Local & State Politics => Topic started by: DowntownNow on November 01, 2009, 09:12:26 am



Title: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: DowntownNow on November 01, 2009, 09:12:26 am
So many in here have been floating this rumor for months....now seems there is some truth to it but only time will tell of the real outcome...but good thing its being made public in a sense, harder to sweep under a rug once the cats out of the bag so to speak.

Reported this morning by the Tulsa World.

TPD officers under investigation
A federal agent is also being scrutinized by a grand jury for possible corruption


By OMER GILLHAM World Staff Writer
Published: 11/1/2009  2:30 AM
Last Modified: 11/1/2009  3:25 AM

Several Tulsa police officers and at least one federal agent are under investigation by a federal grand jury for possible corruption, the Tulsa World has learned.

The grand jury is meeting in a secret location and is being led by federal prosecutors from out of state, an anonymous source said.

Prosecutors appear to be focusing on several Tulsa police officers assigned to the Special Investigations Division. Additionally, an agent either currently or formerly employed with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is a target of the probe, sources said.

Acting U.S. Attorney Scott Woodward said he could not confirm or deny the existence of a grand jury.

Tulsa Mayor Kathy Taylor said she could not comment specifically on any ongoing investigation but said she would fully cooperate with any probe into public corruption.

"I support our hard-working public servants, prosecutors and police officers," the mayor said in a prepared statement. "But I will not tolerate corruption involving any public servant, particularly with those who have taken an oath to uphold the law.

"If it is determined that any officer of TPD has broken the law, they should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law," Taylor said.

Tulsa Police Chief Ron Palmer said last week that he has received no official notification of an investigation.

"I have heard the rumors. The rumors that I have heard are all from the legal community about people being called before the grand jury."

Some individuals contacted by the World said a federal gag order is in place, prohibiting them from speaking about the specifics of the grand jury or its proceedings.

"I have talked to multiple attorneys who have talked to Arkansas prosecutors and acknowledged that a grand jury is taking place and that prisoners are being brought in to testify," said Tulsa attorney Joe Norwood.

Norwood said he is not bound by the gag order.

Tulsa County District Court records show that Norwood has filed a motion to produce discovery in two cases involving clients accused of drug crimes. Norwood is seeking the employment and disciplinary files of Tulsa police officers who could be the target of the federal grand jury, he said.

A source who asked to remain anonymous said: "This grand jury and its secrecy is done for a purpose, and that is the protection of these people who are powerless to be able to deal with this. I am not in the least bit joking. These guys are dangerous. The people that are being exploited by these officers are in the first place criminals, and these folks are in peril."

The officers remain employed by the Tulsa Police Department, records show.

ATF officials said they could not confirm or deny the employment of the ATF agent believed to be a focus of the investigation.

Sources said one of the cases being reviewed by the grand jury is that of Larry Wayne Barnes Sr., 59, and his daughter Larita Annette Barnes, 33, of Tulsa.

The case was filed Aug. 10, 2007, in U.S. District Court for the Northern District of Oklahoma. The two were found guilty April 23, 2008, of two counts of selling methamphetamine and maintaining a home where meth was produced, records show.

U.S. Chief District Judge Claire Eagan was assigned to the Barnes case.

On June 26, 2009, while Barnes and his daughter were still in federal prison, U.S. Attorney David O'Meilia filed a motion to withdraw from the Barnes case, records show.

"The United States Attorney's Office for the Northern District of Oklahoma has been recused from this matter due to a recently discovered conflict of interest," the pleading states. "Substitute counsel for the United States Attorney's Office for the Eastern District of Arkansas have entered their appearances in this appeal."

That same week, Jane W. Duke, U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Arkansas, asked the 10th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals for permission to file a pleading under seal in the Barnes case.

"The information to be contained in the pleading to be filed under seal is related to an ongoing investigation," Duke's pleading states.

"The United States further submits that the information contained in the pleading could jeopardize an ongoing criminal investigation and/or jeopardize the safety of witnesses in that ongoing investigation.''

Records show that Larry Barnes was released from federal prison July 2, 2009, after serving about one year on two 5 1/2-year sentences, which were to run concurrently.

Larita Barnes was released from federal custody the same day, records show. She had received two concurrent 10-year sentences. Larita Barnes is currently in the custody of the Oklahoma Department of Corrections in another case.

The day before the two were released from federal prison, the 10th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals remanded their case back to federal district court in Tulsa, records show. That order is one of more than 35 sealed documents in the Barnes case.

However, some testimony in the case remains available.

Defense attorneys questioned procedures that Tulsa police and a federal agent used to provide money for an informant who allegedly bought a substantial amount of methamphetamine from Larry and Larita Barnes. Additionally, investigating officers faced questions on the lack of phone records between the informant and the defendants, records show.

Meanwhile, records show that at least eight inmates were taken to two area county jails last month with orders to hold them for the Northern District of Oklahoma or the U.S. Marshals Service.

One of the inmates was taken to a jail from the Oklahoma State Penitentiary in McAlester, where he is serving a 10-year sentence on a Tulsa County drug-trafficking conviction, records show. At least two inmates were taken to an area jail from federal prisons in El Reno and Texas, records show.

Sources said the inmates are being interviewed in the corruption probe, which involves alleged false testimony, theft and questionable handling of drugs and drugs proceeds.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: RecycleMichael on November 01, 2009, 09:47:16 am
...harder to sweep under a rug once the cats out of the bag so to speak...
 

what?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on November 01, 2009, 09:59:40 am
what?
Don’t you think that it is quite coincidental that a mayor, planning for another trip around, would suddenly resign and change residence as well as jobs at the time of an ongoing investigation of corruption of one of their department by the fed’s was underway??? 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on November 01, 2009, 10:30:41 am
Don’t you think that it is quite coincidental that a mayor, planning for another trip around, would suddenly resign and change residence as well as jobs at the time of an ongoing investigation of corruption of one of their department by the fed’s was underway???  


She resigned?  Did I miss something?

Didn't she say she wasn't seeking re-election.

A little different, dontcha think?

Start lookin' for dem dere blak hellichopters!


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: custosnox on November 01, 2009, 12:25:12 pm
She resigned?  Did I miss something?

Didn't she say she wasn't seeking re-election.

A little different, dontcha think?

Start lookin' for dem dere blak hellichopters!
Can't she shut down the hellichopteres. lack of funding.  Remember?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: FOTD on November 01, 2009, 12:50:21 pm
Don’t you think that it is quite coincidental that a mayor, planning for another trip around, would suddenly resign and change residence as well as jobs at the time of an ongoing investigation of corruption of one of their department by the fed’s was underway??? 


Enough. She gave %110 for free....while there are some issues of difference with her by all of us here, you can't deny she did her best.

You don't think her honor could possibly have micro managed the TPD to the point of busting the busters do you?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on November 01, 2009, 02:00:08 pm
From what im gathering, this is about a task force fabricating evidence to make a high-profile drug bust, and prosecutors later getting cold feet when the case started to fall apart. 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on November 01, 2009, 02:11:55 pm
You don't think her honor could possibly have micro managed the TPD to the point of busting the busters do you?
Sorry I guess I used the wrong word again.   After the mayor made it know she would be a candidate to extend her term then suddenly makes an about face at a time when a whistle blower turns up tooting on corruption, it would seem a mayor would be informed of an investigation of further corruption under their watch.  (Article lll, Section 1.4, subsection O)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on November 01, 2009, 03:19:36 pm
Sorry I guess I used the wrong word again.   After the mayor made it know she would be a candidate to extend her term then suddenly makes an about face at a time when a whistle blower turns up tooting on corruption, it would seem a mayor would be informed of an investigation of further corruption under their watch.  (Article lll, Section 1.4, subsection O)


Maybe. Or maybe it was a combination of forces that she saw aligning. Poor national economy, unable to rent out glass palace, unable to sell old city hall for development, lawsuit over downtown fees for baseball park, heightened political partisanship, tax receipts reduced so much that basic services would have to be drastically reduced AND a potential investigation. Sort of like when LBJ read the signposts in '67 and realized it was time to move on. ;)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on November 02, 2009, 09:46:07 am
Sort of like when LBJ read the signposts in '67 and realized it was time to move on. ;)
And Reagan.   It could be bye bye for now.  That Arkansas  prosecutor made it known he was not subject to  gag orders issued by the NE District Courts.  ???     


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on November 02, 2009, 10:52:08 am
From what im gathering, this is about a task force fabricating evidence to make a high-profile drug bust, and prosecutors later getting cold feet when the case started to fall apart. 

I was under the assumption that a sincere federal grand jury was called mostly in crimes within subordinate governmental functions.  In the instant case it would seem that the focus is on a malfunction of the local system.  Within the scope there are many facets that can be looked into if such investigation goes on long enough.  One could believe that many pleadings are going on outside the court room.  ;D


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on November 02, 2009, 01:02:50 pm
Is this true? Someone told me that the mayor directed that a special drug squad be formed to blunt the drug fueled crime sprees we've been experiencing. She says its known as the mayor's goon squad. Apparently this squad can be pretty aggressive and abusive if they suspect that you are in the biz, even if hard evidence, legally obtained, cannot be found. Could it be that this investigation is related to this rumor?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: sgrizzle on November 02, 2009, 01:56:31 pm
Don’t you think that it is quite coincidental that a mayor, planning for another trip around, would suddenly resign and change residence as well as jobs at the time of an ongoing investigation of corruption of one of their department by the fed’s was underway??? 


She didn't resign, move or change jobs.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on November 02, 2009, 08:12:06 pm
She didn't resign, move or change jobs.

There goes that damn Tulsa World again reporting that she would be a candidate to extend her reign then reported that she reneged but she would take a job offered by the governor (which would require a long drive each day) or does the job have the perks like the library.  Yea she could use that personal jet that has been flaunted in their stories.   I suppose that I should save that 17 dollars a month I am paying for false information.     


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on November 02, 2009, 08:41:23 pm
Is this true? Someone told me that the mayor directed that a special drug squad be formed to blunt the drug fueled crime sprees we've been experiencing. She says its known as the mayor's goon squad. Apparently this squad can be pretty aggressive and abusive if they suspect that you are in the biz, even if hard evidence, legally obtained, cannot be found. Could it be that this investigation is related to this rumor?

If that is a true rumor I have a rental house that was a victim of a goon squad and has sat vacant for years since.  Man from the DA office came and looked at it.  A federal grand jury in sessions over a long period can find plenty of evidence. 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on January 08, 2010, 01:51:17 pm
Is this the same investigation that's been busting the drug ring in the Catoosa PD lately?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on January 09, 2010, 09:55:43 pm
There are some highly intelligent people that are developing the drugs.  Every house contains most ingredients that can be used in the production  of neth.  China discovered it some 500 years ago.  It was synthesized in about 1880.  It is secreted by a gland in the brain that expands pleasure.  It is dispensed by druggist under a very closed prescribed condition.  Ask your druggist if they can fill a generic prescription for it.  It could be given to your children.

With the goon squad if you have a 2 leader plastic empty bottle on your counter you can be charged with preparing to produce neth.  If you are standing in the back yard and they can see you they will holler “Police” and smash in your front door destroying it.  I have seen the results of their action and hope a federal grand jury will be looking to their acts.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on January 09, 2010, 11:00:50 pm
There are some highly intelligent people that are developing the drugs.  Every house contains most ingredients that can be used in the production  of neth.  China discovered it some 500 years ago.  It was synthesized in about 1880.  It is secreted by a gland in the brain that expands pleasure.  It is dispensed by druggist under a very closed prescribed condition.  Ask your druggist if they can fill a generic prescription for it.  It could be given to your children.

With the goon squad if you have a 2 leader plastic empty bottle on your counter you can be charged with preparing to produce neth.  If you are standing in the back yard and they can see you they will holler “Police” and smash in your front door destroying it.  I have seen the results of their action and hope a federal grand jury will be looking to their acts.


OK....

I'm assuming that...
  • neth = meth
  • leader = liter

Aside from that I think most people don't usually store anhydrous ammonia under the cabinet.

That might also be known as 'anhidrus amoanya'...


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: USRufnex on January 10, 2010, 11:11:58 am
Record number of meth labs found in 2009
The number of labs was higher than the previous five years combined.
By NICOLE MARSHALL World Staff Writer
Published: 1/10/2010  2:23 AM

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20100110_11_A1_ATgnne236515

(http://www.tulsaworld.com//articleimages/2010/A1methlab0110.jpg)

Kinda wild.  How much of that spike is a real increase in use, and how much is an increase in enforcement actions...

I knew the economy was bad, but hey.... I guess I was told at some point that KT didn't try to get re-elected because the unions were not going to support her this time around?!?...

Hire tweekers cuz they can work double shifts...

(http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/epic-fail-promotion-fail.jpg)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on January 10, 2010, 01:36:06 pm
How much of that spike is a real increase in use, and how much is an increase in enforcement actions...

It was rumored that the police agencies behind the first pseudoephedrine law throttled back meth lab busts to create the impression they were "winning the war" once the law went into effect, then slowly started catching up  busting labs again when they needed statistics to prevent drug task force's from being cut.

So a bit of skepticism is healthy when looking at provided statistics.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on January 10, 2010, 06:58:50 pm
OK....

I'm assuming that...
  • neth = meth
  • leader = liter

Aside from that I think most people don't usually store anhydrous ammonia under the cabinet.

That might also be known as 'anhidrus amoanya'...
Made another typo in neth for meth instead of typing the word out.
Leader is being used as a slang word of liter quite often. 
 
Some people have been known to clean their residents with household cleaners and store them under the sink..    (ammonia solution: a solution of ammonia in water. Use: household cleaner, manufacture of fertilizers and textiles. Encarta ® World English Dictionary © & (P) 1998-2005 Microsoft Corporation. Allrights reserved.)

Have been told that in the process of cooking the water is removed leaving the ammonia in the chemical processing  of meth.  At some point of distilling of the ammonia it is quite explosive.

It is rumored that over the years the stimulus monies paid by the fed’s reflects the numbers in Meth lab bust as recorded In the grafts shown..   

There are companies that will reevaluate the city operations and detail the amount of people to perform the needed operations of a city.  Seems there must be a room full of these studies somewhere that  have not been  opened to date.



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: RecycleMichael on January 10, 2010, 07:40:46 pm
Leader is being used as a slang word of liter quite often. 

Shadows is used to mean hidden from the light as a slang word quite often.   


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on January 10, 2010, 07:52:02 pm
Shadows is used to mean hidden from the light as a slang word quite often.   

 :o

+1

I could see neth being a typo if done once.  It was done twice though.  I smell plagiarism I tell you!


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: cannon_fodder on January 11, 2010, 01:09:48 pm
Fwiw, with the new shake and bake method well known (in tulsa) many of the busts are just precursors, stuff that could be used to make meth.  Additionally, a shake and bake "lab" only makes enough for a few hits.  Ergo, more people making meth more often to meet the demand = more busts.

As an interesting aside, okc claims they don't have any shake and bake labs.  By denying it and not busting them, they have statistically eliminated their meth problem.  Magic!


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Conan71 on January 11, 2010, 01:46:19 pm
Fwiw, with the new shake and bake method well known (in tulsa) many of the busts are just precursors, stuff that could be used to make meth.  Additionally, a shake and bake "lab" only makes enough for a few hits.  Ergo, more people making meth more often to meet the demand = more busts.

As an interesting aside, okc claims they don't have any shake and bake labs.  By denying it and not busting them, they have statistically eliminated their meth problem.  Magic!

Much like former TPD chief, Drew Diamond who proudly pronounced we didn't have a gang problem in Tulsa.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on January 11, 2010, 02:59:07 pm
Much like former TPD chief, Drew Diamond who proudly pronounced we didn't have a gang problem in Tulsa.

It's interesting to see how "problems" become "crisis" when someone dangles grant money...

Seat belts, texting, red-light running, too may to list.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on January 11, 2010, 05:12:38 pm
One does not have to dangle grant monies before Tulsa.  Any ordinance seems not to be beneficial to the general public but to its ability to raise revenue for a bloated bureaucracy.  Thus the department of “I am more intelligent then thou because I have a college degree” becomes another tax assessor. 

One could assume that a majority of the registered voters has not passed on any question concerning the general public needs.

23% of the children live in poverty in Tulsa and persons cry give us more of their money they need to sustain life.  These children live on the income that is available making up as Dr Mayo’s wrote of the “400,000 children that hobble to their early graves”.

Tulsa problems may not be solved by a grand jury.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on January 11, 2010, 06:08:39 pm
Hoss:
If one has a roll of aluminum foil, lye, drain cleaner, paper book matches, any form of caustic acid or porch and side walk cleaner in your possession you can be charged to be in the process of producing meth and told you can be sent to prison for life along with a $50,000 fine.   If you will plea bargain then you get 10 years and $50,000 fine.

I believe the only thing would be go to the drug store with a severe cough and say give me some of those football pseudoephededrine pills.  You could produce a very limited amount of the drug.   



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on January 11, 2010, 06:29:15 pm
Hoss:
If one has a roll of aluminum foil, lye, drain cleaner, paper book matches, any form of caustic acid or porch and side walk cleaner in your possession you can be charged to be in the process of producing meth and told you can be sent to prison for life along with a $50,000 fine.   If you will plea bargain then you get 10 years and $50,000 fine.

I believe the only thing would be go to the drug store with a severe cough and say give me some of those football pseudoephededrine pills.  You could produce a very limited amount of the drug.   



Black helicopters anyone?  I think a 'working lab' would need to be in order.  What you're suggesting is plain silly, even for rogue cops.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on January 11, 2010, 07:22:19 pm
Hoss:
You need to read some of the arrest report.  Most are available under FOI. A working lab is not a requirement.  I did a full research on this and supplies are considered the same as guilty.  There is a full story but for safety reasons it is one of those “don’t ask, don’t tell”.  
The winds of change will never effect Tulsa.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: cannon_fodder on January 11, 2010, 07:44:45 pm
Black helicopters anyone?  I think a 'working lab' would need to be in order.  What you're suggesting is plain silly, even for rogue cops.

Hate to agree with shadows, but with the right household chemicals you could be charged with possession of precursors and it would go down as a lab bust.  I've seen it over and over.  Camp fuel, some Kitty litter, empty 2 liters, some ag grade lye, and some grout cleaner = Meth lab.   Generally the busts for precursors are on known Meth heads... but still. It can be pretty weak.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on January 11, 2010, 11:01:22 pm
Hate to agree with shadows, but with the right household chemicals you could be charged with possession of precursors and it would go down as a lab bust.  I've seen it over and over.  Camp fuel, some Kitty litter, empty 2 liters, some ag grade lye, and some grout cleaner = Meth lab.   Generally the busts for precursors are on known Meth heads... but still. It can be pretty weak.

That's the key though...'could be charged'.

Has anyone been charged that way that didn't already have paper on a similar offense?  That's my question.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on January 11, 2010, 11:46:12 pm
Hate to agree with shadows, but with the right household chemicals you could be charged with possession of precursors and it would go down as a lab bust.  I've seen it over and over.  Camp fuel, some Kitty litter, empty 2 liters, some ag grade lye, and some grout cleaner = Meth lab.   Generally the busts for precursors are on known Meth heads... but still. It can be pretty weak.

The same is true for "bomb making materials".  Ive read of instances where that was little more than a battery and some wires.
It doesnt have to hold up in court, only be sufficient to put the suspect through hell and make them look bad in the media. 

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/02/01/national/main2420426.shtml?source=RSSattr=Entertainment_2420426

Outside the courthouse, Michael Rich, a lawyer for both of the men, said the description of a bomb-like device could be used for any electronic device.

"If somebody had left a VCR on the ground it would have been a device with wires, electronic components and a power source," he said.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on January 12, 2010, 12:47:18 am
That's the key though...'could be charged'.

Has anyone been charged that way that didn't already have paper on a similar offense?  That's my question.

The answer would be Yes.


A Missouri judge has ruled that merely buying cold tablets and lithium batteries -- items that could be used to manufacture methamphetamine -- does not provide police with an excuse to stop and search the buyer. In a case where members of the Southeast Missouri Drug Task Force tailed a man buying two boxes of Sudafed tablets at one store and watch batteries at another, then stopped and searched him, Judge William Syler ruled on April 21 that task force members had engaged in an unwarranted and unreasonable detention and search and that the evidence seized as a result must be suppressed.
http://stopthedrugwar.org/chronicle-old/285/coldpills.shtml

A Loveland man who was charged with making methamphetamine at his property near the old sugar factory, and then cleared of the charges, has sued law enforcement agencies, claiming they falsely arrested and prosecuted him.
Myers was charged with two counts of possession of a precursor of meth, manufacturing of a controlled substance and possession of between 25 and 450 grams of a controlled substance.  Prosecutors dropped the charges two months later when the alleged drugs that officers seized tested negative for any illegal substances.
http://www.reporterherald.com/news_story.asp?ID=25700

Eddy, Roger Allen Jr. v. State, COCA Case No. F-2001-336 (April 12, 2002)
(Double Jeopardy/Double Punishment; Excessive Sentence; Jury Instructions- misleading/confusing; Simultaneous convictions for manufacturing and possession of methamphetamine; possession of precursor substance violated double punishment. Convictions for possession of precursor and methamphetamine reversed and remanded with instructions to dismiss. http://www.ok.gov/~oids/Jury_Inst_Mislead.htm

I could go on, but the point has been made.  You can go into almost any home and collect all the ingredients for a meth lab, and make it look pretty damning when gathered together and laid out on the sidewalk for a photo op.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: FOTD on January 12, 2010, 10:43:27 pm
17 is the rumor number....that frees up some of the budget and reduces the threat number...


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on January 13, 2010, 12:38:40 am
The problem is that even if you are not guilty and an unnamed neighbor points an accusing finger it can cost thousands of dollars.  Sue the city will produce a bleeding heart prosecutor with “Judge these protectors of the citizens who are constantly putting their lives on line must follow ever lead.”  A professor in class once said if you are in an accident step out of the car and close the door and it will require a search warrant.  In Tulsa that would end up like the OHP and the Ambulance attendant’s conflict of interest.  ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on January 13, 2010, 12:17:02 pm
A professor in class once said if you are in an accident step out of the car and close the door and it will require a search warrant.  In Tulsa that would end up like the OHP and the Ambulance attendant’s conflict of interest.  ;D ;D ;D

I may be dating myself, but Im old enough to remember a time when if you were pulled over, getting out of your car to meet the officer was a courtesy and a gesture of respect.
Somewhere, they changed the rules.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on March 31, 2010, 06:53:11 am
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20100331_11_A1_Federa970443

WOW


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on March 31, 2010, 02:49:39 pm
That's the key though...'could be charged'.

Has anyone been charged that way that didn't already have paper on a similar offense?  That's my question.

YES

Having been a non-involved by-stander in a set up of evidence and the use of “unless a no contest plea a jury could give you life in prison” It has been happening all along.  To defend the action requires thousands of dollars in attorney fees. The citizen looks the other way at the very mention of “ it all involves drugs”. If the grand jury looks they will find many infractions like the one cited in the article.
.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: nathanm on March 31, 2010, 04:37:54 pm
The thing is, you don't even have to be particularly aggressive with the meth-heads, they practically come to you. A client of mine once defended a guy charged with making some ungodly amount of money selling meth. They seized around $500,000 in cash when they arrested him. This client of mine, being an excellent defense attorney managed to poke enough holes in the state's case that the guy was acquitted. The guy then sued a bunch of government agencies over the whole thing.

Two months later, he was arrested on charges of...making meth. The second time around the police didn't do so much screwing up, so the guy ended up getting 20 years.

A real drug dealer is usually pretty stupid, and therefore easy to catch without any shenanigans.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 10:44:05 am
Yes....These two people were good productive citizens that brought alot to the community.....I could care less what the cops had to do to get this scum off the street.....Spend some time and find out what kind of people they were....Lets see how many of you would like to have them over for tea and crumpets..... ::)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 01, 2010, 11:02:07 am
Yes....These two people were good productive citizens that brought alot to the community.....I could care less what the cops had to do to get this scum off the street.....Spend some time and find out what kind of people they were....Lets see how many of you would like to have them over for tea and crumpets..... ::)

What has happened to the godd ole USA?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: custosnox on April 01, 2010, 11:12:03 am
Yes....These two people were good productive citizens that brought alot to the community.....I could care less what the cops had to do to get this scum off the street.....Spend some time and find out what kind of people they were....Lets see how many of you would like to have them over for tea and crumpets..... ::)

Yes, let's suspend civil liberties and due process.  Hell, we don't need em.  If we think that someone is behaving in an immoral way let's just throw em in jail.  In fact, why bother with the costs of jail, let's just burn em at the stake and be done with it.  You just have to love this kind of logic


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 12:12:41 pm
Yes...What has happened to it when we let it become over-run with drug dealing slime like the scags the cops were trying to put away......Do some research on the scum-bags before you start running your holier than thow yaps.....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 01, 2010, 12:29:14 pm
Yes...What has happened to it when we let it become over-run with drug dealing slime like the scags the cops were trying to put away......Do some research on the scum-bags before you start running your holier than thow yaps.....

It is time to go after the television execs, the banksters, the corporate polluting pigs! Round 'em up.

Guess it depends how you define slime and scags. I think we know what a scum bag looks like. Too bad someone's parent failed to use one before that someone turned into a baker.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: custosnox on April 01, 2010, 01:05:58 pm
Yes...What has happened to it when we let it become over-run with drug dealing slime like the scags the cops were trying to put away......Do some research on the scum-bags before you start running your holier than thow yaps.....

Well then, if we are going to start wipping our a$$ with the constitution, then I suppose you wouldn't mind me having you thrown into this group of scags because you tend to offend people. 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 01:12:49 pm
Well then, if we are going to start wipping our a$$ with the constitution, then I suppose you wouldn't mind me having you thrown into this group of scags because you tend to offend people. 

Thanks for making this country great....Your support of drug dealing thieves is duly noted....Let us know when you are having the Barnes clan over for tea and crumpets...Be sure and let us know how it all goes.....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 01:15:17 pm
It is time to go after the television execs, the banksters, the corporate polluting pigs! Round 'em up.

Guess it depends how you define slime and scags. I think we know what a scum bag looks like. Too bad someone's parent failed to use one before that someone turned into a baker.


Yes..... fauxtard is invited to the tea and crumpet party....I'm sure you and the Barnes will have alot to talk about.......


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: custosnox on April 01, 2010, 01:59:40 pm
Thanks for making this country great....Your support of drug dealing thieves is duly noted....Let us know when you are having the Barnes clan over for tea and crumpets...Be sure and let us know how it all goes.....

I just love how people make moronic statements like this.  Because I support due process, then that means that I support "drug dealing theives".   The process is not there to protect this type, but to protect those that are law abiding.  If you allow the cops to use these measures to put away criminals at any cost, then how long until people are put away this way because a cop "thought" they were criminals?  Why don't you get your head out of your donkey and actually think beyond your own short sighted beliefs?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 02:07:14 pm
I just love how people make moronic statements like this.  Because I support due process, then that means that I support "drug dealing theives".   The process is not there to protect this type, but to protect those that are law abiding.  If you allow the cops to use these measures to put away criminals at any cost, then how long until people are put away this way because a cop "thought" they were criminals?  Why don't you get your head out of your donkey and actually think beyond your own short sighted beliefs?

O.... please... please pull your head out maybe fauxtard can help but I doubt it........Btw thats a cute skirt you are wearing......


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 01, 2010, 02:15:50 pm
O.... please... please pull your head out maybe fauxtard can help but I doubt it........Btw thats a cute skirt you are wearing......

so BB, are you advocating no due process for drug dealers who cops think are guilty.?  How about we do that with speeders?  Jaywalkers?  Hell, why don't we just give our police officers Lawmasters and have them dispense the justice ala Judge Dredd?

I don't like the methheads as much as the next guy, but as has been pointed out, due process exists for a reason.  No need for us to devolve into a police state, dontcha think?  That may be a little exaggerrated on my part, but to selectively target certain offenders kinda has that smell.  JMO.  YMMV.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 01, 2010, 02:26:25 pm
Yes, I can help!



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: nathanm on April 01, 2010, 04:08:39 pm
I could care less what the cops had to do to get this scum off the street.....
Note to self: When Breadburner gets arrested for something he didn't do, print this post and mail it to the Court so they don't have to bother with the expense of a trial.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 07:13:39 pm
Hook.....line and sinker.....I got my limit in this thread......heh...What is today....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 01, 2010, 07:23:05 pm
Hook.....line and sinker.....I got my limit in this thread......heh...What is today....

Yeah, because dispensing with the ad-hominems is all in good April Fool's fun!  No wonder you and Gweed get along so well.

Hmm..makes me wonder where you get your endless supply of naughty photos from....

 :o


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 08:00:54 pm
Yeah, because dispensing with the ad-hominems is all in good April Fool's fun!  No wonder you and Gweed get along so well.

Hmm..makes me wonder where you get your endless supply of naughty photos from....

 :o

Lol....Naughty photos....I did not know you were a girl......My bad...


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 01, 2010, 08:23:27 pm
Lol....Naughty photos....I did not know you were a girl......My bad...

Wrong.  The question still stands though.

 ;D


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 01, 2010, 08:40:17 pm
Hossy...Is that you in the Blue....

(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u29/thenoleman/jeremy.jpg)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on April 01, 2010, 09:10:38 pm
Hossy...Is that you in the Blue....

(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u29/thenoleman/jeremy.jpg)

Oh Snap.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 01, 2010, 09:43:19 pm
Hossy...Is that you in the Blue....

(http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u29/thenoleman/jeremy.jpg)

I did have retort all prepared about your wife and my relationship to the hedgehog.

I decided I'd rather not let this topic devolve into name-tossing.

But you go right ahead.

That does resemble me a little though, back in the 80s.  I guess you must have been..what, about 60?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 01, 2010, 09:52:02 pm
Hook.....line and sinker.....I got my limit in this thread......heh...What is today....

It's your day!


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 01, 2010, 09:58:53 pm
It's your day!

Minus the April's, sure...


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 02, 2010, 05:45:24 am
I did have retort all prepared about your wife and my relationship to the hedgehog.

I decided I'd rather not let this topic devolve into name-tossing.

But you go right ahead.

That does resemble me a little though, back in the 80s.  I guess you must have been..what, about 60?

Only from the waste up I would imagine...... ;D


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 02, 2010, 06:07:45 am
Only from the waste up I would imagine...... ;D

That's not what your wi...oh, never mind.
 ;D


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 03, 2010, 04:39:47 pm


Breaking bad...



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 04, 2010, 03:07:19 pm
I think what you will end up discovering here is an informant wanting to get out of his obligation to provide testimony in this particular case.....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 04, 2010, 03:53:21 pm
U R clueless.....nothing new about that fact.


Tip of an iceberg....rumor: lots more coming.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on April 04, 2010, 06:01:30 pm
U R clueless.....nothing new about that fact.


Tip of an iceberg....rumor: lots more coming.

Sorry Dingus....You would be the clueless one....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: tulsa_fan on April 04, 2010, 09:07:47 pm
U R clueless.....nothing new about that fact.


Tip of an iceberg....rumor: lots more coming.

Not that I am hoping there is more to come, but I have to hope there is more than one drug guy saying the police set him up . . . that's not much basis for ruining someone's career over.  The Barnes' don't seem like they are worth throwing it all away for a setup. 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on April 05, 2010, 09:27:50 am
Not that I am hoping there is more to come, but I have to hope there is more than one drug guy saying the police set him up . . . that's not much basis for ruining someone's career over.  The Barnes' don't seem like they are worth throwing it all away for a setup. 

Only a handful of people actually know the scope of the corruption probe, but some are dropping hints:

"If there is any semblance of truth to this, and if there is a plurality of officers involved, then this is a huge black eye on the Police Department," Bartlett said.

 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: tulsa_fan on April 06, 2010, 09:27:36 am
Only a handful of people actually know the scope of the corruption probe, but some are dropping hints:

"If there is any semblance of truth to this, and if there is a plurality of officers involved, then this is a huge black eye on the Police Department," Bartlett said.

 

Bartlett would be the last one I'd rely on for dropping hints.  And I'm sure he'd be over the moon excited over anything that puts a "huge black eye on the Police Department"


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Conan71 on April 13, 2010, 05:19:13 pm
...."A hearing for a former ATF agent was delayed one day today to allow testimony about whether he should be released to his home in Lubbock, Texas.

Magistrate Paul Cleary approved the delay during a detention hearing for Brandon McFadden, 33, a former agent with the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in Tulsa. McFadden was indicted Friday by a grand jury investigating law enforcement corruption in Tulsa.

The delay allows time for McFadden’s relatives to travel to Tulsa to testify in his behalf about arrangements if he is released to his home in Texas.

McFadden, who was arrested Thursday, has been moved from the Tulsa Jail to Creek County jail, an official said.

The indictment charges McFadden with taking part in a drug conspiracy, possession of methamphetamine with intent to distribute; possession of a firearm during a drug-trafficking crime; and aiding and abetting money laundering. He faces forfeiture actions related to his alleged drug crimes, the indictment states.

The indictment accuses McFadden and unnamed Tulsa police officers of planting drugs on individuals, stealing drugs and money, giving false testimony in court and coercing or persuading drug dealers to sell drugs for the officers, the indictment states.

The grand jury indictment accuses McFadden of operating a drug-selling ring in which he allegedly enlisted 12 drug dealers or drug associates who sold drugs for him.

By offering the drug dealers police leniency or a share of drug profits, McFadden allegedly coerced or persuaded them to work for him, selling and buying methamphetamine, marijuana and cocaine, the indictment states.

McFadden was assisted in his alleged drug-selling conspiracy by a Tulsa police officer identified in the indictment only as “TPD Officer A.” .....

Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=14&articleid=20100413_14_0_Aheari203173


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: nathanm on April 13, 2010, 05:24:35 pm
The grand jury indictment accuses McFadden of operating a drug-selling ring in which he allegedly enlisted 12 drug dealers or drug associates who sold drugs for him.
Wasn't there a movie about that? I think it was set in LA, though...

More seriously, what exactly is a 'drug associate'?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Red Arrow on April 13, 2010, 05:35:51 pm
Wasn't there a movie about that? I think it was set in LA, though...

More seriously, what exactly is a 'drug associate'?

Someone who works at the WalMart pharmacy.   ;D


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: nathanm on April 13, 2010, 05:59:14 pm
Someone who works at the WalMart pharmacy.   ;D
lol, I was thinking more along the lines of a cart pusher. :p


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on April 20, 2010, 01:11:41 pm
The Tulsa Whirled finally got around to making a special section for all the related stories:

http://www.tulsaworld.com/webextra/continuingcoverage/continuingcoverage.aspx?id=5


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on April 21, 2010, 06:46:03 pm
The taxpayer of Tulsa should start being concerned on accusations by letters informing that another TPO is under investigation from the grand jury.  The problem is that these officers will receive their pay while relieved of duty that could extend into years.   The system seem to be available for these suspended officers to receive their regular pay and benefits until the city places them on retirement. 

Shouldn’t there be a limit to the amount or deducted from their vacation pay and other funds if found guilty?

Crime may not pay but being accused of it sure is a benefit to government employees.  Where does it all stop? 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on April 21, 2010, 10:25:23 pm
The taxpayer of Tulsa should start being concerned on accusations by letters informing that another TPO is under investigation from the grand jury.  The problem is that these officers will receive their pay while relieved of duty that could extend into years.   The system seem to be available for these suspended officers to receive their regular pay and benefits until the city places them on retirement. 

Shouldn’t there be a limit to the amount or deducted from their vacation pay and other funds if found guilty?

Crime may not pay but being accused of it sure is a benefit to government employees.  Where does it all stop? 


This has to be the most lucid post I've ever seen from you.

And, believe it or not, one I agree with.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: nathanm on April 21, 2010, 10:59:20 pm
This has to be the most lucid post I've ever seen from you.

And, believe it or not, one I agree with.
I can see both sides. It sucks that we pay officers to not work. It would also suck if said officer was put on unpaid leave and didn't get the benefit of trial for a year or so thanks to our dog-slow justice system and was eventually found not guilty.

Neither is fair. It's just unfortunate we can't really discriminate between the egregious lawbreaking where the accused is almost certainly guilty and investigations that don't end up going anywhere because the accused is in fact innocent.

Generally, I side with the person least able to afford the unfairness.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on April 22, 2010, 10:34:34 am
Meanwhile, Tulsa police declined to release Gray's photograph to the World.

"At this time, the release of his photo would constitute a risk to past, current and future investigations,
including his own safety, and would clearly
be an unwarranted invasion of privacy," Brooks said.


So releasing a mugshot is... what?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on April 22, 2010, 11:20:14 am
Doesn't seem too outrageous to me. His job is undercover and he is innocent till proven guilty. He could or should be temporarily relieved of duty and some limitation as to how long he could be paid or deferred etc. but I see no reason to blast his face all over the newspaper until he's found guilty (unlike celebrities who never get a break!)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on April 22, 2010, 05:58:13 pm
Doesn't seem too outrageous to me. His job is undercover and he is innocent till proven guilty. He could or should be temporarily relieved of duty and some limitation as to how long he could be paid or deferred etc. but I see no reason to blast his face all over the newspaper until he's found guilty (unlike celebrities who never get a break!)

The celebrity analogy is interesting, what do you suppose the reasonable expectation of privacy is of a public servant while exercising their authority, compared to that of someone just walking down the street?   


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on April 22, 2010, 07:05:32 pm
If the public servant's job dictates his anonymity for success, his expectation of privacy is more than that of a celebrity imo. Remember, this guy is innocent till the evidence mounts up and proves otherwise. His career, and maybe his life, are in the balance. A celebrity normally craves attention and most elected officials have a responsibility to be available for their constituents.

The regular guy walking down the street used to have a very high expectation of privacy. No longer. Anyone and everyone can now simply log online and find out his whole life for free or a few bucks. I Goolgled my name once and found out I am a prisoner in Lexington. When I complained to the company they said I would have to prove otherwise before they would change it!


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on April 22, 2010, 09:25:43 pm
If the public servant's job dictates his anonymity for success, his expectation of privacy is more than that of a celebrity imo. Remember, this guy is innocent till the evidence mounts up and proves otherwise. His career, and maybe his life, are in the balance. A celebrity normally craves attention and most elected officials have a responsibility to be available for their constituents.

The regular guy walking down the street used to have a very high expectation of privacy. No longer. Anyone and everyone can now simply log online and find out his whole life for free or a few bucks. I Goolgled my name once and found out I am a prisoner in Lexington. When I complained to the company they said I would have to prove otherwise before they would change it!

Lets say Im the one who buys the chemicals for the city's water treatment.  Ill get a good deal for the city as long as you dont ask questions, like who I am or where the goods come from.
My anonymity makes my job a success, because the chemical costs are way down.

Unfortunately...
my lack of accountability means you will never know the industrial waste company I get my sodium fluoride from is shipped in tankers that dont get cleaned out after they use them to ship other industrial wastes, so...

The argument just doesnt work, and neither does trying to prop up the other end of the equation by lamenting on the public's diminishing privacy.  Gray's usefulness as undercover was depleted long ago when he gave interviews to TV stations, so TPD's privacy assertions are untruthful.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: custosnox on April 22, 2010, 10:18:17 pm
Lets say Im the one who buys the chemicals for the city's water treatment.  Ill get a good deal for the city as long as you dont ask questions, like who I am or where the goods come from.
My anonymity makes my job a success, because the chemical costs are way down.

Unfortunately...
my lack of accountability means you will never know the industrial waste company I get my sodium fluoride from is shipped in tankers that dont get cleaned out after they use them to ship other industrial wastes, so...

The argument just doesnt work, and neither does trying to prop up the other end of the equation by lamenting on the public's diminishing privacy.  Gray's usefulness as undercover was depleted long ago when he gave interviews to TV stations, so TPD's privacy assertions are untruthful.

I'm gonna have to side with H20 on this one.  By description of the job an undercover officer relies on anonymity to be able to accomplish his job.  It also is a matter of safety for the officer.  However this does not remove the officers accountability, as demonstrated by the investigation.  Until proven guilty, it should be considered that if the privacy is not maintained then the officer will not be able to return to their profession if found innocent in the same capacity as originally established.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: MH2010 on April 23, 2010, 12:42:38 am
Kind of a back story about the picture issue....TPD management declined to release the photo of Henderson to the Tulsa World.  The Mayor's office decided to and gave the picture to the Tulsa World.  That is how Henderson's picture got out. 

Now regarding Grey, Captain Brooks was quoted in the Tulsa World saying, "At this time, the release of his photo would constitute a risk to past, current and future investigations, including his own safety, and would clearly be an unwarranted invasion of privacy."

So I don't know what has changed between the Mayor's office overriding TPD management and releasing Henderson's photo and now.



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: rwarn17588 on April 23, 2010, 07:35:56 am

Now regarding Grey, Captain Brooks was quoted in the Tulsa World saying, "At this time, the release of his photo would constitute a risk to past, current and future investigations, including his own safety, and would clearly be an unwarranted invasion of privacy."


I'd say the minute he was implicated in a corruption probe, his cover is blown.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Conan71 on April 23, 2010, 08:14:43 am
I'd say the minute he was implicated in a corruption probe, his cover is blown.

If it would hinder an on-going investigation or put fellow officer's lives in danger, I disagree.  If he/she is simply "implicated" I disagree also.  If, after an internal investigation, and even then only if it did not jeopardize ongoing investigations or officers, then fine, make it public.  If the officer was working with a couple of other officers on a different investigation it could lead to the other LEO's being uncovered.

Why should other officers or citizens be put at risk because of the mal-feasance of one person?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on April 24, 2010, 03:15:50 pm
Most of the rate payers who depend on a secured justice system which should find if there is a possible cause to look into corruption before the final accusation is made, now should be looking into the difference standards afforded by classes.  Being advised by letter that one is being investigated by the grand jury from those conducting the jury for fraud extends beyond reason an unbiased precedence not afforded to the general public.  In this instance there is a possible cause of fraud having been committed in  order to be presented to the grand jury which as a pubic employee, under shield of trust, could and can be placed on the fast track to establish guilt or innocence.  It is at the courts discretion and obligation to do so in the present unless we continues to accepting double standards.  Thus the mug shot should be published under the same rule as others are published before the determination of guilt of innocence is established.     


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on April 24, 2010, 05:58:09 pm
So, I would presume by your argument that rape victims should have their pics put in the paper as well? After all, they may be lying. They certainly put the alleged rapist's pics in the paper and you're all about levelling the classes, so why not?

I'm comfortable with a judge deciding how a case is conducted based on what the prosecutor and defense present to him.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on April 24, 2010, 09:44:30 pm
I'm comfortable with a judge deciding how a case is conducted based on what the prosecutor and defense present to him.

I dont understand that statement in this context, are you saying a judge ordered the mugshot withheld?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on April 24, 2010, 10:39:55 pm
I dont understand that statement in this context, are you saying a judge ordered the mugshot withheld?

If there was any context, it was related to this post, "Being advised by letter that one is being investigated by the grand jury from those conducting the jury for fraud extends beyond reason an unbiased precedence not afforded to the general public.  In this instance there is a possible cause of fraud having been committed in  order to be presented to the grand jury which as a pubic employee, under shield of trust, could and can be placed on the fast track to establish guilt or innocence.  It is at the courts discretion and obligation to do so in the present unless we continues to accepting double standards.  Thus the mug shot should be published under the same rule as others are published before the determination of guilt of innocence is established."   

I like the idea of "innocent until proven guilty". That seems to be escaping some people here. I do not like the damage done by the press in reporting allegations in a case as though they are anything more than allegations unproven by the determination of facts by a court. The wilder and more inflammatory the allegations, the more people tend to believe them. How often have you seen the press apologize and promise to make whole someones reputation after they have been found not guilty? Seldom. You have to sue for such things and that is expensive and largely fruitless.

Who actually benefits from such practice? Only the press as it promotes their product at someone else's expense.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on April 26, 2010, 03:40:50 pm
The police officers are not a breed apart from the general public therefore when there is idications that a crime has been commited they shoud enjoy the same privileges that the citizen enjoy. Person who are questioned because of information as being posssible "persons of interest" mug shots are offtimes published in order for others with credible information to come forward.
In the instant determination the grand jury found that the officer was such "person of interest thus should be subject to any conditions that a suspected citizens would be,  
  


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: fotd on April 26, 2010, 03:44:41 pm
The police officers are not a breed apart from the general public therefore when there is idications that a crime has been commited they shoud enjoy the same privileges that the citizen enjoy. Person who are questioned because of information as being posssible "persons of interest" mug shots are offtimes published in order for others with credible information to come forward.
In the instant determination the grand jury found that the officer was such "person of interest thus should be subject to any conditions that a suspected citizens would be,  
  

The journal seemed to omit this dirty business from their story today, as I recall....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on April 26, 2010, 09:12:24 pm
The police officers are not a breed apart from the general public therefore when there is idications that a crime has been commited they shoud enjoy the same privileges that the citizen enjoy. Person who are questioned because of information as being posssible "persons of interest" mug shots are offtimes published in order for others with credible information to come forward.
In the instant determination the grand jury found that the officer was such "person of interest thus should be subject to any conditions that a suspected citizens would be,  
  

Just saying the same thing over and over is not discourse Shadow. You simply ignore rebuttals to your arguments. Innocent people are often charged yet never convicted. The sting of having your "mug" shot distributed when accused but not printed when absolved is lasting. Some privilege. I once new of a name and photo being used in the newspaper that cost a man his career. Turns out a black law school grad looks similar to a murderous black janitor. TW paid dearly for that. How simple to merely have waited till the guy was at least arraigned. Innocent till proven guilty. Learn it, understand it, repeat it.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on April 27, 2010, 10:33:16 pm
I have never heard of a guilty person being in the prisons.  If  I remember England used this land for a prison camp until after they rebelled and England had to move it to Australia.  By what is happening today we may have been better off if they had established the prison camp there in the first place as we are overrun with innocence people convicted of a non violent crime.  There could be other citizens that could associate him with a mug shot whereas on a sting operation he would not use his birth name.

The history of meth goes back 500 years, it was artificially produced around 1880.  There is no way to stamp it out as it is used by children though  golden age citizens.  Many parents give it to their children under a medical mane and it can be purchased through most drug stores in very small doses.   

In today paper is a picture of a “person of interest” who has not been arraigned.   Get it the system is broken and needs fixing.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: custosnox on April 27, 2010, 10:40:00 pm
I have never heard of a guilty person being in the prisons.  If  I remember England used this land for a prison camp until after they rebelled and England had to move it to Australia. 

Ummm... actually.. the prisoners here were brought over as indentured servents, not as a penal colony.  A bit of a difference there.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: waterboy on April 28, 2010, 07:17:48 am
I'm glad I don't live in your cynical world Shadow.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Gaspar on April 28, 2010, 09:35:43 am
Drugstore Meth

Sounds like a good name for a band.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on April 28, 2010, 04:16:03 pm
Ummm... actually.. the prisoners here were brought over as indentured servents, not as a penal colony.  A bit of a difference there.
We seem to be reading from different history books.  This one records the last ship load of prisoners in route to America had to be taken to a new prison camp established at Sydney Australia at the close of war.
It describes the indentured servants as women who become prostitutes in order to pay for their passage.  At this time the woman was not considered for education and these indentured servants in communication with their “john’s” became the highly educated women in America.  These women of the red light area became the educated elite of Boston.  History seems to be in an evolution process.         


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on September 23, 2010, 10:47:20 am
A Tulsa police deputy chief testified in federal court today about a former burglary detective's alleged involvement in a large bank burglary ring possibly linked to homicides.
Deputy Chief Mark McCrory's testimony came during the second day of a motions hearing as part of the federal probe into law enforcement corruption in Tulsa.


Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20100923_11_0_hrimgs675531


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: swake on September 23, 2010, 10:53:53 am
A Tulsa police deputy chief testified in federal court today about a former burglary detective's alleged involvement in a large bank burglary ring possibly linked to homicides.
Deputy Chief Mark McCrory's testimony came during the second day of a motions hearing as part of the federal probe into law enforcement corruption in Tulsa.


Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20100923_11_0_hrimgs675531

TPD is a sick organization.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on December 16, 2010, 12:19:33 pm
Today's Wall Street Journal story:

Scandal Roils Tulsa Police
Planted Evidence, Stolen Drugs, False Informants Star in Probe; Convicts Freed

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704720804576009812869266014.html


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on December 17, 2010, 04:04:49 pm
The city is sick, not one department.  The controlling segment of the population have the ability to mislead the working poor and then walk-away praising themselves for being part of building a better city.  They have their way on issuing information in the twilight zone as they create their little kingdoms.  The grand jury possibly should look at the purchase of the city hall and the false information as the city continues to juggle the facts on the misleading information made available at the time it was being promoted as a “can’t do without necessity.  Instead of renaming the usage of the vacant floors the working poor would be satisfied by simply calling it the “White elephant barn “.  


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Gaspar on December 17, 2010, 04:12:45 pm
The city is sick, not one department.  The controlling segment of the population have the ability to mislead the working poor and then walk-away praising themselves for being part of building a better city.  They have their way on issuing information in the twilight zone as they create their little kingdoms.  The grand jury possibly should look a the purchase of the city hall and the false information as the city continues to juggle the facts on the misleading information made available at the time it was being promoted as a “can’t do without necessity.  Instead of renaming the usage of the vacant floors the working poor would be satisfied by simply calling it the “White elephant barn “.  


This is awesome!  We can now turn any thread into an exercise in class warfare.   ::)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: RecycleMichael on December 17, 2010, 04:21:09 pm
The controlling segment of the population ...

This was my favorite phrase...

Bark for me, shadows.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: TulsaMoon on December 17, 2010, 04:42:04 pm
 The controlling segment of the population have the ability to mislead the working poor and then walk-away praising themselves for being part of building a better city.  

This is very incorrect! The working poor drive the mean rich man away in his shiney car while he hangs out the sunroof praising himself.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on December 17, 2010, 06:17:27 pm
This is very incorrect! The working poor drive the mean rich man away in his shiney car while he hangs out the sunroof praising himself.

I'm liking this guy's posts more and more.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on December 18, 2010, 12:53:19 pm
This was my favorite phrase...

Bark for me, shadows.
Only a watch dog would understand the bark of another dog.  There is the possibility that even a watch dog could not even understand what is happening as he sleeps his watch away.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on December 18, 2010, 01:07:02 pm
Only a watch dog would understand the bark of another dog.  There is the possibility that even a watch dog could not even understand what is happening as he sleeps his watch away.


Allow me to do the post police honors:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0wu-1OaFJ8[/youtube]


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Hoss on December 18, 2010, 01:45:22 pm
Allow me to do the post police honors:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0wu-1OaFJ8[/youtube]

To the well one too many times, dear Tony.

But then again, you and him do share the same mindset.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on December 18, 2010, 02:03:21 pm
Hate to interrupt your fart party --

Tulsa has been getting a bad rap, but it's not just a Tulsa thing.  Be glad you dont live in Seattle:


The ACLU of Washington and more than 30 commmunity groups made a formal request on Thursday to the Justice Department for a civil rights investigation of the Seattle Police Department citing six incidents since June 2009, the ACLU's letter asked for an investigation of the use of excessive force, especially against minorities.

Among the incidents cited were:

- An detective on a robbery investigation in April saying he would "beat the f****** Mexican piss out of a man.
- An arrest of a 17-year-old boy in October in which an officer was caught on videotape kicking the teen.
- A jaywalking stop by a police officer in June that result in the officer's punching a 17-year-old girl in the face.
- A fatal shooting of a deaf native American woodcarver using a 3" woodcarving blade to carve a piece of wood in the tourist district.


Dashcam video of the later complaint was released today:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1VKo6-m27c[/youtube]

Shortly after the shooting, you hear the female witness yell to Birk, "He didn't do anything." Birk responds, "Ma'am, he had a knife and he wouldn't drop it."
The officer has since been ordered to surrender his gun and badge.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on December 19, 2010, 04:17:40 pm
Hate to interrupt your fart party --

Tulsa has been getting a bad rap, but it's not just a Tulsa thing.  Be glad you dont live in Seattle:


quote]_____________________________________________

No: but Tulsa has the same smell.  First it was public works with the plea bargaining and a slap on the hand with “you have been naughtily don’t do it again”.  Now it is the police department with one of its elite attorneys crying he will defend the city’s obligation (obligation; that is a catchy word)free whereas there is the smell again on who going to pay the tab.  It leaves one to wonder who is the student and who is the teacher.

The mayor (city manager) must feel he is being pushed into the corner again by his response.  The working poor are real people that no longer have a voice in self-governing.  


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Teatownclown on March 30, 2011, 11:16:22 am
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=14&articleid=20110330_11_A1_Tulsap922906

One big blemish.

It's a shame.

Do not hire clowns for cops. There are too many good cops who do not deserve this affiliation with bad cops.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on June 10, 2011, 05:53:10 pm
Two officers have been acquitted and one has been found guilty today in a police trial after a jury returned with a verdict in less than five hours in U.S. District Court in Tulsa.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=443&articleid=20110610_443_0_hrimgs275054

The worse ones got immunity...

Now someone please explain to me the logic in having police dogs sniff money you just took out of your dirty pockets as some sort of evidentiary procedure?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Breadburner on June 11, 2011, 08:00:27 am
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=14&articleid=20110330_11_A1_Tulsap922906

One big blemish.

It's a shame.

Do not hire clowns for cops. There are too many good cops who do not deserve this affiliation with bad cops.

Typical Libtard guilty until proven innocent......


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Nik on September 19, 2011, 01:57:44 pm
TPD is back in the news today.

It seems five officers were sent to a suspect's father's house to arrest her due to several outstanding traffic citations. One officer also accidentally fired his weapon. The person that was arrested just happens to be a person who testified as a witness for prosectors during the corruption trial. She is also going to be a witness in a civil suite against the city and polic.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=443&articleid=20110917_11_A1_CUTLIN383437

Reddit, one of the busiest sites in the US, has had quite a bit of discussion about it. I actually saw it there before I saw it anywhere else and it's not usually my source for local news. When it is, it is rarely good news.

http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/kkc70/5_tulsa_ok_cops_raided_the_home_of_a_woman_who/


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: TeeDub on September 20, 2011, 01:25:35 pm


Forcing entry to serve traffic warrants?    And then having a gun "accidentally discharge"?    I wonder how many "accidental threats" happened first?
Why can't TPD just do their jobs and quit trying to make the city look bad?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on October 08, 2011, 08:35:54 pm

Forcing entry to serve traffic warrants?    And then having a gun "accidentally discharge"?    I wonder how many "accidental threats" happened first?
Why can't TPD just do their jobs and quit trying to make the city look bad?


Wow, just wow:
http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/article/20111007/NEWS02/111006029/Former-officer-held-without-bail-Vermont-threat-case-?odyssey=tab


Added:
He ended up getting 38 days and ordered to leave Vermont.
How many states do you get before you have to turn in your CLEET certificate?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: TeeDub on October 09, 2011, 09:17:22 pm
<REMOVED BY ADMIN AT REQUEST OF REFERENCED INDIVIDUAL>


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: AquaMan on October 10, 2011, 02:20:41 pm
<REMOVED BY ADMIN AT REQUEST OF REFERENCED INDIVIDUAL>


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: TeeDub on October 10, 2011, 02:30:15 pm

I didn't even think about filing a civil suit in federal court.   



Title: TPD officers under investigation Grand Jury
Post by: HixKniffPaf on October 30, 2011, 11:23:31 pm
i dont think there would be any legal issue, he is posting speeds as observed on his radar gun.  He is not pretending to be a police officer nor submitting the info for charges or purpoting that any crime has taken place.  He is simpling posting his observations of a public space.
Bump!


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on October 31, 2011, 08:07:24 am
But it's good to know that for any and all of the lawsuits involved, they won't be able to sue for more than $350,000.  A'Cause we is tort pertected rat'cheer in Okiehoma.


Unlike that 'greedy' family of the Native American woodcarver gunned down in the video who 'stole' $1.5 million in court...




Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on October 31, 2011, 09:25:50 am
But it's good to know that for any and all of the lawsuits involved, they won't be able to sue for more than $350,000.  A'Cause we is tort pertected rat'cheer in Okiehoma.
Unlike that 'greedy' family of the Native American woodcarver gunned down in the video who 'stole' $1.5 million in court...

It's just if you have eight or nine police misconduct lawsuits going at a time it tends to pile up, and take money and resources away from where they would do some good.
I wonder, does the tort limit also apply to federal lawsuits, as well?

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=667&articleid=20120831_16_A1_Cityco862055


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on October 31, 2011, 10:05:39 am
It's just if you have eight or nine police misconduct lawsuits going at a time it tends to pile up, and take money and resources away from where they would do some good.
I wonder, does the tort limit also apply to federal lawsuits, as well?

Must be just state...we can't dictate to Fed about that.  Although our "hicks-from-the-sticks" idiots in the state legislature would certainly love to do that, too!



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on May 17, 2012, 11:59:52 am
Officer Bill Yelton will receive an estimated $176,000 in a lump sum as part of a retirement pension option approved Wednesday morning, in addition to at least $2,700 per month.
A Police Department spokesman said Yelton's disciplinary record is not available under the Oklahoma Open Records Act because he is no longer an employee, since his retirement May 7.

Additionally, Tulsa police officials said they could not comment on whether the now-moot Internal Affairs investigation concluded, what the investigation found or whether Yelton was aware of a possible conclusion in the investigation.

Another convicted officer, John K. "J.J." Gray, will be eligible for more than $3,400 per month in pension pay after 20 years as an officer.

 


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Conan71 on May 17, 2012, 01:48:06 pm
I’m not a police spooner but you can at least post the entire article instead of making it look like a rat got paid off:

Quote
Yelton, who was acquitted in August of charges alleging that he violated suspects' civil rights, received approval for his application from the Oklahoma Police Pension and Retirement Board to begin receiving his pension in June.

The lump-sum option in his pension allowed Yelton, 51, to receive the amount of money he paid into his pension plan for the last five years along with 7.5 percent interest on that money. The option is available only to officers who have worked at least 20 years, with a maximum payout for five years past 20.

Read more from this Tulsa World article at http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=443&articleid=20120517_11_A1_CUTLIN904875

He was acquitted by the jury on the four charges he faced and the lump sum reflects money HE paid into his retirement account the last five years with 7.5% interest.

BFD.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on May 17, 2012, 02:24:48 pm
I’m not a police spooner but you can at least post the entire article instead of making it look like a rat got paid off:


Dude, it's patric. His take is going to look anti-cop.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: nathanm on May 17, 2012, 03:36:25 pm
7.5% interest.

Where can I sign up for that deal (in dollars, anyway)?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Conan71 on May 17, 2012, 04:54:02 pm
Where can I sign up for that deal (in dollars, anyway)?

6066 E. 66th St. N Tulsa, Ok. 74117-1811.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on May 18, 2012, 01:20:19 pm
I’m not a police spooner but you can at least post the entire article instead of making it look like a rat got paid off:

He was acquitted by the jury on the four charges he faced and the lump sum reflects money HE paid into his retirement account the last five years with 7.5% interest.

...
It would seem that the officer in question would need other sources of income to be able to contribute over $2,000 dollars per month to his pension plan over the past 5 years.

As a nation we have come to the point where the grand juries that are impaneled, created as a body of common citizens that issue indictments for prosecution of those who break the laws, when turned over to the elected authorizes, are being overridden by the such employees of government, with a deep conflict of interest.  It is liken the old cliché of asking the fox guarding the henhouse door if there is any thing wrong inside.

And we are bankrupting our country trying to correct these issues in the MID-EAST at the cost of even the lives of our youth.




Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: RecycleMichael on May 18, 2012, 01:34:24 pm
...
It would seem that the officer in question would need other sources of income to be able to contribute over $2,000 dollars per month to his pension plan over the past 5 years.

His base pay was $63,000 per year and he probably worked lots of overtime.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: shadows on May 18, 2012, 02:07:26 pm
His base pay was $63,000 per year and he probably worked lots of overtime.
...

$1,211.53 weekly and working overtime.  The federal grand jury seem to issue and indictment on the possibility that the overtime should not have been charged to the citizens coffers as much overtime seem to be outside of the law.  Or have we come to the point where we pay for someone to wearing the uniform and their performance out side the law is paid for by the law biding citizens?

   


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Townsend on May 18, 2012, 02:11:54 pm
...

$1,211.53 weekly and working overtime.  The federal grand jury seem to issue and indictment on the possibility that the overtime should not have been charged to the citizens coffers as much overtime seem to be outside of the law.  Or have we come to the point where we pay for someone to wearing the uniform and their performance out side the law is paid for by the law biding citizens?

   

Hey, why aren't you writing in old english style?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: AquaMan on May 18, 2012, 05:36:09 pm
I don't remember posting on this thread and I'm surprised that I referenced an individual. I apologize if I posted inappropriately.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on May 18, 2012, 10:08:20 pm
<REMOVED BY ADMIN AT REQUEST OF REFERENCED INDIVIDUAL>

It might almost be worth making it to the next Tulsa Now Happy Hour to hear the story behind that   ;)


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: TeeDub on May 19, 2012, 05:40:45 am

I am looking to see what I said.    I can't imagine I would say something without proper citation to a news source...

Anyone know how to pull old posts?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Vashta Nerada on September 06, 2012, 09:49:27 pm
Quote
City Council OKs settlement in officer-involved shooting death lawsuits

City councilors approved payment of a $110,000 judgment on Thursday to settle two lawsuits related to a 2009 fatal officer-involved shooting.
The money will go to Brandi Cox on behalf of her son, a minor who was injured in the shooting. Her husband, Steven Paul Crowels, was killed.

The officer who fired the shots, Jay Chiarito-Mazzarella, is no longer with the Tulsa Police Department.

The Tulsa County District Attorney's Office found that the shooting was justified, and the Tulsa Police Department's Deadly Force Review Board concluded that Chiarito-Mazzarella acted "out of good faith concern for his own life and safety and the force used was lawful," according to court records.

However, the board recommended that Chiarito-Mazzarella be found to have violated tactical and training policies.
Specifically, the board found that he fired "into the vehicle despite the fact that he knew the vehicle contained at least two passengers and despite the fact that he did not have a clear view of, or shot at, the target," court records state.

Gerald Bender, litigation division manager for the city, said Thursday that given the review board's findings and the $50,000 to $60,000 cost of providing expert witnesses for trial, the City Attorney's Office, with the mayor's blessing, agreed to settle the cases.

"In terms of the amount of the settlement itself, it is not out of line with what we have paid with other officer-involved shootings that have had some tactical errors or other issues," Bender said.

The city pays judgments - court ordered payments - out of its sinking fund, which is financed primarily through property taxes. Judgments are typically paid over three years, with interest, but can be paid in one lump sum.
The city's sinking fund also pays the principal and interest on general obligation bonds.

A Tulsa World report of the incident states that the shooting happened about 11 p.m. Oct. 15, 2009, at the corner of Oklahoma Street and Urbana Avenue.
Chiarito-Mazzarella had tried to stop Crowels' vehicle in the area of 1200 N. Allegheny Ave. after he saw an occupant throw something out of the car, police reported.

The driver refused to stop and sped away, and a short pursuit ensued, police said. The driver lost control of the car at Oklahoma and Urbana, and it slammed into an unoccupied parked vehicle.

Chiarito-Mazzarella got out of his patrol car and was approaching the vehicle from behind when the driver put the car in reverse and attempted to hit the officer with the vehicle, Chiarito-Mazzarella claimed.
"Out of fear for his life and safety, Chiarito-Mazzarella drew his weapon and fired at plaintiff through the rear window of the vehicle," according to court records. "When he continued to hear the engine rev, he fired again."

In all, Chiarito-Mazzarella shot into the vehicle seven times, striking Crowels. Crowels' son was bruised but not struck by the bullet that penetrated the back of his seat. A friend of Crowels' son also was in the vehicle but was not injured.
Crowels died of his gunshot wounds 20 days later.


Quote
Ex-Tulsa cop denied bail in Vermont stalking case
A Vermont judge has refused bail for a former Tulsa police officer who is charged with threatening a Burlington police officer who was in a relationship with his wife, who also is a Burlington officer.

Jay Chiarito-Mazzarella, 41, is charged with felony aggravated stalking and disorderly conduct by telephone. He is accused of confronting Cpl. Steven Dumas on the phone Sept. 24 after discovering the relationship. Chiarito-Mazzarella fired two bullets as they spoke, telling Dumas, "the next one is for you," Dumas reported.

Police said that on Sept. 30, Chiarito-Mazzarella sent Dumas a photo of himself and his 2-year-old daughter in front of Dumas' home.

Chiarito-Mazzarella was formerly a police officer in Tulsa.

In November 2009, the Tulsa County District Attorney's Office ruled that he was justified in fatally shooting a man who the officer said was trying to run over him with a car that October.

In April 2009, Chiarito-Mazzarella and five other Tulsa officers were put on restrictive duty while the death of a man in their custody was investigated. The man became unresponsive while they were trying to put leg shackles on him after he was pepper-sprayed but continued to resist attempts to detain him, the officers said.  - From Staff and Wire Reports



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on November 10, 2012, 03:10:06 pm
TULSA, Okla. (AP) — A former Tulsa police officer serving a 10-year prison sentence for his role in a corruption scandal says a videotaped FBI sting that showed him stealing money during what he thought was a motel drug bust was illegal and violated his right to privacy under the U.S. Constitution, according to a new court filing.

Ex-Cpl. Harold Wells, a 35-year-police veteran, makes the claims in a brief filed Thursday with the 10th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals. Wells was among 11 officers to be charged or named as unindicted co-conspirators in the scandal, which was among the worst to ever hit the department.

Wells was secretly videotaped at the motel in 2009 stealing money during what he and another officer believed was a drug bust of a Texas man. Of $13,000 seized, officers turned in $8,000 and divided the other $5,000 among themselves. Later, they became suspicious and tried to return the money, prosecutors said.

Wells' attorney, William Lunn, said Friday that prosecutors did not have a warrant to videotape the bogus transaction in the motel room and criticized the quality of the recording itself, alleging the government showed only snippets of tape that were more favorable to its case.

"We don't have all their conversations," Lunn said. "There are just these little portions left, and it's unfair for any American citizen to just have a little snippet of a conversation being played against them without a court order."

Lunn described Wells as a model officer who got caught up through no fault of his own with other convicted Tulsa officers as the government probe went on.

"Our point is that Wells was nothing but a highly respected police officer, and he had a really illustrious career as a police officer," Lunn said. "He saved people's lives; he brought in dozens of drug dealers. There was never a hint of impropriety about him."




Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: TeeDub on November 12, 2012, 03:18:21 pm

Amazing how no one ever writes in an article "he was a dirty low down guy who had no future and was destined to fail."

Everyone is always glory bound and perfect right up until they get caught.    Most likely even then it was because of some bad character they happened to be hanging around.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Vashta Nerada on November 12, 2012, 07:55:35 pm
Amazing how no one ever writes in an article "he was a dirty low down guy who had no future and was destined to fail."

Everyone is always glory bound and perfect right up until they get caught.    Most likely even then it was because of some bad character they happened to be hanging around.

So is taking wads of cash to "have a drug dog sniff" still an acceptable practice among police?


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: patric on March 10, 2013, 11:30:22 am
Tulsa dodges lawsuit tidal wave after police corruption investigation
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20130310_11_A13_Attorn988056


"There just aren't that many cases left that the statute of limitations hasn't already run out on" said Attorney Guy Fortney, who represents the city.

Fortney's firm, Brewster & DeAngelis Law Offices, pledged to donate $1.2 million in legal fees to help defend the city as cases were filed - though Fortney said his office has never approached that amount.

Gerald Bender, Litigation Division manager for the city of Tulsa, said the low number of suits filed against the city is due to the quick and aggressive approach Fortney and attorney Clark Brewster used on each lawsuit.

"We determined right up front that we weren't going to spend a dime in settlements," which was a decision Mayor Dewey Bartlett made, Bender said.



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on March 10, 2013, 03:15:27 pm
^^^^ Funny article.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on March 11, 2013, 07:55:55 am
Kind of interesting how Fortney is so concerned about saving Tulsa some money - by his self-admitted aggressive approach.  Wonder if the people responsible for prosecuting the crimes committed are as aggressive in their approach?**    Tim Harris - supposed-to-be-DA.



**Rhetorical question - I've seen how Harris' office works....




Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on March 11, 2013, 04:23:51 pm
Kind of interesting how Fortney is so concerned about saving Tulsa some money - by his self-admitted aggressive approach.  Wonder if the people responsible for prosecuting the crimes committed are as aggressive in their approach?**    Tim Harris - supposed-to-be-DA.



**Rhetorical question - I've seen how Harris' office works....




Oh the stories....


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on March 11, 2013, 04:37:21 pm
Oh the stories....


I'm listening.... can go to PM if you want.

I got a very close up look at TPD and S & M "Buddy" Fallis in the distant past.  What a combination in the 60's!!



Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: guido911 on March 11, 2013, 04:59:35 pm

I'm listening.... can go to PM if you want.

I got a very close up look at TPD and S & M "Buddy" Fallis in the distant past.  What a combination in the 60's!!



Give me some time.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on March 11, 2013, 05:02:03 pm
Give me some time.


No big hurry... I plan to keep making a pest of myself around here for a while yet...


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Vashta Nerada on March 28, 2013, 06:53:46 pm
New York finally cracked down on police officers individual social media use, similar to what we did here at the onset of the TPD corruption probe.
Some of this may sound familiar:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nypd-order-aims-clean-cops-profiles-social-media-article-1.1300827


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: cannon_fodder on March 28, 2013, 07:10:30 pm
"We determined up front that we weren't going to spend a dime on settlements."

Sure Tulsa police officers violated Tulsa citizens civil rights, destroyed lives, lied, and falsely imprisoned people.  Yes, that happened.  But instead of looking to see if the police department did anything wrong we will litigate so citizens don't even try to find out what really happened.

I don't know that the City or department did anything wrong. But I this hard to believe corruption was so widespread without supervisers, the DA, or lots of people knowing.  I believe the NCAA would call institutional control.

As a taxpayer I'm thrilled.  But the attitude concerns me.

/hope we did some serious soul searching behind the scenes


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: heironymouspasparagus on March 28, 2013, 08:00:02 pm


As a taxpayer I'm thrilled.  But the attitude concerns me.

/hope we did some serious soul searching behind the scenes


Concerns you??  You should be terrified!!

And, no, there was no soul searching behind the scenes.  There was a case of massive harassment in early 70's that consisted of events that eventually led to the advice to one person involved that if he moved out of state, he would survive the year.... this was a meeting with TPD and the person and his lawyer.  There were likely others...  The pattern continues.  (No drugs, no crime, no illegal behavior...just an intense dislike between 'clashing' personalities.)





Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Vashta Nerada on April 20, 2014, 09:18:20 pm
Quote
A man who has spent 17 years in federal prison was freed Friday after a judge found that Tulsa law officers — including some later convicted in a corruption probe — manufactured evidence in order to obtain his drug conviction.

Jeffrey Dan Williams was convicted in 1997 of methamphetamine and firearm possession charges and sentenced to 35 years in prison.

U.S. District Judge James H. Payne issued an order on Friday vacating the judgment and sentence and dismissing the indictments against Williams, now 53.

Payne found that the “scheme to manufacture evidence was deliberately planned, carefully executed and intended to defraud this Court, and in fact, this Court did rely upon the fraudulently manufactured evidence in order to convict and sentence Williams.”

Also, newly discovered evidence presented on behalf of Williams “identified numerous constitutional violations that cast doubt on his convictions and undercut the reliability of the proof of guilty,” Payne wrote in his opinion and order.

Williams initially pleaded innocent, later changed his plea to guilty and has since tried to change it back, saying he was coerced to enter a plea.

Following a police corruption scandal in Tulsa, Williams’ case and request to change his plea were brought back for hearings in May 2012.

At an evidentiary hearing, two alleged informants who were used in the federal investigation against Williams testified that they were coerced by Tulsa police officers to testify against Williams in 1997.

Williams maintained he had never met one of the informants who was alleged to have provided information to police.

Meanwhile, prosecutors at the evidentiary hearing worked to establish that investigators followed correct procedures in their 1997 investigation to show the original sentencing was appropriate.

Testimony also included previously unheard, inflammatory allegations against convicted Tulsa police officers, including an account of a plan to rob a police evidence van of drugs and money.

One of the informants in the case testified in Williams’ 2012 hearing that he had worked for former Tulsa police officers John K. “J.J.” Gray, Jeff Henderson, Harold R. Wells and former federal agent Brandon McFadden from 1995 to 1999 selling drugs.

The three officers and McFadden all have received prison terms in connection with a federal corruption investigation that spanned from 2008 to 2011.

In his ruling Friday, Payne found that Gray, Henderson and other unnamed officers in the Special Investigations Division (SID), “conducted an unconstitutional and illegal search and seizures.”

In his decision, Payne also singled out a federal DEA agent, who the judge said was negligent in accepting information against Williams as fact and using it in his investigation which was ultimately was used to convict Williams.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/courts/man-freed-after-serving-years-on-drug-charge/article_a21b0da8-c73a-11e3-90d3-0017a43b2370.html


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: cannon_fodder on April 21, 2014, 08:50:31 am
FWIW, the City paid some of the defendants.  It became clear that the cases were SO bad that it was the only choice.  One of the settlements was discussed in the World a couple months ago.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Vashta Nerada on August 02, 2014, 05:05:49 pm
FWIW, the City paid some of the defendants.  It became clear that the cases were SO bad that it was the only choice.  One of the settlements was discussed in the World a couple months ago.


How Tulsa's corruption probe would have gone if the Feds hadnt' lost their nerve:



Six cops charged with robbery, kidnapping, extortion
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/breaking/20140731_Sources__6_cops_arrested_in_federal_corruption_probe.html

Quote
Six Philadelphia police officers were arrested Wednesday in a predawn roundup and charged with robbing, kidnapping, and extorting drug suspects over a nearly seven-year period.

The officers all were veterans of a narcotics squad that came under the scrutiny of a joint FBI-Police Department Internal Affairs investigation.
The officers charged in a federal indictment are Thomas Liciardello, 38; Perry Betts, 46; Brian Reynolds, 43; Michael Spicer, 46; John Speiser, 42; and Linwood Norman, 46.

The indictment alleges the officers falsified records, held people without arrest, stole drugs and shared in the proceeds.
Federal officials said they stole more than $500,000 from February 2006 to November 2012, including Rolex watches, electronics and a Calvin Klein suit.

According to a 42-page indictment, some of the officers allegedly took part in a game involving beating drug suspects for points. Others held one suspect from a balcony 30-feet above the ground and knocked out his teeth to obtain a computer password.

Prosecutors said the officers routinely filed false police reports to cover up their criminal behavior.
"That many of the victims were drug dealers, not Boy Scouts, is irrelevant," said Edward Hanko, special agent in charge of the FBI's Philadelphia Office.

Police Commissioner Charles H. Ramsey, who attended the news conference where the charges were announced, said the arrests stemmed from "one of the worst cases of corruption I have ever heard."  All the officers, except for Speiser, face up to life in prison, officials said. For Speiser, the maximum term is 40 years. Ramsey suspended all six for 30 days with the intent to dismiss.

John McNesby, president of Fraternal Order of Police Lodge 5, said the accusations against the officers represented the worst allegations of police corruption he has seen during his seven years as union chief.
"On the scale of one to 10, from what I'm reading this is a 10," he said. "These are serious accusations, and they have to be dealt with seriously."
He said the union "does not take corruption lightly," but would review all of the facts before rushing to judgment against the officers.
"On the face of it, it looks bad, but let's let the dust settle, and see exactly what happened," McNesby said. "They all have good attorneys and they'll make the right decisions."

The arrests come seven months after Ramsey first acknowledged a federal probe was underway and said he had pulled at least four of its targets, all narcotics squad veterans, off of street duty.

The probe intensified after former officer Jeffrey Walker pleaded guilty to federal counts of attempted robbery and using a gun during a violent crime in January. Prosecutors said during his last court hearing he had been cooperating with the investigation.
Questions have dogged the narcotics officers' work since at least 2012, when District Attorney Seth Williams said his office would no longer use their testimony in drug cases, a decision that resulted in the dismissal of scores of cases.
The city has since paid at least $777,000 to settle lawsuits claiming the officers framed suspects with false testimony and evidence. Dozens more remain on court dockets awaiting resolution.

In a statement, Williams' office said it "will review previous convictions involving the six officers and will take appropriate action. When a decision is made on these cases the District "
The office said it had no open cases involving all the officers except Norman and that it was reviewing cases involving him "from the relevant time period."
Mayor Nutter, speaking after a groundbreaking in North Philadelphia, said, "If you are corrupt, we will find you."

Walker, 45, began cooperating with the investigation as soon as he was arrested last year in an FBI sting operation, his lawyer said.
An undercover informant caught the former officer on tape scheming to set up a South Philadelphia drug dealer by planting nearly 28 grams of cocaine in his car.

Walker later took his mark's keys, broke into his house and stole $15,000 and five pounds of marijuana.


Title: Re: TPD officers under investigation - Grand Jury?
Post by: Vashta Nerada on December 18, 2016, 10:33:03 pm
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/courts/tpd-corruption-probe-five-years-later-one-former-officer-still/article_e420e5e1-3fa3-5cae-898b-f02882fc768f.html