(AP) COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. The Rev. Ted Haggard resigned as president of the 30 million-member National Association of Evangelicals on Thursday after being accused of paying a man for sex in monthly trysts over the past three years.
Haggard -- an outspoken opponent of the drive for gay marriage -- also stepped down as senior pastor at his 14,000-member New Life Church pending an investigation by a church panel, saying he could "not continue to minister under the cloud created by the accusations."
Mike Jones, 49, of Denver told the AP he decided to go public with his allegations because of the political fight.
"It made me angry that here's someone preaching about gay marriage and going behind the scenes having gay sex," Jones said.
Jones, whose allegations were first aired on KHOW-AM radio in Denver, claimed Haggard paid him to have sex nearly every month over three years. He said he advertised himself as an escort on the Internet and was contacted by a man who called himself Art.
Haggard, a 1978 graduate of Oral Roberts University who is believed to be about 50, was appointed president of the evangelicals' association in March 2003 and has been called one of the most influential conservative Christians in the nation.
http://cbs4denver.com/local/local_story_306172921.html
There are those, who from this hour going back to the original inception of God's true church, have always been bad apples and cast a horrid reflection upon the integrity and standard of true Christianity. I'd say I apologize for them, but how can I make right their evil by apologizing on their behalf? They milk and peddle this precious Gospel of Jesus Christ that I love so much for their own greed and corrupt ways.
In a way, I'm glad the media, the secularists and the non-Christian hold Christianity to the high standard it professes by giving hypocrites a run for their money. This is not glee at their expense; it is simple reaping what one sows.
True Christianity demands integrity and honesty, through and through. Even more so from Christian leaders, who one day will give an account for those they influence, whether in truth or in error.
They are wrong and they do not reflect the high mark that Jesus Christ exemplified to mankind. I offer you no excuses for their behavior.
If christians would hold christianity to high standards, the secular public wouldn't have to be involved.
Where's Aox with one of his National Enquirer pieces to say that Karl Rove and Bush II were watching gay porn with Haggard?
quote:
Originally posted by sgrizzle If christians would hold christianity to high standards, the secular public wouldn't have to be involved.
Some of us do. Guys like this would never make it into our pulpits. And they probably wouldn't like what they sometimes will hear from the pulpit, especially things that require brutal honesty, the highest integrity and submission to true Biblical principles.
Jesus said that if anyone wanted to be His disciple, they must deny themselves, take up their cross and follow Him. A lot of leaders in Christianity have yet to learn what "NO" means.
I noticed, TulsaDavid, that you used the word "some."
Which indicates, "not a majority," and thus, the nonsecular have to also get involved to expose hypocrisy.
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588 I noticed, TulsaDavid, that you used the word "some."
Which indicates, "not a majority," and thus, the nonsecular have to also get involved to expose hypocrisy.
Yup. You noticed right. :)
That which is done in secret will be shouted from the rooftops.
"Jesus' earthly representatives have a long history of blowing it. First, there is Peter...and then every other disciple follows his lead. From then until now we have all been pretty poor representatives of Jesus. (There are some notable exceptions to the contrary. But that is why they tend to be called saints or heroes of the faith. Gandhi famously said that were it not for the actions of Christians, he might have been one himself.) "
http://www.beliefnet.com/blogs/jwalking/
Haggard deserves pity for the internal hell he must have suffered trying to hide his homosexuality while all along attacking outside the very thing he hated about himself. He is spiritually and psychologically destroyed by advancing what he knows to be a lie about homsexuality being "chosen".
Hopefully something good will come out of this, but I'm not holding my breath. Until somone's sexuality is not used as a tool to get people to vote, we will keep seeing these stories and the shame and hurt that go with them.
There is not an apostle or original New Testament leader that ever "blew it" that way.
Peter denied the Lord three times, but on the day of Pentecost when the Holy Spirit was poured out and 120 followers of Jesus Christ were filled with God's Spirit and felt the fire of His presence in their souls, never did they stray or lose integrity like this Haggard guy. He is nothing like Jesus' true earthly representatives.
Sure, Haggard is eligible for God's mercy just as we all are, but he deserves nothing just like we all don't. That's the beauty of God's love and mercy. God became the man Christ Jesus to pay a debt He did not owe, on behalf of us who have owed a debt we cannot pay. But this has nothing to do with our deserving pity. God offers it to us because we could never deserve it. And it all starts with true repentance, i.e., true owning up, confessing of wrongdoing and changing from those sinful practices.
I don't buy into the "born homosexual", and I don't expect to change every mind of those who do. Humans have free will regardless of propensity, and this man chose the iniquity he has practiced. His spiritual and psychological harm is nothing more than the consequences of his own actions, getting busted and being revealed for hypocrite he is and the debauchery he has indulged in. This is not some victim's dilemma or the product of a ruse about homosexuality being "chosen".
Nice try, but people have more power of choice than that lame excuse.
quote:
Originally posted by TulsaDavid
I don't buy into the "born homosexual", and I don't expect to change every mind of those who do. Humans have free will regardless of propensity, and this man chose the iniquity he has practiced. His spiritual and psychological harm is nothing more than the consequences of his own actions, getting busted and being revealed for hypocrite he is and the debauchery he has indulged in. This is not some victim's dilemma or the product of a ruse about homosexuality being "chosen".
Nice try, but people have more power of choice than that lame excuse.
Walk in my shoes before you have your proclamation that homosexuality is chosen. That is my button having someone tell me something which I know from first-hand experience to be false. But get on your pedestal and preach away David, just know that it rings hollow to people with real life experiences. I respect you, but I don't respect your message.
The debauchery is that he cheated on his wife, the sadness is that people out there point fingers and make proclamations without really knowing. I don't need you to "buy in" to anything, just like I will not "buy in" to your beliefs when my own experience has shown me that the hate preached by people like Haggard is immoral.
Go ahead and preach, I'll tune out.
quote:
Originally posted by Conan71
Where's Aox with one of his National Enquirer pieces to say that Karl Rove and Bush II were watching gay porn with Haggard?
I've go the pics but it's gonna cost ya. [:D]
quote:
Originally posted by TulsaDavid
There is not an apostle or original New Testament leader that ever "blew it" that way.
Okay, was your choice of words there intentional? [}:)]
Haggert interview:
http://wm.kusa.gannett.edgestreams.net/news/1162580559552-11-03-06-haggard-interview-.wmv
Agreed except for the fact he was a WHITE HOUSE INSIDER! A meth freak hanging out in the oval office.
What Wisdom Did Haggard Share with Bush Every Monday?
http://www.lastchancedemocracycafe.com/?p=668
"This scandal should wipe the stupid Kerry "joke" news off the face of the earth, especially if they can link Mr. Haggard to Mr. Bush, as this article certainly does."
Actually, this pales in comparison to this treasonous behavior!
"The campaign for the Web site was led by the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, Representative Peter Hoekstra of Michigan. Last November, he and his Senate counterpart, Pat Roberts of Kansas, wrote to Mr. Negroponte, asking him to post the Iraqi material. The sheer volume of the documents, they argued, had overwhelmed the intelligence community. "
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/03/world/middleeast/03documents.html?th&emc=th
FROM KOS!!!!
"Now I realize that an alleged scandal involving a gay hooker, a Right-wing evangelical leader, and crystal meth is enough to make the Rita Cosby's of the broadcast news world tremble with excitement. But I thought a story about how our illustrious War President and Defender against Terrorism over rode his own weapons security experts at the behest of the Rubber-stamp Republican Congress and posted highly classified, detailed technical tips for making a fission bomb on the Internet might be worth a mention. "
WEEKEND FROM HELL FOR BUSH.....
QuoteOriginally posted by aoxamaxoa
http://www.lastchancedemocracycafe.com/?p=668/quote]
That is a great link.
I especially liked the poster who wrote about the gay preacher giving new meaning to "turn the other cheek".
As someone once said, "When one lays down with dogs, don't be surprised if they wake up with fleas."
Well, pastor Driscoll has enlightened everyone why pastors may be tempted to have sweaty man-on-man sex; the laziness of the pastor's wife!
"Most pastors I know do not have satisfying, free, sexual conversations and liberties with their wives. At the risk of being even more widely despised than I currently am, I will lean over the plate and take one for the team on this. It is not uncommon to meet pastors' wives who really let themselves go; they sometimes feel that because their husband is a pastor, he is therefore trapped into fidelity, which gives them cause for laziness. A wife who lets herself go and is not sexually available to her husband in the ways that the Song of Songs is so frank about is not responsible for her husband's sin, but she may not be helping him either."
http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_2006-11-03_evangelical_leader_quits
Thankfully Driscoll has given his fellow pastors a good excuse for those sordid gay affairs, blame the wife!
So let me get this straight. Driscoll essentially implies that Ted Haggard's wife isn't putting out.
So Haggard go finds a MAN to release his sexual urges?
It didn't occur to Haggard to have a mistress?
And, I've seen video of Haggard's wife. She isn't unattractive. So that excuse doesn't fly, either.
Driscoll ignores what is obvious: That Ted Haggard is a suppressed gay man who tried (and failed) to use evangelism to further fuel his self-suppression. The alleged use of meth also is a symptom of his divided psyche.
But instead, Driscoll pretty much blames the wife.
Jerk.
Maybe Driscoll ought to get tossed out on his ear, too.
quote:
Originally posted by okiebybirth
Well, pastor Driscoll has enlightened everyone why pastors may be tempted to have sweaty man-on-man sex; the laziness of the pastor's wife!
"Most pastors I know do not have satisfying, free, sexual conversations and liberties with their wives. At the risk of being even more widely despised than I currently am, I will lean over the plate and take one for the team on this. It is not uncommon to meet pastors' wives who really let themselves go; they sometimes feel that because their husband is a pastor, he is therefore trapped into fidelity, which gives them cause for laziness. A wife who lets herself go and is not sexually available to her husband in the ways that the Song of Songs is so frank about is not responsible for her husband's sin, but she may not be helping him either."
http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_2006-11-03_evangelical_leader_quits
Thankfully Driscoll has given his fellow pastors a good excuse for those sordid gay affairs, blame the wife!
Ya know this really BURNS MY donkey. Right wing fundamentalist Christians have been whining for decades that the problem with America is that people don't take responsibility for their actions. And now this driscoll idiot tries to give Haggard a pass because it's his freakin' WIFE'S FAULT that he did meth and screwed a male prostitute? That's gotta be just about the most ASSHOLIC excuse I've ever seen in my more than half a freakin' century on this planet. I hope a seething, hissing band of preachers' wives parks in his front yard and expresses their opinions of this at ear splitting volume. Every self-respecting, genuine, DECENT Christian should verbally blast this imbecile off the planet.
I doubt if we'll hear a peep from them, but I'd like to hear from a few right wing fundamentalist Christians on this. Do you AGREE with this? How 'bout it, Cubs? Is it the wife's fault?
Here's a couple of email addresses for Driscoll's Website of Sleaze in case you wanna let him know what you think of his comments:
submissions@theresurgence.com
info@theresurgence.com
quote:
Haggard immediately denied the allegations, but later acknowledged having paid the man for a massage and to provide methamphetamine.
"I bought it for myself but never used it," he said on Friday. "I was tempted, but I never used it."
Yeah, RIGHT. Haggard didn't inhale either.
CBS News (//%22http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/11/04/national/main2153399.shtml%22)
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Haggard immediately denied the allegations, but later acknowledged having paid the man for a massage and to provide methamphetamine.
"I bought it for myself but never used it," he said on Friday. "I was tempted, but I never used it."
Yeah, RIGHT. Haggard didn't inhale either.
CBS News (//%22http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/11/04/national/main2153399.shtml%22)
Haggard is also claiming that he purchased a "first time customers only" introductory sample of crystal meth (meth dealers are notorious for their promotions). But threw it away. This must be our GOP version of the implausibility of "not inhaling," but, in typical Republican fashion, seems rather more blatantly wasteful. Did he not think of the consequences of this lie? Why, poor Nicole Richie is probably combing the side of every road out of Denver for that tiny baggie as I type this.http://www.bettybowers.com/nl_nov2006.html
Ted Haggard appeared in
Jesus Camp... here's a couple of reviews posted by sgrizzle from this thread... http://www.tulsanow.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5038&SearchTerms=Jesus,Camp
http://www.christianitytoday.com/movies/reviews/2006/jesuscamp.html
quote:
Ted Haggard, President of the National Association of Evangelicals, who makes a brief appearance near the end of the film, wrote a letter to all 42 NAE denominational leaders that read, in part: "I am concerned that we are seeing the initial attempts to characterize Evangelical practices as extreme and, in some cases, similar to the practices and beliefs of Islamic Fundamentalists. No doubt, we all need to learn to communicate the Gospel more clearly in our globalized world, realizing that our words can be interpreted very differently than intended because of the evolving global situation ....
"I didn't like [Jesus Camp] for two reasons. (1) It portrayed the training of kids at the camp as militaristic, extreme, and scary and (2) It forces non-Charismatic evangelicals to say, "That's not us, it's them!" My concern is that the movie will reverse the growing respect that has been growing between Pentecostal and non-Pentecostal Evangelicals for the past three decades, and that those on the far left will use it to reinforce their most negative stereotypes of Christian believers. ... It's one more 'documentary' that seems to miss the point intentionally."
Magnolia president Eamonn Bowles is surprised at the uproar. In a statement, Bowles says, "We're frankly surprised and a little disheartened by the efforts of prominent members of the evangelical community to clamp down on Jesus Camp. Whether or not the children and camp depicted in the film represents the 'mainstream' of the Evangelical movement is beside the point: they exist, the film documents them, and the subjects feel they've been treated fairly. Why a community that's so quick to attack discrimination from secular Americans would then turn and do the same to other Evangelicals is unexpected, to say the least."
http://www.pluggedinonline.com/movies/movies/a0002908.cfm
quote:
In Colorado Springs, New Life Church pastor Ted Haggard, also the head of the National Association of Evangelicals, is shown playfully interacting with the camera. With his guard down as if among friends, he quips, "If the evangelicals vote, they determine the election. It's a fabulous life!" But after seeing the finished film, he was far from pleased. He wrote, "[You] can learn as much about the Catholic Church from Nacho Libre" as you can learn about evangelicalism from Jesus Camp. He continued, "It does represent a small portion of the charismatic movement, but I think it demonizes it. Secularists are hoping that evangelical Christians and radicalized Muslims are essentially the same, which is why they will love this film."
Enjoy the irony...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6rSjrBhUIA
I thinks this is a right wing conspiracy to capture the gay evangelic vote.....
http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101050207/photoessay/11.html
quote:
At a meeting with President Bush in November 2003, after nearly an hour of jovial Oval Office chat, the Rev. Ted Haggard, 48, got serious. He argued against Bush-imposed steel tariffs on the grounds that free markets foster economic growth, which helps the poor. A month later, the White House dropped the tariffs. Haggard wasn't alone in faulting the policy, and he doesn't claim to be the impetus, but as president of the National Association of Evangelicals, he gets listened to. He represents 30 million conservative Christians spread over 45,000 churches from 52 diverse denominations. Every Monday he participates in the West Wing conference call with evangelical leaders. The group continues to prod the President to campaign aggressively for a federal marriage amendment. "We wanted him to use the force of his office to actively lobby the Congress and Senate, which he did not adequately do," says Haggard. He is also working to broaden his group's agenda. A document issued last fall offered a theological justification for civic activism by U.S. Evangelicals, calling on them to protect the environment, promote global religious and political freedom and human rights, safeguard "wholesome family life," care for the poor and oppose racism. Says Haggard: "With the growth of Evangelicalism worldwide, we have to be involved in political and social action to impact the culture worldwide."
It strikes me as very POSSIBLE that something really good could come out of this for the country. Maybe the backlash from this will force a lot of sleeping Americans to wake up from their stupor and realize that the Right Wing Christian Fundamentalist Thing is nothing but a political organization whose goal is to turn the U.S. into a theocracy controlled exclusively by THEM. Maybe it'll even wake up some sleeping Christians to the fact that they are being exploited for political gain. There MIGHT even be a few Republicans who wake up to the fact that their Grand Old Party has become nothing more than the political whore of the Right Wing Christian Fundamentalist Thing.
I can dream, can't I?
"Are all homophobic Republicans secretly gay? The leaders of the party with a penchant for condemning others would do well to look inward. It's time to call them on their hypocrisy."
http://www.alternet.org/story/43876/
"What is the solution to this misplaced effort to restrict others' behavior? For Freud, it was therapy. But more broadly, it's a dose of introspection, an ability to look inward, and to shift focus from others' behavior to our own."
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
It strikes me as very POSSIBLE that something really good could come out of this for the country. Maybe the backlash from this will force a lot of sleeping Americans to wake up from their stupor and realize that the Right Wing Christian Fundamentalist Thing is nothing but a political organization whose goal is to turn the U.S. into a theocracy controlled exclusively by THEM. Maybe it'll even wake up some sleeping Christians to the fact that they are being exploited for political gain. There MIGHT even be a few Republicans who wake up to the fact that their Grand Old Party has become nothing more than the political whore of the Right Wing Christian Fundamentalist Thing.
I can dream, can't I?
I woke up to that realization some time back, if you notice what one half of my signature says.
For a country founded largely upon the premise of getting away from religious oppression, the fundamentalist Christian right is trying awful hard to interject itself into American government.
The piety and intollerance of the FCR movement will be the ultimate un-doing of the Republican party.
Niether the Foley or Haggard stories would have sprouted legs if not for the GOP being so far up the a$$ of the FCR movement (pardon the pun).
LOL...
Fired Pastor Ted: "There's a part of my life that is so repulsive and dark that I have been warring against it for all of my adult life." Then there's his sex life.
"We all wear the same thorny crown...."
Bob Dylan
quote:
Originally posted by Conan71
Niether the Foley or Haggard stories would have sprouted legs if not for the GOP being so far up the a$$ of the FCR movement (pardon the pun).
Do you have any IDEA how many really bad puns that opens the door to? [}:)]
Whew! I feel much better now that Dobson is going to personally (//%22http://www.gazette.com/display.php?secid=14#/%22) handle Haggard's "spiritual restoration".
Interesting article--repentance apparently now involves a polygraph test. The last I heard sayeth, salvation was between you and the Lord.
Trust in the Lord--but verify???
Maybe next time Haggard wants a massage, Dobson will explain to him that it someone should apply it with hands, not the tongue.
[:O]
I am going to asume they are all the same until proven otherwise.....especially Dobson.
quote:
Originally posted by aoxamaxoa
I am going to asume they are all the same until proven otherwise.....especially Dobson.
I hear ya. Seriously, dude, please take your
Focus off of
my Family.
So how come there haven't been any right wing fundies here to blame this on Clinton?
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
So how come there haven't been any right wing fundies here to blame this on Clinton?
That's the whole problem, I WANT the Christian right to court the Democrat party so I can make fun of THEM when another scandal breaks. [}:)]
quote:
Originally posted by Conan71
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
So how come there haven't been any right wing fundies here to blame this on Clinton?
That's the whole problem, I WANT the Christian right to court the Democrat party so I can make fun of THEM when another scandal breaks. [}:)]
Sweet paybacks, eh? Be patient...it's just a matter of time...
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by Conan71
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
So how come there haven't been any right wing fundies here to blame this on Clinton?
That's the whole problem, I WANT the Christian right to court the Democrat party so I can make fun of THEM when another scandal breaks. [}:)]
Sweet paybacks, eh? Be patient...it's just a matter of time...
I'm already sharpening my fangs...
quote:
Originally posted by Conan71
I'm already sharpening my fangs...
Dude, if your fangs get any SHARPER, even I'LL be scared to tangle with you. [:O]
SPOT! Show no fear like we know you have.....
quote:
Originally posted by aoxamaxoa
SPOT! Show no fear like we know you have.....
Aox, Miss Cates would sh*t a rubber twinkie if she saw that sentence. [}:)]
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by aoxamaxoa
SPOT! Show no fear like we know you have.....
Aox, Miss Cates would sh*t a rubber twinkie if she saw that sentence. [}:)]
I'm not sure who Miss Cates (Phoebe? Yum!) is, but that was just too friggin' hillarious.[:P]
quote:
Originally posted by Conan71
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by aoxamaxoa
SPOT! Show no fear like we know you have.....
Aox, Miss Cates would sh*t a rubber twinkie if she saw that sentence. [}:)]
I'm not sure who Miss Cates (Phoebe? Yum!) is, but that was just too friggin' hillarious.[:P]
I should BE so lucky!!
Nah, Miss Cates was my eight grade English teacher. She was a bee-atch royale and I learned more from her than from any other teacher. Ever.
The next repug to get exposed? Ken Mehlman, head of RNC (who is above the Bush bs) will soon expose himself. That's a prediction ....
Dobson quits (//%22http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/dobson-quits-haggard-counseling-team/20061107212009990005?cid=505%22) Haggard's "spiritual restoration" team.
quote:
Originally posted by Chicken Little
Dobson quits (//%22http://articles.news.aol.com/news/_a/dobson-quits-haggard-counseling-team/20061107212009990005?cid=505%22) Haggard's "spiritual restoration" team.
He can't be bothered with trying to "save souls"; he's got elections to win.
Haggard is a bigot and hypocrite. He spent more time trashing and belittling gays while in his quiet moments (or not so quiet), he found solice in gaydom.
His crying and letter writing is a bunch of b.s. If he hadn't been found out, he would still be looking for favours elsewhere.
It's not his wife's fault that he's a hypocrite and closet gay.
OK ... what the heck is "spiritual restoration"?
It sounds like they're denying reality -- that Ted Haggard is a gay man. Being sequested with a bunch of preachers isn't going to change the fact that he's a repressed homosexual.
Time to come out of the closet, Ted. Be who you are.
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588
OK ... what the heck is "spiritual restoration"?
It sounds like they're denying reality -- that Ted Haggard is a gay man. Being sequested with a bunch of preachers isn't going to change the fact that he's a repressed homosexual.
Time to come out of the closet, Ted. Be who you are.
But how much of a power broker could he be as a gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588
OK ... what the heck is "spiritual restoration"?
It sounds like they're denying reality -- that Ted Haggard is a gay man. Being sequested with a bunch of preachers isn't going to change the fact that he's a repressed homosexual.
Time to come out of the closet, Ted. Be who you are.
But how much of a power broker could he be as a gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
What about an ex gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
I bet he goes and gets himself 'cured'.
quote:
Originally posted by si_uk_lon_ok
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588
OK ... what the heck is "spiritual restoration"?
It sounds like they're denying reality -- that Ted Haggard is a gay man. Being sequested with a bunch of preachers isn't going to change the fact that he's a repressed homosexual.
Time to come out of the closet, Ted. Be who you are.
But how much of a power broker could he be as a gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
What about an ex gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
I bet he goes and gets himself 'cured'.
Oh, yeah. He'll get up there like Jimmy Swaggart and cry some crocodile tears and lament, "I hay-uv SEE-und!" and they'll take him back. I mean, let's face it, there probably aren't a whole lot of Nobel laureates in his target audience.
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by si_uk_lon_ok
quote:
Originally posted by papaspot
quote:
Originally posted by rwarn17588
OK ... what the heck is "spiritual restoration"?
It sounds like they're denying reality -- that Ted Haggard is a gay man. Being sequested with a bunch of preachers isn't going to change the fact that he's a repressed homosexual.
Time to come out of the closet, Ted. Be who you are.
But how much of a power broker could he be as a gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
What about an ex gay right wing fundamentalist Christian?
I bet he goes and gets himself 'cured'.
Oh, yeah. He'll get up there like Jimmy Swaggart and cry some crocodile tears and lament, "I hay-uv SEE-und!" and they'll take him back. I mean, let's face it, there probably aren't a whole lot of Nobel laureates in his target audience.
The thing is they all have to believe he is healed and forgive him, because that's what Jesus would do.
Thing I think is sad is that the meth and escort seem to be a much smaller deal than the gay sex thing.
quote:
Originally posted by si_uk_lon_ok
The thing is they all have to believe he is healed and forgive him, because that's what Jesus would do.
Forgiving him is one thing but I don't think Jesus would expect you to put a repentant thief in charge of the till.
quote:
Thing I think is sad is that the meth and escort seem to be a much smaller deal than the gay sex thing.
Normally I would agree with you on this. But I think what made the gay thing a bigger factor was his infamy for gay bashing and his anti-gay rights stance. I'm not saying he never preached against illegal drug use or prostitution but that's not where his notoriety was, at least that's not my impression.
quote:
Originally posted by aoxamaxoa
The next repug to get exposed? Ken Mehlman, head of RNC (who is above the Bush bs) will soon expose himself. That's a prediction ....
Bill Maher Outs Ken Mehlman on Larry King Live:
MAHER: "Frank Rich wrote about this a couple of weeks ago. He said, yes we've heard about Mark Foley...but he said, that's just the beginning of it. A lot of the chiefs of staff, the people who really run the underpinnings of the Republican party, are gay. I don't want to mention names but I will Friday night.
KING: You will Friday night?
MAHER: There's a couple people everybody in Washington knows, who run the Republican party
KING: You will name them?
MAHER: I wouldn't be the first. I'd get sued if I was the first, but...you know, Ken Mehlman, okay there's one I think people have talked about. I don't think he's denied it when people have suggested it (actually, he has). He doesn't say...
KING: Ken Mehlman? I've never heard that. But the question is...
MAHER: Maybe you don't go to the same bathhouse I do Larry.
KING: Why would someone who is gay take public anti-gay positions? Why would you do that?
MAHER: Because Larry, hating yourself is the greatest love of all.
KING: (Laughs)
FINDING MY RELIGION
Former second-in-command of the White House Office of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives talks about why evangelicals should stay out of politics
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/archive/2006/11/13/findrelig.DTL