If this megalomaniac has any chance at being elected it really is time to blow this town!
One of her volunteers knocked at my door this a.m. I politely told her yeah, when hell freezes over. She thanked me for not slamming the door in her face like my neighbor did. (smart neighbor)
I'm voting for Christiansen - may not agree with him on everything but at least he's a true public servant - and a smart guy.
Get smart Tulsa - don't just vote for the most familiar name.
Quote from: LocalGirl on March 02, 2013, 11:24:28 PM
If this megalomaniac has any chance at being elected it really is time to blow this town!
One of her volunteers knocked at my door this a.m. I politely told her yeah, when hell freezes over. She thanked me for not slamming the door in her face like my neighbor did. (smart neighbor)
I'm voting for Christiansen - may not agree with him on everything but at least he's a true public servant - and a smart guy.
Get smart Tulsa - don't just vote for the most familiar name.
Hah! Christiansen a nice guy? You've obviously not dealt with him at a business level like many I know have. He also snubbed me at the BOK Center grand opening when I asked him a question. I politely called him a D-bag.
I'll keep my options open, but right now I'd vote for Taylor over anyone in the current field.
Kathy made a lot of people really angry and a lot of people really like her. The reason... she actually got things done. Any time you do something or make any changes in this town you will make people angry. You, and even I, may not like her methods, but I liked that she got things done. Doing nothing is the easiest way to not ruffle feathers, too much. The main thing I wanted this last administration to do was implement the new Comprehensive Plan everyone worked so long and hard for and paid so much money and time to get started. Bartlett hasn't pushed it's implementation, quite the contrary he seems to have intentionally stalled it and pushed it off to the side hoping it will wither and die. And has instead pushed ideas that are completely contrary to what people indicated they wanted with the new comprehensive plan (like the completion of the Gilcrease Expressway). His priority was "same ol same ol barely slow Tulsa growth" ignoring national demographic trends and changes, vrs "faster growth for the future of Tulsa by implementing the Comprehensive Plan".
I do like that Bartlett appears to have cut some extraneous fat here and there from city government, he may have been the right guy for the right time in that aspect, and there are still a lot of streamlining/efficiency/upgrading things that need to be done at City Hall. But, you can't ignore the future and ignore making changes, again thinking about the Comprehensive Plan.
How each candidate will prioritize the implementation of the new Comprehensive Plan (which indeed has the potential to make a lot of people quite angry, but needs to be done) will be a major factor in deciding my vote. Bartlett is out, it's between Kathy and Christiansen.
I'm no fan of BC and neither are the others at Riverside.
Dewey is a nice guy who was born on third base and thinks he hit a homer. Unfortunately, he lied about employment under his direction (like he's the reason for the increase?). And he continues to fail at attempting to clean up our air and water.
KT is a known entity and yes, a familiar name. Actually, we should feel fortunate she is willing to go it again. Tulsa needs a ballsie Mayor.
Quote from: Teatownclown on March 03, 2013, 11:17:40 AM
KT is a known entity and yes, a familiar name. Actually, we should feel fortunate she is willing to go it again. Tulsa needs a ballsie Mayor.
So ballsie she dropped out of the race last time when she saw the recession coming.
Christianasen does not have a clue, Bartlett does not have a vision and Taylor is more worried about her image and dreams of higher office. I don't see any good choices.
What did KT do wrong? Higher office? we should be so lucky....She is hands above every state politician when it comes to smarts and ability to get government to work for the taxpayer.
Quote from: DTowner on March 03, 2013, 12:40:35 PM
So ballsie she dropped out of the race last time when she saw the recession coming.
Christianasen does not have a clue, Bartlett does not have a vision and Taylor is more worried about her image and dreams of higher office. I don't see any good choices.
Actually if you read exactly why she was not running again vis-a-vis the economy, the challenges had started and she felt Tulsa would be better off if she didn't have to be distracted by a campaign at the time. At least that's her stated reason. I honestly didn't fault her for not having much energy at the time for another term. She accomplished the most and was appreciated the least. If everyone appreciates the current look and vibe of the Brady District and near areas, I strongly suspect it would not look like it does now and we'd be still awaiting many of the improvements which are now done, like the Matthews Warehouse project or Guthrie Green.
I was no KT fan when she came into office and remained that way for a year or so. It dawned on me that she really had vision. Sure, cronies of hers benefitted by her being mayor, but who hasn't? She's got Kaiser's ear and some people call her his puppet. If her being in office helped get more of KFF's money spread around within the IDL, I fail to see how that is a negative.
I'm not calling you out specifically, I'm simply encouraging people to give an honest appraisal of the individuals running for office and I think Taylor is grossly mis-characterized as a "tax and spend librul" or that she ran from some sort of challenge. Anyone who has actually had the opportunity to work around her knows she doesn't shy away from a good challenge.
I like Bill Christiansen. I've been a constituent of his and customer at his aviation business. I have nothing bad to say about previous business dealings I've personally had with him nor with anything when he was a councilor. I think he could be a good mayor.
Bartlet (sic) is a clueless bumpkin. He needs to go back to tending his oil business.
I'd vote for either Taylor or Christiansen. I'd have to give the edge to KT as I know what her leadership style is and I think it's what Tulsa needs to keep from becoming complacent.
I think that is a good assesment Conan. +1
Quote from: Conan71 on March 03, 2013, 06:20:42 PM
Actually if you read exactly why she was not running again vis-a-vis the economy, the challenges had started and she felt Tulsa would be better off if she didn't have to be distracted by a campaign at the time. At least that's her stated reason. I honestly didn't fault her for not having much energy at the time for another term. She accomplished the most and was appreciated the least. If everyone appreciates the current look and vibe of the Brady District and near areas, I strongly suspect it would not look like it does now and we'd be still awaiting many of the improvements which are now done, like the Matthews Warehouse project or Guthrie Green.
I was no KT fan when she came into office and remained that way for a year or so. It dawned on me that she really had vision. Sure, cronies of hers benefitted by her being mayor, but who hasn't? She's got Kaiser's ear and some people call her his puppet. If her being in office helped get more of KFF's money spread around within the IDL, I fail to see how that is a negative.
I'm not calling you out specifically, I'm simply encouraging people to give an honest appraisal of the individuals running for office and I think Taylor is grossly mis-characterized as a "tax and spend librul" or that she ran from some sort of challenge. Anyone who has actually had the opportunity to work around her knows she doesn't shy away from a good challenge.
Connan – While I thought Taylor did a pretty good job as Mayor, I think you give her more credit than she deserve for what's currently happening in the Brady and downtown. The foundations for many of today's achievements in that area were laid before she became mayor and/or have more to do with the efforts of others. The ballpark has helped the area, but the development around it has generally been disappointingly sparse to date.
My biggest problem with Taylor is that, as you noted, it was clear when she backed out of running for a second term that the city (state and county) were headed for some tough economic times. If she is as skilled as she says and you believe, then that is exactly the time the city needed her the most. Claiming she was worn out just doesn't cut it. She quit when the going got tough and now wants the job back when things appear to be on the upswing. That is not the kind of leadership I can believe in.
I don't find any of the three candidates appealing, but I think she will win.
Quote from: DTowner on March 04, 2013, 11:38:32 AM
The ballpark has helped the area, but the development around it has generally been disappointingly sparse to date.
I disagree. I think the ballpark has helped quite a bit. I also don't blame the ballpark just because the properties directly next to it haven't sold and changed. I attend many games and see lots of people walking to the ball park after hanging out in both the Brady Arts District and the Blue Dome.
I have young kids and they never said they wanted to live near the fairgrounds even though we went to many a game there. Now, my kids really want to live and work downtown. The ballpark made everything within five blocks cool to them.
Baseball is magic and moving the ballpark spurred everything in my opinion.
To be specific, what I remember about Taylor's announcement in June, 2009, that she was not seeking reelection was that she was pushing the ball park financing package through the city council. Some councilors were balking because they were reluctant to give her a big win in the run-up to the campaign. She defused that concern by publicly announcing that she would not seek reelection. The package passed that very evening. In her announcement she mentioned that the challenges the city was facing would require her full attention and she would need to be making decisions that could be unpopular and didn't feel that her spending time on the campaign trail was in Tulsa's best interest. But make no mistake about it, pulling off the ballpark deal was at the center of her decision.
The claim that she ducked the recession sounds like one of Freddie Davis's spiels.
Quote from: DTowner on March 04, 2013, 11:38:32 AM
Connan – While I thought Taylor did a pretty good job as Mayor, I think you give her more credit than she deserve for what's currently happening in the Brady and downtown. The foundations for many of today's achievements in that area were laid before she became mayor and/or have more to do with the efforts of others. The ballpark has helped the area, but the development around it has generally been disappointingly sparse to date.
My biggest problem with Taylor is that, as you noted, it was clear when she backed out of running for a second term that the city (state and county) were headed for some tough economic times. If she is as skilled as she says and you believe, then that is exactly the time the city needed her the most. Claiming she was worn out just doesn't cut it. She quit when the going got tough and now wants the job back when things appear to be on the upswing. That is not the kind of leadership I can believe in.
I don't find any of the three candidates appealing, but I think she will win.
Quote from: cynical on March 04, 2013, 02:20:19 PM
To be specific, what I remember about Taylor's announcement in June, 2009, that she was not seeking reelection was that she was pushing the ball park financing package through the city council. Some councilors were balking because they were reluctant to give her a big win in the run-up to the campaign. She defused that concern by publicly announcing that she would not seek reelection. The package passed that very evening. In her announcement she mentioned that the challenges the city was facing would require her full attention and she would need to be making decisions that could be unpopular and didn't feel that her spending time on the campaign trail was in Tulsa's best interest. But make no mistake about it, pulling off the ballpark deal was at the center of her decision.
The claim that she ducked the recession sounds like one of Freddie Davis's spiels.
This is what I recall as well. I met her a couple of times. She's very sharp and I think she was a great mayor. And Dewey is a terrible mayor, he has to go.
Christiansen might be a good mayor as well, he was usually a lonely sane voice on the city council there for awhile when the council overall was just a looney bin. But, she's got the experience and already did a good job. She's probably just the safer choice. Either one would likely be able to do well with the much more reasonable council that Tulsa seems to have right now.
The FOP will bankroll their yes-man Christianson in order to defeat Bartlett, so Bartlett's only smart move at this point would be to unload
the dead albatross around his neck and replace the police chief(s).
Taylor? She bailed on the people of Tulsa quicker than an Egyptian hot-air balloon pilot.
Quote from: Vashta Nerada on March 04, 2013, 08:08:05 PM
Taylor? She bailed on the people of Tulsa quicker than an Egyptian hot-air balloon pilot.
You are not calling her a "quitter" are ya?
Quote from: Vashta Nerada on March 04, 2013, 08:08:05 PM
The FOP will bankroll their yes-man Christianson in order to defeat Bartlett, so Bartlett's only smart move at this point would be to unload
the dead albatross around his neck and replace the police chief(s).
Taylor? She bailed on the people of Tulsa quicker than an Egyptian hot-air balloon pilot.
Take a look at what she's been doing the last four years. "Bailed" is hardly a term I'd use.
If people truly understood how much of a force she has been in getting Lobeck/Taylor Foundation funds distributed throughout the city as well as being able to influence others to do the same, I think they would have a far better appreciation for her. Our quality of life has benefitted through the elected and un-elected efforts of Kathy Taylor.
I'm pretty certain The Lobeck/Taylor family could afford to live and move their philanthropy to other locales where it would apparently be more appreciated.
Quote from: Vashta Nerada on March 04, 2013, 08:08:05 PM
Taylor? She bailed on the people of Tulsa quicker than an Egyptian hot-air balloon pilot.
Were you even living here then?? Usually your thought process is much less convoluted and ends up at least somewhere near the real world... this time - swing and a miss.
I think this election will be slightly tilted more towards voting against someone rather than voting for. Anybody but Bartlett!!
I'm voting for RM.
Thanks for you support. Unfortunately, I am not running for Mayor in 2013.
Get back with me in four years.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on March 05, 2013, 08:22:17 PM
Thanks for you support. Unfortunately, I am not running for Mayor in 2013.
Get back with me in four years.
Through inaction, many an opportunity is lost.
May not want you in four years....
I just saw an ad for "Gator Boys"....and I knew even without their example, that putting your head inside an alligator's mouth is really a bad idea. Probably a lot like running for office....
Quote from: RecycleMichael on March 05, 2013, 08:22:17 PM
Thanks for you support. Unfortunately, I am not running for Mayor in 2013.
Get back with me in four years.
Sorry, no chance. You have a trashy past.
Quote from: Teatownclown on March 05, 2013, 08:47:47 PM
Sorry, no chance. You have a trashy recycled past.
Recyclable items should not be considered "trash". Just ask any automobile salvage yard owner if he considers his establishment a "junk yard".
;D
Quote from: Red Arrow on March 05, 2013, 09:39:42 PM
Recyclable items should not be considered "trash". Just ask any automobile salvage yard owner if he considers his establishment a "junk yard".
;D
No. My driveway is not a "Junk yard"....
Quote from: RecycleMichael on March 04, 2013, 01:31:24 PM
I disagree. I think the ballpark has helped quite a bit. I also don't blame the ballpark just because the properties directly next to it haven't sold and changed. I attend many games and see lots of people walking to the ball park after hanging out in both the Brady Arts District and the Blue Dome.
I have young kids and they never said they wanted to live near the fairgrounds even though we went to many a game there. Now, my kids really want to live and work downtown. The ballpark made everything within five blocks cool to them.
Baseball is magic and moving the ballpark spurred everything in my opinion.
Well... I do not adhere to the "Baseball is magic" dogma...
Field of Dreams is soooooo last century, RM. :D
But I do believe the "walkable downtown stadium" model is a qualified success.
I don't know how much of it was Kathy Taylor's doing, but in hindsight, I think the location of the ballpark on North Greenwood may have turned out to be better than Bill LaFortune's proposal for the East End/East Village. Unfortunately for LaFortune, and for Taylor in her first few months in office, it turned out Tim Kissler and Willie Lauterbach and their Global Development Partners team from DC were especially good at spending other people's money... and all their supposed assets turned out to be nothing more than smoke-and-mirrors... but I still wonder how popular the "Stadium Improvement District" is going to be twenty years from now?...
As a kid, my family would go to TU basketball games at the Assembly Center, and we never walked anywhere before or after the games.
Park. Watch. Drive home.
Repeat the same routine for anything at the fairgrounds pavillion or the old ballpark.
I think the Brady District is easier to develop than Blue Dome/East End. There are more existing buildings, and it has better "bones."
Every time I read something about how Blue Dome/East End is going to magically transform into some walkable residential urban utopia in the next two or three years, I am tempted to drive down to 3rd & Greenwood and look south for yet another reality check. I really wish the BOk Center had been built there, but alas... excuse me if I find it hard to get excited about another church being built and the local opera company setting up shop in an old fire station... I really don't see that inspiring people to want to move downtown.
Hmmm. KT? My biggest beef with her was that she wasn't a "real" Tulsan and therefore could never comprehend the mindset and twisted civic pride we have here...
Blue Dome is as easy a walk from the ball park as most of the currently developed density in the Brady. I think most all the BD bars and restaurants do as much business as they have time and room for on game nights.
Agreed.
Blue Dome is definitely walkable from the ballpark...
I meant to say that the development you see in Blue Dome starts with the existing older buildings on 1st and 2nd streets, but the areas south of 3rd are sparse, barren, and much harder to develop compared to Brady (or 6th & Peoria, for that matter).
Most of the area south of the Blue Dome will not be repurposed. Lots of empty lots there that will see buildings from scratch.
Interested to see what the final product looks like at the old Bill White building. Sure seems like that would have been easier to scrape and rebuild.
Quote from: rdj on March 07, 2013, 08:23:59 AM
Most of the area south of the Blue Dome will not be repurposed. Lots of empty lots there that will see buildings from scratch.
I'll believe it when I see shovels in the dirt-- or in this case, shovels in the asphalt.
Whither Urban 8? And how's that "neighborhood-transforming" Tulsa Opera HQ landswap going?
When I drive by the Home Depot, the last thing that comes to mind is:
"Wow, this part of town could really use a new church!" :D
Quote from: TulsaRufnex on March 07, 2013, 04:45:12 PM
I'll believe it when I see shovels in the dirt-- or in this case, shovels in the asphalt.
Whither Urban 8? And how's that "neighborhood-transforming" Tulsa Opera HQ landswap going?
When I drive by the Home Depot, the last thing that comes to mind is: "Wow, this part of town could really use a new church!" :D
I'm not disagreeing with you, I never believe a project will happen until the tenets move in and open for business.
I was stating that most of the building stock south of 6th street in the "east end" is not really suitable for rehab, it is demo and rebuild from scratch primarily.
Quote from: TheArtist on March 03, 2013, 08:07:09 AM
Any time you do something or make any changes in this town you will make people angry. You, and even I, may not like her methods, but I liked that she got things done.
So, it doesn't matter what tactics are used to accomplish one's goals? I think the ballpark is a good thing, too, but I know it wasn't all KT's doing - lots of private money and influence was behind that project. I also know she was dishonest in the process of getting the project through the Council. But, so what??
Quote from: Teatownclown on March 03, 2013, 12:55:36 PM
What did KT do wrong?
What (else) did she do wrong? Oh, please! How about her lies to accomplish the City Hall move? How about her refusal to attend CC meetings and make required presentations because they DARED question her? How about firing the new Parks Department head, within months of actively recruiting her, because she DARED question her (KT)? KT thinks she's royalty, exempt from ethical standards, and she's nothing more than an empire builder!
NO - it's NOT ok to 'get things done' in a crooked way - even if some of those things may be beneficial. (What about when they're not?) She's shown she will do whatever is necessary to have things HER way and giving over power to someone like that is just nonsensical.
Quote from: Conan71 on March 05, 2013, 12:02:38 AM
If people truly understood how much of a force she has been in getting Lobeck/Taylor Foundation funds distributed throughout the city as well as being able to influence others to do the same, I think they would have a far better appreciation for her.
Oh, and by the way...the Lobeck/Taylors care so much about Tulsa that they sold their profitable car rental company to a privately held Missouri firm resulting in a net loss of more than 110 Tulsa jobs. What - they needed the money?
I think some of your dates of a sale are not accurate.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 11, 2013, 07:03:44 PM
Oh, and by the way...the Lobeck/Taylors care so much about Tulsa that they sold their profitable car rental company to a privately held Missouri firm resulting in a net loss of more than 110 Tulsa jobs. What - they needed the money?
They outright owned a car rental company?
These unimportant facts you guys refer to are getting in the way of a perfectly good partisan rant she has going. When nothing else sticks it will be noted that an Obama sign was seen in Taylor's yard.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 12, 2013, 12:20:15 PM
These unimportant facts you guys refer to are getting in the way of a perfectly good partisan rant she has going. When nothing else sticks it will be noted that an Obama sign was seen in Taylor's yard.
Oh, give me a break. The last thing I am is partisan. (I happen to have voted for Obama.) The things I have said here are true, but if you don't like my message then attack it - not me.
In 2007, Vanguard Car Rental Group Inc. was privately held and Lobeck was CEO. It is common knowledge that he was a (if not the) principal.
I (and the citizenry of Tulsa, knowingly or unknowingly) have good reasons for wanting to keep KT out of office and they have to do with HER - her actions, her tactics. Leadership means l
eading people and during her tenure as mayor, she demonstrated her
lack of ability to work with people. Leadership does not mean just stacking the deck.
But then again, the city used to own City Hall.
Now we rent the building it moved to, and a business partner got occupancy.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 12, 2013, 12:34:48 PM
Oh, give me a break. The last thing I am is partisan. (I happen to have voted for Obama.) The things I have said here are true, but if you don't like my message then attack it - not me.
In 2007, Vanguard Car Rental Group Inc. was privately held and Lobeck was CEO. It is common knowledge that he was a (if not the) principal.
I (and the citizenry of Tulsa, knowingly or unknowingly) have good reasons for wanting to keep KT out of office and they have to do with HER - her actions, her tactics. Leadership means leading people and during her tenure as mayor, she demonstrated her lack of ability to work with people. Leadership does not mean just stacking the deck.
Sounds a little like a personal vendetta to me.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 12, 2013, 12:34:48 PM
Oh, give me a break. The last thing I am is partisan. (I happen to have voted for Obama.) The things I have said here are true, but if you don't like my message then attack it - not me.
In 2007, Vanguard Car Rental Group Inc. was privately held and Lobeck was CEO. It is common knowledge that he was a (if not the) principal.
I (and the citizenry of Tulsa, knowingly or unknowingly) have good reasons for wanting to keep KT out of office and they have to do with HER - her actions, her tactics. Leadership means leading people and during her tenure as mayor, she demonstrated her lack of ability to work with people. Leadership does not mean just stacking the deck.
Fine. I will attack your message. I think it is misguided and your facts are wrong.
Bill Lobeck bought Alamo Rental Car and National Rental Car out of bankruptcy. He moved the headquarters of his new firm to Tulsa. After they became profitable, Enterprise Rent a Car purchased them to become as big as Hertz and Avis. Dollar Thrifty was also based in Tulsa and recently was purchased by Hertz and have announced moving the Headquarters to Florida.
The Lobecks make their home in Tulsa and now gives lots of money to charity and she wants to serve as a public servant for no pay. She went to school in Oklahoma and got her law degree from OU.
Don't vote for her if you don't want to. But making up facts and then attacking her "leadership" without offering any facts seems unjustified to me. Please tell us what candidate you support so we can have the same opportunity to make up facts about them.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 02:03:49 PM
Fine. I will attack your message. I think it is misguided and your facts are wrong.
Bill Lobeck bought Alamo Rental Car and National Rental Car out of bankruptcy. He moved the headquarters of his new firm to Tulsa. After they became profitable, Enterprise Rent a Car purchased them to become as big as Hertz and Avis. Dollar Thrifty was also based in Tulsa and recently was purchased by Hertz and have announced moving the Headquarters to Florida.
The Lobecks make their home in Tulsa and now gives lots of money to charity and she wants to serve as a public servant for no pay. She went to school in Oklahoma and got her law degree from OU.
Don't vote for her if you don't want to. But making up facts and then attacking her "leadership" without offering any facts seems unjustified to me. Please tell us what candidate you support so we can have the same opportunity to make up facts about them.
What in your post is an attack on LocalGirl's posts? I'm not seeing any correction of any of LocalGirl's statements.
How do you "correct" stuff like this?
Quote from Localgirl: "I also know she was dishonest in the process of getting the project through the Council. But, so what??"
Uh, you know she was dishonest? Sounds like opinion. Share with details or its just electioneering by an opponents supporter.
Quote from: Teatownclown on March 03, 2013, 01:55:36 pm
What did KT do wrong?
Quote from Local Girl: What (else) did she do wrong? Oh, please! How about her lies to accomplish the City Hall move? How about her refusal to attend CC meetings and make required presentations because they DARED question her? How about firing the new Parks Department head, within months of actively recruiting her, because she DARED question her (KT)? KT thinks she's royalty, exempt from ethical standards, and she's nothing more than an empire builder!
NO - it's NOT ok to 'get things done' in a crooked way - even if some of those things may be beneficial. (What about when they're not?) She's shown she will do whatever is necessary to have things HER way and giving over power to someone like that is just nonsensical.
Sounds like Local Girl may have had a losing battle with KT or her administration in the past. At best, these are opinions by the supporter of another candidate. Its hard to refute such opinions because little detail is offered as evidence and they should not be confused with facts.
Local Girl said we lost jobs. She fails to make any mention of jobs created.
Secondly, Enterprise moved 80 jobs to St. Louis, not 110 as she claimed. The 110 number she confused with Dollar Thrifty buyout by Hertz. She was wrong with her facts.
I bet she is one of the many people supporting Christiansen who spend considerable time posting on the Tulsa World and the local TV station websites about how terrible the opponents are and their guy is the true savior of our town. If you read these, you would think that Christiansen is going to win with almost all the votes.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 02:03:49 PM
...and your facts are wrong.
After they became profitable, Enterprise Rent a Car purchased them to become as big as Hertz and Avis.
Uh, yeah, that's what I thought I said.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/31/business/31rental.html?_r=0:
"Last year, in a filing for a public offering, Vanguard said it earned $105.3 million in 2005 on $2.89 billion in revenue."
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 02:03:49 PM
...and she wants to serve as a public servant for no pay.
True she takes no salary. But why don't you check her budget increases for appointed positions in the mayor's office. My GUESS is that it more than makes up for the foregone salary. (at this juncture, I wasn't able to find those numbers) At any rate, certainly her $7.1 million Great Plains settlement, had it not been reversed by the OK Supreme Court, would have.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 02:03:49 PM
Don't vote for her if you don't want to.
duh...
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 02:03:49 PM
Please tell us what candidate you support so we can have the same opportunity to make up facts about them.
Quote from: LocalGirl on March 02, 2013, 11:24:28 PM
I'm voting for Christiansen - may not agree with him on everything but at least he's a true public servant - and a smart guy.
uh, DUH...
Quote from: Hoss on May 12, 2013, 12:59:58 PM
Sounds a little like a personal vendetta to me.
Nope, guess again. Never met the woman, never worked for her, don't travel in her circles, don't know her - except as mayor. (same for Lobeck) Just watched and listened and learned.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 12, 2013, 04:39:09 PM
How do you "correct" stuff like this? Its hard to refute such opinions because little detail is offered as evidence and they should not be confused with facts.
You mean like these?
Quote from: Hoss on March 03, 2013, 01:30:44 AM
Hah! Christiansen a nice guy? You've obviously not dealt with him at a business level like many I know have.
Quote from: Conan71 on March 03, 2013, 06:20:42 PM
Bartlet (sic) is a clueless bumpkin.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 05:30:39 PM
Secondly, Enterprise moved 80 jobs to St. Louis, not 110 as she claimed. The 110 number she confused with Dollar Thrifty buyout by Hertz. She was wrong with her facts.
No, I think you need to check your facts.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/article.aspx/Vanguard_transfers_30_employees_to_St_Louis/20080222_5_E1_spanc86254:
"When the merger was announced last March, Vanguard had 10,000 employees, 659 of them in Tulsa."
"Over the past year, contrary to the expectations of company executives, the merger has resulted in a 17.4 percent decrease in Vanguard jobs in Tulsa."
last time I checked, 659 X .174 = 114.67 > 110
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 05:30:39 PM
I bet she is one of the many people supporting Christiansen who spend considerable time posting on the Tulsa World and the local TV station websites about how terrible the opponents are and their guy is the true savior of our town.
Yes, I support Christiansen (and I said so at the outset.) No, I have not posted on ANY other sites. Yes, I have formulated OPINIONS about KT, as mayor, from listening, watching, and research. No, I cannot PROVE what was in KT's mind when she fired Nancy Atwater (not a friend, not a colleague) only months after actively recruiting her. I did inquire at the time and I did reach a conclusion based on the information I found and what I observed. I guess, since it's not written somewhere, I have no business reaching a considered opinion. No matter that I witnessed KT's behavior with the council, including her refusal to attend their meetings, with my own eyes on local news stories and on TGOV.
What's with you guys anyway? I have to be either a mindless zealot or full of sour grapes? Honestly, I just think that Tulsa rarely has the opportunity to elect a true public servant and I believe, based on his Council record, that BC is one. (again, not a friend, not a colleague) And, Yes, I'm passionate about local politics...ok, maybe even hyper-passionate.
Quote from: TheArtist on March 03, 2013, 08:07:09 AM
You, and even I, may not like her methods, but I liked that she got things done.
I guess the bottom line with some of you is that leadership with integrity is too unreasonable a standard. I disagree.
Oh, and just for the record, Conan (above), I agree with you completely - even without detailed documentation.
I'm going with "mindless zealot" Alex for $50 please.
"Yes, it's my opinion...but its also very true".
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 12, 2013, 06:58:49 PM
"When the merger was announced last March, Vanguard had 10,000 employees, 659 of them in Tulsa."
"Over the past year, contrary to the expectations of company executives, the merger has resulted in a 17.4 percent decrease in Vanguard jobs in Tulsa."
No, I cannot PROVE what was in KT's mind when she fired Nancy Atwater (not a friend, not a colleague) only months after actively recruiting her.
I guess he must have been a bastard to create hundreds of jobs. The fact that many still remain must be proof to you that he should be attacked on a public forum. Take a drink of reality sometime.
Oh, a person was hired and then it didn't work out...get the pitchforks and torches out! The facts is that every Mayor (and Governor and President) routinely replace department heads. There has been a different Park Director under each of the last four Mayors. There has been a different City Attorney, different Fire Chief and Police Chief, a different head of Engineering, etc. under almost every one of the last six Mayors.
For you to try and bring up some obscure person (not a colleague, not a friend, my a$$) who was fired years ago shows how little it takes for you to make up outrage for political purposes.
And local girl...
I agree with you about Bill Christiansen being smart and a good public servant. I have spoken to him often (including three days ago) and he is always very nice to me. My parents adore him and loved him as a Councilor and he was the only City Councilor who ever really asked me questions about recycling and actively tried to help me.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 12, 2013, 09:16:03 PM
For you to try and bring up some obscure person (not a colleague, not a friend, my a$$) who was fired years ago shows how little it takes for you to make up outrage for political purposes.
Ok, that's enough. I was spurred to start this topic when a KT campaigner knocked at my door - not months earlier when BC announced his candidacy, though I knew I would support him from that moment. I formulated opinions about KT YEARS ago when she was mayor and I was very involved in neighborhood issues. I watched and listened closely and neither liked nor respected what I saw. I used the Nancy Atwater (NOT a friend and NOT a colleague) example because, having occurred during that time, it was something I knew about first-hand and because it's a concrete example of the behavior I OBSERVED in KT throughout her tenure. There are many many more examples of her childish and dictatorial behavior, all evident through observation. I believe she left office (elected not to run) because she had bigger and better irons in the fire at the state level and, at the time, heaved a huge sigh of relief that we would be rid of her. I was, frankly, outraged at her hubris in believing that she could simply step back in to her 'old job' and hoped that Tulsans wouldn't allow it. I still do - with a passion.
My opinions on the two candidates are UNRELATED.I don't know KT personally, but loathe her as mayor. I believe she deems herself not a public servant, but more an overlord (enabled by lots of $-acquired influence.) I hate that in government! My opinions are based on my own perceptions of facts and events that I KNOW to be true because I was paying attention. So, my big mistake was having the unmitigated gall to air my opinions on a public forum, huh?
You and others, obviously, disagree and that's your prerogative. However, your prerogatives do not serve to curtail my own. I view many of her behaviors as 'wrong' where you do not. Fine. But, through this, you believe you're privy to the operation of my mind? I assure you that you are not!
Go have a drink, yourself. Drink to your own astonishingly superior intellect and morality.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 12, 2013, 11:07:00 PM
Go have a drink, yourself. Drink to your own astonishingly superior intellect and morality.
Thanks for noticing.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 11, 2013, 06:04:17 PM
So, it doesn't matter what tactics are used to accomplish one's goals? I think the ballpark is a good thing, too, but I know it wasn't all KT's doing - lots of private money and influence was behind that project. I also know she was dishonest in the process of getting the project through the Council. But, so what??
What (else) did she do wrong? Oh, please! How about her lies to accomplish the City Hall move? How about her refusal to attend CC meetings and make required presentations because they DARED question her? How about firing the new Parks Department head, within months of actively recruiting her, because she DARED question her (KT)? KT thinks she's royalty, exempt from ethical standards, and she's nothing more than an empire builder!
NO - it's NOT ok to 'get things done' in a crooked way - even if some of those things may be beneficial. (What about when they're not?) She's shown she will do whatever is necessary to have things HER way and giving over power to someone like that is just nonsensical.
I never said "it doesn't matter what tactics are used" that's a product of your bias. I also did not say "it's ok to 'get things done' in a crooked way".
I do not like how the Bartlett administration appears to be "slowing down the implementation of and or pushing aside, or at best not pushing for" the implementation of the new Comprehensive Plan for instance. And has even been pushing for things in total contradiction of it's findings (one of the studies showed that Tulsa would have slower growth if we continued "as usual" and did things like the Gilcrease Expressway expansion" but would have faster growth if we redid our zoning/infrastructure planning to instead begin focusing more on quality, pedestrian friendly infill. So what's he do? Pushes for the Gilcrease Expressway expansion and ignores the new Comprehensive Plan that everyone worked so long and hard on. Now I could cry foul and suppose he is just wanting his way over the peoples wishes, point to this and that to show how he is being crooked and even immoral in how he does all this, call him names "King Bartlett" etc. But I know this is just the way things are played. Each administration is going to have it's priorities that will be different than someone elses and will do things to make sure their goals are pushed forward and others goals that they do not want to happen are pushed back or ignored. Depending on your perspective the "tactics" involved may look, or may indeed be, "shady". There is a difference between being morally wrong and legally wrong. I believe it's morally wrong to be pushing for more sprawl as usual development, and ignoring the tenants of the new Comprehensive Plan, which I believe will, over time, hurt our cities potential. But that doesn't mean the "means" or "tactics" by which he is doing so is illegal or wrong in that respect "though I don't like them".
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 12, 2013, 11:07:00 PM
Ok, that's enough. I was spurred to start this topic when a KT campaigner knocked at my door - not months earlier when BC announced his candidacy, though I knew I would support him from that moment. I formulated opinions about KT YEARS ago when she was mayor and I was very involved in neighborhood issues. I watched and listened closely and neither liked nor respected what I saw. I used the Nancy Atwater (NOT a friend and NOT a colleague) example because, having occurred during that time, it was something I knew about first-hand and because it's a concrete example of the behavior I OBSERVED in KT throughout her tenure. There are many many more examples of her childish and dictatorial behavior, all evident through observation. I believe she left office (elected not to run) because she had bigger and better irons in the fire at the state level and, at the time, heaved a huge sigh of relief that we would be rid of her. I was, frankly, outraged at her hubris in believing that she could simply step back in to her 'old job' and hoped that Tulsans wouldn't allow it. I still do - with a passion.
My opinions on the two candidates are UNRELATED.
I don't know KT personally, but loathe her as mayor. I believe she deems herself not a public servant, but more an overlord (enabled by lots of $-acquired influence.) I hate that in government! My opinions are based on my own perceptions of facts and events that I KNOW to be true because I was paying attention. So, my big mistake was having the unmitigated gall to air my opinions on a public forum, huh?
You and others, obviously, disagree and that's your prerogative. However, your prerogatives do not serve to curtail my own. I view many of her behaviors as 'wrong' where you do not. Fine. But, through this, you believe you're privy to the operation of my mind? I assure you that you are not!
Go have a drink, yourself. Drink to your own astonishingly superior intellect and morality.
I really was not a Taylor fan for the first year or two she was in office. I'm sure there's plenty of posts of mine somewhere in the murky past of this forum containing very harsh criticism for her over the City Hall move and a few other issues early on in her administration. I was also against the ball park in downtown because we had a perfectly good one at Expo Square. I'm glad to admit I was wrong on that one, I have seen first-hand how much that helped catalyze redevelopment and commerce in the surrounding area and it's truly a nice facility.
What changed my view was actually getting to work with and around her on a project for the Oklahoma Centennial time capsule. The Artist and I both worked on that project. I actually found her to be very thoughtful, inquisitive, and a very skilled and deft administrator. She's one of the busiest and well-organized people I've ever met. Far from being dictatorial, she was very good at delegating authority to capable assistants but she would stay on top of issues or projects until they were completed. I never perceived her as uppity or having a royalty complex. That's why the title of this thread really rankles me.
Unfortunately, we were not able to find a permanent home for the time capsule before she left office, mainly due to issues we had with the Parks Department and/or Parks Board. The Bartlett Administration has never expressed interest in pushing this along, but honestly, they've had issues which I believe would take priority.
She got things done and she was aggressive in getting them done, I can certainly see how that rubs some people the wrong way or can make her misunderstood. I'm sure she helped get projects through which benefitted business associates and backers, most every politician does that. Many of those projects have resulted in a more livable Tulsa, that's pretty hard to deny. I perceive her as someone who really cares about her city.
She and her husband can afford to retire and go float around on a yacht somewhere instead of having the pressure of public service. Instead, she would rather be someone who makes a difference.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 12, 2013, 11:07:00 PM
Ok, that's enough. I was spurred to start this topic when a KT campaigner knocked at my door - not months earlier when BC announced his candidacy, though I knew I would support him from that moment. I formulated opinions about KT YEARS ago when she was mayor and I was very involved in neighborhood issues. I watched and listened closely and neither liked nor respected what I saw. I used the Nancy Atwater (NOT a friend and NOT a colleague) example because, having occurred during that time, it was something I knew about first-hand and because it's a concrete example of the behavior I OBSERVED in KT throughout her tenure. There are many many more examples of her childish and dictatorial behavior, all evident through observation. I believe she left office (elected not to run) because she had bigger and better irons in the fire at the state level and, at the time, heaved a huge sigh of relief that we would be rid of her. I was, frankly, outraged at her hubris in believing that she could simply step back in to her 'old job' and hoped that Tulsans wouldn't allow it. I still do - with a passion.
My opinions on the two candidates are UNRELATED.
I don't know KT personally, but loathe her as mayor. I believe she deems herself not a public servant, but more an overlord (enabled by lots of $-acquired influence.) I hate that in government! My opinions are based on my own perceptions of facts and events that I KNOW to be true because I was paying attention. So, my big mistake was having the unmitigated gall to air my opinions on a public forum, huh?
You and others, obviously, disagree and that's your prerogative. However, your prerogatives do not serve to curtail my own. I view many of her behaviors as 'wrong' where you do not. Fine. But, through this, you believe you're privy to the operation of my mind? I assure you that you are not!
Go have a drink, yourself. Drink to your own astonishingly superior intellect and morality.
Passion is great but passion without facts is just irritating.
I am always surprised how little people seem to understand when they say, "We need government run as a business by business people." without truly understanding what it takes to be an effective business leader. You've described nothing that KT has done that is unusual in the business world. Probably Christiansen and Bartlett have their own similar histories but you didn't draw those conclusions or do that research.
All three are capable and good candidates. For once we have what look like competent, experienced business people to choose from. And all you can do is draw inferences from news reports, a campaigner and your own biases about one of them while ignoring such inferences about the other two? That makes your arguments weak. You don't like her, we get it.
Sometimes expensive shoes hurt your feet. You may want to throw them in the back of the closet and wear your tennies for a while, but eventually you miss the way people looked at you, and you feel compeled to dig them out again.
KT was not a bad mayor, but she was not a great one. Bartlett has done little to impress anyone. Both seem like they enjoyed the status of the position more than the sacrifice.
I think perhaps we should look for a candidate who sees the position as more than a hobby. I'm not sure who that person is. I still like the idea of a business person, but we need one willing to work ON the business rather than just being a participant or figurehead. That requires more of an entrepreneur than a CEO, someone who has improved, innovated, and been passionate about something.
I don't see that person yet. Perhaps we won't for a while. None of the campaigns realize what most Tulsans really want and that is a bit upsetting.
Quote from: Gaspar on May 13, 2013, 10:20:48 AM
None of the campaigns realize what most Tulsans really want and that is a bit upsetting.
What do most Tulsans really want?
Quote from: Townsend on May 13, 2013, 11:44:44 AM
What do most Tulsans really want?
Occasional snacks and an afternoon nap is what I want.
Quote from: Townsend on May 13, 2013, 11:44:44 AM
What do most Tulsans really want?
Cholesterol and saturated fat free extra sharp cheddar cheese that tastes as good as the real stuff.
And free avgas. ;D
Free Marshall's beer for everyone!
Quote from: Conan71 on May 13, 2013, 01:37:54 PM
Free Marshall's beer for everyone!
Marshall's for the win! My vote goes to Conan ;D
Quote from: Townsend on May 13, 2013, 11:44:44 AM
What do most Tulsans really want?
Point well taken. I can only speak for what I want, and that is stated above. I am tired of politicians, status-collectors and political hobbyists. I want a mayor who understands the office as an act of sacrifice, and service to the people. I don't see that being communicated.
There is a Taylor sign in my District 4 Councilor's yard. Could be his wife's.
Quote from: carltonplace on May 14, 2013, 11:51:19 AM
There is a Taylor sign in my District 4 Councilor's yard. Could be his wife's.
I think he is just a fan of Taylor Swift.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 13, 2013, 10:09:01 AM
Passion is great but passion without facts is just irritating.
Don't lecture me about facts. I've seen your glib, one-liner dismissals of facts you don't want to hear. It appears to me you have a pretty selective definition of the word 'fact' anyway:
Quote from: AquaMan on May 12, 2013, 12:20:15 PM
These unimportant facts...
to wit:
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 11, 2013, 10:53:18 PM
I think some of your dates of a sale are not accurate.
Quote from: sgrizzle on May 12, 2013, 09:31:37 AM
They outright owned a car rental company?
Quote from: AquaMan on May 12, 2013, 12:20:15 PM
... you guys refer to are getting in the way of a perfectly good partisan rant she has going.
A statement that happens to coincide with your mindset is a fact. But information reported in local news broadcasts rises only to the level of 'inference.' It's laughable.
What are your goals here, local girl?
Are you looking to just use the forum to express opinions? Are you just trying to make enemies by attacking the regulars? Is this just a window you saw open and thought you would talk bad about other candidates to help your pick?
Not that you will take it, but I suggest you give some credence to posters before you assume they are out to get you. The many posters here represent lots of brain power and a wide variety of views. We can't agree on much politically, but we try to give each other reasons why we feel the way we feel.
When you write sentences like this..."but loathe her as mayor. I believe she deems herself not a public servant, but more an overlord (enabled by lots of $-acquired influence.) I hate that in government! My opinions are based on my own perceptions of facts and events that I KNOW to be true because I was paying attention." ...you draw the ire of the posters that disagree with you.
You say you KNOW, I say you FEEL. Yes. You are entitled to your feelings, but you should know that others may not agree with what you write.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 14, 2013, 04:37:45 PM
What are your goals here, local girl?
Are you looking to just use the forum to express opinions? Are you just trying to make enemies by attacking the regulars? Is this just a window you saw open and thought you would talk bad about other candidates to help your pick?
Not that you will take it, but I suggest you give some credence to posters before you assume they are out to get you. The many posters here represent lots of brain power and a wide variety of views. We can't agree on much politically, but we try to give each other reasons why we feel the way we feel.
When you write sentences like this..."but loathe her as mayor. I believe she deems herself not a public servant, but more an overlord (enabled by lots of $-acquired influence.) I hate that in government! My opinions are based on my own perceptions of facts and events that I KNOW to be true because I was paying attention." ...you draw the ire of the posters that disagree with you.
You say you KNOW, I say you FEEL. Yes. You are entitled to your feelings, but you should know that others may not agree with what you write.
Over how long period of time must I participate on this forum before I can make a statement like "Bartlett is a clueless bumpkin" or "Christianasen does not have a clue" without being called a mindless, partisan liar?
I made no assumptions about other posters; I simply responded. Can we
now just begin to have mutually respectful discussions about issues on which we disagree?
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 14, 2013, 04:13:50 PM
Don't lecture me about facts. I've seen your glib, one-liner dismissals of facts you don't want to hear. It appears to me you have a pretty selective definition of the word 'fact' anyway:
Damn, pegged Aquaman ;)
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 14, 2013, 05:12:06 PM
Over how long period of time must I participate on this forum before I can make a statement like "Bartlett is a clueless bumpkin" or "Christianasen does not have a clue" without being called a mindless, partisan liar?
I made no assumptions about other posters; I simply responded. Can we now just begin to have mutually respectful discussions about issues on which we disagree?
Your posts are quickly flammable and I and others disagree. You have said these things on Kathy Taylor...
"If this megalomaniac has any chance at being elected it really is time to blow this town!
One of her volunteers knocked at my door this a.m. I politely told her yeah, when hell freezes over."
"What (else) did she do wrong? Oh, please! How about her lies to accomplish the City Hall move? How about her refusal to attend CC meetings and make required presentations because they DARED question her? How about firing the new Parks Department head, within months of actively recruiting her, because she DARED question her (KT)? KT thinks she's royalty, exempt from ethical standards, and she's nothing more than an empire builder!"
"NO - it's NOT ok to 'get things done' in a crooked way - even if some of those things may be beneficial. (What about when they're not?) She's shown she will do whatever is necessary to have things HER way and giving over power to someone like that is just nonsensical."
"I don't know KT personally, but loathe her as mayor. I believe she deems herself not a public servant, but more an overlord (enabled by lots of $-acquired influence.) I hate that in government! My opinions are based on my own perceptions of facts and events that I KNOW to be true because I was paying attention." Do you not realize that some disagree with you? Do you not expect people who like her to disagree and say so?
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 14, 2013, 05:12:06 PM
Over how long period of time must I participate on this forum before I can make a statement like "Bartlett is a clueless bumpkin" or "Christianasen does not have a clue" without being called a mindless, partisan liar?
I made no assumptions about other posters; I simply responded. Can we now just begin to have mutually respectful discussions about issues on which we disagree?
Probably years. But that's part of the fun of it, don't you think?? You probably should provide more direct evidence, anecdotes, stories, information - adds some interest to the argument and makes it more difficult to rebut.
What (else) did she do wrong? Oh, please! How about her lies to accomplish the City Hall move? Example - "She said... <this, that and the other> .... working to have city hall moved, and they are false because....< some more stuff to back up why it is false >....."
How about her refusal to attend CC meetings and make required presentations because they DARED question her? "She was a no show on < date, time, location >...!"
I have been blasting away at Inhofe ever since I started on here. And HE has been incompetent since his first election won back in the 60's, and yet, we still have enough people here in this state to keep re-electing him for decades!! One example was when he was first elected to the US House of Representatives, he couldn't get a real committee assignment until somewhere near his third term due to his obnoxious a$$hole way of dealing with the other Reps.... and that certainly was good for the state having no effective representation during those years! Not!
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 14, 2013, 05:26:16 PM
Your posts are quickly flammable and I and others disagree.
Do you not realize that some disagree with you? Do you not expect people who like her to disagree and say so?
Yes, I do - without calling me a mindless, partisan liar.
The City Council meetings you refer to were subcommittee meetings orchestrated to try and attack the Mayor. That set of councilors did the same thing to the previous Mayor. They are all gone from office now, many of them by the ballot box. Their behavior cost them their political lives. Frankly, I don't see any of them ever getting elected to anything ever again.
The City Council can't demand that the Mayor appear before them. She tried to in the beginning, but generally they were rude and not listening. I think any Mayor would have stopped attending.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 14, 2013, 05:30:51 PM
The City Council meetings you refer to were subcommittee meetings orchestrated to try and attack the Mayor. That set of councilors did the same thing to the previous Mayor. They are all gone from office now, many of them by the ballot box. Their behavior cost them their political lives. Frankly, I don't see any of them ever getting elected to anything ever again.
The City Council can't demand that the Mayor appear before them. She tried to in the beginning, but generally they were rude and not listening. I think any Mayor would have stopped attending.
Ah yes, memories of Medlock. What a troll he turned out to be.
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 14, 2013, 04:13:50 PM
Don't lecture me about facts. I've seen your glib, one-liner dismissals of facts you don't want to hear. It appears to me you have a pretty selective definition of the word 'fact' anyway:
to wit:
A statement that happens to coincide with your mindset is a fact. But information reported in local news broadcasts rises only to the level of 'inference.' It's laughable.
Oh yeah, well whatever. You on the other hand have just been a fountain of facts as long as adjectives and pejoratives qualify. Wow, so cerebral.
Look, I've been skewered by the best around here and get up swinging. You hardly register.
Quote from: Conan71 on May 14, 2013, 05:16:14 PM
Damn, pegged Aquaman ;)
And you as well. She's really good huh?
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 14, 2013, 05:30:21 PM
Yes, I do - without calling me a mindless, partisan liar.
Who called her a mindless, partisan, liar? I missed that.
LocalGirl's rants and raves aside, I just had a call from her campaign that I found interesting. Most of what was said was the usual lip services, but what stood out to me was the claim that she kept police on the street even during recession. Can someone please explain to me how she managed that when she left office right before the recession?
Quote from: AquaMan on May 14, 2013, 06:32:53 PM
Who called her a mindless, partisan, liar? I missed that.
I did. I need to apologize for that.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 14, 2013, 06:29:41 PM
Look, I've been skewered by the best around here and get up swinging. You hardly register.
Oh yeah? Well...my dad can whip your dad! :)
Quote from: LocalGirl on May 14, 2013, 08:01:21 PM
Oh yeah? Well...my dad can whip your dad! :)
Very likely if your dad is still living. Mine is not. But he was a tough guy who everyone seemed to like.
I just re-read the last five pages and have to say I don't see any facts you've provided. Some allegations, lots of anger and plenty of feelings. Politics can do that.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 14, 2013, 06:31:19 PM
And you as well. She's really good huh?
I'd come up with a glib one-liner come-back for that but it's time for the hot tub. ;)
You'll have to excuse me for this bit of suburban boondocks ignorance, but when is the vote for Tulsa's mayor? I've been itching to say that people get the kind of government they deserve, so when this vote is concluded will you consider swapping your mayor for one or two councilors out here in Owasso? I'd gladly take any of the three in exchange for the black-helicopters-and-tin-foil-hats councilors we have now.
Quote from: Ed W on May 14, 2013, 09:53:34 PM
You'll have to excuse me for this bit of suburban boondocks ignorance, but when is the vote for Tulsa's mayor? I've been itching to say that people get the kind of government they deserve, so when this vote is concluded will you consider swapping your mayor for one or two councilors out here in Owasso? I'd gladly take any of the three in exchange for the black-helicopters-and-tin-foil-hats councilors we have now.
Primary Election - June 11, 2013
Runoff Primary Election (if necessary) August 13, 2013
General Election - Tuesday, November 12, 2013
I know of at least ONE candidate I'd gladly give up to you...
Quote from: AquaMan on May 14, 2013, 06:31:19 PM
And you as well. She's really good huh?
What makes you assume she is a she? Man you just won't stop jumping to conclusions.
Prediction:
Bill and Dewey will split the republican vote at the primary. KT will be the mayor in a primary win.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 14, 2013, 08:49:42 PM
Very likely if your dad is still living. Mine is not. But he was a tough guy who everyone seemed to like.
I just re-read the last five pages and have to say I don't see any facts you've provided. Some allegations, lots of anger and plenty of feelings. Politics can do that.
Well, not to belabor the point, but the sale of National/Alamo while profitable is a fact. The resulting loss of more than 110 Tulsa jobs is a fact. The firing of the new parks dept. head is a fact.
Maybe you can really help me out here:
"How about KT's refusal to attend CC meetings and make required presentations because they DARED question her?"
"The City Council meetings you refer to were subcommittee meetings orchestrated to try and attack the Mayor."
The first quote is irritating because it's not fact-based. The second does not seem to be. I don't get it.
Enough, now, about my thoughts, opinions and feelings re KT. They are obviously not shared and my worst fear - that she'll be elected - is probably well based. We'll all just have to watch and see what happens after that.
No, my dad's not living - for many years now. It was just a figure of speech.
I take back my apology.
The previous City Council demanded she appear before them at meetings on Tuesdays. These were informational meetings. You say "she refused" to attend them. In reality (where the rest of us live), she stopped going after they insulted her again and again. Mayor LaFortune was treated the same way and he also stopped attending them.
There is no provision that allows the City Council to demand the Mayor or any city employee appear before them. "Refusing" to attend this modern day inquisition orchestrated by power hungry jerks was the smart move. For you to act like this is some negative for Kathy Taylor tells me all I need to know about you. You don't care the reason, just will take any instance and try and turn it into a negative to attack the other candidate.
If she had continued to go and get beat on by the out-of-control councilors, you would have probably said she didn't stand up to them. There ain't any good answer to people like you.
Answer me this. Have you stopped kicking your dog? If you answer yes, you admit to kicking it before. If you answer no, you admit to still kicking it. If you say you don't have a dog, it tells me that you hate dogs.
What is your answer?
May be a bad place/time to ask this but RM, did I see you in a Kathy Taylor commercial on the television last night?
Yes. My agent set it up and I needed the money. At least it wasn't soft porn this time.
Quote from: carltonplace on May 15, 2013, 12:16:10 PM
What makes you assume she is a she? Man you just won't stop jumping to conclusions.
Prediction:
Bill and Dewey will split the republican vote at the primary. KT will be the mayor in a primary win.
I know. I'm such a sexist pig for that. At least I treat campaign workers who knock at my door with respect even though I may not support their candidate. That's a fact. Takes lots of guts to have to talk in person with the Locals.
And, I agree with your assessment.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 15, 2013, 03:52:23 PM
Yes. My agent set it up and I needed the money. At least it wasn't soft porn this time.
I thought your work in "Dumpster Muff Diving" was inspired, Michael. And I'll never look at old bicycle inner tubes quite the same after seeing the innovative uses for recycled ones.
Quote from: Ed W on May 15, 2013, 06:26:11 PM
I thought your work in "Dumpster Muff Diving" was inspired, Michael. And I'll never look at old bicycle inner tubes quite the same after seeing the innovative uses for recycled ones.
Well, that explains something. All the time I thought they were supposed to be dumpster diving for muffins.
Nothing better than a pipin hot dumpster muffin.
(http://www.womenshealthmag.com/files/images/0809-papaya-pineapp-muffin.jpg)