A group called "Tulsans United for Fairness" is planning to sue the City of Tulsa to stop the trash deal. The allegations are basically the same ones made and then withdrawn by TRI (dismissed with prejudice), arguing that the public was excluded from the decision making process. They are also claiming a violation of the open bidding act because the winning bid was announced but there was a two month delay before a contract was signed (therefore something might possibly have happened that was a violation). They're basic argument is "I've never heard anyone in favor of this." It should be pointed out that while attending the meetings on this issue I did not hear any of the people mentioned speak nor see any of the TUFF members at the meetings.
The group claims it has not received funding from TRI and no TRI member is a member of the group. They want to revoke the contract, take the decision making authority assigned to TARE away and essentially give board authority to city-wide votes on the contracts... they do not mention how such a thing would work or if we will vote on all city contracts or just this one.
"Tulsan's United for Fairness" ("TUFF") was founded on March 29, 2012, as a shell company to facilitate this lawsuit. It has no other known function other than to shield whoever is paying for and attempting to gain from this maneuver. Known members include:
George Gibbs – republican political candidate (City Council district 8, lost), the person who sued over the South Tulsa bridge, and partner at Gibbs Armstrong.
Jim Bridenstine – "Republic Patriot for Congress." Rice University, then the Navy, then an MBA from Cornell. Then he came back to Tulsa in 2008 and was the executive director of the Tulsa Air and Space Museum for almost 2 years (tried to get us the Shuttle), before resigning to focus on his career in the Naval Reserves. Now running for Congress.
Ken Walker – Republican Candidate for State House "Man of Faith, Man of Action." From Baltimore, military guy. "Fulfilled his dream to move to the Tulsa area in 2002 with his family."
George Erik Zoellner – As registered agent. Holds a Ph.D. in Education from OSU. His "study buddy and dear friend" is Dr. Cassandra Funderbruck (wife of Judge Carl Funderbruck – who is very unlikely to hear this case anyway), worked for TCC, then colleges in Texas before moving to the Marshall Islands. Apparently back in Tulsa now with political aspirations, maybe?
And that's it, as far as I can tell. So maybe just a political ploy to add a dot to their resume? An unknown connection to TRI? It seems odd that three people that I haven't seen involved in the process the entire way are all of sudden very interested. The timing is also very weird... or calculated.
With the 180 day governmental Tort Claim notice; by the time this lawsuit is filed and actually before a judge, the contract will be well underway, the delivery of the CNG trucks will be nearly complete, and people will be having their cans delivered. A judge will be real hard pressed to enter an injunction at that point. BUT, I guess that will mean these political candidates can be losing the "good fight" just as the election is approaching.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=593&articleid=20120406_11_A1_CUTLIN487029
Totally unbiased and neutral story by the Tulsa Beacon [/sarcasm]: http://www.tulsabeacon.com/?p=5883
Our town back in the day was run more efficiently and better managed over all under the commission form of government because there were never these reactionaries to stop progress. Today, we find ourselves faced with obstructionism every inch of the way. These types can't deal with change. The rest of us get the butt end of their stingy distorted twistedness. Oh how this happens more on the National level because you Teabagger/GOP'ers out there do not take a stand against the extreme righties. :)
Quote from: cannon_fodder on April 06, 2012, 09:42:39 AM
So maybe just a political ploy to add a dot to their resume?
I would hate to be running for office on the "don't change our trash" platform.
Quote from: Teatownclown on April 06, 2012, 12:35:56 PM
Our town back in the day was run more efficiently and better managed over all under the commission form of government because there were never these reactionaries to stop progress. Today, we find ourselves faced with obstructionism every inch of the way. These types can't deal with change. The rest of us get the butt end of their stingy distorted twistedness. Oh how this happens more on the National level because you Teabagger/GOP'ers out there do not take a stand against the extreme righties. :)
How do you explain OKC then? I don't blame the mayor/councilor system for the obstructionism though I do agree we were better managed before the change. Some people don't like to be "managed" especially if they have very little say in who gets to manage them. That was the problem with the commission form we had.
Its the personality of negativism here as regards to leadership and that springs from the concentration of wealth, education and power from which our leadership emerges. A more visible example of that is to tune into TGOV then compare and contrast to Tulsa World comments sections.
Quote from: AquaMan on April 06, 2012, 01:25:07 PM
How do you explain OKC then? I don't blame the mayor/councilor system for the obstructionism though I do agree we were better managed before the change. Some people don't like to be "managed" especially if they have very little say in who gets to manage them. That was the problem with the commission form we had.
Its the personality of negativism here as regards to leadership and that springs from the concentration of wealth, education and power from which our leadership emerges. A more visible example of that is to tune into TGOV then compare and contrast to Tulsa World comments sections.
The old cliché of “we the people” has been changed to “the city hall will decide” and if there is noncompliance we will fine you. Jefferson fears of mob rule (in Tulsa) are at rest. Through the electronic media more of the citizens are becoming aware that the noose around their necks grow tighter as more operations of the city are being forced upon them by the expanding bureaucratic city hall.
The changes from individual handling of the trash to loading it by machines will eliminate needed jobs. It puts the burden on manual loading and positioning of the trash on the citizens and charging them or the trash cop will give them a ticket which can be converted to a fine.
The citizens were not educated to the charter change as printed in the legal news on December 15, 1988 (ordinance 17090) but it has been the source of constant eternal confusion in the past 23 years. Tulsa is changing the people’s authority to rule themselves to non elected trusts.
As these groups band together they may be able to regain the ability to stand up and determine their needs as citizens. The greatest obstacle they will encounter could be corrected with a change of venue.
Though I know better...
Shadows: so to keep needed jobs should we bring back milk men, elevator operators, and better yet, hire 50 men to dig holes down riverside and 50 men to fill them back in? Job creation, yay!
*gasp* change? I vote no! Everything must stay the same. Golden age mentality: the best is behind us and change is always for the worse. It also ignores reality.
Should we convert all jobs to machines?
How do we make jobs once we have eliminated them?
Are we able to tax the unemployed into prosperity?
Can you increase the economy by debits spending?
How do we control population when we open the doors to all?
How can we have birth control except with sex toys?
The internet is transferring the once educated into a bunch of zombies.
Quote from: shadows on April 06, 2012, 04:47:47 PM
The changes from individual handling of the trash to loading it by mahines will eliminate needed jobs.
The new trash/recycling system will create more jobs through recycling efforts. Please pay attention, shadows...MORE JOBS.
Quote from: shadows on April 06, 2012, 05:23:23 PM
Should we convert all jobs to machines?
How do we make jobs once we have eliminated them?
Are we able to tax the unemployed into prosperity?
Can you increase the economy by debits spending?
How do we control population when we open the doors to all?
How can we have birth control except with sex toys?
The internet is transferring the once educated into a bunch of zombies.
Case in point......
RM: good tidings if that is taking away the jobs present and converting those openings to the city payroll. Will the operation of the recycling venture be operated by the city budget or will it be a stand alone company? The trash operation being replaced entailed several ventures and was a private venture in the beginning.
Am not aware where it is possible for any more efficient operation except throwing more money in the operation. On the bottom line it would seem to read "several increases will be available".
shadows...you really don't read the news or pay attention. Instead you just whine about everything and make inane comments.
Several increases will be available? What kind of pre-emptive crap is that? You just make up stupid stuff for a reason?
A local private company has won the hauling contract. They are experienced and plan to hire many workers. They are also buying their trucks from a local company, another local company is building new re-fueling stations, and a local recycler is investing millions of dollars and hiring dozens of new employees to handle the collected recyclables.
The only thing not local about the new service is buying the carts. There are no Oklahoma companies making these carts.
Yes, the city workers will be transferred to other positions than trash. Some will do green waste some will work on bulky waste, and some will go to work in other departments. An equipment operator is always cross-trained to work on other equipment. Driving a trash truck is not unlike driving a dump truck.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on April 06, 2012, 09:20:56 PM
shadows...you really don't read the news or pay attention. Instead you just whine about everything and make inane comments.
Several increases will be available? What kind of pre-emptive crap is that? You just make up stupid stuff for a reason?
A local private company has won the hauling contract. They are experienced and plan to hire many workers. They are also buying their trucks from a local company, another local company is building new re-fueling stations, and a local recycler is investing millions of dollars and hiring dozens of new employees to handle the collected recyclables.
The only thing not local about the new service is buying the carts. There are no Oklahoma companies making these carts.
Yes, the city workers will be transferred to other positions than trash. Some will do green waste some will work on bulky waste, and some will go to work in other departments. An equipment operator is always cross-trained to work on other equipment. Driving a trash truck is not unlike driving a dump truck.
Game...set...and match.
Shadows, if you post anymore on this, you're just foolish.
Quote from: bacjz00 on April 06, 2012, 10:18:32 PM
Game...set...and match.
Shadows, if you post anymore on this, you're just foolish.
Be sure, he will.
yeppers Shadows. You'll be given a term TNF sentence and can return as "Shadowclown." :'(
Sorry, but the past 23 years of the city operating under the new charter should have proven to the citizens how more efficient city operations can be conducted. If there is a doubt just ask anyone in the glass cube. Ask the citizens how much more secure they felt when the strong mayor laid off some 100 policemen as crime was increasing.
The city has experience a land fall in sales taxes as food products increased from 25 to 100 percent but this increase in the food products has limited the ability of many to maintain an healthy diet. There is a growing concern among the working poor, aged and retiree, with very limited incomes, that increases their burden added on to their struggle for existence.
The failure to enter into the hauling contract after awarding it leaves in the minds of many citizens that changes were made after the contract was awarded. Instead of a service to the citizen it seems to be another source of revenue (new tax) collected from the citizen. Since the city owns the trash and must dispose of it and the recycles are sold to a recycler in bulk, the price of the recycles will vary with supply and demand.
The citizens are not afraid of change but in the past the changed have become detrimental as shown in the increasing city budget.
http://www.tulsaworld.com/opinion/article.aspx?subjectid=61&articleid=20120409_61_A9_Justas338120
Trash lawsuit little more than sour grapes and politics
By World's Editorials Writers
Published: 4/9/2012
Just as Tulsa is beginning to put the trash hauling controversy behind it, along comes a group threatening to file a lawsuit and rehash what rational people believed to be a done deal. So far, the lawsuit is little more than a threat by a group calling itself Tulsans United for Fairness. Its attorney says the threatened lawsuit would challenge the trash board's decision based on the Open Meetings Act and Competitive Bidding Act. An earlier lawsuit also challenged the Open Meetings angle and it was dismissed.
The group's members claim that the main issue is representation. They say the trash board is not accountable to the public or even the City Council. What, exactly, does this group expect? Neither the City Council nor the public can vote on every decision made at City Hall. Do these people have any idea how city government works? Do they understand what a representative democracy is?
Members of city boards and commissions, most of whom perform their role for no money, are appointed by councilors and the mayor. They answer to the mayor and/or City Council. The mayor and councilors answer to the voters. If voters don't like the way things are going at City Hall they can change the cast there, as they did in the last city election. The change in Tulsa's trash policy was a years-long process that involved the trash board, several councilors and the public. There were no secret meetings.
Opponents of the change often cite a poll that found that more than 90 percent of Tulsans didn't want to change their method of trash collection. Change is difficult. When most people were asked if they liked their current trash collection system, they said "yes." That doesn't mean that they were adamantly against changing. It sounds as if sour grapes are being served and politics being played. Two members of the group ran for City Council and were defeated. So, if you can't win the election, get in there and stir up trouble another way.
One is running as a Republican for a House seat and another is running in the Republican primary for U.S. First District Congress. Can't hurt to get some free publicity, although we don't understand how a local trash issue has any relevance in a congressional race. Tulsa's trash collection system was going to change no matter who received the contract.
This contract went through the correct process. Although there are likely to be some early glitches, it will eventually be the best system for the city. Frivolous lawsuits such as the one threatened do nothing other than waste money and time and continue to make Tulsa look silly to our friends in the suburbs and around the state.
I can't believe that four republicans are suing to keep a subsidy in place. Isn't that a form of welfare?
Quote from: carltonplace on April 09, 2012, 08:55:58 AM
I can't believe that four republicans are suing to keep a subsidy in place.
Everyone is a conservative until
their subsidy is in jeopardy.
And on gun laws everyone is a liberal until they've been assaulted. ;)
Quote from: Conan71 on April 09, 2012, 08:57:28 AM
Everyone is a conservative until their subsidy is in jeopardy.
And on gun laws everyone is a liberal until they've been assaulted. ;)
Hey, I've never been assaulted..but I'm a social liberal/fiscal conservative-moderate. Does that count?
Oh, and C, I did go down to the election board last week. Welcome me to the droves of registered Indies.
Quote from: Hoss on April 09, 2012, 09:01:34 AM
Hey, I've never been assaulted..but I'm a social liberal/fiscal conservative-moderate. Does that count?
Oh, and C, I did go down to the election board last week. Welcome me to the droves of registered Indies.
Oh no! You got caught out in the wind too, eh?
Welcome to Independence!
Quote from: Conan71 on April 09, 2012, 10:41:47 AM
Oh no! You got caught out in the wind too, eh?
Welcome to Independence!
I'm sick of it. I'm nearly ready to get that pony!
http://www.verminsupreme.com/
;)
FWIW, Ken Walker, one of the guys who filed a Governmental Tort Claim against the trash board, is on the ballot today.