Largest employers - Number of employees
State of Oklahoma - 38,100
Tinker Air Force Base - 26,000
U.S. Postal Service - 8,706
University of Oklahoma - 7,902
Oklahoma City Public Schools - 5,900
US FAA Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center - 5,600
City of Oklahoma City - 5,320
- - -
97,500 government jobs. Of which only 11,000 are supported by Oklahoma City, the rest are subsidized by the entire state. Given the population demographics that implies Tulsa has provides a huge jobs subsidy to Oklahoma City (ignoring BS like the Zink Dam revote, the tit-for-tat museum funding that ended up having the Tulsa portion stripped out, etc.). Meanwhile, Tulsa has so few State sponsored job it doesn't register in any statistics I could find.
I raise this issue for two reasons:
1) other States transfer their services, and related jobs, around the State. Regional centers will have some State offices to both spread the available services and keep the required support services, and associated jobs, around the state. Oklahoma apperently has little interest in doing this. Tulsa enjoys some mandatory services that cannot be readily outsourced to Oklahoma City - a DHS branch, workers comp Courts, and perhaps a few other small offices. But otherwise Tulsa, nor any other major area, shares in the wealth generated by the bloated, yet "small and conservative", government down the turnpike (statistically emjoying 107000 government jobs - or 20% of all employment in Oklahoma City).
and 2) this arrangement worked fine and no one raised complaints when Tulsa could rely on oil and gas, buttressed by a strong manufacturing base, to "stay ahead." With industry continuing to mechanize and Oklahoma City outpacing Tulsa in oil and gas jobs (not too mention their good job of position in tourism - boosting their tourism related employment to Tulsa+20,000), the difference threatens to reduce Oklahoma to one significant economic base and "everyone else."
With technology as it stands there is no longer a reason to centralize government power, government money, and government jobs. We believe in a small local government – yet don't seem to practice that belief. While I applaud the job leaders in Oklahoma City have done to take care of their community, the State needs to realize there is more to Oklahoma than "the City."
/vent
We spread government money around inefficiently via the prison system, university system, and a bunch of un-needed school districts. That's Oklahoma's favored form of pork.
I get where you are going with this, but decentralization gets expensive with facility construction and operational costs, unless, of course they take up leased office space.
Quote from: cannon_fodder on February 03, 2012, 08:01:24 AM
Largest employers - Number of employees
State of Oklahoma - 38,100
Tinker Air Force Base - 26,000
U.S. Postal Service - 8,706
University of Oklahoma - 7,902
Oklahoma City Public Schools - 5,900
US FAA Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center - 5,600
City of Oklahoma City - 5,320
- - -
97,500 government jobs. Of which only 11,000 are supported by Oklahoma City, the rest are subsidized by the entire state. Given the population demographics that implies Tulsa has provides a huge jobs subsidy to Oklahoma City (ignoring BS like the Zink Dam revote, the tit-for-tat museum funding that ended up having the Tulsa portion stripped out, etc.). Meanwhile, Tulsa has so few State sponsored job it doesn't register in any statistics I could find.
I raise this issue for two reasons:
1) other States transfer their services, and related jobs, around the State. Regional centers will have some State offices to both spread the available services and keep the required support services, and associated jobs, around the state. Oklahoma apperently has little interest in doing this. Tulsa enjoys some mandatory services that cannot be readily outsourced to Oklahoma City - a DHS branch, workers comp Courts, and perhaps a few other small offices. But otherwise Tulsa, nor any other major area, shares in the wealth generated by the bloated, yet "small and conservative", government down the turnpike (statistically emjoying 107000 government jobs - or 20% of all employment in Oklahoma City).
and 2) this arrangement worked fine and no one raised complaints when Tulsa could rely on oil and gas, buttressed by a strong manufacturing base, to "stay ahead." With industry continuing to mechanize and Oklahoma City outpacing Tulsa in oil and gas jobs (not too mention their good job of position in tourism - boosting their tourism related employment to Tulsa+20,000), the difference threatens to reduce Oklahoma to one significant economic base and "everyone else."
With technology as it stands there is no longer a reason to centralize government power, government money, and government jobs. We believe in a small local government – yet don't seem to practice that belief. While I applaud the job leaders in Oklahoma City have done to take care of their community, the State needs to realize there is more to Oklahoma than "the City."
/vent
+1
Response from okcpulse and/or laramie in 3....2.....1
Quote from: Hoss on February 03, 2012, 09:32:27 AM
Response from okcpulse and/or laramie in 3....2.....1
They don't matter. I'd like to hear an informed opinion from someone with decision making powers.
I'm tired of hearing Tulsa's bond issues are getting roadblocked while OKC's has full support from the governor to Tulsa reps.
Quote from: cannon_fodder on February 03, 2012, 08:01:24 AM
Largest employers - Number of employees
State of Oklahoma - 38,100
Tinker Air Force Base - 26,000
U.S. Postal Service - 8,706
University of Oklahoma - 7,902
Oklahoma City Public Schools - 5,900
US FAA Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center - 5,600
City of Oklahoma City - 5,320
- - -
97,500 government jobs. Of which only 11,000 are supported by Oklahoma City, the rest are subsidized by the entire state. Given the population demographics that implies Tulsa has provides a huge jobs subsidy to Oklahoma City (ignoring BS like the Zink Dam revote, the tit-for-tat museum funding that ended up having the Tulsa portion stripped out, etc.). Meanwhile, Tulsa has so few State sponsored job it doesn't register in any statistics I could find.
/vent
Although I like your vent, I have to point out that it isn't exactly on mark. Many of those jobs are not funded directly from OK taxes derived from the rest of the state.
Tinker...26,000
Postal Service....8706 (for now)
FAA....5600
City of OKC...5320
OKC public schools........5900
These are jobs that are Federally funded or funded by and for OKC residents. In comparing Tulsa to OKC in that regard you would also have to deduct the number of employees that work in Tulsa for OU, OSU that are funded by the state.
Unless I missed something, it appears that nearly 50,000 of those employees are on Federal rolls or local tax rolls not the rest of the state.
It still explains why they have less impact from economic downturns but you can't fault them for being
A. Centrally located in the state.
B. Having an international airport that is a hub in the system
C. Making use of A& B
Quote from: Townsend on February 03, 2012, 09:34:18 AM
They don't matter. I'd like to hear an informed opinion from someone with decision making powers.
Is her honor posting on this forum? just kidding.
Quote from: carltonplace on February 03, 2012, 10:43:57 AM
Is her honor posting on this forum? just kidding.
"Informed" opinion
Quote from: Townsend on February 03, 2012, 09:34:18 AM
They don't matter. I'd like to hear an informed opinion from someone with decision making powers.
I'm tired of hearing Tulsa's bond issues are getting roadblocked while OKC's has full support from the governor to Tulsa reps.
I know they don't, but it's their
modus operandi to strafe these kinds of threads.
Quote from: Hoss on February 03, 2012, 11:43:13 AM
I know they don't, but it's their modus operandi to strafe these kinds of threads.
That was an attempt at a sideways face slap for the OKC posters.
The Tinker information is probably a bit off with the lease on the old GM plant, they have surely hired more work force. Additionally, of those 26k, 11-13k are military members, and while they are "recession proof", doesn't mean they are poverty proof.
Quote from: JCnOwasso on February 03, 2012, 12:57:24 PM
The Tinker information is probably a bit off with the lease on the old GM plant, they have surely hired more work force. Additionally, of those 26k, 11-13k are military members, and while they are "recession proof", doesn't mean they are poverty proof.
I think Boeing is in the old GM plant, but by any stretch of the imagination, those jobs are essentially federally-funded.
To be fair, recession proof isn't really recession proof in this climate of austerity in state budgets.
Curious how "recession proof" OKC is if CHK continues to have trouble and NG prices stay low.
Quote from: Sutton on February 20, 2012, 09:01:28 AM
Curious how "recession proof" OKC is if CHK continues to have trouble and NG prices stay low.
Sounds like more producers are choking down supplies.
Another day, another McClendon scandal.
Oklahoma is doing very well under Mary Fallin, our unemployment rate droped some more to around 5.5% one the lowest in the nation. Mary Fallin's pro-business and tax cut atitudes help the economy big time. Here in Tulsa anyone who wants a job can find one. Since Mary Fallin came to power our unemployment rate has been dropping and dropping every month. Michigan and Ohio are a mess jobs are bleeding out of those states. Ohio has not only a state income tax but every city in Ohio has it's own city income tax and some school districts in Ohio even have a school district income tax and still the school systems are always broke and prop. taxes are sky high. Residents and companies are fleeing the state.
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 09, 2012, 12:35:20 PM
Oklahoma is doing very well under Mary Fallin, our unemployment rate droped some more to around 5.5% one the lowest in the nation. Mary Fallin's pro-business and tax cut atitudes help the economy big time. Here in Tulsa anyone who wants a job can find one. Since Mary Fallin came to power our unemployment rate has been dropping and dropping every month. Michigan and Ohio are a mess jobs are bleeding out of those states. Ohio has not only a state income tax but every city in Ohio has it's own city income tax and some school districts in Ohio even have a school district income tax and still the school systems are always broke and prop. taxes are sky high. Residents and companies are fleeing the state.
She's gonna drive this state into a handcart. But I've already pointed this out.
You and shadows obviously have been sniffing the Fallin 'brown gas'....
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 09, 2012, 12:35:20 PM
Oklahoma is doing very well under Mary Fallin, our unemployment rate droped some more to around 5.5% one the lowest in the nation. Mary Fallin's pro-business and tax cut atitudes help the economy big time. Here in Tulsa anyone who wants a job can find one. Since Mary Fallin came to power our unemployment rate has been dropping and dropping every month. Michigan and Ohio are a mess jobs are bleeding out of those states. Ohio has not only a state income tax but every city in Ohio has it's own city income tax and some school districts in Ohio even have a school district income tax and still the school systems are always broke and prop. taxes are sky high. Residents and companies are fleeing the state.
Even when the meds wear off it's still allowed in its local library.
Too bad it hasn't learned to properly use reference material.
Quote from: Townsend on May 09, 2012, 12:41:07 PM
Even when the meds wear off it's still allowed in its local library.
Too bad it hasn't learned to properly use reference material.
You'd think being in a library it would learn...
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 09, 2012, 12:35:20 PM
Oklahoma is doing very well under Mary Fallin, our unemployment rate droped some more to around 5.5% one the lowest in the nation. Mary Fallin's pro-business and tax cut atitudes help the economy big time. Here in Tulsa anyone who wants a job can find one. Since Mary Fallin came to power our unemployment rate has been dropping and dropping every month. Michigan and Ohio are a mess jobs are bleeding out of those states. Ohio has not only a state income tax but every city in Ohio has it's own city income tax and some school districts in Ohio even have a school district income tax and still the school systems are always broke and prop. taxes are sky high. Residents and companies are fleeing the state.
Wait....YOU
ARE MARY FALLIN AREN'T YOU!!!
Quote from: AquaMan on May 09, 2012, 12:52:00 PM
Wait....YOU ARE MARY FALLIN AREN'T YOU!!!
Sounds about right.
I saw a friend who owns a major landscape company and he said finding labor has become a huge issue....seems like all the immigrants went home.
Inflation coming.....
Quote from: Teatownclown on May 09, 2012, 01:14:55 PM
I saw a friend who owns a major landscape company and he said finding labor has become a huge issue....seems like all the immigrants went home.
Inflation coming.....
Had lunch with a friend Tuesday that owns a large landscape company. He indicated same.
Quote from: Teatownclown on May 09, 2012, 01:14:55 PM
I saw a friend who owns a major landscape company and he said finding labor has become a huge issue....seems like all the immigrants went home.
Inflation coming.....
This has been a problem since HB 1804. How long ago was that? Five years? Localized inflation hasn't happened as a result.
There's a general shortage of skilled and un-skilled labor in this market, not just landscaping and other jobs you are used to seeing Hispanics do. There's probably work for at least 6000 to 7000 welder/fabricators in the Tulsa area which goes un-filled because there aren't enough welders to go around or the ones who can't get hired have other "issues".
Quote from: Conan71 on May 09, 2012, 03:10:04 PM
There's a general shortage of skilled and un-skilled labor in this market, not just landscaping and other jobs you are used to seeing Hispanics do. There's probably work for at least 6000 to 7000 welder/fabricators in the Tulsa area which goes un-filled because there aren't enough welders to go around or the ones who can't get hired have other "issues".
Those darn drug tests!
For a while Tulsa was juuuust holding steady population wise and looking at the racial demographics run down from the last census, we were losing white population in Tulsa and the only way we were holding steady was because of the increase in hispanic population.
I would love to see more numbers. Otherwise it might very well be that some part of the low unemployment rate could be because we are losing population faster than we are losing jobs.
History shows that what Mary Fallin is doing works, cutting taxes and getting gov. off of people's backs really works. Getting rid of regulations and low taxes attracts jobs, companies, and new business and that in turn brings in more money -not less money- to the state. Doing the oppiset bleeds jobs and companies for examples look at Michigan & Ohio. Michigan was run by democrats for years, taxes are choking everyone, business is leaving. Cutting gov't growth puts money in the private sector and it makes jobs and grows the economy, growing gov't takes money out of the private sector and kills jobs as is what Obama & the democrats are doing on the national level.
Anyone who wants a job in Tulsa can find one if they really want to work. Oklahoma's housing martket is also stronger than many other cities. Oklahoma has a solid economy much better than it was under gov. Henry. I give the credit to Mary Fallin.
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 10, 2012, 12:46:33 PM
Anyone who wants a job in Tulsa can find one if they really want to work. Oklahoma's housing martket is also stronger than many other cities. Oklahoma has a solid economy much better than it was under gov. Henry. I give the credit to Mary Fallin.
I give credit to the oil and gas business....business, something you must not understand to credit a rude governess who hasn't had time to impact squat except teaparty causes.
Quote from: Teatownclown on May 10, 2012, 12:48:21 PM
I give credit to the oil and gas business....business, something you must not understand to credit a rude governess who hasn't had time to impact squat except teaparty causes.
I don't think he's the only one who forgets that Tulsa (and Oklahoma generally) are usually countercyclical economically.
Quote from: Teatownclown on May 10, 2012, 12:48:21 PM
I give credit to the oil and gas business....business, something you must not understand to credit a rude governess who hasn't had time to impact squat except teaparty causes.
Yes but the oil and gas Oklahoma has won't do any good if the state had burdensome regulations and heavy taxes and choking environmental rules. No one would want to mess with it. It also takes a pro-business atitude, and low taxes to draw in companies and develope the natural resources. If Oklahoma became a state like Michigan no one would want to mess or invest in anything in the state it just would not be worth the cost and hassle. Michigan has alot of natural resurces and great waterways for shipping, but the state has choking taxes and regulations that kill companies who want to invest and develope it.
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 11, 2012, 10:56:03 AM
Yes but the oil and gas Oklahoma has won't do any good if the state had burdensome regulations and heavy taxes and choking environmental rules. No one would want to mess with it. It also takes a pro-business atitude, and low taxes to draw in companies and develope the natural resources. If Oklahoma became a state like Michigan no one would want to mess or invest in anything in the state it just would not be worth the cost and hassle. Michigan has alot of natural resurces and great waterways for shipping, but the state has choking taxes and regulations that kill companies who want to invest and develope it.
Here here! We need to go back to the heady days where everyone had a refinery in their back yard and the air was thick with smoke! Who wants to live a long and healthy life?
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 11, 2012, 10:56:03 AM
Yes but the oil and gas Oklahoma has won't do any good if the state had burdensome regulations and heavy taxes and choking environmental rules. No one would want to mess with it. It also takes a pro-business atitude, and low taxes to draw in companies and develope the natural resources. If Oklahoma became a state like Michigan no one would want to mess or invest in anything in the state it just would not be worth the cost and hassle. Michigan has alot of natural resurces and great waterways for shipping, but the state has choking taxes and regulations that kill companies who want to invest and develope it.
Why are you talking future tense here? "If the state had burdensome regs and heavy taxes and choking env rules..." Do you think we are considering those things or that we already have them? I can't understand what you're saying here.
And where is this faulty understanding of the oil industry coming from? Fallin people? Believe me now and learn it later, when oil is $200 a barrel no restrictions will stop development of that resource. Demand and supply rule even in your world.
Sauer, if so, The Governess needs to take the hit for how our state is one of the three worst for individuals and families who want to get ahead in life. It's her fault. :)
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20120511_16_A1_Olhmso379571
only %30 of Oklahomans experience upward mobility. Fail.
Quote from: AquaMan on May 11, 2012, 01:21:38 PM
Why are you talking future tense here? "If the state had burdensome regs and heavy taxes and choking env rules..." Do you think we are considering those things or that we already have them? I can't understand what you're saying here.
And where is this faulty understanding of the oil industry coming from? Fallin people? Believe me now and learn it later, when oil is $200 a barrel no restrictions will stop development of that resource. Demand and supply rule even in your world.
More like...Governor Failin'....
Quote from: Hoss on May 11, 2012, 02:08:05 PM
More like...Governor Failin'....
Sauers' lament?
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 09, 2012, 12:35:20 PM
Oklahoma is doing very well under Mary Fallin, our unemployment rate droped some more to around 5.5% one the lowest in the nation. Mary Fallin's pro-business and tax cut atitudes help the economy big time.
Please give a single example of a tax cut or pro-business move that Mary Fallin has done. Cite the source and monetary effect.
If you can't, then shut the hell up.
Quote from: RecycleMichael on May 11, 2012, 03:55:02 PM
Please give a single example of a tax cut or pro-business move that Mary Fallin has done. Cite the source and monetary effect.
If you can't, then shut the hell up.
You should take your own advice....donkey....!
Quote from: Breadburner on May 11, 2012, 04:35:15 PM
You should take your own advice....donkey....!
No sense to be seen here folks. Keep movin'.
Quote from: Teatownclown on May 11, 2012, 01:24:19 PM
Sauer, if so, The Governess needs to take the hit for how our state is one of the three worst for individuals and families who want to get ahead in life. It's her fault. :)
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?subjectid=11&articleid=20120511_16_A1_Olhmso379571
only %30 of Oklahomans experience upward mobility. Fail.
No! Don't you know that's probably all Brad Henry's fault... better yet, it's Obama's fault. I'm sure if he wasn't in office Oklahoma would be much better off!! ::) Damn Donkeys
Quote from: sauerkraut on May 11, 2012, 10:56:03 AM
Yes but the oil and gas Oklahoma has won't do any good if the state had burdensome regulations and heavy taxes and choking environmental rules. No one would want to mess with it. It also takes a pro-business atitude, and low taxes to draw in companies and develope the natural resources. If Oklahoma became a state like Michigan no one would want to mess or invest in anything in the state it just would not be worth the cost and hassle. Michigan has alot of natural resurces and great waterways for shipping, but the state has choking taxes and regulations that kill companies who want to invest and develope it.
I love when people use this excuse as well. Everything should just be a free for all... I mean the wild west days in modern times is the way to go. A civilized society has rules, republican's make just as many as democrats. Government is government, and there is no such this as "small government" either.
The regulation in the United States aren't any worse than any other modern society that surrounds us either. Take Canada for example. People around here freak, and say we are about to send a ton of oil to the Commie's (China) because Obama denied the pipeline. The proposed pipeline from Alberta to British Columbia would under go 10 times the amount of scrutiny it will here, that's the whole reason they didn't do it in the first place. If you think the people in California are tree huggers, try spending some time in and around Vancouver. Do you really think Canada wouldn't sell us out if the Chinese were going to pay them more, and it was just as easy to ship it to them? No.
This over regulation of the Oil and Gas industry is all BS! Republican's pockets are just lined with their companies money, and they tell people that Democrats are just trying to kill jobs when they know they aren't really going to critically analyze this situation and realize our country isn't going to implode because we don't bend over and hold our ankles for the Oil and Gas companies. We need some sort of regulation in order for people to be able to drink their well water, or for our city to not have contaminated water more than it already is.