The Tulsa Forum by TulsaNow

http://www.ktul.com/news/stories/1008/561354.html

That stinks, but I can't remember the last time I watched KTUL for anything. Their website seems decent, but for non-HD news I would favor KOTV bceause of weather (though I think their news is average to subpar but what station's isn't in Tulsa?) Channel 2 will keep me watching as long as they are broadcasting in HD and not coming off as a bunch of hacks.

2 is owned by a national company that runs 10 TV stations as well as newspapers, etc.
5 is owned by the clear channel megaconglomerate.
6 is owned by the Griffin family who is pretty well off.
8 is a privately held company



8 will always be the underdog but 6 and 8 are the only "local" stations anymore.

8 is not all that local anymore; they are more like 2.  They are owned by a company called AllBriton that owns several other affiliates and Politico.   http://cfc.ktul.com/external.cfm?p=acc (http://"http://cfc.ktul.com/external.cfm?p=acc")

KOTV might have the most "local" ownership of anyone, with the Griffin family calling the shots.  Of course, their Sunday sports show has a hard time covering Tulsa sports, so the term "local" might not be all that it's cracked up to be.

Seems to be happening throughout the media these days.  Wonder if Giordano made the cut?

Post from pissed-off former KTUL employee in 3-2-1...

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Originally posted by Conan71

Seems to be happening throughout the media these days.  Wonder if Giordano made the cut?

Post from pissed-off former KTUL employee in 3-2-1...

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Was that a poop joke? [}:)]

I don't know if he made the "cut" either, but his trial is this month...

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Originally posted by Conan71

Seems to be happening throughout the media these days.  Wonder if Giordano made the cut?

Post from pissed-off former KTUL employee in 3-2-1...

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Giordano is still there.

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Originally posted by Gold

8 is not all that local anymore; they are more like 2.  They are owned by a company called AllBriton that owns several other affiliates and Politico.

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2 is still Scripps Howard out of Ohio.
6 is Oklahoma City-based.
8 is run out of Washington, DC.
23 was sold to a Kansas City holding company (Newport) after Clear Channel decided it wanted to focus on billboards and radio.

Between winter/spring layoffs at KOKI, the summer chopping at KOTV and this, Tulsa TV stations have lost a combined 40 jobs this year alone. I just can't believe KJRH will sail through without doing the same.

Note to college journalism students: THERE'S STILL TIME TO CHANGE YOUR MAJOR!

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Originally posted by iplaw

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Originally posted by Conan71

Seems to be happening throughout the media these days.  Wonder if Giordano made the cut?

Post from pissed-off former KTUL employee in 3-2-1...

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Was that a poop joke? [}:)]

I don't know if he made the "cut" either, but his trial is this month...

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Smashing humor sir, I never even saw that one coming!

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Originally posted by Gold



This Great Depression talk is really silly.  We are nowhere near that.  Maybe it would be worth discussing when there is a decade straight of double digit unemployment.  But this stupid deal isn't it.

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If there were not other reasons I had for not voting for Obama, that alone would keep me from it.  Glib politicians don't realize talk like that helps to create recessions and people to lose their jobs because business people listen.  Sullivan most likely lost my vote when he left DC with an ambiguous sound bite about "25% unemployment" a couple of weeks ago after Congress' second vote on the bailout.  That kind of talk will kill spending in an economy, even necessary spending.

I know for a fact a lot of this rhetoric is giving the owner of my company jitters and he's not alone.  We are not buying any larger equipment for resale on speculation again until after the election, if then.  I also don't believe we are going to put on any more welders and fabricators for the time being.

The raw sales numbers don't bear out his fears, but with all the talk, he's tucking his wings in.

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Originally posted by Conan71

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Originally posted by Gold



This Great Depression talk is really silly.  We are nowhere near that.  Maybe it would be worth discussing when there is a decade straight of double digit unemployment.  But this stupid deal isn't it.

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If there were not other reasons I had for not voting for Obama, that alone would keep me from it.  Glib politicians don't realize talk like that helps to create recessions and people to lose their jobs because business people listen.  Sullivan most likely lost my vote when he left DC with an ambiguous sound bite about "25% unemployment" a couple of weeks ago after Congress' second vote on the bailout.  That kind of talk will kill spending in an economy, even necessary spending.

I know for a fact a lot of this rhetoric is giving the owner of my company jitters and he's not alone.  We are not buying any larger equipment for resale on speculation again until after the election, if then.  I also don't believe we are going to put on any more welders and fabricators for the time being.

The raw sales numbers don't bear out his fears, but with all the talk, he's tucking his wings in.

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Well, we'll see.

What happens if the "glib" talk turns accurate? It's not hard to see the parallels here. The underlying reason the Depression lasted so long was because the financial system collapsed. When you've got big, big banks all over the place going under and others refusing to give credit, it's hard not to make the connection.

Let's put it this way: Do you want a politician to be cautionary and say that things might be rough for a spell? Or do you want a politician to be sunny and happy and say that "prosperity is around the corner," a la Hoover?

Taking a stance of "hope for the best and expect the worst" is hardly what I would call negligent. At least it's not delusional.

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Originally posted by Conan71

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Originally posted by Gold



This Great Depression talk is really silly.  We are nowhere near that.  Maybe it would be worth discussing when there is a decade straight of double digit unemployment.  But this stupid deal isn't it.

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If there were not other reasons I had for not voting for Obama, that alone would keep me from it.  Glib politicians don't realize talk like that helps to create recessions and people to lose their jobs because business people listen.  Sullivan most likely lost my vote when he left DC with an ambiguous sound bite about "25% unemployment" a couple of weeks ago after Congress' second vote on the bailout.  That kind of talk will kill spending in an economy, even necessary spending.

I know for a fact a lot of this rhetoric is giving the owner of my company jitters and he's not alone.  We are not buying any larger equipment for resale on speculation again until after the election, if then.  I also don't believe we are going to put on any more welders and fabricators for the time being.

The raw sales numbers don't bear out his fears, but with all the talk, he's tucking his wings in.

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I don't see either side in this election giving honest, frank answers about the financial system.  Part of that is the complexity, part of it I suspect is that neither side is really sure what they are walking into in January 2009 and what the corresponding action will be.

That's what is kind of jacked up about this one.  We need an honest, frank candidate that will break down the issues, whether it be energy or the financial system.  The energy example is particularly frustrating because there seems to be one solution to the issue (diversification and additional infrastructure, including nuclear power), but neither side is willing to talk about the expense it is going to take to get that ball rolling.  Same thing with the national debt -- this isn't healthy and means we need to spend less, meaning fewer pet projects, etc., whether it be a bridge to nowhere or funding for a daycenter in south Chicago.

I'm still voting for Obama.  I'm just not particularly motivated by either side's rhetoric and would prefer to throw the current group of bums in DC out in favor of newer bums that might be marginally better.

Obviously, you shouldn't BS your way through a slowdown.  But the level of hyperbole in election campaigns does a lot of harm IMO.    People can berate Bush all they like for not sounding warning horns earlier, but he did show restraint by not blowing a smoking hole in the economy as long as he could.  A good leader is going to try and minimize panic as much as possible.  Unfortunately, the two Presidential candidates are getting more press for their statements on the economy rather than the current leader.  (Love him, hate him, he's still the leader till Jan. 20).

I'm not hearing great ideas out of any of them, much as Gold said in his post.  I think it's so damn complex, there may not be but a handful of people on the planet who really do have a grasp on all this.

It's really, really hard to create a direct correlation between the Great Depression and the state of our current financial markets.  We've created collateral out of thin air with "securities", we've hyper-inflated the lifestyle costs of every social class due to stupid, government-encouraged lending policies which caused construction and homebuying costs to artificially inflate (and created securities to insulate and mask against those losses when prices fell to a realistic level).  The financial system is so much more complicated now.  

It's as simple as diminishing people's optimism and creating fear that hard times are ahead.  You will cause even less cash to wind up in the economy.  If people are led to believe their future survival is in jeopardy, they start to horde.  It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Great points.

I suspect a lot of it isn't that difficult.  Don't panic and hide your money under your bed.  Call out the idiot news organizations running stories about the depression -- truth be told, the economy is so different now, it's not easy to compare at all.

The hard part is the future regulation and figuring out who to hold accountable for the massive writeoffs that are to follow.  Hopefully, the body politic learned enough this time around to make that a non-partisan issue.

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Originally posted by Gold

Great points.

I suspect a lot of it isn't that difficult.  Don't panic and hide your money under your bed.  Call out the idiot news organizations running stories about the depression -- truth be told, the economy is so different now, it's not easy to compare at all.

The hard part is the future regulation and figuring out who to hold accountable for the massive writeoffs that are to follow.  Hopefully, the body politic learned enough this time around to make that a non-partisan issue.

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Even though I suspect you and I differ on some core political issues, we are in agreement on many other things.

The lessons to be learned are vast and the fall-out will continue, unfortunately, for decades I'm afraid.

Fortunately, I've lost nothing in this debacle as I've sold nothing.  

Another aspect which happened in the last year was unprecidented profiteering in oil and just about all other commodities in the last year.  I'm not talking the cost of trading paper, I'm talking the real street cost of hard commodities.  When the price and copper and steel goes up- there is little which is not impacted.  Automotive, construction, oil and gas, research, medical, on and on and on...

For instance, a certain type of steel-fabricated pressure vessel which cost $95,000 eight months ago now costs $115,000 from the same manufacturer.  That same vessel was in the neighborhood of $75K five years ago.  Even though raw steel prices are back down, it's still not trickling into real-world consumption yet.

HOLY ****.

I came in this thread to hear about layoffs at channel 8 and before getting to the end, I have heard about everything from some guy pooping in his pants, recession, depression, and everyone being scared!!

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Originally posted by TUalum0982

HOLY ****.

I came in this thread to hear about layoffs at channel 8 and before getting to the end, I have heard about everything from some guy pooping in his pants, recession, depression, and everyone being scared!!

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The Internets are a cruel bidness.

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Originally posted by Conan71

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Originally posted by Gold

Great points.

I suspect a lot of it isn't that difficult.  Don't panic and hide your money under your bed.  Call out the idiot news organizations running stories about the depression -- truth be told, the economy is so different now, it's not easy to compare at all.

The hard part is the future regulation and figuring out who to hold accountable for the massive writeoffs that are to follow.  Hopefully, the body politic learned enough this time around to make that a non-partisan issue.

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Even though I suspect you and I differ on some core political issues, we are in agreement on many other things.

The lessons to be learned are vast and the fall-out will continue, unfortunately, for decades I'm afraid.

Fortunately, I've lost nothing in this debacle as I've sold nothing.  

Another aspect which happened in the last year was unprecidented profiteering in oil and just about all other commodities in the last year.  I'm not talking the cost of trading paper, I'm talking the real street cost of hard commodities.  When the price and copper and steel goes up- there is little which is not impacted.  Automotive, construction, oil and gas, research, medical, on and on and on...

For instance, a certain type of steel-fabricated pressure vessel which cost $95,000 eight months ago now costs $115,000 from the same manufacturer.  That same vessel was in the neighborhood of $75K five years ago.  Even though raw steel prices are back down, it's still not trickling into real-world consumption yet.

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I think it depends on what you define core political issues as.

I think there is plenty of room for bipartisan agreement on fiscal and energy policy.  For example, there is literally only one way to solve the energy issue, with lots of little sub-parts that confuse the whole discussion; renewables aren't anywhere near being close to what some paint them to be and drilling off shore isn't going to make that big of a dent (though we should still do it).   Same thing with fiscal policy: we need more oversight of loans, etc. -- if a certain bank is "too big to fail," then it is probably also "too big not to be regulated."

I'd rather our government be pragmatic about these issues than waste time on distractions like whether Elian Gonzalez is in the right place or whether it approves of Florida's policy on end of life care.  We elect these peoples to help with our problems -- notbattle some moralistic crusade.

Interesting point on the price of stuff going up, but some raw material costs going down.  (Or is the dollar bouncing back while everyone else tanks?)  My wife hired a cleaning lady in the middle of the summer.  She explained that she needed to charge $10 more than she did the friend who sent her to us because the cost of fuel has gone up.  It made me wonder when I saw oil fall 50% off the high: do we get to pay $10 less now?  (Silly, but bare with me.)

A lot of places that had to raise prices when things got expensive last year (and the dollar tanked).  Depending on what market you are looking at, some may not lower prices until they have to out of competition, and in some really specialized markets like the widget you explain, I suspect they'll try to rake in the profits while they can.

There are probably some interesting opportunities with all this volatility for an investor much wiser than myself or Boone Pickens. [;)]

Two questions:

1.  Anyone have the 13 names?

2.  Is this thread still on topic?

That link has already been taken down, does anyone have another link to this?

Let's hope Carol Lambert will move on.
In regard to the next prez........we need a leader...Obama aint thr guy!

I found out one person I know was one of the lucky 13. He was like 3rd or 4th in the pecking order.

TULSANOW FORUM... "Where thread-drift is a way of life"

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Originally posted by sgrizzle

I found out one person I know was one of the lucky 13. He was like 3rd or 4th in the pecking order.

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Have you heard if Kevin King was one of them? I've noticed his name hasn't been posted with the latest news stories.

New Link:

http://newsok.com/tulsa-tv-station-announces-layoffs/article/3311971

Clint Boone was the only on-air talent.